That time an investor you probably know, took me for $40,000

That time an investor you probably know, took me for $40,000

Belmont, NC · Member since 2013 · 139 posts · 21 votes

Some of you have seen my posts on here and they are generally providing help to others. I'm not necessarily asking for help here, but any professional input and advice is certainly welcome. 

Last fall I began talks with an Atlanta, GA based company called Summit & Crowne Partners. Their owners, @Abhi Golhar and Walt Higgins were ecstatic to bring me on board and help facilitate the growth of a powerhouse company in charlotte that would encompass a Real Estate Brokerage which Abhi and I currently own together, a General Contracting firm, an Investment Firm, and a Project Management side for other investors. 

In December, Abhi and I started working towards opening the real estate firm in Charlotte, NC, Summit & Crowne Realty. This was realized shortly in to the new year and we hit the ground running. Shortly after this in February, I passed my General Contractors' exam. Abhi and I were both excited about the possibilities of me coming on board to take over some projects they were having trouble with; 5 in total. 

In March I started the construction of 2 spec build homes for Summit & Crowne Partners with a handshake and a verbal agreement that I could build both houses for $207,000 each and in 6 months time. They also had jump in and work on 3 remodels they had going; one in Providence Day area and 2 in Johnson C Smith University area. In the 3 months that followed that seemed like a blur considering how busy I was taking on all these projects at once, on top of my normal projects I already had going, we racked up spending amount in excess of $300,000! I had the 2 spec build homes framed and roughed in. We were ready for sheetrock when Walt, @Abhi Golhar's partner informed me that they had pissed of their investors and would essentially need to fire me. At this point they have an outstanding labor and material balance in excess of $20,000 which still hasn't been paid to date. they also have an outstanding GC fee almost equal to that which also has not been paid to date. So far for the $300,000 plus amount of work and material provided, I've been compensated a measly $10,000. I worked out a deal with Abhi and Walt early on which was a great deal for them. Instead of the projected $110,000 cost of hiring me at full  price for all projects, I decided to give them a deal of $70,000 for all projects. I've now saved them $40,000 and they are telling me they are over budget on all these houses. 2 or 3 of them, sure, they are because they had a project manager before me who apparently had free labor haha. Anyways, I've been nothing but gold for their company and i'm ahead of schedule and under budget on the 2 spec build homes I took over for them that carries a $7,500 monthly debt service EACH!!! 

I have now filed liens against all 5 of the properties that I was working on for them with the clerk of court in the name of the respective owner, Summit & Crowne Partners, LLC of Atlanta Georgia and Summit & Crowne Charlotte Reserve, LLC of Charlotte, North Carolina. My next step is to perfect the lien and file a lawsuit. I've already placed a retainer fee on deposit with my attorney in the amount of $1,000 after our $150 initial consult. She charges a whopping $200 per hour, so I'm hoping to avoid incurring any more expenses from her, but she is the necessary evil.

I guess I'm really writing this out of anger and distaste towards the folks who originally brought me in to their company with hopes and dreams as far as the eye could see. I planned on making $70,000 with this firm this year alone, so naturally I was turning down business left and right because I was so busy and didn't need/want any more income. Now I'm stuck with a $22,134.33 labor and material bill and lacking my $19,010.15 General Contractors fee based on my pay structure that again, was agreed with a handshake and a smile. Well, they did send emails confirming the pay structure, so I have that leg to stand on when we go to court. 

With any luck, this post will bring enough negative feedback for their company and we can avoid the lawsuit with a settlement (of full price of course), and I can go back to having my life back. 

In the mean time, does any one have a similar experience or any helpful hints for me as this is my first time being owed any amount of money, except for my grandma who passed away owing me $220...I guess I can write that off now :) 

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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
10y

Troy,   Good luck with it.. talk with a sharp lawyer who knows the liens laws inside and out and get your liens in there.. thats the cheapest protection you can get.

the HML may take a deed in Lui and then make a deal with you.. I have done that in the past ( I did a lot of HML in my day).. so I would be in constant contact with that lender.. as your going to bugger up her title. and MOST HML do NOT want to have to foreclose.. we will if we have to but thats the least desireable thing to do .. as we usually lose money when that happens.

It will really come down to the equity in the deal.. and your X partners investors how they feel about it.. do your X partners have the dough to litigate this ?

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Realtor · Douglasville, GA · Member since 2016 · 44 posts · 17 votes
    10y

    Never do handshake/verbal deals, even with friends.  Sometimes it's hard to take this approach with people you know well (or think you know) but you must do it.  I've been able to defuse the potential perception of a lack of trust with the following rationale, although it is a good practice by itself:  

         If something happened to me or the other party and a family attorney is now wrapping up the business, how will they know what we agreed on if it's not in writing?  The written agreement needs to be in place as an artifact if something horrible goes wrong.  Plus, people's memory can be flawed at times.  Hope that helps.

  • Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    10y

    Sorry that you have to deal with that.

    I would recommend that you let your local REIA know. While they aren't responsible for their members, I know that GAREIA has sometimes deleted memberships of people, who have been proven to have done wrong. And if these are people that need that interaction with other investors, it would put them on the spot and they might see that it might be more beneficial to pay you than to lose their connections

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    10y

    couple things that stand out to me.. 7500 a month vig on a 200k construction loan is over 30% interest are you sure about that one !

    mechanics liens as long as they are properly filed IE did you need to send pre lien notices ?  In our state they are a super lien they would come before the mortgage.. so this is a great state to be a contractor who knows the liens laws.. but even so the lender will have to pay you or foreclose you out.. as a contractor again in our state if your liens are not perfected because of a flaw or timing issue you can sue for unjust enrichment... 

    If you have an attorney at 200 an hour who is any good thats a GREAT deal.. most litigators are double that. 

    I understand the sentiment of having a written contract but it really does not make a bunch of difference here.. a default is a default.. you have to litigate it if you have a written contract and you have to litigate it if you don't... so don't get to beat up about that part .. of course its best to have. but its not the end of the world. 

    I could easily see this as a BK situation with the LLC that borrowed the money and did the work filing chapter 7 and walking away especially since they are not domiciled in NC.... so be cognizant of that you don't want to run up 20k in legal fee's only to get wiped out legally.

    @Michaela G.I think we all need to be careful to hear both sides of the story before we flame people. I am sure this is probably correct no reason to doubt the OP version of the facts... But my years in this business have shown me that there are usually two sides to the story.. 

  • Belmont, NC · Member since 2013 · 139 posts · 21 votes
    10y

    thanks for the info @Jay Hinrichs. Their loan is a hard money loan, so they have a hefty payment. It might have only been $7500 for both houses, but they sure do have a lot. And the hardmoney lender said she hadn't even paid them out what we spent when I spoke with her. 

    It's definitely too late to talk about written contracts, and verbal contracts are legal and enforceable, so I'm not too concerned with that. 

    I'm not extremely knowledgeable of the Lien law in NC, but I know I have 120 days from last furnishing to file the lien and 180 days from last furnishing to perfect the lien. 

    good heads up about the bankruptcy option. Hopefully that isn't the case, but with the upcoming lawsuit, they could force the sale of the properties as-is (I would love to buy them out), and then the debts be paid. 

    I'll keep working with my attorney and bugging the owners via text and email about payment, which have gone unanswered for weeks now. 

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    10y

    Troy,   Good luck with it.. talk with a sharp lawyer who knows the liens laws inside and out and get your liens in there.. thats the cheapest protection you can get.

    the HML may take a deed in Lui and then make a deal with you.. I have done that in the past ( I did a lot of HML in my day).. so I would be in constant contact with that lender.. as your going to bugger up her title. and MOST HML do NOT want to have to foreclose.. we will if we have to but thats the least desireable thing to do .. as we usually lose money when that happens.

    It will really come down to the equity in the deal.. and your X partners investors how they feel about it.. do your X partners have the dough to litigate this ?

  • Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

    @Michaela G.I think we all need to be careful to hear both sides of the story before we flame people. I am sure this is probably correct no reason to doubt the OP version of the facts... But my years in this business have shown me that there are usually two sides to the story.. 

     I totally agree. That's why I wrote that they sometimes take action on PROVEN members. It could not be a 'he said...she said'

  • Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    10y

    I agree with @Jay Hinrichs on getting the lien filed ASAP, if nothing else to get in line ahead of other potential lienor.  I hope you don't have any lien validity issues without a written contract.  I've seen guys wait until the last minute here, then not realize they have a statutory obligation to send a specific type of demand letter, a required 10 days in advance of filing a lien, and ran themselves out of time.

  • Rock Hill, SC · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 597 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Troy Knight:

    Some of you have seen my posts on here and they are generally providing help to others. I'm not necessarily asking for help here, but any professional input and advice is certainly welcome. 

    Last fall I began talks with an Atlanta, GA based company called Summit & Crowne Partners. Their owners, @Abhi Golhar and Walt Higgins were ecstatic to bring me on board and help facilitate the growth of a powerhouse company in charlotte that would encompass a Real Estate Brokerage which Abhi and I currently own together, a General Contracting firm, an Investment Firm, and a Project Management side for other investors. 

    In December, Abhi and I started working towards opening the real estate firm in Charlotte, NC, Summit & Crowne Realty. This was realized shortly in to the new year and we hit the ground running. Shortly after this in February, I passed my General Contractors' exam. Abhi and I were both excited about the possibilities of me coming on board to take over some projects they were having trouble with; 5 in total. 

    In March I started the construction of 2 spec build homes for Summit & Crowne Partners with a handshake and a verbal agreement that I could build both houses for $207,000 each and in 6 months time. They also had jump in and work on 3 remodels they had going; one in Providence Day area and 2 in Johnson C Smith University area. In the 3 months that followed that seemed like a blur considering how busy I was taking on all these projects at once, on top of my normal projects I already had going, we racked up spending amount in excess of $300,000! I had the 2 spec build homes framed and roughed in. We were ready for sheetrock when Walt, @Abhi Golhar's partner informed me that they had pissed of their investors and would essentially need to fire me. At this point they have an outstanding labor and material balance in excess of $20,000 which still hasn't been paid to date. they also have an outstanding GC fee almost equal to that which also has not been paid to date. So far for the $300,000 plus amount of work and material provided, I've been compensated a measly $10,000. I worked out a deal with Abhi and Walt early on which was a great deal for them. Instead of the projected $110,000 cost of hiring me at full  price for all projects, I decided to give them a deal of $70,000 for all projects. I've now saved them $40,000 and they are telling me they are over budget on all these houses. 2 or 3 of them, sure, they are because they had a project manager before me who apparently had free labor haha. Anyways, I've been nothing but gold for their company and i'm ahead of schedule and under budget on the 2 spec build homes I took over for them that carries a $7,500 monthly debt service EACH!!! 

    I have now filed liens against all 5 of the properties that I was working on for them with the clerk of court in the name of the respective owner, Summit & Crowne Partners, LLC of Atlanta Georgia and Summit & Crowne Charlotte Reserve, LLC of Charlotte, North Carolina. My next step is to perfect the lien and file a lawsuit. I've already placed a retainer fee on deposit with my attorney in the amount of $1,000 after our $150 initial consult. She charges a whopping $200 per hour, so I'm hoping to avoid incurring any more expenses from her, but she is the necessary evil.

    I guess I'm really writing this out of anger and distaste towards the folks who originally brought me in to their company with hopes and dreams as far as the eye could see. I planned on making $70,000 with this firm this year alone, so naturally I was turning down business left and right because I was so busy and didn't need/want any more income. Now I'm stuck with a $22,134.33 labor and material bill and lacking my $19,010.15 General Contractors fee based on my pay structure that again, was agreed with a handshake and a smile. Well, they did send emails confirming the pay structure, so I have that leg to stand on when we go to court. 

    With any luck, this post will bring enough negative feedback for their company and we can avoid the lawsuit with a settlement (of full price of course), and I can go back to having my life back. 

    In the mean time, does any one have a similar experience or any helpful hints for me as this is my first time being owed any amount of money, except for my grandma who passed away owing me $220...I guess I can write that off now :) 

     Troy PM I got a great law firm just for this. Just not 100 % sure they handle NC but I am sure.

  • Ira Township, MI · Member since 2015 · 57 posts · 17 votes
    10y
    Just remember if you do go the litigation route this post would be able to be used against you; this is very specific account of what happened. I would follow what the Attorney suggested, $200/hr for real property issues is fair; the $1000 retainer should be enough-unless you have to go to court.-
  • Belmont, NC · Member since 2013 · 139 posts · 21 votes
    10y

    I have already filed the lien! That was my first move. In NC, you just have to file the lien. No waiting or notice period required. Next step is enforcing the lien with a lawsuit. 

    As for this post being part of the litigation, I don't see any qualms with it. I'm no lawyer, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn last night haha. But I don't see anything in this post that will hinder any sort of litigation. 

    Not sure what the X partners financial situation is, but I'm certain they have the dough to do some stuff based on their proof of funds they provided me back when this all started. 

    @Alex Franks, thanks, I'll chat with you. 

  • Rental Property Investor · East Wenatchee, WA · Member since 2014 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    10y

    The only ship not designed to sail is a partnership.

    Sorry to hear of your troubles and best wishes, Troy.

  • Full-Time Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    @Troy Knight, Is there anything we local investors can do to help get you guys out of these projects?  Feel free to private message me if you prefer to take this offline.  

  • Belmont, NC · Member since 2013 · 139 posts · 21 votes
    10y

    This issue has been resolved between Local Knolwedge Investments Inc and Summit & Crowne Parterns, LLC.

  • Realtor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2014 · 935 posts · 467 votes
    10y

    glad to hear. 

  • Full-Time Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    Happy it worked out Troy.  Hope to meet you in person one day :)

  • Belmont, NC · Member since 2013 · 139 posts · 21 votes
    10y

    Thanks Bryan. It was settled through a settlement offer I proposed. Glad to have this in the rear view!! 

  • Buy & Hold Owner · Redlands, CA · Member since 2015 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Troy Knight:

    This issue has been resolved between Local Knolwedge Investments Inc and Summit & Crowne Parterns, LLC.

     You follow-up is wonderful as it attests to your integrity.  WELL DONE :=)

  • Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2016 · 63 posts · 4 votes
    9y

    @Troy Knight

    Hi Troy , we had a similar issue where we paid 1500 USD each ( 3 people ) to start the loan processing and we never took the loan and never got the refund

    Could you advise how did you contact Summit and Crowne partners to get your issue resolved 

    Thank you

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