SEO Real Estate Investing
Investor · West Babylon, NY · Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 1 vote
I want to hire someone to do my SEO for me, if anybody can guide me to the right path. Such as what questions should I ask them? How do I differentiate the good SEO companies from the not so good SEO companies? What is the average I should be spending per month?
Thank you.
YES. Finally. Someone that does it right. SEO is THE BEST way to do marketing and get leads. My site has been 1st on google for a year now and I get leads out of my armpits!! Super motivated seller leads, about 6 a day.
I have no idea what to do with all these leads.
Here is the thing though... no SEO company would ever be able to outdo me. And no I am not bragging, I am actually making a point.
All SEO companies do the SAME thing. Questionable backlinks, and your standard on page SEO.
Now me.. the obsessed freak, I devise
my own SEO techniques all white hat and spend about 15 hours a day working on my SEO. What SEO company would do this? None. They have 4 5 20 clients? They can't possibly do all that personal SEO goodness to your ie
So my point? Learn how to do it and do it yourself!
I don't have a specific guy to point you to...but I would always say that when it comes to web development of any kind, try to find a single developer over an agency. Freelancers tend to have more pride in their work as each project they do usually get's put in their portfolio, versus an agency where you can be just another contract to close.
Do make sure that the Dev specialized on some level with SEO, but my suggestion is to head the freelancer route.
@Brandon Reed Thank you Brandon, I appreciate the reply.
YES. Finally. Someone that does it right. SEO is THE BEST way to do marketing and get leads. My site has been 1st on google for a year now and I get leads out of my armpits!! Super motivated seller leads, about 6 a day.
I have no idea what to do with all these leads.
Here is the thing though... no SEO company would ever be able to outdo me. And no I am not bragging, I am actually making a point.
All SEO companies do the SAME thing. Questionable backlinks, and your standard on page SEO.
Now me.. the obsessed freak, I devise
my own SEO techniques all white hat and spend about 15 hours a day working on my SEO. What SEO company would do this? None. They have 4 5 20 clients? They can't possibly do all that personal SEO goodness to your ie
So my point? Learn how to do it and do it yourself!
@Jerryll Noorden that's pretty cool.
I really don't know much about SEO but do know that time I spend on working on SEO is time spent away from making deals. I have seen numerous companies (investors themselves??) that espouse to provide a lead generating package that provides the support or takes me through "uping" my ranking. Are these worth while? Currently I send out mailers and starting Driving for Dollars. A website could be a 24/7 lead machine.
@Tyler Cody - I specialize in SEO and run a small boutique style company - although we are on the verge of shifting towards a more holistic approach (email, facebook, remarketing, etc.) Here's some unbiased advice (I'm not pitching you.)
I've been doing this for a couple years now and and I strongly suggest finding yourself a local free lancer that you can roll up on and keep accountable - in person. Keep on top of reports, don't just gloss over them. Ask them to explain the report - so you know what numbers to watch. Also research the different metrics (I'll gladly give you a quick run down on this if you'd like.) This would be like monitoring AVR, cashflow, etc.) It is important. These numbers will never go skyrocketing up and up like most people want, but there should be a steady increase.
One heads up with reporting is some agencies will change their keywords each month (swap out bad performing ones for good performing ones) or include a ton of useless keywords that anybody could rank for. Be wary of this - and call them out on it if it happens.
Find someone you can develop a long-term plan and relationship with, and someone that is going to be flat out honest with you from the start (even if it isn't what you want to hear.)
Also note, some websites aren't worth doing SEO on. Don't do SEO on a cheap or poorly built website, imo.
You will not get overnight results with SEO - and it won't be cheap, but it will pay off and then some if done correctly.
If it is cheap, you're taking a risk by hiring someone that is green and willing to work for the experience, or you're going down a path you don't want to take by hiring a flat out cheap SEO - which I've seen turn into messy situations. Bad SEO doesn't just not get you results, it may lead to a penalty and that means more $$ needed (and worse - time) to get you out of the hole they put you in, before you can move forward.
Some of my longest standing clients came from that exact situation - innocently hiring a "good deal" that spammed their email, but then drove their rankings into the ground.
If you can find someone that knows what they're doing, you may be able to get them to "prove" themselves by working at a lower rate - but then bumping to a higher rate once certain milestones are achieved. You'd need to negotiate this, but it is a good way to keep the SEO motivated to drive results, and hedges your risk at the same time.
If you can find a person to give you a referral of who they use, that is best. Most SEO agencies won't give out their client's websites (with good reason) but if you know the person, then you can do some due dilligence and look them up in Google and see what they rank for.
When hiring an SEO - ask them if they use white hat, grey hat or black hat techniques. I suggest remaining open to white and grey hat, but run from black hat UNLESS it is for a very specific reason. Black hat can be handy if you need to rank for a search term for a couple months and don't care if you lose the ranking (and the domain possibly - don't use your main domain for this ever imo) once Google catches the black hat tactics.
Grey hat and white hat SEO are fairly common. The majority of SEO people will use mostly white hat - but then use something called "private blog networks" to obtain powerful links predictably, at quantity and without charging an arm and a leg for. White hat will generally obtain links from pre-existing websites, such as guest blog posting. This is kind of technical, but worth having a basic understanding of.
The larger the agency, the less the person cares. Big agencies often hire sales people as their account managers, and their pay is directly linked to the amount of $$'s their accounts bring in each month. The problem with SEO, is that because results take time, it can be easy to talk through the 1st 3 months w/o doing much. Finding someone you trust is very important here.
I also strongly advise learning a bit about SEO so you can talk their lingo at some level.
Good luck!! And also the advice dropped in this thread is great. You'd be best to learn it yourself... nobody cares as much about your money as you do! And that's what Google rank is - a marketing channel that brings in $$.
I really don't know much about SEO but do know that time I spend on working on SEO is time spent away from making deals. I have seen numerous companies (investors themselves??) that espouse to provide a lead generating package that provides the support or takes me through "uping" my ranking. Are these worth while? Currently I send out mailers and starting Driving for Dollars. A website could be a 24/7 lead machine.
There is a difference between SEO and companies that do SEO. SEO is Search Engine Optimization. The other one is a person, doing Search engine optimization. See the difference?
"time I spend on working on SEO is time spent away from making deals". Yeah I really don't think you know much about SEO if you say that. That absolutely makes ZERO sense. (No offense). It's like saying time spend on breathing is time spend away from living.
How do you "make deals"? I do not think they fall in your lap as you brush your teeth. You devote SOME time marketing. Talking to someone.. looking for a deal. Well SEO is just that. Looking for deals.. but then better. Deals look for YOU.
Again:
This pictures shows how people ask me to please come and buy their house. It is on automatic, while I eat, sleep, poop, bump uglies with a hotty... I get leads!
SEO IS "making deals".
You make deals BECAUSE you do (correct) SEO. Working on SEO IS making a deal. Sorry to say this but if you do not do SEO you will sooner or later get choked out of business. Everything is online now. If anyone wants to sell their house, not many people's first choice is a news paper ad, smoke signals, radio... they go online. Anything online IS SEO.
Its like a magic black box. You do certain things to a black box, and the black box spits out leads that turn into deals.
It just amazes me how not many investors know nothing about SEO, or websites. I look at the websites of many people here on BP and I am bewildered how they think that site could ever perform. It is crazy!! We live in the digital age. Online is EVERYTHING. If you have a website for more than 4 months, and you have no traffic, or conversions, and you are not yet on the first page of google... what are you doing??!!
@Jerryll Noorden that's pretty cool.
haaa thank you ma man!! :D
Someone wanna provide a basic outline on how SEO operates as it relates to bringing you motivated seller leads? Specifically compared to direct mail.
Trying to wrap my head around the concept.
@Jerryll Noorden Thank you for your reply and I emphasis my initial statement about not knowing much about SEO other than i do know what it is and the difference between what SEO is and what a company that does SEO. What I don't know is the things that has to be done to increase my standing. I guess what I should say is there value in getting a company that builds these website templates (that I spend an hour customizing to my use) and promotes or guides me through the SEO process.
I did a search "sell house quickly in Connecticut" and your page is found high up on the 1st page. How long did it take to get that high ranking? I see your site is Investor Carrot, one source I am looking at using. Did you have to use some company outside of IC ("paid traffic")?
Doug
@Jerryll Noorden Thank you for your reply and I emphasis my initial statement about not knowing much about SEO other than i do know what it is and the difference between what SEO is and what a company that does SEO. What I don't know is the things that has to be done to increase my standing. I guess what I should say is there value in getting a company that builds these website templates (that I spend an hour customizing to my use) and promotes or guides me through the SEO process.
yes yes, I got it.
Yes, SEO seriously is the backbone of my company. The fact that so few investors know how to work it or leverage it is what made me grow so rapidly.
I look at all websites of the investors here on BP and I am sitting here in disbelief of what I see.
I can help you with anything SEO if you want me to. I would love to help you stand out. It is the hard working people that I get most satisfaction from helping them!
Jerryll Noorden Any advice and tips on how to get started with SEO, my site is in development so I’m not yet ready. However fully agree that I need to focus on doing my own SEO rather than hiring a company. Any advice would be great, thanks!
Sure, absolutely.
Yes, forget hiring companies (if you seriously want to be on top of google).
Here is my advise. And rather than giving you a fish let me teach you how to fish.
DUDE you are a sick individual!! Writing SEO posts at 3AM. WTH!! ... If you were not so hairy I would ask you out on a date!
So...
There is JUST one concept you need to understand when it comes to SEO. EVERYONE thinks they are good at SEO. EVERYONE thinks they understand it.. and
EVERYONE does the same thing...
Google says Do Backlinks yo!. So everyone does that.
Google says "sprinkle keyword" here and there and use LSI's too. EVERYONE does this.
So now you have 15 sites doing all this, why would site #3 be ranking higher than site #7?
The one concept you need to understand is what Google's job is. In a previous post I said "I am 2 steps above Google.. and some of you think I am so fu of myself. The ACTUAL truth is.. OMG I SO AM!!"
But other than that.. I do have a point if you focus.
So Google's ONLY job is to make web surfers happy. That's it! Users go on google to find "stuff". Google's job is to determine what the best website is for the keywords the user typed in.
So I do not care about google's rules, I go beyond this. What would make a user pick me if they saw me in the SERPS? What would a user appreciate in a website. How would a user find me if they had the powers of google and be able to have knowledge of all sites out there?
Eliminate Google altogether and write SEO to please the user, not google.
As google tries to please the user by formulating protocol to do this automatically, I overstep google and become higher in the chain of Google command and only focus on this. I seriously do not have many backlinks at all. I never focused on backlinks because it is damn hard and time consuming... yet I am not only ruling my market, I get crazy leads.
SO if you can just grasp that concept you will always outdo everyone that obeys Google.
However, there are certain things you NEED to do to even be on the map.
On-Page SEO
Off-Page SEO
Seriously I can go on... but these are just the beginning things you have to do to even appear on the 4th page. For the 1 page SEO secrets... haaaaaaaaaa, I don't give my kookoo so easily in the open for all to see
Someone wanna provide a basic outline on how SEO operates as it relates to bringing you motivated seller leads? Specifically compared to direct mail.
Trying to wrap my head around the concept.
SEO..
Again, googles job is to show you the site on top of the list that best provides the soluton to a problem you are trying to solve.
If you are looking for how to plant roses you would search for "How do I plant a rose bush?". Google has crawlers that constantly scant and record all websites on the Matrix!
So just assume that google knows what every website's text is. Google is a machine. It is a human. Google always tries to improve the machine code to be more human like. Although they are good, they are not great... this is why grey hat and blackhat SEO is still alive.
Before when google really sucked monkeybutt, you could just populate your site with " how to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roseshow to plant roses
And Google would think, OMG this website is ALL about how to plant roses and you would rank 1.
If a human would see this they would know "this dude is trying to cheat the system" and a human would flag/penalize the site". This is where Google is trying to get, but not quite there yet.
So, SEO, is basically, making sure google knows what your website is about. How do you let google know this? by following the rules Google sent out to everyone. Get backlinks, sprinkle keywords yada yada yada.
Once google knows what your site s about, and have accumulated enough google trust, you will rank high for the keywords you have on your site.
So now... when people look for seling their house instead of planting roses, your site would come up... and then these people beg you to please please please "buy my house".
So lets see...
website from GD $15,- for 2 years.
Hosting (for me anyways) =$100 a month.
You get one deal a month= $7K- 120K (depending if you are flipping, wholesaling...
Now compare this to direct mail marketing.
(again my numbers)
3000 to 5000 maiers a month= tone of work+tons of time+ $5,000.- to $8,000.- a month!
But this is not all...
Your eyes are used to spam mail, and you ignore it. Ever had these pizzahut cards in the mail, by one large pizza get 39 toppings free? Sure you have.. dd you take it and actually read it with attention? no!
So although you pay a crap load of money you are not guaranteed people even see the mailer. Same applies to written letters.
IN ADDITION.. you are BEGGING them to please sell their house to you. Not just begging, you are paying a ton of money to be able to beg them to please sell.
This is why people say DM is low quality leads. They are not motivated
SEO leads are high quality leads, because they are seeking you out. (and it is cheaper, and you make a lot more deals).
running 3 laps around your house butt naked does improve your SEO skills. Don't believe me? TRY IT!!
@Jerryll Noorden Thank you for your reply and I emphasis my initial statement about not knowing much about SEO other than i do know what it is and the difference between what SEO is and what a company that does SEO. What I don't know is the things that has to be done to increase my standing. I guess what I should say is there value in getting a company that builds these website templates (that I spend an hour customizing to my use) and promotes or guides me through the SEO process.
I did a search "sell house quickly in Connecticut" and your page is found high up on the 1st page. How long did it take to get that high ranking? I see your site is Investor Carrot, one source I am looking at using. Did you have to use some company outside of IC ("paid traffic")?
Doug
Mr Doug. For give me bud, I didn't see your second half of the Q.
See, that is the wonderful thing about "Google trust".
I never tried to rank for those keywords. Not sure if I even used them. Yet I rank 1.
It took me 3 to 4 months to rank on first page of google with appearances on the first spot fluctuating. After 6 months of starting my website I was on first for 3 to 4 keywords. Now I am ranking first for , honestly I have no idea for how many keywords.
But don't misunderstand. This is not a good thing.
I do not want to be first for many keywords. I just want to be first for a handful. But you can't control that easily...
This is what I am now researching..
@Jerryll Noorden @Tyler Cody I completely and totally agree with everything Jerryll said.
(1) SEO leads (or Google Adwords is about the same) is the absolute hottest lead category. There can be no doubt. Direct-mail leads take a very long time to cultivate. MLS leads are competitive and have pretty tight margins. Cold Calling you have to go through a lot of filler.
Don't get me wrong, you can make money using every strategy, but SEO/Adwords . . .we are talking about people that are ready to sell ON THE SPOT . . . True story - I got a big deal on an SEO lead that came in on Wednesday. I had a contract at my price signed in 4 hours. I am also doing an equivalent value DMM deal - and I had to chase that lead for nearly two years.
(2) I'm not sure why everyone is trying to pay for an SEO "guru". They can't really tell you anything you can't learn for free - and none of it is really rocket science. You can get good sites like InvestorCarrot at minimal cost - and they are mobile friendly.
At most, I'd pay for like a monthly consultant. Perhaps a conversation for $50 to $100 one a month. Don't drop anymore than that.
One thing I will say though - I think a lot of this depends on your market. I have like 10,000 competing sites in Miami, Fort Lauderdale. I'm on page 1 after about 8 months of hard work - but leaping over serious competitors is a challenge.
I also have a ton of stuff business related to run - so I can't spend 5 hours a day doing SEO. Perhaps if you're just wholesaling . . . but how could I bounce back and forth between 4 rehab projects and have 5 hours a day for sitting at a desk doing SEO . . .
@Jerryll Noorden @Tyler Cody I completely and totally agree with everything Jerryll said.
(1) SEO leads (or Google Adwords is about the same) is the absolute hottest lead category. There can be no doubt. Direct-mail leads take a very long time to cultivate. MLS leads are competitive and have pretty tight margins. Cold Calling you have to go through a lot of filler.
Don't get me wrong, you can make money using every strategy, but SEO/Adwords . . .we are talking about people that are ready to sell ON THE SPOT . . . True story - I got a big deal on an SEO lead that came in on Wednesday. I had a contract at my price signed in 4 hours. I am also doing an equivalent value DMM deal - and I had to chase that lead for nearly two years.
(2) I'm not sure why everyone is trying to pay for an SEO "guru". They can't really tell you anything you can't learn for free - and none of it is really rocket science. You can get good sites like InvestorCarrot at minimal cost - and they are mobile friendly.
At most, I'd pay for like a monthly consultant. Perhaps a conversation for $50 to $100 one a month. Don't drop anymore than that.
One thing I will say though - I think a lot of this depends on your market. I have like 10,000 competing sites in Miami, Fort Lauderdale. I'm on page 1 after about 8 months of hard work - but leaping over serious competitors is a challenge.
I also have a ton of stuff business related to run - so I can't spend 5 hours a day doing SEO. Perhaps if you're just wholesaling . . . but how could I bounce back and forth between 4 rehab projects and have 5 hours a day for sitting at a desk doing SEO . . .
DUDE.. "House Heroes". Friggin AWESOME.
I always wanted to incorporate something like that.
I was thinking MonkeyMan. Have a "MM" on my chest. How awesome is that!
Dude thanks for the encouragement.
And yes I also agree you are right with you ke money no matter what you route you choose as long as you outdo your competitors.
So for you all this may be a stupid small thing... but earlier this month my DA and PA jumped a bit, and I checked so did everyone else's (most people)
So I stepped it up with something very novel in the works.. and guess what. This morning it went up an other point.
For an SEO guy this is better than the 3 letter S word with your fav VS model!
Drinks on me! YESSSSSS
Sorry, had to share ^_^
Let's hope it doesn't go down....
@Jerryll Noorden Finally diving into some SEO! However did google just do something different this past month? Ive seen a decrease in my and competitor DA?
Anymore advice on SEO would be great!
@Jerryll Noorden Finally diving into some SEO! However did google just do something different this past month? Ive seen a decrease in my and competitor DA?
Anymore advice on SEO would be great!
Good for you!!!!! Good man!
Google always does something "different".
But what you see is not Google's doings. That is MOZ.
they indeed did something drastic recently.
See if your numbers changed relatively wrt your bunghole competitors.
As for advice... I shall give you an unfair advantage ;)
@Jerryll Noorden Finally diving into some SEO! However did google just do something different this past month? Ive seen a decrease in my and competitor DA?
Anymore advice on SEO would be great!
Good for you!!!!! Good man!
Google always does something "different".
But what you see is not Google's doings. That is MOZ.
they indeed did something drastic recently.
See if your numbers changed relatively wrt your bunghole competitors.
As for advice... I shall give you an unfair advantage ;)
Hey Jerryll, new to InvestorCarrot here. Do you do the work for your clients? Or you give them a course for them to follow? I would also like to know your pricing for SEO, i want to be the best at my market and provide the best value to both my buyers and sellers. I haven’t done DM but I’m leaning more toward cold calling and driving for dollars. I feel like SEO would add some value with less work for me. Right now just focused on my backyard which is a tough one (NYC)! But i can also venture out to Nassau and Westchester, and maybe Waterbury CT. Pricing would be cool to see if i can afford it now or look for ways to fund this kind of marketing. Thanks Jerryll, keep doing your thing my man.
@Jerryll Noorden Finally diving into some SEO! However did google just do something different this past month? Ive seen a decrease in my and competitor DA?
Anymore advice on SEO would be great!
Good for you!!!!! Good man!
Google always does something "different".
But what you see is not Google's doings. That is MOZ.
they indeed did something drastic recently.
See if your numbers changed relatively wrt your bunghole competitors.
As for advice... I shall give you an unfair advantage ;)
Hey Jerryll, new to InvestorCarrot here. Do you do the work for your clients? Or you give them a course for them to follow? I would also like to know your pricing for SEO, i want to be the best at my market and provide the best value to both my buyers and sellers. I haven’t done DM but I’m leaning more toward cold calling and driving for dollars. I feel like SEO would add some value with less work for me. Right now just focused on my backyard which is a tough one (NYC)! But i can also venture out to Nassau and Westchester, and maybe Waterbury CT. Pricing would be cool to see if i can afford it now or look for ways to fund this kind of marketing. Thanks Jerryll, keep doing your thing my man.
Hey man.
Biggerpockets is going to stick a probe up my cute lil butt and electricute it, if I talk about my business in the open.
But fear not... I have buns of steel, and secondly.... I can message you the details and answers to all your questions.
I have been thinking about doing a little seminar here on Biggerpockets teaching others how exactly I do SEO. Just not sure how many people can let go of their inferior marketing systems and be openminded enough to look onto something bigger better and stronger.
But regardless, I will connect with you in provate!
@Jerryll Noorden have you ever done that training for SEO? I would be interested. I am sure you would have others that would be interested as well.
@Jerryll Noorden have you ever done that training for SEO? I would be interested. I am sure you would have others that would be interested as well.
No I have not. If there is enough interest I would be very willing.