Boulder, CO · Member since 2016 · 22 posts · 4 votes
While I have been following real estate investing for a while, I haven't taken the plunge. With a bit more time on my hands due to this pandemic is letting me revisit it.
I'm interested in learning more about Pueblo, CO. I live in Boulder and know that Pueblo has a lot of potential and I'd like to learn more.
Can anyone point me to some good places to learn more? Perhaps there is a meetup (virtual of course) I could join?
Rental Property Investor · Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2019 · 29 posts · 33 votes
6y
@Joshua Zapin - I have been studying and looking in Pueblo seriously for a little while now. I recently bought my first investment property in Pueblo.
I think Pueblo is a great market overall. Since I don't personally live there, I don't know all of the neighborhoods as well as @Sam Dangremond seems to. I looked at his map, and for the most part, I would agree. My experience is that it's street by street, so dig in deeper in some of those areas and really get to know it.
One notable thing to be cognizant of is that there is a super fund (lead and arsenic contamination) in the middle of the city which is not on that map. I'm not going to say that it's necessarily an automatic no-go, but you should be aware that financing there is more difficult and you may have more legal disclosures/work to make sure you're doing it right. Might also be an opportunity for a pop once the government is done cleaning it up (some time in the next 2 to 20 years).
I don't know of any Pueblo specific REIA's inside the city. I've considered starting one, even though I live in the Springs. The REIA that normally is at 3rd space here in the Springs usually has a handful of Pueblo investors, so I'd encourage you to come visit sometime after all of this. I'd suggest that you even go to one in your area because, honestly, a very significant percentage of Pueblo is owned remotely from other cities farther north I-25 of Pueblo. You may find long distance investors in your area.
I will say that many of the major economic drivers for Pueblo are under attack with this crisis: Healthcare is suffering with non-elective procedures being forced to stop (and one of the two hospitals is perpetually in trouble even before this). The stock market crash is putting pressure on pensions and retirements, which is a non-negligible driver. CSU-Pueblo is in distance-learning mode (and based on national headlines, it seems likely that may continue for a while). And obviously, the direct short term issues we're all experiencing with the stay at home orders, etc will hurt significantly all on its own. I think some of these are more lasting than others and may take some time to rebound.
I often say that Pueblo is at the end of the whip of Colorado's economy - so it has higher highs and lower lows, relatively speaking. I think the lows are on the horizon and I'd be very careful to make sure that you have STRONG cash flow in the best of best areas if you're buying to hold and an amazing deal for flips.
For example, where we owned in Aurora in 2012 has approximately doubled in value. In that same time frame, many of the areas of Pueblo we've been looking in have 3-5x'd.
If you have any questions, please reach out. I like talking about Pueblo.
Investor · Pueblo, CO · Member since 2012 · 96 posts · 63 votes
6y
@Joshua Zapin
That map is neighborhood quality.
Yes, I own single family residential.
Tough to judge how the pandemic is really affecting things. My personal feeling is that commercial office space will be hit harder than residential.
I’d recommend Realtors Mike Tripp, Jim Towers, or Chris Pasternak.
Until this virus situation hit, Pueblo was very bullish. Good economic growth on the horizon with expansions of the steel mill and economic development surrounding the riverwalk. Check out The Pueblo Chieftain for lots of news stories. Overall, Pueblo has much lower cost of living than Colorado Springs and Denver, so we’re seeing lots of in-migration from the rest of the state as well as from other states.
Rental Property Investor · Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2019 · 29 posts · 33 votes
6y
@Joshua Zapin - I have been studying and looking in Pueblo seriously for a little while now. I recently bought my first investment property in Pueblo.
I think Pueblo is a great market overall. Since I don't personally live there, I don't know all of the neighborhoods as well as @Sam Dangremond seems to. I looked at his map, and for the most part, I would agree. My experience is that it's street by street, so dig in deeper in some of those areas and really get to know it.
One notable thing to be cognizant of is that there is a super fund (lead and arsenic contamination) in the middle of the city which is not on that map. I'm not going to say that it's necessarily an automatic no-go, but you should be aware that financing there is more difficult and you may have more legal disclosures/work to make sure you're doing it right. Might also be an opportunity for a pop once the government is done cleaning it up (some time in the next 2 to 20 years).
I don't know of any Pueblo specific REIA's inside the city. I've considered starting one, even though I live in the Springs. The REIA that normally is at 3rd space here in the Springs usually has a handful of Pueblo investors, so I'd encourage you to come visit sometime after all of this. I'd suggest that you even go to one in your area because, honestly, a very significant percentage of Pueblo is owned remotely from other cities farther north I-25 of Pueblo. You may find long distance investors in your area.
I will say that many of the major economic drivers for Pueblo are under attack with this crisis: Healthcare is suffering with non-elective procedures being forced to stop (and one of the two hospitals is perpetually in trouble even before this). The stock market crash is putting pressure on pensions and retirements, which is a non-negligible driver. CSU-Pueblo is in distance-learning mode (and based on national headlines, it seems likely that may continue for a while). And obviously, the direct short term issues we're all experiencing with the stay at home orders, etc will hurt significantly all on its own. I think some of these are more lasting than others and may take some time to rebound.
I often say that Pueblo is at the end of the whip of Colorado's economy - so it has higher highs and lower lows, relatively speaking. I think the lows are on the horizon and I'd be very careful to make sure that you have STRONG cash flow in the best of best areas if you're buying to hold and an amazing deal for flips.
For example, where we owned in Aurora in 2012 has approximately doubled in value. In that same time frame, many of the areas of Pueblo we've been looking in have 3-5x'd.
If you have any questions, please reach out. I like talking about Pueblo.
Colorado Springs · Member since 2019 · 17 posts · 7 votes
6y
@sam dangremond I like your map. LOL at Meh.
@Jeremy Norman I have a friend who is investing in the area and he has an investor buddy who has been investing there for a long time. It can be a good market with ups and downs. Have to be property and location specific like anywhere. I am looking at the market as well.
Boulder, CO · Member since 2016 · 22 posts · 4 votes
6y
@Jeremy Norman Thank you for that amazing insight. Super helpful. Could you summarize where the growth is coming from? I imagine some of it comes from being a bedroom community to Colorado Springs. But I know there is some growth going on as well.
I finally bought my first property in Pueblo about 2 months ago. I am still rehabbing it. I love Pueblo, but I also have found it to be tricky. I plan on staying in Pueblo. The numbers are lower, but it works for my budget.
Rental Property Investor · Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2019 · 29 posts · 33 votes
6y
@Todd Nagel - For sure. It's not all doom and gloom. I bought a 4 plex there in the beginning of the year, so obviously I think it's a worthwhile market. But, as you said, yes, you need to know it. People have absolutely lost their shirts there and I don't want to be one of them.
For instance, I have HOURS of video of me just driving up and down streets at different times of day and week making verbal notes about where I am and what I'm seeing. I also leaned heavily on others for real day to day experience. I usually gut check what I think I'm seeing with my realtor and some people who are familiar with the area. My tenants have offered lots of opinions about parts of the city they like and they don't (and I've often driven to the areas to determine if they were right). After all of that, there are only a few slim areas I'm running numbers, just because I know them well enough to feel comfortable and there are enough deals that I can be that picky.
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@Joshua Zapin - One of the reasons I like Pueblo is that it has (had?) a lot of growth engines for such a small town.
One of the more interesting in the area is that people are selling in the Denver area and moving down to Pueblo West where they can build brand new for less than they sold for and still keep a nest egg around. That seems to be attracting empty nesters and the like. While that alone is pretty good, it also fuels healthcare in Pueblo (proper) and secondary services like restaurants and the like. It's also worth noting that Pueblo's hospital system has a pretty decent feed zone between highway 50 (east/west) and southern I-25. You can see the impact this is having on northern Pueblo near the hospital where it is gentrifying (quickly). Also, north and north-west Pueblo is very nice (near Pueblo West), as you can see on the map @Sam Dangremond shared.
Another is CSU-Pueblo. Belmont (and especially the stuff right next to the campus) are pretty nice. They definitely are drafting some of the money coming in there - between student housing and staff housing as well. Aside from the college, there is a lot nearby that is attractive (eating, shopping, etc), etc. Walmart, target, and home depot are all nearby over here.
There are definitely some people who are commuting to Colorado Springs from Pueblo, one of my inherited tenants was one. I think that as prices go up in the Springs and the supply keeps being strained that will be the case. It doesn't hurt, but I don't think I would count on this as what keeps the economy humming.
There are also a handful of other primary industries around. There is a steel mill that has been around forever. In spite of its reputation it's actually only something like 700 jobs. It is no longer the largest employer in town even though Pueblo's website said it was as recently as last year. Trane (Nothing stops a Trane) has manufacturing in the area. There's even farming - pueblo is locally known for its chiles throughout southern Colorado (and yes, they are pretty good). There's even a pretty reputable water filter company down there, I hear.
Like I said earlier, I think Pueblo is going to get hurt more than Denver and Colorado Springs, only because, even though it has a lot of primary industries, they are less recession resistant than are available up north (I mean, Denver has the state capital and Politics are always in season, it seems). However, it's hopefully less boom-bust as it was in the past when steel was it's life-blood.
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After all that said, as @Rick Wade said, I think it is tricky too. There's a lot going on and its not as easy to find some services as you might in larger cities up north on I-25. Honestly, I personally like that too because it's a barrier to entry. Once you find people you trust, you have an unfair advantage. I'm not sure if that's what he's referring to, but that's been the tricky part of my experience.
I meant that sometimes you have to look deeper. I have had to really look at the market there from its own perspective, not from a universal perspective. The people in Pueblo have their own way of doing things. Just like you, I like this market and plan on being here for the long haul. I like the area and as I learn what works here and what does not, it becomes easier.
Rental Property Investor · York, PA · Member since 2013 · 101 posts · 30 votes
6y
My advice before investing in any new town is to sign up for all the wholesalers lists to see what's being offered. Don't buy anything for a bit. Just watch to see what properties are selling for and where. Call them, attend showing, and see if the deal would make sense to you.
Pueblo, CO · Member since 2019 · 22 posts · 12 votes
6y
Joshua,
I live, work, and own investment property in Pueblo County, I am happy to provide a market analysis for you. My background before real estate was computer consulting and accounting. You may connect with me right here on BP.
Does anyone have any insight into self storage in Pueblo? I'm a big fan of using self storage as a land bank. A quick google search returns about 16 self storage sites around pueblo.
Real Estate Consultant · Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2017 · 354 posts · 386 votes
6y
@Joshua Zapin - Have you looked at Security or Widefield? It's still pretty cheap, located between Pueblo and Colorado Springs, has good views, a military base and an Amazon facility coming soon. (Amazon is coming to south Colorado Springs, but that is relatively close to Widefield.) I think this is an area that has a lot of potential and sits between two very attractive investing cities.
Real Estate Broker · Pueblo, CO · Member since 2015 · 35 posts · 37 votes
6y
@Daniel Becht across the street from our office we have I would say at least 100 units going up. At one point Pueblo/Pueblo West was starved for storage units. I don't have any statistics per se to give you but I would say at the moment we are/will be flush with storage units in the area.
Rental Property Investor · Colorado Spgs, CO · Member since 2020 · 91 posts · 61 votes
6y
@Joshua Zapin have to say I appreciate you bringing the conversation up. I have looked through several times just to make sure I catch all the information in it. I have a property here in Colorado Springs but looking at generating cf here is tough. Pueblo looks like it has some real opportunities. I know someone here was saying 3rd space was a meetup for the local rei group, has that resumed or is it virtual? I’m finally finishing school and eager to learn more and find my next rental property.
@Joshua Zapin have to say I appreciate you bringing the conversation up. I have looked through several times just to make sure I catch all the information in it. I have a property here in Colorado Springs but looking at generating cf here is tough. Pueblo looks like it has some real opportunities. I know someone here was saying 3rd space was a meetup for the local rei group, has that resumed or is it virtual? I’m finally finishing school and eager to learn more and find my next rental property.
Hi Jeremy, the 3rd space meetup will resume in person 06/16. That meetup has been extremely beneficial for me over the last several years so I'd highly recommend.
Rental Property Investor · York, PA · Member since 2013 · 101 posts · 30 votes
6y
My advice for anyone looking to invest is to research the area, sign up for all the wholesalers lists, and have an agent send you all distressed properties on the MLS. Practice on these properties like you would actually invest. Visit the homes and talk with agent or wholesaler selling them. Once you've learned enough to feel comfortable, the only way to truly learn is to take the plunge and buy a property. We wholesale about three homes a month in Pueblo, and you can receive them at www.InvestInAHouse.com. Good luck!
Interesting approach Darren. I am new to rei (this is my first post on BP), live in Denver and currently learning as much as I can about various markets within Colorado.