Renatus Investment Coach/ Mentor
Engineer · Chicago, IL · Member since 2014 · 8 posts · 7 votes
Renatus Investment Coach/ Mentor
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Residential Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2014 · 6 posts · 16 votes
12yHi Marisa,
I may catch some flak for this, on this site. I'm a current Renatus student in Chicago, based at the same Downer's Grove office you probably visited. I've just been a student for a little over a month. I believe, personally, that it's the right fit for me. But I'm not going to say that everyone/anyone NEEDS a Renatus education to succeed in Real Estate. It's true as other posters have stated, that that there is a LOT of information right here in the BiggerPockets community. In fact, I usually listed to BP podcasts on my Thursday commutes to the office for study groups.
What Renatus and the Downers Grove office study groups give me are the comprehensive, structured education, followed through in study groups, and a community of students and mentors who have gone through the classes and have gone on to make a number of successful deals. There is a group accountability to complete the classes, there are discussion groups to make sure concepts are covered, there are regular events (these events are NOT visiting "gurus" whose appearance is aimed at selling additional products).
You would be with people whom you will be in a 'graduating class' with, have had education together with in study groups, and will be able to do deals with. I've gotten to know several of the other students and instructors pretty well in the short time I've been with them. There are a number of other activities hosted by the Downers Grove office: Today after work I visited a fix and flip in Barrington that's about to go on the market - where Renatus students who participated are going to make a ton of money. After that, I traveled down to Downers Grove and in a small group I played the Cash Flow 101 game. This is a "Rich Dad" product aimed at training you how to think about real estate investments at a broad level. (Other Chicagoland REIA's also host "Cash Flow nights" for the same purpose).
If you do not pursue Renatus education, you can find communities of Chicago investors through REIA groups, including Meetups which are listed here. I'm sure Brie Schmidt has already reached out to you if you have made an introduction here, and she can probably steer you to her REIA group. If you tend to work better with some structured education and with a group of people who will motivate you, hold you accountable, and keep you from procrastinating, and if you can commit to traveling to the Downer's Grove office on at least a weekly basis (Thursday nights), then Renatus may be a good fit for you, at the $2k "Essentials" level.
Renatus DOES have an education marketing side, which is completely optional. Myself, I'm not focusing on that. In fact, when I was first introduced to Renatus, the education marketing side gave me red flags, since I perceived it to be a MLM. I like to steer far away from MLM's and have had a couple MLM's pitched at me which I've declined in the past. I feel education marketing is 180 degrees from what I want to do. But I can understand their argument that you need to learn to market to be successful in real estate anyway -- whether it's marketing yourself, your abilities, your properties for wholesale, for rent, for sale, etc. The company's arguments for giving students the option to market its education are: 1) it keeps the money in the community where it can be reinvested rather than sending it to ad agencies or other advertising vehicles, 2) It allows students another mode of cash flow so they can build an operating/investing budget with which to start their RE investing 3) It helps train students to become salespeople, and this discipline is valuable in real estate.
I personally think that Renatus' idea to market the education this way also gives them a terrible image problem, considering that I resisted the first opportunity to join because I checked up on Renatus online and concluded it was an MLM scam, and you can see that there are many who bring up the "MLM" label in regard to the education sales. I personally am not focused on selling the Renatus education. You'll see that I do not have any kind of link in my bio or in this message pointing you at any kind of place you can register. In fact, this post is the first time I have ever mentioned the company on Bigger Pockets.
Whatever your decision, I wish you all the luck in your investing career. If you sign up, I will NOT get a commission based on your decision - that would go to the person who recruited you through the Craigslist ad.
207 Replies
- 9yShawn AckermanPro MemberReal Estate Entrepreneur · Mid West, East Coast · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
Originally posted by @Maggie G.:
I want to hear opinion of people who are former student not a current affiliate .
Very good point!
- Wholesaler · Trenton, NJ · Member since 2016 · 5 posts · 2 votes9y
I am an experienced investor have completed over 100 deals in the last couple years. I am a member of Renatus and I have learned so much that I did not even know the education is priceless. I paid Ron Legrand 3,000.00 back in day and my first deal I made 30k. So as they say you think education is expensive I say so is ignorance. Pay to learn Renatus changed my life and a bunch of people on our team. We have a meeting every week where we go through the education together as a group. Dan The Deal Maker.
- Mc Kinney, TX · Member since 2017 · 9 posts · 18 votes9y
I just joined the forum after finding this discussion. I wanted to share my experience with Renatus. I will not paint a pretty picture. I can't speak as to whether they help you become a successful real estate investor or not. I'm sure some people join up and become very successful because of the training and mentorship they receive. This information refers to the North Dallas office, located in McKinney, TX.
My wife has a good job and we are in ok shape financially. My job took a turn for the worse at the beginning of the year however. I've been looking for something new and saw one of those signs, "Learn real estate investing... The Right Way". I called the number. The guy I talked to was one of the students, a brand new student (I didn't know this at the time). I first had to watch a video that was approximately 1 hr. long. After that I was supposed to attend a meeting with more in depth information. I was unable to attend because of my work schedule so he sent me a link to another video instead. This was approximately 2 hrs long. After I did that, he set up a phone interview with the head guy, John Albert Ferguson. I said that I was going to be doing real estate investing solo, but they wanted my wife on the phone for the interview also, so we did it. After that, he set up an appointment for my wife and I to come to their office for a final interview which was to take 1 and a half hours. It was not really an interview but a sales presentation, and it took over 2 hours.
I was very into it and wanted to embark on a real estate investing career. My wife was not into it and she'd talked to some people who'd spent $10,000 to $20,000 on exactly the same type of thing, 2 or her workmates, who never made any money after spending a small fortune. I still wanted to do it, and when they asked if we were willing to sign up and pay the $20,000, I said yes. My wife, God love her, just said "whatever you want to do", even though she was fuming inside apparently. So we gave our credit card and got signed up.
When we got home after the meeting is when I found out my wife's true feelings. It was a very rough night for me. She alternated crying and yelling at me all night. She finally said she was going to divorce me if I didn't get our money back. We are trying to get out of debt with one credit card close to maxed and this would've pretty much maxed out our main emergency credit card. I tried to reason with her that this was the best way to get us out of debt, though looking back she was probably right about everything. So I texted Mr. Ferguson at 1:00 in the morning telling him we needed to cancel the membership and get a refund and I told him the truth about everything that was going on with my wife. I told him I had been excited to get started but unfortunately I would not be able to do it.
He texted me the next morning and said we both had to come to the office and sign a cancellation/refund document. My wife was not happy that she had to go in there. Why she had to come in, I don't know. I was the only one who was going to be doing it and I was the only one who had signed anything. But he said we both had to sign the documents and I didn't question him because I just wanted our money back.
When we arrived, he was nice at first asking us what happened. We explained. He went on by saying he's not trying to sell us but then tried again to sell us. When he realized we were a lost cause is when his true colors came out. He said to us and I quote, "I suggest that you guys NEVER get involved in real estate investing again. You should just continue doing what you're doing would be the best thing." I found that quite rude and my wife found it even ruder. We shouldn't ever get involved in real estate investing because we came to our senses and realized we're not in a position currently to pay someone $20,000 for some training and mentorship? How dare he! And that wasn't the end. We had to read over 4 pages of stuff. I don't remember what it said, I was basically pretending to be reading. Then he got the document we had to sign and said we had to sign it with his red sharpie. Before we signed it though, he told me that I had to write in big red letters across the text of the document "I GIVE UP". What a dick move. I wanted our money back so I did it.
Then thinking about everything later, I realized there were some red flags during our final interview/sales presentation. This is when I found out the guy who recruited me was brand new also. That guy's name was Todd and he was at that meeting too, though he didn't really say anything. I don't know if John meant to say this or it slipped out, but we were talking about the tax breaks and he said that the accountants were just getting Todd taken care of because he just joined up. This guy was supposed to be my mentor and he probably barely knew more than I did. John also talked about being in charge of other offices across the country. How could he have any time for his students here if he had other offices elsewhere in the country. It's only later I found out he worked for the company Renatus and he was taking credit for running offices elsewhere that were actually run by other people. I was also concerned about the recruiting part. I had no interest in recruiting for Renatus. I just wanted to be a real estate investor. Nothing was ever mentioned by John Ferguson or Todd at any time about the recruiting aspect, but now I know it is something students of Renatus do. Whether they're expected to do it or not, I do not know. Todd was brand new and was already trying to recruit people.
I attended the final interview/sales presentation last Thursday. That's the day I gave my credit card. I signed the cancellation/refund document the next morning, Friday. The $20,000 posted to my credit card on Saturday afternoon. Today is Monday. As of today, the charges have not been reversed. So, now I'm dealing with trying to get these charges off my card. I texted John this morning and told him about the charges being on my card and please take care of it. I also called the credit card company to dispute the charges, which they said can take 6-8 wks. Hopefully, Mr. Ferguson will get those charges taken off so I can get on with my life.
I do plan on getting into real estate investing, against the advice of Mr. Ferguson, but I won't pay $20,000 or anything close to that in order to do it.
- Mc Kinney, TX · Member since 2017 · 9 posts · 18 votes9y
Oh yeah, Mr. Ferguson also said several times how he only has 8-12 people on his team at any time. I don't believe that for a second. Most of his current students are probably trying to recruit new people all the time. They get big commissions for doing so. Am I to believe he will stop taking $20,000 from people just because they've got 12 people on their team? If 30 or 40 people are willing and able to pay that much to join up, I'm sure he will take them all.
I'm not saying this won't work for everyone. I just don't like the lies that were told to us and his attitude after we decided not to do it.
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
Wow ... My apologies for your experience.
That said, however, please consider how your spouse will feel when you lose $20K or more on a deal because you didn't know what you were doing. There won't be any refunds, then. As I've said before, listen to Brandon Turner's podcasts and webinars where he tells how much he lost on his early deals for not knowing any better.
Education doesn't cost - lack of education costs.
Keep your passion for REI, if you can. You will need, however, to find something the two of you can go into whole heartedly as a couple. Find some common ground between the two of you and a way to build a business around it which can support you in your later years. For example, one couple I know built a pet-sitting business - they bill their up-scale clientele around $44K/mo. Another couple deals in collectible cards and such.
My best to you both.
- Mc Kinney, TX · Member since 2017 · 9 posts · 18 votes9y
There wouldn't have been a refund here if we hadn't come to our senses right away. I believe I read we had 3 days. After that we would have been SOL. Anyway, I don't want to work with anyone who would belittle and demean someone just because they won't pay $20,000 of their hard earned money on something, no matter what it is. I already have a working knowledge of real estate and have gained a lot more for free in the last couple days.
- 9yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@David Dachtera I wrestle with this one as well...
having been involved with many guru events. some of the folks no doubt would lose their money if they did not invest in training.. others just need some basic guidance.. it really depends .
bottom line though in my mind is there simply is not enough real estate for all those that want to buy their way in to it to go around... so most that pay for education or lose money on a flip or try to wholesale or become agents.. they fade away anyways.. I think one needs to really understand what their skill sets are before they blow money on anything real estate related especially if they are borrowing it or putting gi ton CC.. great way to end up in massive debt
- Banker · Ponte Vedra Beach, FL · Member since 2016 · 16 posts · 3 votes9y
@james heefner I am so glad you got out in time. That was always my point, they claim it's about real estate education but it's really about selling the education. And "they'll" always say, you don't have to sell if you don't want to, but funny how are all "trainings" are about selling...
If you really would like to get involved in RE investing, join a local REIA group. Yes, some of those want to sell you stuff, too, but you can network and make connections. But here is a great way to start in real estate: buy a duplex or two-family house and pay that mortgage off, put money away for repairs, and when you're ready you can use the equity and buy another, Yes, being a landlord isn't for everyone, but you can become a millionaire without spending a dime on education. But do your research like, for example, make sure you create an LLC to put your property in and create a separate one for each property. Find a good lawyer who understands that, if not, keep looking.
Stay on this website and listen to podcasts, etc,, lots of information. Congratulations on not falling for the Renatus brainwashing....and there are other websites, too, that can be very helpful. You'd be surprised how willing people are to help fellow investors, without spending $20k.. good luck.
- Professional · Mansfield, TX · Member since 2013 · 77 posts · 44 votes9yI joined Nouveau Rich years ago, and they became Renatus soon afterwards. Went through their online training, but never heard from my sponsor again. I don't recommend them. Not because they don't offer value, rather your money can be better spent. I have tried several other programs since. If you insist in joining a group or being mentored, let me know and I'll recommend some to you with real value and results.
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
The marketing side is optional, but some folks push it too hard. You CAN raise money to do deals that way, but it's your choice and not required.
Renatus WAS NEVER Nouveau Riche - they have always been two separate entities. If you know of another REI education company offering lifetime access to their classes, please PM me with the info. Always looking to "add arrows to my quiver".
- Banker · Ponte Vedra Beach, FL · Member since 2016 · 16 posts · 3 votes9y
@ David Dachtera yes, they "say" it's optional, and no one can force you, but that IS the emphasis and that is what all the "training" is about, selling the education, bottom line, you know it, too. For the record, I think a lot of those "investment gurus" all charge why too much money for their "education" whether it's Renatus or any of the other gurus. Anyone can learn it and maybe you'll make mistakes but you can still make mistakes having taken the education, that's just part of life. Live and learn, as they say. As far as I am concerned, Bob Snyder is shady as I have done some research on him and he was part of Nouveau Riche, that is a fact, undisputed..........
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
Now, finish your homework...
1. When did Bob Snyder leave NRU?
2. Why?
3. When did NRU file for bankruptcy?
4. When was Renatus founded?
5. What is Renatus's BBB rating?
6. Did they earn that rating or did they buy it?
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
... and, for the record, Renatus instructors are not "gurus". They are business people who donate their time to record classes and travel to the communities to teach workshops (expenses are paid by the community, NOT Renatus!). They teach what they do everyday in their business.
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
Yes. It takes a certain aptitude, but it also takes a certain attitude and, as you no doubt have seen here on BP, most newbies need some serious attitude adjustment. Most of them are still consumers and they need to become entrepreneurs. That's why the beginning classes are geared toward exactly that: teaching the basics of business and entrepreneurship. You don't get that from "the gurus".
- Banker · Ponte Vedra Beach, FL · Member since 2016 · 16 posts · 3 votes9y
@david dachtera I know who the instructors are, makes no difference. You drank the Kool-Aid a long time ago. I get that. Just glad James got out when he did. buy a multifamily and you're an investor....if I had cash, I could flip a house...don't have cash...$20k would make a good down payment...just saying...
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
I'd hoped you were better than that. But, that's ok. Some folks (like you) just gotta bash.
Buy RE without an education and you're a fool, in my opinion. Put $20K down, lose up to $120K or more when you screw it up because you didn't know what to do and what not to do.
Education doesn't cost - lack of education costs. Prove me wrong.
Get educated, build and insure your business entity structure and have IT buy RE and you're not only an investor, you're a business person and an entrepreneur ... and, you're protected!
Yes - Renatus IS a marketing company which sells RE investing education. Be a marketer, be a student or do both! Your choice.
Be a marketer and make money to enhance your education and do deals. Do deals and make money to build your wealth and secure your financial future.
We're holding our weekly Q & A follow-up meeting as I write this. No Kool-Aid, just water bottles and pizza. Nothing for sale at this meeting, either.
- Professional · Mansfield, TX · Member since 2013 · 77 posts · 44 votes9y
Originally posted by @David Dachtera:
The marketing side is optional, but some folks push it too hard. You CAN raise money to do deals that way, but it's your choice and not required.
Renatus WAS NEVER Nouveau Riche - they have always been two separate entities. If you know of another REI education company offering lifetime access to their classes, please PM me with the info. Always looking to "add arrows to my quiver".
- Professional · Mansfield, TX · Member since 2013 · 77 posts · 44 votes9y
Interesting that you say Renatus WAS NEVER Nouveau Riche. It has been many years, but if memory serves me right, one of the partners of Nouveau Riche bought out the other partner, and renamed the program to Renatus. They started with the Nouveau Riche system, and grew from there. How do I know this: 1) I joined Nouveau Riche, and 2) my Nouveau Riche username and password provided access to Renatus. It even maintained my historical Nouveau Riche purchase receipts in the Renatus system. I cannot say what has happened since, but this is why I say Nouveau Riche ultimately became Renatus.
As for lifetime memberships, checkout http://houseflippinghq.com/ or http://houseflippingmastermind.com/. They have 3 levels of investor opportunities: beginner (up to low 6 figures), intermediate (mid-to-upper 6 figures, and advanced (high 6-to-7 figures). Admission to this group is limited, and higher end training/membership has qualifications. The higher end is more of a master-mind group. They have online training and monthly live Coaching calls, you can always email them in-between, and active Facebook closed group. I'll be attending their HouseHackingLive event in October 2017. They also have a regular Podcasts "The House Flipping HQ Podcast with Justin Williams" and "I Love Real Estate Stories" by Andy McFarland. Justin and Andy have recently expanded their "staff" with Mike&Mike Wholesalers and more. Lastly, they actively support Children's Charities: to end child-slavery, and provide funds for children's medical research and operations.
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
Memory serves you wrong. See the questions I posed to John Smith for the actual sequence of events.
The fact that your NRU back office credentials got you into the same facility under the Renatus banner is relatively meaningless. Bob Snyder bought a LOT of NRU's assets out of the bankruptcy (you didn't think he could duplicate all of that in less than a calendar quarter, did you?).
No, NRU DID NOT ultimately become Renatus. They are, always have been and always will be two separate entities, one of which is no longer in business due to the founder / CEO's fiscal mismanagement, the other is a growing business led by a man recognized in the business community for his honesty and integrity and is recognized by Inc. Magazine as one of the 1600 fastest growing companies in the US (which of "the gurus" can say THAT?). After six and a half years, Renatus already has more students achieving greater success than NRU ever had.
I looked at HouseFlippingHQ. Didn't see any mention of on-line classes, study groups, local investor communities, etc. Seems to only be focused on house flipping - one of six Renatus curricula.
No comparison - not even close.
- Mc Kinney, TX · Member since 2017 · 9 posts · 18 votes9y
I didn't mean to get things heated. I just wanted to share my experience. Maybe Renatus is great, I don't know. I'm no longer willing to pay $20,000 to find out. I WILL educate myself before I even start thinking about doing any deals. I will get my realtor license first also, thanks to some good free advice. I will also set myself up an LLC. I already knew about this but thanks for the good advice.
One other thing John Ferguson of the Dallas office was telling me that I didn't like was about how I could get my 20 grand back from the government. Told me to set up the LLC or S-Corp. I could write off the 20 grand as business investment. Ok no problem there. But then he said I could say my children are employees and write off their wages. My kids are 6 and 8. I don't think it'S legal for them to be paid wages. I could be wrong and i'm not gonna waste my time asking an accountant or an attorney about it because i'm not gonna do that anyway. It would be me who got in trouble for it. I could say "well john ferguson told me to do it", little good that would do me if it all went south. Seems like fraud to me but like I said I don't know for sure and i'm not gonna waste my time finding out, because it'S unethical at the very least.
I also don't like the fact that the founder of Renatus was the basically the 2nd in command of that Nouveau Riche company. That should give anyone pause who'S thinking of joining Renatus. I don't care if he got out before it all went bad or when he got out. That just tells me he knew things were about to fall apart and was smart enough to get out while the gettin was good. He was high up in the company so he knew what they were doing was fraud.
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
Yes, there is a lot you can do within your entity structure and yes, it is 100% legal (rich people wrote the tax code, remember?). If you see mention of a "Cash Recovery Party", that will be a Renatus marketer holding an event where they will actually show the portion of Mark Kohler's class where he outlines exactly how to take tax deductions for work your children (and even grandchildren!) do for the family business, even as simply as being in a picture you use to market your self or your business. That makes them a model. Mark pays his college-age son to work on his websites. He pays his younger children to address and stuff envelopes, do the shredding, clean up the home office, etc.
One of my local group leaders features his young boys in his promotional pictures. This allows him to legally and ethically pay them. The oldest boy is 12 and has a self-directed Roth IRA which owns a dozen income properties. Likewise, the younger one. Even though they're not of legal age, they're both "real estate investors".
ALL of that is 100% deductible (from the business's income!). Your Renatus tuition is 100% deductible as a professional development expense. I do acknowledge, however, that it's a deduction and not a tax credit.
As I mentioned to Duane, see my reply to John Smith about the sequence of events. Bob Snyder is a man of impeccable integrity. He had to leave NRU because because NRU's leader was not. When NRU ultimately folded, he collected the pieces in the bankruptcy sale and built a new level of success - the success NRU missed thru it's leader's misdoings and its flawed business model.
Hope this helps ...
- Mc Kinney, TX · Member since 2017 · 9 posts · 18 votes9y
@David Dachtera,
I do thank you for your input and I really don't mean to be rude to you or anyone. But even if paying my 6 and 8 yr. old children for a tax deduction is legal and YOU say it'S ethical, that doesn't make it ethical. I still find it unethical. I guess my ethical code is different from yours.
Now, I didn't realize Renatus was the company I was getting involved with until Mr. Ferguson mentioned at the sales presentation that the actual name of the company was Renatus, or I would've been researching Renatus beforehand. I was researching John Albert Ferguson and Real Deal Real Estate because that's what he was calling it. I've been researching Renatus since then, and everything i've found tells me I made the right decision.
Some people aren't as hard on Renatus, saying that there might be some merit in their program but it is grossly overpriced.
Now I don't know about all that Bob Snyder and Nouveau Riche stuff. What I do know is that, 1. Snyder was co-founder of Nouveau Riche, 2. Nouveau Riche imploded and the other 2 founders had to pay hefty settlements, 3. Bob Snyder is founder of Renatus, 4. Renatus, though a totally different entity as you've pointed out, seems to be set up almost identically to the ill-fated Nouveau Riche.
Now i've noticed you will always defend Renatus to the end, no matter what anyone says. This does not make me see them in a better light, however, because I don't really know who you are or what your involvement is with Renatus. Are you just an investor/student who paid for the Renatus education? Are you a recruiter for Renatus? Are you both? Someone higher up? Heck, you could be Bob Snyder for all I know. I don't believe they verified MY identity when I signed up. So on here, you could be whoever you want people to think you are.
I hope that didn't come off as rude, but i'm sure it did.
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
Here's what you're not getting ...
I am not a financial or legal professional. What I say is virtually meaningless. Neither is John Ferguson.
What DOES have meaning is the source of this information which is a JD Tax Attorney / CPA Tax Accountant named Mark Kohler, a partner in KKOS Lawyers (he's the second "K"). He is the instructor of the two-day tax and legal class. He cannot teach it or even say it without risking his professional position, even though neither should be construed as legal or financial advice.
You're still drawing invalid conclusions about Bob Snyder and Renatus. Renatus is NOT NRU V2, it's not even close, no matter how much you want it to be. All of the education has been rerecorded. NRU did not even have on-line delivery. Not all of the NRU instructors were recruited for Renatus. One has even had to be removed due to integrity issues. The education delivery is entirely different. The marketer's compensation plan is a VAST improvement over NRU.
If you come off as rude (I didn't say you did, but if you're feeling as such) it suggests that you're defending a position you may not even consider defensible, that being right is more important to you than having correct information. Food for thought.
I am exactly what I include in my disclaimer: I am a student of the Renatus Education. I am a marketing affiliate. I am also a volunteer at my local investor community. I call myself, "Guest Services Representative" - I make coffee, put out treats and snacks when we have them, I clean up, I make sure the restrooms are stocked with paper goods, I help out with technical issues when I can, ...
Yes - I will profess the truth to the bitter end. You are entitled to your opinion, what ever (mis)information you may feel it is based on, but I will defend the truth to the bitter end. I would be out of integrity if I didn't.
- Mc Kinney, TX · Member since 2017 · 9 posts · 18 votes9y
@David Dachtera,
Yeah that'S what I thought. As such, nothing you say about Renatus can be trusted. What you say is not truth, only biased opinion. I'm not sure how apologizing for being rude makes me someone who is defending a position that I dont consider defensible. What a strange thing to even say. I never really had a position until now. I was just sharing my experience and then sharing things about what I discovered since that last meeting.
Everything you've posted makes me want to stay as far away from Renatus as possible, not because of what you're saying but because of how you're saying it. You kind of act like a bully, which is funny because that'S exactly how my wife described John Ferguson after we signed the cancellation documents. I would like to thank you for making me realize cancelling was the best decision I could've made.
Now here'S an idea for the Renatus cost structure that I would've done without a 2nd thought. The cost is still $20,000, but you only have to pay $1,000 at time of acceptance into the program. $1,000 is still a lot of money to most people, but losing it would not cripple me financially. Then, seeing how this is such an awesome program and students can't fail if they follow it, the remaining $19,000 would be paid out of your first and (if necessary) 2nd real estate deals. If you never get a deal, you don't owe anything, you're just out the initial $1,000. This would make Renatus accountable for their students, and it would be in their best interests to make sure their students are getting deals. The students are more protected because they don't lose their life savings if it turns out to be a bunch of bunk. That'S one thing that seems to be lacking is accountability. If a student never gets a deal, Renatus affiliates say "well it'S not our fault, so it'S obviously your fault for not following the program." Apparently, the training is perfect, without flaws, though i've never known anything in this life to be perfect.
I realize this structure will never happen as long as there are people willing to pay $20,000 up front, but c'est la vie.
- Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
Not sure where that luck of trust comes from. Everything I've posted is verifiable. How does my being an affiliate impact that in ANY way? ... and if I don't disclose being an affiliate, that will be held against me, as well. Lose - lose proposition, no?
Funny you should mention bullying - that's exactly how I feel when people keep contradicting me with "alternate facts". I do not post opinions, I post facts as I have witnessed them, unless indicated otherwise. Others post what they think are facts, but are not verifiable (everything on the internet is true, right?).
As for the alternate pay structure suggestion, I kind of like this quote from "The Hunt For Red October": Cmdr. Remius says, "When Cortez landed in the new world, he burned his ships. As a result, his men were well motivated." (Yes, I read that with Sean Connery's lisp and his British accent! :-)) If you don't commit, how will you ever move forward? I understand that may be a reluctant spouse talking.
D'ya ever notice that colleges give you a degree but do not guarantee your success? (Actually, that's not entirely accurate. Businesses and the schools are in cahoots to determine who gets hired, who gets promoted, etc. and, if you don't "kiss up" to the right people, you're toast.)
A college education can cost as much as $200 or more per credit hour. You can "audit" (repeat once) certain classes, but not all of them, and you do not have no-charge access to any class updates or additions.
The cost for Renatus education breaks down to about $42 per hour of education. It's not structured using credit hours, so that's the closest comparison. Access is "for life" except the middle tier including all updates and additions.
D'ya ever notice that colleges don't finance? You have to go elsewhere to get financed.
Renatus finances (the gurus don't) and helps you with other ways to your education funded.
At the risk of being accused of sounding like John Ferguson, he was right about one thing - he just didn't finish the thought (as you related it to me). So, I will:
Until you lose your fear of big dollar amounts, real estate investing - or any business, really - may not be for you.
You need to learn to be confident in your own decisions, to take responsibility and not blame others when things go wrong, and to do whatever it takes to succeed.
You need to be able to commit to a course of action, to persevere, and to follow through. These are key attributes if you are going to deal with banks and other sources of financing ... buyers, sellers, tenants and others who might seek to take advantage of you ... contractors, trades people and others who will rely on your guidance and leadership to bring a project to a successful fruition ...
Right now, I'm not seeing that from you. It may just be a lack of confidence from not knowing. After all, you haven't taken any classes yet, and Hard Knocks U. hasn't left you bloodied and broken (it will, give it time).
So, if it was me, I would not extend an invitation to work with me.
Seriously - find something you do well, which you enjoy doing and which others are willing to pay well for you to do.
In my opinion (note that - opinion!), you would not be happy dealing with the stresses that come with being a business owner. So, I don 't think you would be happy in REI.
Take care - be well!
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