Top 5 Recession Proof Assets; What's yours?

Top 5 Recession Proof Assets; What's yours?

Real Estate Investor · Hartford, CT · Member since 2011 · 222 posts · 17 votes

Hey BP,

I just finished with having a pretty neat conversation with my mentor. He owns a decent size real estated company. They invest in mutli-family markets around the U.S. And owns a little over 1700 units.

However, our conversation was about being "Recession Proof" now I now I've seen a few individuals on this site talk about this topic, paticularly Rich Weese and others about eventually becoming "Recession Proof/Prepared" for any, and most economic downtursn. He listed is 5 asset classes that he is currently involved in for this preparation:
- Multi-family housing (apartments)
- storage units
- oil & gas
- short terms loans/under a Year
- gold & silver

Now my question is, When EXACTLY is the right time to begin this preparation, when your finally pretty much done with investing? When your stabalizing? When you reach a certain networth?

Is your portfolio suppose to be made up of a paticular percentage of assests for this?

I'm just interested to know. Read a nice article on forbes, and they even mentioned ART! Which I heard is ok as well!!

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Virtual Assistant · Anaheim, CA · Member since 2013 · 167 posts · 44 votes
13y

My FAITH is my number 1 recession/depression/ no matter what happens asset.

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Lakewood, OH · Member since 2013 · 68 posts · 23 votes
    13y

    Oddly, that is the most complicated question I've ever seen asked here on BP. There are entire books of over 1000 pages written on portfolio management and asset allocation. You'll likely get some good opinions as other members here answer, but good golly it is a doozie of a question

    I can tell you CFP and CFA certified/chartered individuals will require additional information including life goals, risk tolerance, age, human capital, lifestyle expenses, etc. They'd use this to set asset allocations to meet this.

    I don't want to totally dodge the question, so I'll offer that typically the asset classes that other proclaim to be "recession proof" such as commodities (eg oil & gas, gold & silver) and money market/t-bill (loans under year) offer lower expected returns. On average, In 1 year or 1,000 years from now an ounce of gold will still be an ounce of gold and worth exactly what it is today. After taxes (remember taxes are based on nominal gains not real returns) you typically lose purchasing power/wealth

    Short term speculators may rush into any asset thinking they know the future and the efficient market hypothesis is wrong. But, most sophisticated long term investors only allocate small portions (less than 5%) of their portfolio to these low (or negative) expected return assets in exchange for their diversification and downside risk benefits.

    Now, multi-family housing and storage units are a little different. They are not only a commodity but also utilized to add value to society and offer a lot of the downside risk hedging while still offering some level of real return.

    This is a bit cryptic and dodgy of an answer, but I hope it is at least of some help

  • Commercial Landlord · Oshkosh, WI · Member since 2013 · 299 posts · 88 votes
    13y

    The best time to begin investing is today. Starting today insures financial security and freedom we all seek sooner rather then later. The keys are this Get cash reserves in place. Next add insurance and investments and last begin to diversity and add more assets.
    What you decide to invest in has a lot to do with your personality. I like garden stye apt buildings and homes and land. Its just my favorite.
    When I get cash I convert a little into silver and gold coinage and bullion. Not much but enough to make me feel cozy. I also believe owning business when you get too much cash build up is a good idea. Own a car lot or a pizza joint after all if you need cashflow sometimes a small business can be a nice place for cashflow.
    The apt buildings are a place for residual income and they are long term ways to store wealth and receive income monthly.
    Notice I haven't even mentioned the stock market or bond market or anything else related to Wall street. I have spent most of my career staying away from paper assets because I felt a lack of control. I like to be in control over the asset. Its easier to cut costs when you are the owner and you are the entire board as well;) The words Enron and Madoff are other reasons i stay away from the paper asset world. I dont have to worry as much about corruption when Im collecting!
    I like owning gold and silver bullion and coins and I would have 12 to 15 years ago told you not to bother having more then 1 to 2% in your portfolio but today with whats happened with the monetary system lately I think 5% is not too much. This is all opinion mind you. the guys on Wall street would say I am nuts but hey most of the brokers over there are broke too. I own my home free and clear and a great deal of real estate mortgage free as well. It has been a long road for me and I am finished being taken advantage of by Wall street. Last time I cashed out of Wall street I used the money to buy real estate and I have not looked back since. Silver I bought at 6 dollars and ounce I have cashed out once already to buy a house. Im not spending a ton of money buying new assets maybe 15k to 20k a year invested of my cash. I am now just maintaining what I have and working on projects to go green with my assets or add value to land I own. Its hard to quit after you get rich doing it because its like a cookie in a cookie jar you keep coming back to. I try to travel at least 4 times a year and I quick working 70 hour weeks so I could actually get to know my family again. It was worth the hard work.
    Assets should be income producing and that will make them liquid. Owning smaller homes in addition to large apt buildings makes it possible for me to access a quick 50k if I need to sell off one asset for what ever I need.
    I have done some commercial deals in the past and if you can stomach the risk I would say they can really pay off. Its lower returns and longer term 10 years vs a house flip might be a 6 month investment. Owning a strip mall or office building is a safe place to park some big cash if you have it.
    I stick to apts because I know it. Whether you buy land and cruise timber or farm or do orchards,pizza joints,industrial property it has to be in your personality for it to work. What keeps bringing me back to homes and apts is I love to renovate living space its my 1st love. My second love is landscaping and working up land for orchards and gardens and green space.
    What ever your dream is should be where you put most of your eggs even if the eggs are spread out in a bunch of different investments.
    Having investments in multiple markets after you get some assets under your belt is a good idea as well as trying out more then one type of asset.
    My biggest worry today is about America and the dollar and will our economy be able to compete against China or ect. While I might be ok with fewer dollars or a shrinking dollar I shudder to think what will happen to a huge part of the lower middle class when the coming devaluation actually happens. What are my assets worth if my customers cant pay rent or buy my apples or ect.? Being rich means nothing if there isnt money circulating in an economy. The Fed QE 1-2-3 is a concern and I figure the best we have to look forward to is 70's style inflation. But maybe with a shrinking economy , austerity and less spending maybe deflation happens? Who knows. as long as things dont degrade into chaos those that plan should be ok.. Anyone here is planning if they are buying real estate to hold especially income property.
    My friend just got back from the Philippines a week ago and he commented to me how interesting it was that even though the masses there are dirt poor somehow the price of land there is more per acre for each lot then in many places in the US? His second home is on one of the smaller islands away from Manila. So dont go thinking its because its a large metro area he is in its expensive;). You see 3+ billion Asians like land and precious metals and they are beginning to buy. What do you think will happen globally as our population increases and billions begin to finally have spending money for assets? Now is a great time to buy and sit on it for the next 20 to 30 years.

  • Real Estate Investor · Hartford, CT · Member since 2011 · 222 posts · 17 votes
    13y

    Huggy- thanks for the response. i am very sure that this is not a an easy anser, and that there are a TON of variables on this topic. i just wanted to see hat everyone else's perspective was. I know this was mentioned before, but things change really quick in this industry so i was trying to see if responses changed! thanks alot though!

    William Bannister- phenominal post. my mentor actually mentioned the same advice that you were giving. It really does depend on your personality. He really stressed to me how important this was though to be prepared, especially with the declining of the middle class.

    its funny that you mentioned apple orchards. i actually know a guy who owns a great deal of orchards (forgot what kind) in the phillipenes, and he is turning some great coin there for him and his family.

    Owning some real estate free and clear, even your residence is another topic we touched on in case you needed to free up some cash for an emergency. Rich Weese speaks on alot on this same topic.

    My main question was defintly ansered. i know that now is the time to buy, i just wasnt sure when was the time to start diversifying your assets. Your points were very identical to what he mentioned.

    Any extra advice is always welcomed! especially for new bucks!!! :)

  • Durham, NC · Member since 2012 · 498 posts · 48 votes
    13y

    If there is another global recession, oil is the first thing to drop!

  • Real Estate Investor · Hartford, CT · Member since 2011 · 222 posts · 17 votes
    13y

    Xing Zhu great point...i actually read a few articles on that.

    however, dont have to much knowledge on that topic....fee free to chime!

    GM

  • Lender · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2012 · 714 posts · 169 votes
    13y

    If you have a couple extra dollars at the end of the month, go to a local coin store and buy some silver coins. If you have a lot of money at the end of a few months, buy a gold coin!!!

  • Real Estate Investor · the villages, FL · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    13y

    Geoffrey M- I guess brilliant minds think a like! Seriously, if there were still some secrets to discover in regards to real estate I would be shocked.

    Corey D-I agree with your suggestion on buying silver and gold coins. I would suggest that buyers looking for a hedge against inflation would stay with the smaller coins. 1/10 ounce and 1?5 ounce are my favorites in gold and I prefer junk silver coins and 1 ounce ingots. No bars for me! Rich

  • Commercial Landlord · Oshkosh, WI · Member since 2013 · 299 posts · 88 votes
    13y

    Regarding the purchase of coins if you go online to a coin broker like monex or kitco or a reputable broker you can buy bags of lose silver or just coins at prices barely above spot. You get better prices per ounce and can pay less then 1 dollar over spot. Some times they want a couple grand to send u a bag of silver since its hard for them to split bags into small amounts + they like bigger purchases. There has been some fake stuff going around silver plated crap watch out for that and make sure your broker/dealer is willing to bet you the farm what your getting is what you paid for. Dont let it stop you from investing in silver and gold though just be very careful what brokers and dealers your getting it from. I like the popular coins they are much easier to resell and they can appreciate faster over time. My favorite coin is the walking liberty you can never go wrong with these. Morgan dollars are the other ones I like.
    If you trust a local dealer which isnt easy these days to buy just a few pieces of silver a month. I am always a little nervous but if they have been in business long enough maybe that helps. The stuff I am buying now are 1 ounce coins, 10 ounce, 100 ounce silver bars. I am also on occasion buying gold ounce coins. The 1/5th version of the gold and silver I may begin to purchase but at the current price of 32 per ounce I think a silver 1 ounce coin splits up your investment to a small enough denomination that if it was even used for something like money you could just trade a coin for what ever your buying. Once silver hits 100 dollars an ounce I might be inclined to get some 1/5 ounce silver or just buy silver dimes;) This will make the purchase small enough to use as normal currency if you are wanting that.
    Im not a dooms day guy but since they have been passing silver and gold for thousands of years it seems more stable then paper currency is.
    If you have ever seen a one trillion dollar zimbabwe note its pretty funny. In 1946 Hungary printed a note with 20 zeros on it! 100 quintillion note! Hey can I get a loaf of bread for a 100 quadrillion, NOT. Hey you have a silver dime ya sure no problem here is your bread and some eggs.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    13y

    In a depression the GDP falls, it is the slowing of the consumption function or products and services being consumed less than an economy in balance. To hedge against recessionary effects an investor needs to look at products and services that are more necessary for society. At the micro level....Food, clothing and shelter being the main three required anywhere.

    IMO, in hard times, such as the Great Depression, people will "make do", clothing and textiles are products that can be ignored by most consumers, items owned can be repaired, traded and fabricated from other items, like Scarlet's gown from drapes. The fabric store has done well long term, people will repair/recover things before buying new, if it's nicer furniture.

    Shelter is what most of us deal with here, but saying multi-family or even SFH, is not really recession proof in the long run if you own in less populated areas. In a small town if people are unemployed they don't have income to pay rents or mortgages. Vacancies rise and rents are reduced as a result. Look to Detroit, certainly not a small town, but even there the population remaining is not sufficient to keep properties occupied and retain values.

    Land and improvements owned is a good hedge as rents or income produced does not hinge on meeting any liabilities, with the exception of taxes. Mine are residential, one recreational and one commercial/agricultural unimproved acreage, all for my own consumption. (There are apple trees on the farm, LOL)

    If you don't eat you'll die. Obviously investing in food production, processing, storage and delivery is a good bet. Don't go put your money in a restaurant chains, but in a grocery store partnership for example ( :) ) In recessionary times, restaurants can get killed.

    Speaking of dying, phamaceuticals are also a good recession proof ploy, not in just medicines but also in medical equipment and assessories.

    Commodities like gold and silver seem to be the choice of all of these preppers, we have over 50 pounds of this stuff and IMO not that handy except as to the appreciated value over the years. Seems many think we will be trading troy's again...LOL

    My notes are pretty safe, I have held my breath over the past five years but no problems, knock on wood, but in a really bad recession defaults would/could go up.

    Bars/lounge are pretty safe if they are not highly leveraged and have low overhead, I'm pretty safe with particapations and the fringe benefits aren't bad. Some folks keep drinking even in bad times.

    Fixed and Variable Annuities can be fine to park retirement cash, staying with large insurance companies like Prudential and Metropolitan. These companies paid out during the Great Depression, pretty deversified for hands off, but yields are low.

    Oil and gas leases in production are okay, you can buy these at a discount making them more attractive, as mentioned above production would slow eventually to demand. Retail natural gas has been good and I'd think retail heating oil in the north would be okay.

    Don't do much stock anymore, seems like industrial robotics will be good and R&D in medical robotics. Since the federal government is behind the medical side, some real break throughs are on the way I'm sure.

    Other stocks might be an interest; Government contractors in high tech R&D, batteries, optics, and software, but I know nothing about software, just what I'm told.

    Aluminum should be getting better as China keeps demand up, guess you could pick up cans, LOL.

    Lastly, guns and ammo, no angel funding here. Sales are up in recessionary times, a good indicator of social fears and consumer expectations. Wonder what the value of my AR is now? Hmmm....

  • Accountant, Enrolled Agent · Grayslake, IL · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    13y

    Bill Gulley,

    I just read an article that some ARs have tripled and quadrupled in market value.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    13y

    Should have bought a hundred of them back then, LOL, I might swing by the gun shop, I'd rather have a mini 14 I think, I can't carry the AR out without being watched now......

    Sorry for the ot comment....back to investments.....

  • Investor · Little Rock, AR · Member since 2010 · 628 posts · 251 votes
    13y

    Call me a redneck....
    But, have you tried to purchase any ammo lately? It is only a matter of time before they start gouging.
    Don

  • Real Estate Investor · Hartford, CT · Member since 2011 · 222 posts · 17 votes
    13y

    Great thrad guys. I appreciate all of the advice!!!

    GM

  • Virtual Assistant · Anaheim, CA · Member since 2013 · 167 posts · 44 votes
    13y

    My FAITH is my number 1 recession/depression/ no matter what happens asset.

  • Specialist · Memphis, TN · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    13y

    The other glaring omission in my opinion in the initial list is international real estate. It is unlikely the whole world will be in recession at the same time. I came to the USA market because the New Zealand market was in recession. That market is now booming again so to be recession proof I would have some funds in overseas real estate.

  • Specialist · Portland, OR · Member since 2010 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    13y

    Having cash is great during a recession.

  • Investor · Arroyo Grande, CA · Member since 2012 · 23 posts · 8 votes
    13y

    Thought student housing was one of them. Got into it, and TIC management, economy etc changed it , may lose it too!!!

  • Real Estate Investor · the villages, FL · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    13y

    It looks like this topic has been regenerated. I did post previously in this thread, but really didn't answer the question stated in the title. I'm not really that concerned about recession proof assets but in security assets. Among those would be food, water, cash, real estate of all types if possible, and bullion type gold and silver. Rich

    Kris-I also was involved in student housing, – –!! Once.

  • Developer · Garland, TX · Member since 2008 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    13y

    Nothing is fool proof, but simply owning low cost rentals where you can afford to drop the rent and undercut most of the competition seems prudent.

    Bill, a hundred ARs might get you a visit from the ATF. They may insist on coming in your house.

    A guy I know bought a bunch of SKS's several years ago for about $100 each. He doesn't plan on selling.

    .22 ammo has pretty much doubled in price. My local Wal-Marts are all out of stock. Interesting in that it isn't military or assault ammo. Ammo has long shelf life. Again, there's that ATF issue if you hoard a truck load.

  • Developer · Garland, TX · Member since 2008 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    13y

    Another one, more of a lifestyle choice for us than prepper behavior. We have cattle and goats. I also just had a two acre lake put in. Water demand is rising. Plus we'll stock it.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    13y

    Jon, kidding about 100 ARs, while I'm sure something could be worked out with a dealer, like financing inventory, probably not a viable time/effort investment.

    2 acre lake sounds like a good swimming hole, will your dept. of natural resources stock it free? They do here!

    I'm not too concerned about water, lake front on Table Rock Lake, on the White River main channel, with a good well too.

    Your animal ranch is too labor intensive for me, a guy down by the lake grows rabbits and chickens, a strange prepper type that thinks everyday will be the last, uses a 1/4 tank of gas and tops it off.

  • Real Estate Investor · the villages, FL · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    13y

    I had a gentlemans' ranch in Oregon in 1980-being self sufficient and worrying about kids (4 at the time). We had 31 acres, purchased 10 steers, built a 1 acre lake which was stream fed from our stream with an island in the middle and a dock on the side, over a half-million board feet of commercial timber, a food storage room and even planted a 50 tree fruit orchard. I've never worked so hard in my life! We lived in the rain for two years and then finally ran for cover to another state! Ranching is not for me. Rich

  • Investor · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 450 votes
    13y

    Diversification is the only "proof". And even then, it is only "resistant" and not "proof".

    I was having a conversation with my dad about inflation, which can be similar in effect to recession, and came to the conclusion that I just don't have enough assets to protect myself against it. Not yet, at least.

    There is a time for concentration and a time for diversification. It is really quite silly for someone with limited funds and assets to go out and buy gold, land, water, etc. Until you have some significant wealth, you just hinder your progress by making such investments in most cases.

    If I split my extra money off into all the different places my dad does, I'd never live long enough to see any significant gain in any one of the investments. Now, if I play my cards right and work hard and have some preparedness to meet opportunity, then maybe I will be able to "talk" about the luxury of diversification.

    Having a marketable education and/or skillset can go a long way to keep you afloat in good and bad times.

  • Real Estate Investor · Hartford, CT · Member since 2011 · 222 posts · 17 votes
    13y

    Brian Hoyt- you definitely have a point. That wouldnt make any sense. Its almost as if your eating your seed corn!

  • Ian IppolitoBusiness Member
    Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    11y

    Here's my two cents:

    There are many recession resistant investments, that do better than the average investment during a recession. However, that just means that they don't drop as much as the others: they still drop. There are very few recession loving investments, that are guaranteed to increase during a recession. Part of the problem is that there are different types of recessions. Things that do well in a normal business recession, can be horrible places in a financial credit recession.

    If a recession is coming in the next 1 to 3 years, two strategies makes sense:

    1) short-term investments that will mature in two years or less. For example, making hard money loan/bridge loans. Even better, is to do this now (while the expansion is fairly healthy) and also reducing exposure over the next year or two. So when the downturn occurs, you'll be minimally exposed.

    2) long-term investments that you intend to hold through the recession and into the next cycle.Preferably, they should be fairly recession resistant so that you see a positive return on investment earlier in the next cycle. For example: mobile home parks, self storage, Senior assisted living.

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