Rental Property Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2020 · 49 posts · 23 votes
So I haven't heard from my tenants in 1 month. I'm a long distance real estate investor and my PM company has called, texted, e-mailed, sent out smoke signals but tenants are still refusing to answer. They initially stated that they were going to pay me for the first 2 months, but now they're refusing to answer. My tenants are now 3 months behind in rent and I have e-mailed possible solutions/modifications for rent payment anddd still nothing. Any suggestions on how to go about this given delayed eviction in the midst of this pandemic? And I know for sure that they're in thee house.
South Holland, IL · Member since 2017 · 374 posts · 432 votes
6y
@Jay B.
I agree with @Dan Nelson
Give 24 hour notice to enter because you believe the property is abandoned (because of no response). I GUARANTEE you the tenant will start to communicate again. 100%. This is the technique I’ve used. All of a sudden they know how to communicate.
Investor · Little Rock, IA · Member since 2015 · 136 posts · 72 votes
6y
Sell and invest in a different state. Your tenants have you over a barrel and they know it. IL and Chicago specifically has some of the most tenant friendly laws in the country. Add COVID 19 on top of that and you have no chance of getting any rent from them unless THEY feel like paying you.
These are not the type of tenants you want in your property. The fact that they are not responding says a lot about them. They have no intentions on paying, otherwise they would be responding to make payment arrangements. They have money coming in from unemployment and the stimulus package, there really is no reason not to pay. As soon as the restrictions are lifted on evictions, I would have my attorney file.
Send the judgement to a debt collector, they generally take 50%, but that is better than nothing. It may take a few years before you see anything but I would go after the funds they owe you because of how they decided to handle it.
If a tenant called and asked to be let out of their lease because of all this and were willing to hand over keys, I would let them out and not go after them.
But when people don't have common courtesy, and are making the situation much harder than it has be. It is more than fair to go after the funds in their bank account with garnishments.
Rental Property Investor · Corona, CA · Member since 2015 · 46 posts · 8 votes
6y
I agree with John, so many property management companies are strictly management from a desk, whisch is why we developed our own PM division....they should be doing all these things for you. But if you don’t want to offer cash for keys, i would position for an eviction at first opportunity
These are not the type of tenants you want in your property. The fact that they are not responding says a lot about them. They have no intentions on paying, otherwise they would be responding to make payment arrangements. They have money coming in from unemployment and the stimulus package, there really is no reason not to pay. As soon as the restrictions are lifted on evictions, I would have my attorney file.
Send the judgement to a debt collector, they generally take 50%, but that is better than nothing. It may take a few years before you see anything but I would go after the funds they owe you because of how they decided to handle it.
If a tenant called and asked to be let out of their lease because of all this and were willing to hand over keys, I would let them out and not go after them.
But when people don't have common courtesy, and are making the situation much harder than it has be. It is more than fair to go after the funds in their bank account with garnishments.
Thank you for your response. This is so true. Thank you.
I agree with John, so many property management companies are strictly management from a desk, whisch is why we developed our own PM division....they should be doing all these things for you. But if you don’t want to offer cash for keys, i would position for an eviction at first opportunity
Thank you so much for your response. There is a lot to consider here. I appreciate your advice.
Sell and invest in a different state. Your tenants have you over a barrel and they know it. IL and Chicago specifically has some of the most tenant friendly laws in the country. Add COVID 19 on top of that and you have no chance of getting any rent from them unless THEY feel like paying you.
Thank you for your response. I appreciate this forum. I did not know how tenant friendly Chicago was.
Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
6y
I hate cash for keys. Here is an analogy: The slime balls that encrypt your data and hold it ransom do so because people pay them. If no one paid them, there would be no incentive to keep doing this.
Similarly, you pay a tenant for keys. There is no eviction on the tenants record. Some landlord in the future rents to these slime balls when they pass his checks maybe after living somewhere else for a year. They then do their slime ball behavior to the LL. Well it is not you. Well at some point it could be you. You could get a tenant that has no eviction because he got paid to leave on "good terms". It basically is passing the buck. Someone will get stuck with this bad tenant that should have an eviction on their record. That LL may end up doing a cash for keys. The tenant is being rewarded for bad behavior. It does not take a rocket scientist for them to realize that they can do this again and again until some LL decides to break the cycle.
Why not be the LL that breaks the cycle? I will not do cash for keys. I explain to the tenants that in my town the vacancy rate is very low (not sure what the vacancy rate is in Chicago). Any blemish on their tenant history will relegate them to the worst rentals from this point forward. They pay every time. Of course, normally the courts are not shut down ...
Naperville, IL · Member since 2018 · 330 posts · 357 votes
6y
I used to agree with Dan, but have changed my mind after a couple awful tenants. Just putting them in my rearview mirror and freeing up my property is worth a lot. And I have never relied on landlord recommendation as I know they can be utter b.s. So I don't feel bad about "passing on" the professional tenant...and I screen much better and haven't had a jackass in 5 years now, I've been a REI for ten.
Rental Property Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2020 · 49 posts · 23 votes
6y
@Dan Heuschele Thank you for your response. This is a great analogy. However, I do worry about the cost in legal fees. I understand it’s something that has to be done, but the cost and time especially during the pandemic makes it challenging.
Rental Property Investor · Riviera Beach FL · Member since 2017 · 89 posts · 54 votes
6y
@Quincy Lockett thank you!! I have a Detroit tenant that hasnt pay rent in 2months since the lockdown and not responding to us. Your 24 hour to enter works like a CHARM
So I haven't heard from my tenants in 1 month. I'm a long distance real estate investor and my PM company has called, texted, e-mailed, sent out smoke signals but tenants are still refusing to answer. They initially stated that they were going to pay me for the first 2 months, but now they're refusing to answer. My tenants are now 3 months behind in rent and I have e-mailed possible solutions/modifications for rent payment anddd still nothing. Any suggestions on how to go about this given delayed eviction in the midst of this pandemic? And I know for sure that they're in thee house.
I think cash for keys is more valuable now more than ever with the courts being closed. Best of luck.
Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2019 · 471 posts · 342 votes
6y
Times are changing. I do not have this issue, but empathize with the many that do.
Used to be, that when rent was due this week, and you didn't have it to give, you were taken out of the property and dealt with directly. Sometimes the land lord would walk through your house and help himself to what was of value first, and THEN have you placed on the street by thugs. You didn't need to actually be late for your rent, as if the landlord THOUGHT you couldn't pay, he might just move on you a bit earlier just because!
Yes, THIS is the Chicago Way! This is also why a lot of wooden hotels went up in smoke. Ahh, the days before cheap insurance!
So now we have a legal system to prevent much of this. Landlords had too much power, and the limits were enforced by the courts.
Our constitutional protections against government taking control over our property without just compensation have been violated. Now is when we need to move to the REDRESS protections in our constitution and demand a satisfactory justice.
In this day and age, so many seem to think that if you do not return a phone call or an instant message, you have committed a crime. Because you bang on the door, and I ignore you, that is supposed to be illegal too. Actually, a tenant not answering your phone call or other message, is no large issue. I know we feel all powerful because we own these properties, and we sometimes demand that our tenants perhaps show us more respect than any OTHER bill collector.
As the nation ends it's Voluntary requests from government officials and so-called community leaders, we will get through this. I don't see us getting back to where we were January 1st. Every time we as a nation agree to be dictated to by our government, we find the rules have changed. Fear does this. So let's move on and make the best of it!
If there is no better qualified rent prospective begging to get into one of your rent delinquent properties, and if your property is in a safe way, you can withstand even more months of no payments. You don't want to, but you can. If you have a property manager, understand that he is broke too! Even if you pulled the tenants out in the middle of the night, your payments would not resume. I suggest patience.
I am the kind of landlord that takes the front and back door off a property for repair, and does not come back until the house is empty. Did that a few times. Worked every time, but there ARE risks to this that could cost more than your rent. Patience is what I work on a lot!
A few here on Bigger Pockets have expressed that when the rent is late, the notices go out on schedule. It's nothing personal, and it's business for profit! Never be ashamed that you do something for profit. You have stated that the process has begun. That is great! You can now, only petition the courts. You are not alone.
I am in Rockford. In February I was about to purchase a few rental properties in the poorer parts of town. The deals did not go through. had they went through, I would have been very stuck. This is a very educational time we are going through! Hold on, as I think I see a few more curves and dips in the tracks ahead!
Attorney · Chicagoland · Member since 2019 · 103 posts · 90 votes
6y
I'm an attorney in Chicago, and I do mostly real estate and tenancy. For right now, there's no real way that you can evict them for non-payment of rent. The judge simply won't let you appear to get a judgment, so no matter what you do to evidence that they should be paying you, they're living there, and they aren't paying you, you won't get a signed judgment that evicts them.
I would say even sending a 5-day letter is a mistake. The FDCPA says that you cannot make communications with legal action against a borrower that you can't or won't take. You can't evict them right now if they don't pay within 5 days, and frankly, we don't know when the Courts will resume. I have some cases set for the first week of June, but I really expect those are going to get continued again. A savvy tenant, or a tenant with a savvy legal-aid representative, will hit you with a consumer debt collection practices counterclaim for doing eviction-related tasks during the stay.
I turned on notices for this thread so I can reply and help if you need.
Rental Property Investor · Anthem, AZ · Member since 2014 · 7 posts · 10 votes
6y
Assuming you are referring to the federal FDCPA, the part you are referring to I am guessing refers to 807 False or misleading communications. That section applies to "debt collectors" and the definition of "debt collector" in 803 generally excludes persons collecting a debt that they originated as long as they are collecting the debt using their own name.
Further, the "threat to take action" section doesn't say an action that you can't take, it says an action that cannot be legally taken. The usual 5-day notice in Illinois notifies a tenant that they either pay or their lease will be terminated. I am not aware that terminating leases in Illinois has been made illegal, if you have information to the contrary I would appreciate reading it.
I do understand the risk of a litigious client, even if a landlord is fully complying with the law, and is always a risk that should be considered. There seems to be little reason, IMO, to send a 5-day notice given that it will accomplish little at this point so your advice is not unreasonable though I think the reasoning can be simply be that it is ineffective.
Attorney · Chicagoland · Member since 2019 · 103 posts · 90 votes
6y
@Account Closed Illinois' FDCPA prevents debt collectors from threatening suit when a suit is impossible. That's the section to which I'm referring. 225 ILCS 425/9(a)(20) prevents a debt collector from threatening a legal remedy which does not presently exist. Debt collectors are completely screwed by the Illinois orders, including order 2020-10.
Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2011 · 73 posts · 35 votes
6y
We're still going thru the motions of serving 5 Day Notices. The tenants we're dealing with are not being evicted b/c of the effects of Covid 19, but of their own actions. And using the crisis as another excuse to stay and not pay.
The moratorium on evictions ends on Mon, 5/18. That means that if you had a judges order for the eviction prior to the stay at home order, but the sheriff wasn't able to serve it, starting next week they are able to. Whether they do or not is another thing.
My attorney told me today that we are able to e-file the eviction w/ the county, but it won't be heard until the courts open in June.
Investor · Newtown Square, PA · Member since 2015 · 132 posts · 149 votes
6y
@Quincy Lockett this is a great idea that I have used several times. I post an abandonment notice to the door stating that we will enter in 5 days to change locks and secure the property.