ABC Capital/Philly Invest Review - Terrible Experience

ABC Capital/Philly Invest Review - Terrible Experience

Rental Property Investor · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2013 · 141 posts · 93 votes

ABC Capital review and the problem with Turnkey companies

I've done a detailed write up of my first turnkey experience in Texas with Texas Turnkey Property (link). I've seen a lot of threads asking for people to share their experience with ABC Capital as they are heavily promoted on BP.

WHY ABC CAPITAL/PHILLY INVEST:

I found out about ABC several years ago through a well known promoter, Maverick Investors. They had attractive numbers, much better than other turnkey providers I had seen. After seeing generally positive feedback on the company on BP, I contacted them, was put in touch with one of their sales guys named Ari, was the most helpful of anyone at the company. He sent me some properties to look over and I chose the one I was most interested in. It's located in Brewerytown, which promised strong appreciation with modest cash flow. Obviously, appreciation should never be relied upon, but a lot of the factors I look for in a successfully gentrifying market (proximity to transit, beautification efforts by the city, employment nearby, development in the neighborhood, all verified by the Philly planning commission) made me comfortable with my level of risk in pursuing this strategy.

In a gentrifying neighborhood, I figured I would have the greatest shot at a successful buy-renovate-rent-refinance strategy. The purchase price was $155k, their ARV estimate was $220k. My intent was to take out as much as possible through the refinance and purchase a second property with ABC that would cash flowbetter.

I did my research on the property, had a local realtor unaffiliated with ABC give me their opinion on Brewerytown; he alsopulled some comps for the neighborhood for me and crazily enough, ABC Capital's estimates for both ARV and rent seemed right on.

So I pulled the trigger. All cash, closed within 3 days.

THE PURCHASE:

I purchased a property that was already close to being finished with renovation. Usually, these renovations take several months. Instead, it was completed several weeks after closing, around late April, which was great. I started the process of refinancing using a local lender they recommended. (Side note: ABC advertises a B-R-R-R strategy, but if you are out of state with no affiliation to Philly, their local lenders are actually local credit unions and won’t lend to out of state investors.) I found a lender on my own, but the appraisal came in short - $190,000. Disappointing, but not a huge deal.

In both of my turnkey experiences, purchasing has been the easiest, smoothest part. But when the time comes for property managers to take over, it's clear that this is the Achilles heel of turnkey companies.

RENTING/PROPERTY MANAGEMENT aka WHERE **** HIT THE FAN:

First major issue was with renting the property out. In such a hot neighborhood, it should be easy to rent out a well-priced, newly renovated property. A month went by with no activity. I checked on my property's address on google and found two issues:

1.They were using a google street image view of the property pre-renovation with crumbling stucco and all as the first image on Zillow, Trulia, etc. No wonder it wasn't getting any interest! I asked ABC to remove the google street images view of my property and replace it with a renovated one.

2.They had lowered the rent to $1150. I never received an email from ABC informing me of a change. I asked Ari about it, and he explained it was to get somebody in the property quickly and the rent guarantee would pay me the difference. He also said that the rental guarantee of $1300/mo was good for at least one year, but if that first tenant stayed for longer than the year, then the rental guarantee would still pay the difference for the entire duration of the first tenant. I felt that ABC should have let me know before the price drop, not after.

I reached out to a local property manager not affiliated with ABC to get her opinion, and she agreed it was priced right at $1300/mo, but that it wasn't listed on the MLS, which was probably why I was having a hard time finding a renter. I brought it to ABC's attention and they told me that upon further review, they've agreed to start paying a broker to list properties that rent for over $1000 on the MLS. Ari told me they were going to send someone out to take pics of my property that day.

After 2.5 weeks, I asked for an update on whether or not it had been listed on the MLS yet. One of their property managers who explained that my property was burglarized two weeks prior. Uhhh…what? Look, I get that **** happens. ABC Capital has no control over something like a burglary. I wasn't upset with them that it happened. However, I was upset I wasn't informed earlier, especially since I had been checking in regularly throughout that time period. The response from the PM was that they just jumped into action and didn't stop to inform owners. While I appreciated the action, surely after 2 weeks the hubbub would have died down enough to inform the owner.

I asked them what the timeline for repairs was. No progress had been made with repairs because the police department has not come out to file the police report.After the police came out 4 weeks after the burglary, renovations began again. It took about 6 weeks to be completed.

After the second renovation was complete, I waited for news of any renters. In the meantime, the following issues popped up:

  1. I received a notice from the city water department threatening to shut off the water. ABC property management had told me they would cover the water bill during renovation and vacancy. Jay told me I was misinformed by his team, but did not offer to cover the cost of his team’s mistake.
  2. I received several notices from the city inspection department stating that I was in violation of their building permits. I sent these notices to Jay, who assured me personally that his team was aware and already working with the city inspectors on it. Finally, I received a notice from the city stating they were going to take legal action against me and the fines accrued were well into the 6 figures. Pissed, I reached out to Jay who was incredibly rude towards me. I ended up having to call the city over several weeks to work with the city inspectors directly, ALL of whom denied ever having spoken to Jay’s team on my case. Jay did hire a structural engineer who walked the property and gave his approval that the property was structurally sound. The city inspectors took the report and listened to my frustrating story and cleared the violation without requiring me to pay anything. I think they felt bad for me.
  3. That 10 year tax abatement that was advertised by ABC Capital was never completed, either. Jay’s team is incompetent at best, dishonest at worst. I recently received the tax assessment and the value had increased substantially. I was confused because Ari had told me the tax abatement was already taken care of way back when the property was renovated the first time. After calling in, the city made it clear that the deadline was December 2017, and I am no longer eligible for it.

    After 10 months of collecting the rent guarantee without any renters, I noticed that they had dropped the advertised rent to $950, still without letting me know. That’s a huge drop from $1300! Fed up and pissed off, I fired ABC. It took about 2 months to get my final statement and deposit. My new PM walked the property and mentioned a few things that ABC had skimmedover:

  1. ABC neglected to replace the fridge for some reason (it was included in the scope of work). Jay reimbursed me the cost of a fridge in my final deposit
  2. I had purchased a 2 BR, but the second bedroom was so small, you couldn’t fit a twin size bed with the bedroom door closed!! No wonder the appraisal came in under and $1300 rent was too high!

Within 2 weeks, my new property manager had found a renter paying more than the $950 ABC was advertising. No issues with my new property manager.

To all the ABC prospective clients that have been reaching out to me directly for my experience, I hope this is enough to deter you – no returns are worth this much headache. I would stay far, far away from ABC Capital. You should also know that current investors unhappy with ABC have contacted me in the hopes of organizing legal action against the company. Their property management company also apparently has a class action lawsuit being built against them by another commenter in a different thread.

To all the current ABC investors who are unhappy with ABC have also reached out to me, if you need a new PM, let me know. I have been referring others to my new PM.

TLDR: ABC is the worst; false advertising, impotent property management, lawsuits incoming, stay away! Issues summarized:

  1. Property was advertised as a 2 BR, but the second bedroom can’t fit a twin size bed.
  2. 10 year tax abatement – ABC’s property management never registered it, told me it was done, and now it is too late for me to register with the city
  3. ABC never contacted the city for a final inspection, causing the city to threaten legal action against me and accrue well over 6 figures in fines that I had to resolve on my own.
  4. Never found a renter for me after 10 months. My new property manager found a renter in 2 weeks for more than what ABC was advertising.
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Member since 2018 · 6 posts · 23 votes
8y

@Jay Hinrichs What makes you think I am a foreign investor? Just because my name is Asian does not mean I am a foreign investor. I am a US (Greatest country in the world) investor. There are hundreds of thousands of Asians living in NYC. Come over to NYC, it would make you feel like a minority. At least in NYC, nobody would treat you like a foreigner just because your name is foreign. 

In regards to why check needed to be written and sent in a world of of modern technology these days, that would be a question to Jay himself. I texted Jay this morning about the bounced check, he did take care of it and wired the money to me this morning. After all these months, I finally got my money back. Jay also wanted me to say something nice to the world that he took care of my payment. Originally, I was going to at least say something nice like appreciating him for going to the bank and wiring the money, But on second thought, this is the money that ABC owed me for months, why would I be so nice? Just because I received it, and I should thank him for it? I don't know how many people out there still have not received their money that they are supposed to receive. So in this case, I would stay neutral, and leave the facts to speak for themselves.

@Jay Hinrichs I don't know how much you have invested with ABC, and I don't really care. To be a successful business, I always believe it should treat everybody equal and fair, and of course with honesty. You are happy with ABC does not mean other people should have your same experience. Please be more considerate to other investors. If you had to go through all we had to with ABC, you would not feel the same. Nothing personal, just want everybody remember be informed on this forum.

Again, I am an American and PROUD to be one too!!

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  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Sarah Lam:

    nice try @Jay Hinrichs. Check the abc capital threads, they are flooded with people complaining about ABC. I get weekly if not daily investors contacting me asking how to get a response from ABC. It’s not just me, but sure, try to make me out to be vindictive when everything I’ve said is true. 

    Sarah answer one simple question.. why did you not take a Full recession when offered.. that's the bottom line.. no one can make everyone happy your not happy your on a crusade.. I get that.. but at the end of the day and having done this for 40 years I have had to buy property back more than a few times from disgruntled buyers.. but that's what a standup company does they offer a full recession lke what was offered to you.. instead you just kept the property and keep on harping talking about all these mysterious people contacting you and of course BP being the site it is.. people automatically take what you say as the truth when in fact most landlords with limited experience have no clue anyway.. so if your not happy take the recession and move on.. we all have better things to do in life..  this reminds me of a divorce proceeding LOL..  Emotion is dictating things not business decisions.

  • Rental Property Investor · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2013 · 141 posts · 93 votes
    8y

    @Jay Hinrichs you’re kidding me, right? Do you know how long it took me to get anything done with ABC? Even when dealing with Jay directly? I had to initiate everything, keep the ball rolling and keep them HONEST because they dropped the ball on EVERY aspect of this purchase. After months of chasing, unanswered emails, ignored texts, condescending communication, I am so relieved to have nothing to do with Jay or ABC anymore. That is my victory and reward. Why would I ever enter into any other type of business deal with a man I don’t trust, whose company has proven to be incompetent in nearly every area they market themselves in, and is also just plain rude? I don’t want to have to deal with the headache of working with him anymore. I am very open to selling, but I’m overseas at the moment, making things a bit harder for me to get the ball rolling.

    I still don’t understand why you relentlessly support Jay given all the issues other investors are facing. And not just these “mysterious” ones that I keep mentioning, who I won’t share because of their own privacy, but the others that have spoken up about their problems publicly. 

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Sarah Lam:

    @Jay Hinrichs you’re kidding me, right? Do you know how long it took me to get anything done with ABC? Even when dealing with Jay directly? I had to initiate everything, keep the ball rolling and keep them HONEST because they dropped the ball on EVERY aspect of this purchase. After months of chasing, unanswered emails, ignored texts, condescending communication, I am so relieved to have nothing to do with Jay or ABC anymore. That is my victory and reward. Why would I ever enter into any other type of business deal with a man I don’t trust, whose company has proven to be incompetent in nearly every area they market themselves in, and is also just plain rude? I don’t want to have to deal with the headache of working with him anymore. I am very open to selling, but I’m overseas at the moment, making things a bit harder for me to get the ball rolling.

    I still don’t understand why you relentlessly support Jay given all the issues other investors are facing. And not just these “mysterious” ones that I keep mentioning, who I won’t share because of their own privacy, but the others that have spoken up about their problems publicly

    just what I thought a personal vendetta not grounded in business but just emotional..

  • Rental Property Investor · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2013 · 141 posts · 93 votes
    8y

    @Jay Hinrichs Hey Jay why don’t you just buy it off me? Your buddy Jay walsh says it’s a good deal so you can trust him. Put your money where your mouth is?

    I’m not selling to him because of the work it would cause me. Is that emotions? 

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Sarah Lam:

    @Jay Hinrichs Hey Jay why don’t you just buy it off me? Your buddy Jay walsh says it’s a good deal so you can trust him. Put your money where your mouth is?

    I’m not selling to him because of the work it would cause me. Is that emotions? 

    Ok Sarah show me your hud of what you Paid I will buy it as soon as title is ready  how is that.. ????  you keep the rents you have got I will give you your purchase price and you can be done with this emotional roller coaster.

  • Rental Property Investor · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2013 · 141 posts · 93 votes
    8y

    @Jay Hinrichs WOW now I’m really convinced you’re somehow in business with ABC/Jay. Somebody sent me a message saying exactly that a few weeks ago, but now it seems pretty convincing to me. 

    Happy to discuss more about offloading this property. I’ll send you a PM. It’s midnight here and I’ve got an early flight tomorrow morning so will message you then. 

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Sarah Lam:

    @Jay Hinrichs WOW now I’m really convinced you’re somehow in business with ABC/Jay. Somebody sent me a message saying exactly that a few weeks ago, but now it seems pretty convincing to me. 

    Happy to discuss more about offloading this property. I’ll send you a PM. It’s midnight here and I’ve got an early flight tomorrow morning so will message you then. 

     OK I proved my point you will sell it to me  .  but you for emotional reasons wont sell it back to the vendor.. I get it.

    but do PM me see if we cant get you taken care off like I have said I have bought about 3 mil worth of property in Philly and am always keen to add more.

  • Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    8y
    There was another thread about a poor experience with this company
  • Member since 2018 · 6 posts · 23 votes
    8y

    @Jay Hinrichs What makes you think I am a foreign investor? Just because my name is Asian does not mean I am a foreign investor. I am a US (Greatest country in the world) investor. There are hundreds of thousands of Asians living in NYC. Come over to NYC, it would make you feel like a minority. At least in NYC, nobody would treat you like a foreigner just because your name is foreign. 

    In regards to why check needed to be written and sent in a world of of modern technology these days, that would be a question to Jay himself. I texted Jay this morning about the bounced check, he did take care of it and wired the money to me this morning. After all these months, I finally got my money back. Jay also wanted me to say something nice to the world that he took care of my payment. Originally, I was going to at least say something nice like appreciating him for going to the bank and wiring the money, But on second thought, this is the money that ABC owed me for months, why would I be so nice? Just because I received it, and I should thank him for it? I don't know how many people out there still have not received their money that they are supposed to receive. So in this case, I would stay neutral, and leave the facts to speak for themselves.

    @Jay Hinrichs I don't know how much you have invested with ABC, and I don't really care. To be a successful business, I always believe it should treat everybody equal and fair, and of course with honesty. You are happy with ABC does not mean other people should have your same experience. Please be more considerate to other investors. If you had to go through all we had to with ABC, you would not feel the same. Nothing personal, just want everybody remember be informed on this forum.

    Again, I am an American and PROUD to be one too!!

  • Rental Property Investor · Tel Aviv, Israel · Member since 2012 · 163 posts · 57 votes
    8y

    I am not affliaited with ABC or any other Turnkey provider.

    however, I deal with these type of properties (some are ABC proprties) and I would like to agree with @Jay Hinrichs:

    property management , especially in these type of markets (the type of properties ABC has) - is a TOUGH and VERY CRUEL business! even if you try to manage this type of tenants yourself - it will be a long roller coaster ride! maybe personal experience can come into play and help you manage and survive these type of markets, but I have been doing it for years with TONS of experience (learned my TENANTS lessons back in the day in some tough California markets ...) and in the end of the day - like @jay 

    @Jay Hinrichs said it is not exact science .. and you also need some LUCK...

    the rpoeprties I have got from ABC are well managed , I cam defiently say that, money is coming in.... 

    again - never met with @Jay Walsh and I do not know him... but I think this thread is not doing him justice, from what I know - ABC runs couple of thousands properties in very tough markets, I believe it is very hard to satisfy 100% of their clientele..

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @KING SHUN CHIK:

    @Jay Hinrichs What makes you think I am a foreign investor? Just because my name is Asian does not mean I am a foreign investor. I am a US (Greatest country in the world) investor. There are hundreds of thousands of Asians living in NYC. Come over to NYC, it would make you feel like a minority. At least in NYC, nobody would treat you like a foreigner just because your name is foreign. 

    In regards to why check needed to be written and sent in a world of of modern technology these days, that would be a question to Jay himself. I texted Jay this morning about the bounced check, he did take care of it and wired the money to me this morning. After all these months, I finally got my money back. Jay also wanted me to say something nice to the world that he took care of my payment. Originally, I was going to at least say something nice like appreciating him for going to the bank and wiring the money, But on second thought, this is the money that ABC owed me for months, why would I be so nice? Just because I received it, and I should thank him for it? I don't know how many people out there still have not received their money that they are supposed to receive. So in this case, I would stay neutral, and leave the facts to speak for themselves.

    @Jay Hinrichs I don't know how much you have invested with ABC, and I don't really care. To be a successful business, I always believe it should treat everybody equal and fair, and of course with honesty. You are happy with ABC does not mean other people should have your same experience. Please be more considerate to other investors. If you had to go through all we had to with ABC, you would not feel the same. Nothing personal, just want everybody remember be informed on this forum.

    Again, I am an American and PROUD to be one too!!

    my deepest apologies I have done business with clients all over the world and that was defiantly a mistake to take that leap.. 

    1/2 of my personal investor base is of Asian decent or living in southeast Asia.. so again deeply apologize and did not mean to offend. 

    End of the day looks like your taken care of and we can move on.. EnJoy this great counties birthday today.. 

  • Fairfax, VA · Member since 2013 · 69 posts · 35 votes
    8y

    @Jay Hinrichs I don’t think it’s fair that you’re accusing Sarah of having a personal vendetta against ABC. Just b/c she was willing to publicly share her personal experience doesn’t mean she’s out to get ABC. It’s about sharing information to help other investors make informed decisions, that’s what BP is here for, right? And Sarah’s experience isn’t just a one off “mistake” that you’re making it out to be. There are many, many other angry and frustrated ABC customers, myself being one of them. There’s another  thread if you’re interested in reading up on it.

    That’s great for you that your investments with ABC have worked out, but just because you’ve invested a large amount with them and haven’t experienced the same issues others have, it doesn't mean those issues aren't true. Maybe you go the special treatment b/c you have a large amount invested with them, who knows?

    Also, you and @Lior Reich seem to only be focusing on the PM part, and defending ABC on how PM is difficult in these types of neighborhoods. If you paid attention to all of Sarah’s review, and read the other thread, you’d know that PM is only a small part of how ABC is falling short. From what I understand, ABC does the tenant placement themselves but partners with third party PM firms to do the PM once the properties are actually tenanted, so the PM isn’t even the main point of frustration here, it’s the rehab and tenant placement process, along with their lack of communication with the customer.

    If you read the other thread, I posted about my experience with ABC as well. It’s been over a year, and my property still isn’t complete! How is that in any turnkey model acceptable? Yes, construction projects have delays, but over a year for a rental property is just ridiculous, especially when the contract clearly states 90 days for rehab. And beyond that, there’s zero communication. Every time we contact ABC for an update, we get the runaround. The property’s been “close” to completion for the past year. This comes down to how a business is operated. Maintaining clear lines of communication and setting customer expectations is a fundamental part of any business. If lying and making up stuff is a routine part of how ABC operates, then that seriously calls into question the integrity of the business itself. And I’m not alone in this. I’ve also had many other frustrated ABC customers reach out with similar experiences.

    The experience wouldn’t be nearly as frustrating if ABC were upfront with everything, versus misleading us. Again, if you read the other thread, you’ll get a much better idea of the frustrations ABC’s customers have experienced.

    Maybe at some point in the past ABC did operate differently and were able to deliver satisfactory products and services to their customers in a timely manner. But that’s definitely not the case now. Maybe ABC grew too fast and didn’t have the proper systems in place to scale up, so now they’re just playing catch up. I don’t know, but I do know that how they’re running their business now is definitely NOT acceptable. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    8y
    Idk how many total investors ABC capital has but let’s say it’s in the thousands. The biggest turnkey provider in the country is Memphis invest, and I don’t think I’ve ever seen any complaints about them ever and they have over 5000 homes and over 1000 investors. Same goes for the turnkey company I’ve used. They’re smaller, but I’ve never heard anything bad about them and anytime I mention who they are, everyone says what great people the owners are. The PM (attached to the turnkey company) js extremely communicative to the point where if I don’t get an answer in under 2 hours (during the week) I consider that “slow”. Obviously I don’t always expect it to be that fast, but a lot of times it is, so it sets that expectation in the back of your mind. They have a repair warranty for the first few months of ownership and any repairs are reimbursed like clockwork at the end of the month for that warranty. Never had a check for rent sent to me, all ACH. Hits my account 3 days later. Easy Peezy. My main point is I don’t buy the whole argument that thousands of investors means someone will have a bad experience. I can think of two companies off the top of my head that I’ve never met someone who has had a bad experience with
  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Stacy Weng:

    @Jay Hinrichs I don’t think it’s fair that you’re accusing Sarah of having a personal vendetta against ABC. Just b/c she was willing to publicly share her personal experience doesn’t mean she’s out to get ABC. It’s about sharing information to help other investors make informed decisions, that’s what BP is here for, right? And Sarah’s experience isn’t just a one off “mistake” that you’re making it out to be. There are many, many other angry and frustrated ABC customers, myself being one of them. There’s another  thread if you’re interested in reading up on it.

    That’s great for you that your investments with ABC have worked out, but just because you’ve invested a large amount with them and haven’t experienced the same issues others have, it doesn't mean those issues aren't true. Maybe you go the special treatment b/c you have a large amount invested with them, who knows?

    Also, you and @Lior Reich seem to only be focusing on the PM part, and defending ABC on how PM is difficult in these types of neighborhoods. If you paid attention to all of Sarah’s review, and read the other thread, you’d know that PM is only a small part of how ABC is falling short. From what I understand, ABC does the tenant placement themselves but partners with third party PM firms to do the PM once the properties are actually tenanted, so the PM isn’t even the main point of frustration here, it’s the rehab and tenant placement process, along with their lack of communication with the customer.

    If you read the other thread, I posted about my experience with ABC as well. It’s been over a year, and my property still isn’t complete! How is that in any turnkey model acceptable? Yes, construction projects have delays, but over a year for a rental property is just ridiculous, especially when the contract clearly states 90 days for rehab. And beyond that, there’s zero communication. Every time we contact ABC for an update, we get the runaround. The property’s been “close” to completion for the past year. This comes down to how a business is operated. Maintaining clear lines of communication and setting customer expectations is a fundamental part of any business. If lying and making up stuff is a routine part of how ABC operates, then that seriously calls into question the integrity of the business itself. And I’m not alone in this. I’ve also had many other frustrated ABC customers reach out with similar experiences.

    The experience wouldn’t be nearly as frustrating if ABC were upfront with everything, versus misleading us. Again, if you read the other thread, you’ll get a much better idea of the frustrations ABC’s customers have experienced.

    Maybe at some point in the past ABC did operate differently and were able to deliver satisfactory products and services to their customers in a timely manner. But that’s definitely not the case now. Maybe ABC grew too fast and didn’t have the proper systems in place to scale up, so now they’re just playing catch up. I don’t know, but I do know that how they’re running their business now is definitely NOT acceptable. 

    point taken thankyou... At the end of the day I offered to Buy Sarahs head ache for what she paid full price no cost to her .. she did send me a colleague request which I thought was going to be follow up with here is the address here is my hud and here is where you send my check.. but I have not hear anything else from here.. So my point was if she was so unhappy with the company the best most companies can do is offer a full recession and move on.  If the buyer will not take that up.. then in my mind its just going out of their way to complain.

    However I know with ABC this is not turn key in that your closing on a rehabbed rented house your buying PRE rehab and getting built in equity based in essence the BRRRR routine so not fair to compare to turnkey rent ready that's not what you bought.. But one year yes no argument there from me that is something that should be addressed by the company.

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Caleb Heimsoth:

    Idk how many total investors ABC capital has but let’s say it’s in the thousands. The biggest turnkey provider in the country is Memphis invest, and I don’t think I’ve ever seen any complaints about them ever and they have over 5000 homes and over 1000 investors.

    Same goes for the turnkey company I’ve used. They’re smaller, but I’ve never heard anything bad about them and anytime I mention who they are, everyone says what great people the owners are.

    The PM (attached to the turnkey company) js extremely communicative to the point where if I don’t get an answer in under 2 hours (during the week) I consider that “slow”. Obviously I don’t always expect it to be that fast, but a lot of times it is, so it sets that expectation in the back of your mind. They have a repair warranty for the first few months of ownership and any repairs are reimbursed like clockwork at the end of the month for that warranty.

    Never had a check for rent sent to me, all ACH. Hits my account 3 days later. Easy Peezy.

    My main point is I don’t buy the whole argument that thousands of investors means someone will have a bad experience. I can think of two companies off the top of my head that I’ve never met someone who has had a bad experience with

    Caleb every company gets some amount of complaints or what have U no one is exempt from this just because you have not seen them they happen.. NO one can be in the rental business and be absolutely 1000% perfect simply not possible its not possible in the human condition of any tenant base.   You simply have not been doing it long enough or had enough units.

  • Rental Property Investor · Tel Aviv, Israel · Member since 2012 · 163 posts · 57 votes
    8y

    @Stacy Weng

    you are correct, I did mention the only part I am familiar with first hand with ABC properties and this is - PM. 

    my business model is helping investors who have bought Turn Key properties - and their investment has "gone wrong" on them.

    "gone wrong" = all the points you have mentioned in your post... dishonesty , lack of communication , miserable performance and etc...

    for fact - I dont support almost any TURNKEY model.

    if you go to turnkey - I believe that the property you are buying needs to be in FULL SHAPE and preforming returns as fact for some time - other wise , to my understanding - IT IS NOT Turnkey...

    hope I am being more clear now.

  • Member since 2018 · 4 posts · 1 vote
    8y

    I'm a Hong Kong buyer and bought two houses from ABC in 2016. Since Dec last year, ABC started delaying to pay guarantee rent and even they paid, the rent was not as full amount as guaranteed in the contract. I haven't received guarantee rents since March this year. They breached the contract in the first place.

    The worst thing is that both houses are broken without any renovation which is supposed to be completed in first two months after closing of my purchase according to the contract. They breached the contract again.

    Mr. Jay Walsh, please buy back my houses and pay back all the outstanding rents asap.

  • Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2014 · 23 posts · 19 votes
    8y

    @Hon Wai  I know this is just a place for you to vent.  However as you know the product you were sold was insured (rental) by a 3rd party insurance company.  As you were informed this company went out if business and stop paying July of last year.  As you also know ABC honored this rent and paid out of pocket to you until December 2017.  As also has been communicated and you can look up in public records we have sued this insurer and all proceeds will first go to clients that we have not made whole.  That being said all the payments you receive this year came from ABC as an attempt to do good by our clients.  The only payments you have not received (which you will) as you also know are being held up by compliance as our international payment processor.  With regard to the houses not being dont,  your right they Philadelphia got so hot it was hard hire and retain contractors to finish the houses. Thats why ABC no longer sells houses that require renovation.  We sell only finished performing houses.  That being said your houses are being worked on and will be finished. 

  • Member since 2018 · 4 posts · 1 vote
    8y

    Mr. Jay Walsh, thanks for your prompt reply. I think you're a trustworthy person who would always abide the contract, fulfill the obligation on the contract and uphold the sanctity of contracts under any circumstances (including the shutdown of the 3rd party insurance company because this is your responsibility and not mine). Please refer to the contract and do according to the contract.

    Mr. Jay Walsh, are you sure that ABC "honored" the rent and paid out of pocket to me? Please refer to the contract we signed. That is your "rental guarantee", your promise without any conditions, not honored.

    Regarding renovation, I know it was hard to hire and retain contractors to finish the houses, not only in Philadelphia but also in Hong Kong and maybe even Baltimore, Cleveland and Jackson that ABC is now exploring these cities for selling turnkey properties. Please be noted that my purchase was done in 2016. It's already two years. Renovation has not been done yet. Your explanation would never infer a reasonable time for such deferred performance. Please abide the contract.

    Here's the text quoted from your ABC website : "The full renovation is conducted in less than 90 days after the purchase of your home."  

    http://www.abccapitalinvestments.com/our-renovatio...

    I'm sure you'll delete or amend the above web page very soon after reading this message.

    Mr. Jay Walsh, please arrange early buy-back of my two properties at my purchase price and settle all the outstanding rentals. This is not a vent. This is the fact. 

  • Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2017 · 364 posts · 109 votes
    8y

    I hope your contract doesn't have a small print somewhere like a disclosure that is at the end of that web page.

    Maybe it's the time to get a lawyer.

  • Member since 2018 · 4 posts · 1 vote
    8y

    Thanks for your advice, Lana! Their web disclaimer can't override the contract in which there's no such disclaimer.

  • Baltimore, MD · Member since 2018 · 169 posts · 82 votes
    8y

    2 years??? thats completely unreal. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Hong Kong, Hong Kong Island · Member since 2018 · 3 posts · 6 votes
    8y
    Yes, 2 years and owner don’t know as ABC keep cheating the insurance company to get the rent paid. We found it early this year when finally insurance company can’t paid due to huge loss. I am one of the 40 investors from Hong Kong get no rental now which guarantee in contact. This is not just several unlucky cases in ABC. But a large % of investors facing similar problem. Can’t imagine how worse can a company operating in US like ABC.
  • Baltimore, MD · Member since 2018 · 169 posts · 82 votes
    8y

    @Edward Chan thats a real shame. get a good lawyer perhaps, definitely get someone who knows philadelphia and its rental property to report to you and your partners if not already. If you have any rentals in baltimore, i could certainly help anyone examine/assess rental property. I have a large portfolio in baltimore i manage all aspects of. 

  • Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2014 · 23 posts · 19 votes
    8y

    @Edward Chan  This ONLY applies to HK investors that were using that rental guarantee product.  Every single other client does not have rental guarantee after their first year.  They were all informed the product was no longer available and they are fine.  I am honoring the HK ones out of ABC's pocket.  I dont know what cheating the insurance company means but please look up the lawsuits in public records that have been provided.  ABC Capital Investments vs. Nationwide Rent Sure et al, US District Court Eastern Pennsylvania. Filed initially November 2017. 

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