Tax Overages
Saint Paul, MN · Member since 2014 · 6 posts · 9 votes
Anyone know if this tax Overages program with Rick Dawson and Bob Diamond is for real or legit? Thinking about adding this to my portfolio just want to make sure i'm not being scammed with this.
Thanks
Andre
like most things when dealing with government when they have money in their possession they don't want to give it up, they want to keep it, even though it isn't theirs. I
example is California tax sale overages, note I don't know the current law, they had a chance for the ex-owner to claim overages for one year. Of course those that even knew there was a tax sale didn't know about any possible overage, they just thought the property was gone and that was that, and the counties were not going to hunt them down and tell them, so after one year they got to keep the money. And that was fair because they wanted the money to help some poor politician out that had to drive a two year old car and needed a raise to cover a new one, or some other worthy public need.
I did this for several years as a side activity and one day a county supervisor said to me, do you know how much your costing the county each year? Of course I knew a ton about him and said not as much as that feather bedding wife of yours. I knew her office second in command and if his wife even showed up at all in her department to head it, it probably didn't add up to 18 days a year.
Any way most states passed laws to limit finders fees to help keep the money in their coffers. The official bs was we are saving consumers from being abused by finders. The real fact is they get to keep the money because the real owner is very unlikely to ever find out about it without a finder showing up. .But I bypassed those laws by actually buying the rights to the money. The actual owner could get his money now, It is theirs and they have a right to sell their rights to it. And I upset some treasurers that viewed these kinds of moneys as government slush funds.
One person I knew in Washington state just used to send a postcard saying you have X dollars due you. I will tell you where it is for 5% of the amount you have coming, save this card because I won't ask again and many sources of funds due people have time limits to collect or you lose the money. The state had a 5% finders limit at the time and
@Rick H. Is this a 13100 affidavit situation? If so, can you make a tax overage claim as a partial interest?
You can claim anything you want, however, what it all boils down to will be some guy or gal who feels overworked that makes the call based on their assessment of the situation.
I have one going in LA county right now where I only have one if the heirs signed up. I always use an attorney, too. This gives my claims the air of credibility.
The county has been putting me off for 3 years. I finally got appointed as administrator with a full probate powers and they still balk. I may have to sue however the big joke us on me because Medi-Cal has put in claims exceeding my $170,000+ Surplus claim.
You can try anything, however the issue with a 13100 Affidavit is that:
1) Medi-Cal must still be noticed!
2) Cash or reall estate, if DoD value over $150,000 you still need to probate.
The thought thing is to find a way to be a secured creditor such as mortgage lender of record prior to the tax sale.
Btw, I spend all day today with my friend David who lives near you right by the mission. Would have called but hey, learn so much from hanging with my friend!
@Rick Harmon
The personal property (the overage) of the estate is over the 150K limit to do a 13100 affidavit, unless we can argue that at the time of death the property was worth under 150k because of the condition it was in? So it looks like I will have to do a probate? What do I need to get started on this ? can I do it myself or do I need the heir to initiate this? Is it wise to buy out any of the heirs I can now or should I stick with the assignment and contingency fee method? What's my best strategy here, in your opinion?
BTW Thanks for the help @Rick Harmon and @K. marie P.
Valuation of the estate is based on date of death, not what the overages are today. What's the date of death of the last living joint tenant? It's pretty unlikely there is no Medi-Cal debt. That's one of the reasons properties go to tax sale in CA. Ask the heir what kind of health care the decedent had.
@K. marie P.
I'm going to the city to dig up the death certificate later this week. I just know it was a few years ago. As for the medi-cal debt, how would I got about finding out how much they owe? Let's assume the family has no idea and I need to figure it out myself.
@K. marie P.
I'm going to the city to dig up the death certificate later this week. I just know it was a few years ago. As for the medi-cal debt, how would I got about finding out how much Fthey owe? Let's assume the family has no idea and I need to figure it out myself.
For the most part you can't. You have to open the probate and notify Medi-Cal. If it were easy everyone would be doing probate and overages. :)
Ready, shoot, aim.
Why not just spend the money and take the risk?
Sure, the attorney will only talk to his/her client going forward. Sure, DHCS (Medi-Cal) has a high shot of taking all the money (like one I have now, and others before it). So, you be out the money for the filing fee, the bond, the referee. Attorney and PR each receive their stat fee.
Do ya feel lucky ? Well, do ya?
Ready, shoot, aim.
Why not just spend the money and take the risk?
Sure, the attorney will only talk to his/her client going forward. Sure, DHCS (Medi-Cal) has a high shot of taking all the money (like one I have now, and others before it). So, you be out the money for the filing fee, the bond, the referee. Attorney and PR each receive their stat fee.
Do ya feel lucky ? Well, do ya?
Well I have been know to be a gambler. I'm gonna roll the dice on this one a see what happens :)
@Natasha Wade In order to work on behalf of a claimant, they are required to sign a waiver that will release the funds to you or the legal representative that is working the claim. My company has processed approximately $8,000,000 this year in unclaimed funds on behalf of our clients
Original Post by Brian P:
Joe Kaiser has been mentioned for Washington and I would have told new investors to use his info in many areas of investing. I kind of thought he was a brother I didn't know I had. I did do a couple of tax sale deals in that state just like Joe and I felt the states real interest was not consumer protection but state slush fund protection. Joe knew how to get the overages and the state hated writing checks to him and reducing their slush fund balance and they were willing to spend tons of tax payer money to stop him.
@Brian P, @John Reed, & @K. marie P.
Do any of you advise working multiple states and not just one exclusively? If so, how many states should one realistically expect to work? What are some ways to avoid being targeted by officials who are looking for reasons to squeeze you out of the market? Perhaps I should consider joining the BBB and setting up a website to establish credibility.
Thanks everyone for their valuable feedback!
Original Post by Melissa Burtley:
Do any of you advise working multiple states and not just one exclusively? If so, how many states should one realistically expect to work? What are some ways to avoid being targeted by officials who are looking for reasons to squeeze you out of the market? Perhaps I should consider joining the BBB and setting up a website to establish credibility.
I should also probably add that I'd like to work the state of Oregon. However, I don't have any other states on my list at this point. Is that a bad thing??
@Melissa B. Those are awesome questions I'm going bring the COO of our company @Glen Arnell in to this discussion. He spends 40+ hours a week managing our day to day recovery.
@Melissa B. First of all I want to thank John for including me in your question. My first suggestion is do not work Oregon for the following reason...A property owner can skirt their taxes for 6 years before the property goes to auction and then the "county" takes "ownership" and then sales the property at auction. Thus the property owner that we would be "skip tracing" will never have rightful claim to the excess proceeds even if excess is created. This process is a state wide statute.
However Melissa don't let Oregon burst your bubble...there are several states and counties available to work. One of the things that was important to me when I began my overage business was to identify "when" and how "often" tax sales occur. My goal was to create myself a steady income throughout the year with checks coming in monthly.
How many states and counties depends are your availability of time. I generally use the analogy of Duck or Geese Hunting. If the Flock represents all the available states to work and the individual ducks or geese represent each county I would not just start "shooting" at the Flock...I would aim in on 1 duck and then the 2nd and then the 3rd all within a reasonable and manageable timeframe.
In my business I begin by verifying the following:
Deed or Lien State/County
When do the Sales Take Place
How soon is the information available regarding the Excess List
How easy is it to get the Owners/Addresses of the Auctioned Property
Do I have a "great" skip tracing company
Then I go to work!!!
@Glen -- Thanks for the tips! :-)
I have try to hunt people down and believe me it is harder then you think. I have not given up. I live in Denver, Colorado and the real estate market is so tight a deal is very hard to come by. I want to make finding people who are owed money a Win Win for all. And I also want to do this right.
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@Norman Clark some people don't want to be found, for their own reasons.
I love this site. I just watched a video about this. It sounded so good. But alas, as with all things real estate BP has an answer. Thank you all.
@Sandra Lee Hi Sandra! Any update? I'm considering this as well... Thanks
Hello Sandra, I sent a message to you, I would so like to start out in this Biz, not having to spend 1500.00 yikes
@Norman Clark Hi Norman. I just watched Mr. Diamond's video on Overages. It's been a few months since you last reported your difficulties with finding claimants. Do you have any guidance for those of us considering that specific market? Thanks!!
Hi Dede,
I’m currently working the overages program.
I’ve purchased the Bob Diamond content.I know it’s pretty pricey and Diamond is probably getting paid.However, I’m not in the business of counting no one else’s money.I take it that, he’s running a business – either you can “fake it” or “make it”……. It appears that he markets well.Therefore, he’s “MAKING IT” $$$.
However, I can definitely share my thoughts.After viewing a webinar on overages, I was sold.Little did I know – there was still leg work to be done……
The program consist of about 12 webinars (some, audio only), frequently asked question section (pretty detailed), the option to create a creditability site (website as a money finder), and all documents needed (how to find the lists, scripts, POA, contingency fee forms, and etc).
PROS
Overall, to say the very least, it lays a great foundation.It’s very informative and outlines the process well enough to get you started.The content also list the best states to work the overages program. These recommended states have been found to have the least convoluted claims process, accept third party finders, avoid physical court proceedings, and primarily will not require extra monies for retaining legal representation and etc.
CONS
COURSE:Webinars, Content, and Docs.
My Opinion: The Webinars and Content dates back a few years.Some are long and drawn out and redundant.However, the documents needed to accompany the claim, seem to be kept up to date accordingly.
COURSE:Recommends not working the overages program in your state.
My Opinion: Why not? Especially, if the state in which you reside, is listed as recommended to work the overages program.Besides, I find that clients like being able to walk into an office and put a name with a face – verses- receiving a call from an unknown person, post cards, or foreign mail, stating “YOU GOT UNCLAIMED MONEY”.
COURSE:Recommends using a 1. Cloud based CRM for retaining client info and tracking your claims * Outsourcing tasks - 2. Mobile Notary, if working outside of your own state, to obtain client info and witness signatures, 3. Virtual Assistants, to answer calls 4. Skip Tracers, to locate clients, byposting ads on Craigslist 5. Business Phone/Fax
My Opinion:I feel a cloud base CRM is not needed.If you are computer savvy, Microsoft has templates for client management that are very detail and workable in excel.Whether these additional things are needed, all depends on you as a person, how involved you want to be in the business, or how disconnected.Personally, I like to control my business, I don’t need too many hands in the pot.As well, I like very little overhead.
COURSE:Customer Support, once you purchase the program.
My Opinion:It’s apparent that they’ve taken their own advice – virtual assistants.When contacting them, you can get someone on the phone, but it’s hard getting direct answers, you’re redirected to send an email to their support team.If it’s questions about the content or “how to” in your state – deferred to the frequently asked question section.But hey – If you think about it – you pay for the program, not 1x1 or hands on assistance.So – I get it.
Think about it – it’s knowledge based, right? With any course or content, it’s not going to give you everything in a nutshell.It will only provide the necessities.So, you will have to take what you learn, gain more knowledge from other faucets and streamline it to develop your own process, best practices and methodology.
Things that have helped ME:
I hope this helps!
Good Luck!
Actually, I’d been working the State unclaimed money list for a while but was limited to a 10% finder’s fee, per the state statue.The downside is that the state is reluctant to work with finders and will only present checks to the claimant.With this being said, I would only get paid after the claimant has recovered the funds.And the claimant knew this.So, in order to ensure I was compensated for my services, I presented the claimant with disclosures, to sort of scare them, that legal proceedings would occur, if I wasn’t paid in a timely manner once the check was cut.However, it deemed to be a lot of work for very little money and not very lucrative.
A few years back I was living in a rental property, and a letter arrived in the mail addressed to the homeowner.The homeowner and I had a pretty decent relationship, considering he lived out of state.So he asked that I open and read the letter in his absence, to see if it was an urgent matter that needed to be addressed with the residence.However, it was an “Unclaimed Money” letter regarding another property he had owned in Washington DC.
Since this seemed to be similar to a service that I was already providing, it prompted me to do more and more research.I started with “YOUTUBE” first.This is a very good source of information.My opinion: There is a guy on there, Shawn Buige, his firm has an overages program that can be purchased for much cheaper than Diamonds.As well, you can choose not to work overages, but instead work with them.From my understanding, you’ll supply the firm with all the necessary paperwork to file a claim, by visiting your local courts and etc. They will process the claim and do all the hard part and the finder will just wait on their check.I know you may not need it because you’re pretty much familiar with overages.Again, everybody has their own process, so you will need to pick and choose your sources of information.Like I said, some can have long and drawn out processes, but it’s up to you to streamline it.
Since it’s been 10 years or more for you -Going into it, make sure you know:
What I’ve provided is from my experience and for informational purposes only.This is what has worked for me.Some may beg to differ and may advise otherwise.
If you’re really serious about this, shoot me over your email.I will provide you with some info where you can get refreshed on this subject matter, sooner than later.There is a fee, but not to me.Don’t get me wrong, I’m not soliciting, my information is free.However, the source charges.
Me myself, not to talk figures, but I expensed approximately $ 4000. to learn the overages business.Reason being, you will not get all the information in 1 place.There will be pieces missing.I think this is because people really don’t like to share their concepts and “how to” of this business.This is an effort not to oversaturate the business. Prime Example:There are quite a few that are on this blog and is actively working the business, but has yet to give anyone as much information that I have provided you. All in all, if you get these list there is so much out there that everybody can get a piece of the pie (Seriously).
Again, Good Luck!
Does anyone have any information on Tax Sale Overage that's more current than 2 yrs ago.
Any working this angle an making any money
12% seems like the highest one should go without being extreme. A rael estate agent gets 3% for the entire purchase price for a lot of work. If 3-7% isn't enough try a standard fee of a grand or three, like a wholesaler. More only if you are recovering 50K or more for someone.
I was also on that call last night. I did some research today and found out pretty much everything I need to know to get started in the business. What I am uncertain about is how saturated the business is. From what I have seen so far it looks legit and a nice niche to explore.
Hi Sandra! How did this work for you?
I was also on that call last night. I did some research today and found out pretty much everything I need to know to get started in the business. What I am uncertain about is how saturated the business is. From what I have seen so far it looks legit and a nice niche to explore.
Hi Sandra! How did this work for you?