I agree with PASSIVE money. If someone can prove they recently invested and were NOT "attached" to property, they should receive money first.
Then , investors who did nothing but roll over, should be next.
People who made money already have money...........MY F'N $.
those who were damaged the most, get the opportunity first.
It looks like its just that simple!
So Scout, you're saying that since you've rolled your investment over since day one, and have never seen a penny of your $ or interest, you would be willing to let people that just invested 1 month ago and only have 1 return coming, receive money before you? You're very generous!
I don't think any of us are going to have much say in how the funds are dispersed anyway....and Scout, I'm just messing with you!
In reality I think there will be X amount of dollars and it will be dispersed by the same % to each investor. Not by dates and such. Don't forget, that was Pinnacles way of dispersing money, they're history. The SEC and Hays Consulting will disperse it as fairly and legally as possible in THEIR own manner. There are also leases on buildings, legal fees, fines, etc. etc. to be paid, maybe even back taxes...who knows! I'm sure it all comes out of the same pot.
Passivemoney, The original atty. for Pinnacle quit several months ago. That was also in the WSJ article from Sept 21.
Here's another potential wrinkle I've been wondering about. Some of the investors may have been employees or friends/family of employees and may have known what was going on. They may have gotten in early with the specific intent of getting away with other people's money. They may have even duped other people into investing without telling them it was a scam. I assume the SEC can find these people and would make sure they wouldn't get any additional money they might be "owed," but can the SEC also go after their assets, too? If such people do exist then they, too, have been stealing from innocent people.
Hello Chamar22
He quit last month, two days before the WSJ - that is what Robert H told my husband.
The attorney felt the heat for himself and was trying to get out. He is the one that has the so called knowledge of the partnerships for all the investors and he delt with all the closings.
We would have our money if it was not for the "short form agreement" sound familiar?
TN, When I went to GA. in April 2006 and met all of the employees they stressed the point that as employees they were not allowed to invest in Pinnacle. This was intended to keep them on the straight and narrow so they could not benefit from referrals and false exagerations of how wonderful the company was. Don't know if all that is true given the fact that even though some people quit/got fired, they made no attempt to let the investors know this was a hoax. Maybe they got a huge severance check to keep quiet.
This is in response to someone who said that Pinnacle's fines, legal fees, back taxes, etc. will be paid out of their current assets. In short, if this is the case then the investors are actually paying Pinnacle's fines, legal fees, back taxes etc.
This hardly seems right! Gene O'Neal, Robert Hendree and the rest of the Pinnacle crooks who worked there should go in debt to pay these things...though I do know better...the gov't want their money first even if it is us, the investors, who end up paying for these things!!
The formula for distrubution of net assets is not likely a decision that Hays makes on it's own. There are laws, and precedents which dictate how the factors (amount paid in, time invested, prior disbursements, etc.) are used to determine each persons share.
Since some of the factors may be 'gray areas', it might be beneficial for investors to consider obtaining legal advice to protect their interests. Also, Hays Consulting is certainly a very helpful part of the process of refunding leftover assets, if any. However, it would be smart for investors to understand what the liqudators role is in terms of representing the investors. It may be that legally, their job is to simply maximize the net asset value, and do not get involved with figuring out disbursements formulas.
Some issues may need to be claimed legally by investors, such as being considered secured creditors, instead of unsecured, etc. These questions are all unanswered, and the best answers would come from an attorney.
What seems like should be the "fair" way to split up any leftover money may not be how it actually works.
Best of luck to all.
Did anyone actually read page 5 and 6 of the 22 page summons filed on Pinn. by the SEC? G. O'Neal is allowed $12,000 per month for the next 3 months for living expenses and $25,000 to use as a retainer for legal councel. If he needs more, it sounds like he can have more. He also can go out and find a job. So is this money coming out of the frozen assets that should be returned to us? As far as I'm concerned he should be sitting in jail for the next 45 days until this goes to court. Or better yet, he should be chained up inside the hole he crawled out of.
The last comments about dispursements make sense......but who was hurt the most, % wise, like consistent rollovers has to pull alot of weight.
No law for that.......COMMON SENSE.
Again, WHERE IS EVERYONE??????????????????????
even 10% of investors would make 200 people.
Did you all get your money back and dont give a sh -t ??????
I am a Pinnacle Investor
Does anyone know approx when Greg Hays will be sending out the claim form to the Pinnacle Investors?
The reason I'm asking this is because I drive a truck all over the country for a living and I need to know when to route myself home so I can "meet" the claim forms in the mail, fill them out and return them and go back out on the road to try to recover some of the money that I'll probably lose
vincentrose,
The claim forms are going to posted on Greg Hays' web site so if you have internet access you don't have to rearrange your route to meet them. Right now I would recommend getting all of your Pinnacle paperwork together and copies of cancelled checks or wire transfers. You are going to need that to verify your claim when you submit it. There are examples of claims from the other companies that are on Hays' web site that you can view to get an idea of what the claim form looks like.
http://haysconsulting.net/pinnacle.html
I too am in agreement with Passivemoney. I invested 80k after I received agreement on an initial 60K. I never received a partnership agreement for the 80k and Richard Morales-employee told me in September that it was never attached to a property. I told him I wanted my money back. He said the Short Form was a verbal agreement and directed me to someone else to make the request. What a joke. I told him this is not standard relative any form of a real estate transaction. We all know the money is paid when the contract is signed and usually in front of a notary. What were we thinking! Personally I was swayed by people getting paid. In fact Pinnacle screwed up in August on applying money and returned it to me in the beginning so it can be applied to the right account. That seemed credible at the time. Overall, my reserves are now depleted. I know others are in the same boat. We will all have to work harder and longer and invest wiser to make it up. Blah, Blah , Blah!
:badwords:
The roundup from the morning papers:
"Further, O'Neal was fined and sentenced to probation for forgery in 1998, which he did not disclose to investors, the suit maintains."--Atlanta Journal Constitution
"Anguish over Pinnacle has spilled over onto Internet message boards, where some investors report missing their most recent payments, while others say they were paid a few days late. Denver real-estate investor Gerry Reif says he never received $53,000 due on Sept. 27. He added that he spoke this week to a Pinnacle representative, who told him she didn't know when he would be paid."--Wall Street Journal
It's hard to believe that employees that worked for Pinnacle did not know what was going on. I know at least 4 people that I dealt with at various times and they all pretended like everything was OK and we all get paid.
Dear Investors:
Following please find a letter I have drafted this evening that will be posted on my web site tomorrow. I know all of you have many questions and we are working as diligntly as possible to develop hard numbers we can share with you. We have frozen all know bank accounts, taken immediate steps to limit expenses by terminating staff and rejecting office leases. I plan to spend most of the day tomorrow focused on the real properties that were acquired by Pinnacle.
As you may already know, on October 11, 2006, the United States Securities and Exchange Commission (the "SEC") filed a lawsuit in federal court in Atlanta, Georgia against Pinnacle Development Partners, LLC ("Pinnacle") and Gene A. O'Neal. In a nutshell, the SEC's Complaint asserts that from 2005 through September 2006, the Defendants were involved in one or more fraudulent investment offerings that purportedly involved real estate partnerships ("the Pinnacle Investment Program").
In connection with the SEC’s lawsuit, the court has appointed me as Receiver for Pinnacle. Among other things, I am responsible for determining the amounts invested in the investment programs promoted by the Defendants; the returns or interest paid on those investments; and determining what happened to the money that was invested.
This letter and the enclosed Investor Claim Form are being sent to you because the records available to us indicate that you were an investor in the Pinnacle Investment Program that is the subject of our investigation. Because our information may be incomplete at this point, I am asking that, if you know other investors, please make certain that they have received this letter. If not, a copy of the letter and Claim Form can be obtained from my website (see below).
Our investigation is in the very early stages. My lawyers, along with my professional staff and I, are working to gather as much information as possible so that we can gain a clear understanding of what happened here. We are currently reviewing accounting and banking records, real estate records and other business records of Pinnacle. We do not currently have direct access to Mr. O’Neal, but we are trying to obtain information from him (through his attorney) and from employees of the company and other witnesses.
Because of the significant amounts of money apparently invested in this program, the number of partnerships and the period of time during which the offering was conducted, this is a complicated assignment and requires the cooperation of people, like you, who made investments. The enclosed Claim Form is an important part of this process. Not only will this substantiate any claim that you might have to a distribution, it will provide us with valuable information that will assist us in our investigation. Please note that we have established a claim deadline of December 31, 2006. If your claim form is not received by that date, the claim might not be allowed.
I encourage you to complete the enclosed form at your earliest convenience. The information that we have requested is important. Please note that in addition to completing the form, we are asking you to provide us with copies of any supporting documents such as check copies (front and back), wire transfers and correspondence.
As we undertake this effort, you should understand that all of us who are involved in this investigation and recovery effort are paid out of the assets that are the subject of the receivership. Based on our experience in cases like this, we know that the investigation and administration of this receivership will be expensive. Our goal is to spend time and money wisely. Therefore, in virtually all of our planning and recovery efforts, we will take cost and potential financial benefit into account.
It will likely take months for us to complete our investigation and determine whether the amount of the distribution to creditors. We may be required to file additional litigation to recover assets or obtain recoveries from those who were involved with these investment programs before a distribution can be made. The reality of this circumstance is that it is much too early for us to make any estimate about the amount that will be distributed. We plan to file a report with the Court within 45 days that will describe the overall circumstances, including recoveries and assets, as of that date. At that time, we may be able to provide an assessment regarding the prospects and timing of any distribution. When filed, the report will be available on my firm’s website.
I realize that this news is likely distressing to you and difficult to understand. We will do our best to keep you and the Court informed regarding our efforts. As this case goes forward, we may file additional reports indicating where we are in our investigation and what, if anything, we are finding. So that you can have access to these reports and other information, we have established a page for this case on our website, which you will find at www.haysconsulting.net. On our home page, click on the link to Pinnacle Development Partners to find information relevant to this case. Initially, we are posting a copy of the SEC’s complaint, along with the order appointing me as Receiver and freezing the assets of the Defendants. As noted above, we have also posted a copy of this letter, the enclosed Investor Claim Form along with a downloadable template to assist you with calculating your claim. As our reports are filed with the District Court, they will be posted on the website.
I encourage you to check the website frequently, especially in the early months of this case. However, because we have numerous investors and our staff is devoted to active investigation, we request that you try to avoid calling my office for routine updates. Not only do these calls distract us from our other efforts, they are relatively costly to the estate. Even so, if you do need to call my office about a specific issue, please contact Shuwanda Sloane at (404) 926-0059. You may also contact us via e-mail through the website.
Sincerely,
S. Gregory Hays, Receiver
[/i]
rkny, after meeting Robert Hendree, I could truly understand why? He is a manipulative control freak.
We employes where not pretending that everything was ok, we were told that everything was ok, and that it was just taking a longer time to process and close the accounts correctly. This is why we told investors this information. I know for a fact that I believed in the company 100 percent and didn't know about anything going on. That information was only given out to the higher-ups, and kept from all of the employes who actually had to deal with the investors. And to the comment posted by chemar22; we didn't get a damn thing as far as severance check, the only thing that we recieved was a quick out the door by the sec. We no longer are employed, and thought everything was ok going into work on Wednesday...boy where we surprized :crying: We might not even get the pay check for the past week since the account is now frozen, so all we can do is move on, and hope that they do the right thing which is to pay out all the investors, and pay the employes their last checks.
Broke,
I believe that you guys might not have known all the details, but given the fact that you have been very timely and dilligent in calling us with return details in the past, all of a sudden you were back logged and were not suspicious- I can't buy it. Due dates have not changed, just the fact that accounts "had" to be closed. That should not have put any additional burden other than all money had to returned. Anyway, I just wish somebody would have blown the whistle in September when Pinnacle was still raking in the money without any intent of ever paying the new investors.
I have been searching the properties that pinnacle currently have and alot of the properties were bought for a lot more that what the property is worth. I think some one shoud investigate the previous owners of those properties and see if the have anything to do with Gene oneal. It could be very possible that some of the previous owners be in the scam too. Example ; i buy your land for triple the money its worth and then we split the money later thats a very good way of getting away with our money. :protest:
That is some funny sh--it Broke & laid off, welcome to the club... LOL
:crying:
Now you guys are on the other end of the phone... "Where is my money?" It will be a little late... Call back next week... LMFAO :oops:
:beer: <<<-------Robert Drinking coffee, fu--ck em all Gene, we are bullet proof
Bigman,
That has to be the funniest post I've seen on this forum so far.
To the Receiver - I appreciate your post and you obviously working on the case. However, you did point out how "expensive" you and your legal team's efforts would be on this case.
My question is where is the justice in attorney's and other legal professionals profiting from the finanical demise and disaster that investors are faced with? What ever happened to the day when attorney's did pro-bono work?
It just does not seem fair or even close to equitable that you and your legal team would be compensated first for what already seems apparent (albeit with hindsight) and further jeopardize any financial return that investors could hope for. Forget returns but just a return of principal would suffice at this point.
I'm sure you are yet to hear the true horror stories of what people are faced with (divorce, homes probably being foreclosed on etc) and yet you make it very clear that your team will be paid first from what little funds may be left at Pinnacle.
While I welcome the work your team will do in getting to the bottom of this, I just don't see the justice to us as investors. It would seem there would be a fairer, more equitable solution to how your legal team should be paid for their services.
Just Another Freaking Pissed Off Investor!!!!
That has to be the funniest post I've seen on this forum so far.
To the Receiver - I appreciate your post and you obviously working on the case. However, you did point out how "expensive" you and your legal team's efforts would be on this case.
My question is where is the justice in attorney's and other legal professionals profiting from the finanical demise and disaster that investors are faced with? What ever happened to the day when attorney's did pro-bono work?
It just does not seem fair or even close to equitable that you and your legal team would be compensated first for what already seems apparent (albeit with hindsight) and further jeopardize any financial return that investors could hope for. Forget returns but just a return of principal would suffice at this point.
I'm sure you are yet to hear the true horror stories of what people are faced with (divorce, homes probably being foreclosed on etc) and yet you make it very clear that your team will be paid first from what little funds may be left at Pinnacle.
While I welcome the work your team will do in getting to the bottom of this, I just don't see the justice to us as investors. It would seem there would be a fairer, more equitable solution to how your legal team should be paid for their services.
Just Another Freaking Pissed Off Investor!!!!
How is it not fair for the legal team to be paid first? If the legal team never got paid, who exactly would do this kind of work? Contrary to your belief, this is not some cheap undertaking to figure out exactly what happened, and how to distribute the funds. It is only fair for the consulting firm to get paid out of this. Otherwise they are nothing more than volunteers.
And please do not say "pro bono work." This is not something they can work on 10 hours a week for two months and fix everything.