Potential tenants seeing vacant unit unattended?

Rental Property Investor · Cherry Hill, NJ · Member since 2015 · 626 posts · 495 votes

5y

I manage 3 SFHs with a very demanding W2 job. While I get the concept of the lockbox and time savings, there are risks regardless of the types of neighborhood it is. People now have access to the keys of the property at any time so you lose control on access to your property. Additionally, wouldn’t you want to meet your new prospective tenant?

I lost my own property on TurboTenant and schedule appointments around my work schedule or on weekends when I am off. I think it is extremely important to meet and have discussions with prospective tenants to get a feel for who is renting my property.

6 Reply

Eric James

Investor · Malakoff, TX · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes

5y

I'd never let people into my rentals without someone present. What I do to save time is group/open house type showings once or twice a week.

8 Reply

Matt M.

Specialist · Easton, PA · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes

5y

@Dylan Katz

Yeah I’d never let any into one of my houses alone. And that’s how I get a gut feeling about them, by meeting them.

2 Reply

Dylan Katz

OP

Member since 2020 · 9 posts · 2 votes

5y

@Joe Martella

What kinds of things do you look for when you meet and talk with potential tenants?

Dylan Katz

OP

Member since 2020 · 9 posts · 2 votes

5y

@Matt M.

Yes this is was my gut reaction as well, what kinds of things do you look for that give you that gut feeing for a tenant?

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Russell BrazilBusiness Member

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Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes

5y

Say goodbye to the appliances and copper if you do that.

Honestly, that sounds like something written by someone who has no practical landlording experience.

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3 Reply

Adam Martin

Rental Property Investor · Member since 2020 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes

5y

A lot of the larger management companies in my area do this and honestly I see it as low risk of theft. They know the house is empty and if you are going to break in you will just break a window or lock and help yourself in without giving your personal info to get in, the house is listed online and there are vacant pictures. That said I do not do it as I like to meet the tenants. I like to list the house as available on a Wednesday and available to see on the weekend. This allows me to have a couple days to gather showings and I try to bundle them to make it worth my time and am usually finishing everything up so if I get a no show I have work to do anyway. During the walkthrough I like to answer questions they have as well as ask questions of my own. I like to see if the answers they give are consistent and get to know them better. I am pretty laid back and people tend to open up to me, they often tend to overshare and get weeded out which is a plus. If you were to do it I would use an electronic deadbolt where you can change the combination every night and check to make sure windows or doors aren't left open just in case.

3 Reply

Alecia LovelessPro Member

Member since 2019 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes

5y

@Dylan Katz My sister has rentals north of the DFW metroplex and she did this with just one of her dozens of units and went back the following weekend to discover the pipes gone and the outside AC unit stolen. Lesson learned.

Developer · Houston TX · Member since 2018 · 423 posts · 400 votes

5y

@Dylan Katz

I have properties scattered throughout the city. I know the book you are referring to and he had some good points as I recall. I have allowed prospects to view a unit without having one of my team members present especially with COVID but here is what I do.

Install a keypad door lock that you can control using your phone rather than the traditional lockbox. Costs $100-$250.

Before a prospect gets a newly generated code via text to their phone we have them email us a copy of their ID, have them put up a $200 security deposit which they get back within 24hrs using our online payment and we verify them using Social Media. This takes just a few minutes.

We also have two cameras we install temporarily while a unit is empty. One inside the living room and the other outside facing the driveway or front door. These cameras can be viewed from my phone. And they send me alert of movement as well as allow me to talk to them over the built-in speaker.

They have 1 hour from their appointment time to go view before the code becomes invalid.

In all my years we have not had anyone break in or steal. The lock will notify you if it hasn't been locked properly, and your cameras can alert you if there is any movement inside the property or out front when no one is supposed to be at the property.

With these precautions you can allow prospects to view your property at their convenience and freedom to look around without the landlord standing behind them, following them from room to room.

We do full background, credit/criminal, employment, and rental history verifications. The idea you need to meet them in person to get a feel for them I think doesnt always work out as planned. After all, the person you meet is in their "job interview" mode so they will be professional and have their best foot forward.

Best of luck

5 Reply

Rental Property Investor · Cherry Hill, NJ · Member since 2015 · 626 posts · 495 votes

5y

@Dylan Katz. Just normal conversation. Ask what they do for work, see if they have any questions about the property. See what my gut instinct says. Get a feel if they are being honest about their past rental history.

I know the questions I am interested in and try to get the answers out naturally through informal conversation. Try to gain the rapport. If you lease to them, you want to know who you lease to.

You would be surprised on what you find out through casual conversation.

2 Reply

Chris Matthew

Rental Property Investor · Waterville, NY · Member since 2020 · 26 posts · 26 votes

5y

@Dylan Katz there are many things to consider before allowing anyone access to the unit. However, in my 15 yrs of managing somewhat nicer apartments in a rural area, I’ve had great success doing just that. I screen the prospect first. I find out where they work, what they are looking for in a place and why they are leaving their old place. If they sound the least bit sketchy I schedule a group showing a week or so out for the “B” tenants. If they present themselves well and have a legit sounding backstory, I often inform them the door will be left unlocked by someone who works closely with me and inspected and locked after their visit. I also ask them to shoot me a text when they arrive and Whalen the leave. This also allows me to assess, their ability to comply with simple requests, their consideration when coordinating with others and get a measure of their punctuality. If they are late and don’t inform me, they probably aren’t going to be great tenants.

I do notify the neighboring tenants that the part will be shown so they can keep an eye out for any suspicious activity.

Perhaps it is luck, or knowing the area... there is not anyone that unlocks and locks the door. I leave it unlocked during showings. If I know I’m not going to show it anymore, I simply ask the last person to lock the door when they are through.

I also leave blank application forms on the kitchen counter and explain the $50 refundable application deposit. If they complete the application, I review it, have a conversation about the apartment and their rental history. If everything checks out the $50 become part of the security deposit. If not it gets refunded. If I offer them the lease and they don’t sign within 7-10 days requested, they lose the deposit.

I meet everyone face to face for the lease signing. So far, I have never had issues with chronic non payment or had to evict anyone that I have vetted.

If you are renting at or below market quality housing, I’d be much more Leary about leaving a door open.

Shanna Vataj

Real Estate Agent · Westchester, NY · Member since 2021 · 77 posts · 35 votes

5y

@Dylan Katz

We do a coded lockbox at vacant rental units. If I have more than one person seeing it (ex: back to back), I will make sure i’m there. If not, they send me a picture of their license and get the code. This is for vacant units only.

Cliff H.Pro Member

Rental Property Investor · Nashua, NH · Member since 2014 · 587 posts · 477 votes

5y

@Dylan Katz yes. 100%. Rent all my units for years without ever setting foot in the house, most in under 30 days even in challenging rental markets where supply outstrips demand and across class A, B, and C properties. All works, 100% automated, and way better than meeting folks in person.

This one of the most misunderstood aspects of self-management and causes many landlords and PMs to both waste time and out their safety at risk meeting unknown prospects at vacant properties without screening. Have you seen the statistics on realtor attacks? It’s not pretty. Or think about it this way: would you rather have an insurance claim or a hospital visit?

I know where my interest lies?

Todd Pultz

Rental Property Investor · Dayton, OH · Member since 2019 · 293 posts · 440 votes

5y

@Dylan Katz I agree with @sco@Scott M. That this is more about the area. In challenging areas we would absolutely never do this. Of course people can break in if they want or squat if they want, but I’m not going to make it easier for them.

However, if your dealing with higher caliber of tenant in an area with little crime concerns, this can be super effective and work great. No different than renting out an Air BnB right? You have to have systems in place to check the property after these showings etc the same as you would an air BnB. We use our Maintenace team.

My caution would be if you are in a state that has serious squatter rights, I would not remove a barrier for a potential squatter and allow unattended showings.

Mike Gordon

San Jose, CA · Member since 2020 · 42 posts · 25 votes

5y

@Luciano A. Are there keypad door locks that don’t require wi-fi to function? I don’t want to keep internet service on in a vacant unit just for the door lock and when a tenant moves in they change the WiFi anyway.

I’d be interested in hearing about remote solutions that don’t need WiFi access.

I also don’t want prospective tenants in my units unattended. I think there are liability concerns too - what if they don’t return the key, have a party, and the place burns down?

It would be nice, however, to be able to let contractors in remotely.

Also how do you set these door locks up with tenants so that they have access and you do too? Wouldn’t they want to change the code or not allow the landlord to open the door remotely?

Rental Property Investor · Cherry Hill, NJ · Member since 2015 · 626 posts · 495 votes

5y

We are all talking about theft and squatters. What about the other liabilities such as trip and falls?

The wireless locks and cameras are an added expense, and I would imagine that it is too much trouble to have an internet service setup just to cancel it a week later, unless part of your business model is to include basic internet services.

Developer · Houston TX · Member since 2018 · 423 posts · 400 votes

5y

@Mike Gordon

We usually pay $10-$20 for another tenant's wifi access or neighbor depending if SFR or Multi. Units rent fairly quickly so I agree the hassle of having wifi setup is too troublesome. There are new door locks that have the ability to work without wifi but they can get expensive. Our cameras use a prepaid sim card from Tmobile. No wifi is needed and no monthly contracts.

These locks have up to hundreds of codes you can program. You can set code that is only good for a certain period of time. So if the prospect wants to go see it on Saturday between 1-2 then you set code through your phone with access limiting to that time frame. If they come at 2:10 the code they received will not open the door.

The cameras allow you to see them come and go while the unit is empty. In my experience anyone sharing their cell number, paying deposit arent the ones that will show up and steal the copper lines. As another post mentioned above, posting a vacant property online or a sign on the front yard can attract thieves.

Changing wifi carrier or password does not do anything to the locks. They still use the stored codes. A new tenant that moves you can program their desired 4 digit code thus they dont have access to changing codes without notifying you. You can give contractor access the same way as you give to a prospect.

Hope I was able to answer your question.

Ibrahim Yamini

Member since 2020 · 101 posts · 32 votes

5y

I know someone who runs an Airbnb and they never show up to the property or has keys. I don’t fully understand how it works but he has an electronic lock that he lets the guests use. From my understanding, they type in the last four digits of their phone number to access the property. When they check out, the code is reset to a number that only he or the property manager knows.

Seems like it could be useful for what up you’re planning and you wouldn’t have to worry about keys. Just a thought

Developer · Houston TX · Member since 2018 · 423 posts · 400 votes

5y

@Joe Martella

The cameras are easy to put up and takedown. We don't leave them at the property after it is rented. So the cameras get used often. Allows us to sleep at night knowing if someone breaks in we will be alerted. Versus showing up to find front door smashed in or broken window and appliances stolen. Has been super helpful in the new builds that we do as well as keeping an eye on our empty units. Doesn't make sense if you have a few properties and they get rented fast but once someone scales and they have say 10 empty units all across town it can get costly to have someone go check on them weekly. Time is money.

Liability issue....... cant someone fall while you are showing the property? And if there is a tripping hazard should be taken care of before renting it out. The tenant can fall after renting the property. And of course, good insurance is priceless.

Rental Property Investor · Cherry Hill, NJ · Member since 2015 · 626 posts · 495 votes

5y

@Luciano A.

Tripping hazards should be taken care of before you show the property. You are correct. But you, as the owner aren’t present to dispute any claims made.

As for the cameras, how do you setup the internet

Eric James

Investor · Malakoff, TX · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes

5y

I find it ironic to read people saying that it isn't safe for landlords to show rentals to strangers in person but there is no risk to your rental by letting them see it without you being there in person.

Dylan Katz

OP

Member since 2020 · 9 posts · 2 votes

5y

@Luciano A.

Is there a specific brand of lock or cameras that you recommend? The type of locks youre describing are exactly what I was thinking.

Developer · Houston TX · Member since 2018 · 423 posts · 400 votes

5y

@Joe Martella

In my experience best protection is having GREAT insurance and umbrella policies in place. In regards to the cameras, these are the cameras we have liked using.

Can buy for around $200 on Amazon.
Reolink Outdoor 3G/4G LTE Mobile Cellular Battery Security Camera Reolink Go

You simply put in a sim card and download their app. Easy to use and the best thing is real-time. Has speaker so can speak and hear what is going on. We sometimes will welcome the prospect over the camera's speaker which sometimes surprises them but also lets them know we are watching lol.

Developer · Houston TX · Member since 2018 · 423 posts · 400 votes

5y

@Dylan Katz

I would look at

Kwikset 99390-004 Halo Wi-Fi Smart Lock Keyless Entry Electronic Touchscreen Deadbolt Featuring SmartKey Security, Iron Black

This gives you both the ability to use code entry but also allows you to rekey the lock when the tenant moves out. Kwikset SmartKey is great savings when the tenant moves out.

We normally will rekey to our office key when the unit is empty so all of our team members can have quick access then we rekey with new keys before a tenant moves in.