Finditandfundit.com
Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2008 · 691 posts · 12 votes
Hello,
Since I started investing, I have allowed myself to be the recipient of many gurus and people trying to sell mentoring programs and other services aimed at newby investors. Some I have found very helpful, and I find that if I sift through the garbage I can usually find a gem of thought from most every program, in order to formulate my own that works for me.
I was wondering about a particular one called Ameraco, Inc. Their site is finditandfundit.com. The idea is they are portraying themselves as the site to go to if you are a whoelsaler or birddog. they say they have buyers, financing, mentoring, everything! Of course, it all sounds too good to be true, so I thought I would ask and see if anyone has tried it and found it worth the cost.Thanks, Mike
I purchased the Ameraco "program" in April '09 and I can say I learned a lot about it in the last two weeks...some good, some not so good. A lot of what everyone said here in this blog and on other blog sites is true and credible advice...too bad I did not heed it. I can also tell you that I asked my credit card company to enter a dispute against Ameraco and issue a credit. I feel better now, as I came to the realization, that I probably wasn't ever going to do a deal with them or their investor network (if it really exists, and I cannot say if it does or doesn't yet).
This post is to help prevent anyone else from wasting their time, money and dreams on Ameraco. It might not be a classic Internet marketing scam like some of the others, but if it's legitimate, then it's nearly impossibile to execute a deal and get paid, in my opinion.
In a nutshell, I spoke with one of their sales reps for about a week before the sign-up, asked lots of questions, got lots of positive feedback (as well as immediate callbacks), and the FedEx with the "program" and membership info arrived as expected a week later. I got a package containing a manual, some supplemental books with links to Internet resources, an audio CD and the account/password to their private-access Website (deal submission online form and other resources, such as basic real estate contracts in PDF format). I read the manual on how to work their program and listened to the audio CD containing a scripted Q&A session. (The supplemental information with links to Internet resources was nothing special that I couldn't find on my own.) The manual they sent was somewhat helpful (as far as a basic real estate information and contracting were concerned, plus how to submit a deal), and they did go to a lot of trouble to explain how the program could work given the right circumstances and perseverance, and why/how it was legal (assignable contracts), but it left me with more questions than it answered. Plus, it had several outdated references, redundant information, poor examples and big holes regarding the execution of current real-world real estate investment deals. I also learned that a big part of the strategy relies on the seller waiting for and putting-off the ernest money until/if an investor picks up the deal (unless you want to risk your own money). In theory, the program sounds good, and might have worked for someone at some point in history, but in reality, it's very difficult to execute in today's market given the very tight investor requirements, deal submission process and "highly motivated" seller assumptions. It's like finding a needle in a haystack just to locate the target property...and then you need to find at least 3 other almost identical, sold "comparables" to prove your good deal and current market price...and still be at least 30% below fair market value for nearby residential listings (on top of deducting necessary repair expenses), and at least 40% for an REO...and don't think you can submit a deal for vacant land, commercial or anything else that is not a standard family residence. There's a lot of home foreclosures out there, but it's difficult to find a property/deal that meets Ameraco investor requirements (and you won't find them on Foreclosure.com or any other well-known source)...and it's still not clear how much commission % will be paid...or how quickly...if at all. The method for calculating the commissions and the details of how it gets paid are ambiguous and not well documented in the manual. You're definitely being paid to be a bird-dog (at best), and you have to find the bird...then you might get paid...but I cannot verify that with anyone.
Much to my dismay, as soon as I was a paid member, I never did get to speak with my sales rep again to get my questions answered (even though he said I would be able to) and I always got transferred to a "Support Line" voice mail when I called. Support never called me back (oh, and they know if the caller is a paid member by the incoming phone number, I found out, and then it's "straight to voice mail" from then on. Before sign-up, the operator would tell me if my sales rep was "in" and she could apparently see him from where she was sitting, but after sign-up, she claimed she couldn't see his desk and he was always "out" for family issues or some other reason unavailable, and my v-mails left with that sales rep were never returned anymore after he got me to sign-up).
Eventually, after not receiving any support call-backs, I asked the Ameraco operator/dispatcher to transfer me to the sales manager. He didn't return my call until many hours later (saying he was in meetings). I mentioned that I wanted a refund (being dissolutioned and dissappointed with the support) and that's when he told me that the program was sold as "non-refundable" and I should have seen that in the terms and conditions. I told him that my sales rep said I could get a refund if I was not happy with the program...so the sales person basically lied to get me to sign-up (one of the many lies). During the call he went to great lengths to blame me for not making the program work...I wasn't trying hard enough or looking in the right places for a deal, apparently. Eventually, during the call and after a lot of hostility on his part, the sales manager agreed to refund my money if I sent all the materials back to him (less shipping, of course). I also told him I would file a complaint with the BBB and post some negative blogs entries. However, it remains to be seen if he really follows through with the refund.
On a side note, I think that at one time in the past Ameraco might have been a viable company...even though their claim of 10,000 investors in the network is doubtful. But in the end, it's becoming clear that Ameraco's primary objective was just a "boiler room" operation on the front end designed to get the $495 out of every caller, and the sales rep will just tell you what you want to hear just to get you to sign-up...such as, deals are easy to find in my area, investors are plentiful with lots of money to spend, and commissions are big, easy and quickly paid. Once you are in the network the relationship immediately changes, there are new surprise conditions that they didn't tell you about before you sign-up, and there's no guarantee that an investor wouldn't steal the deal behind your back (although, I cannot say if that really happens, but they address it in the materials).
I also called the Florida Better Business Bureau to find out more, and I talked with an agent at the BBB. Seems Ameraco has had 11 complaints in the last 36 months, and 4 this year in '09. All complaints have been addressed by the company, so on one hand that is a good sign, but I'll bet that Ameraco bends over backward to rectify those complaints to keep that A+ rating because it's an integral part of their sales strategy. So, I would be very cautious about this rating...it's easy to get an A+ because it's calculated by the BBB computer based on a formula for the number of complaints and the rectification of those complaints.
Oh, one more thing...when I talked with the credit card agent, she looked at the details behind the transaction and apparently the charge is run through a "Barber and Beauty Shop" merchant account, even though on my credit card statement it said "Ameraco". When I told the BBB agent about the "Barber and Beauty Shop" merchant account, she asked to see the detail so they can address it with Ameraco.
I'll post more details about my experience if anyone is interested. Mike.
Looks like another bird-dog service of some sort. I know nothing about them but await responses from those who do have reactions (good or bad).
Interesting, I also signed up to see what the deal is like. When I hear something I will post.
They called me. Basically the deal is this. You pay the $400, they train you how to wholesale or partner with a rehabber, yadda, and also give you access to their list of investors which they claim is 8,000+. Every time you submit a property, you submit it to the viewing of that many investors.
It may be worth it, but Im going to hold off for now. It is a one time only fee, it all kinda scares me, until I hear from someone I trust that it's a good idea to sign up, I probably wont.
You have to pay $400? I thought it was $495. I don't think it's a scam they're registered with the BBB and don't have many complaints, and for the complaints they do have they responded to them, and dealt with them so that's a plus (You have to keep in mind it's not the amount of complaints you want to look at it's how they responded to them that's important) I know another company called TCS foreclosures that's doing the exact same thing as Ameraco, but they want $10,000 to start. They claim you'll make that back with your first deal. I've been watching Ameraco periodically and I've seen how many Investors sign up the last time I checked the most recent Investor signed up last month. They've been around for a while so they may have many Investors, they say now that have 9,000+ investors. I don't know what to say except just try it out for yourself. I tried using Google to find bad reviews on it, but nothing came up (which is a good thing, if a company is a scam or have bad reviews you'll find it on google)
I purchased the Ameraco "program" in April '09 and I can say I learned a lot about it in the last two weeks...some good, some not so good. A lot of what everyone said here in this blog and on other blog sites is true and credible advice...too bad I did not heed it. I can also tell you that I asked my credit card company to enter a dispute against Ameraco and issue a credit. I feel better now, as I came to the realization, that I probably wasn't ever going to do a deal with them or their investor network (if it really exists, and I cannot say if it does or doesn't yet).
This post is to help prevent anyone else from wasting their time, money and dreams on Ameraco. It might not be a classic Internet marketing scam like some of the others, but if it's legitimate, then it's nearly impossibile to execute a deal and get paid, in my opinion.
In a nutshell, I spoke with one of their sales reps for about a week before the sign-up, asked lots of questions, got lots of positive feedback (as well as immediate callbacks), and the FedEx with the "program" and membership info arrived as expected a week later. I got a package containing a manual, some supplemental books with links to Internet resources, an audio CD and the account/password to their private-access Website (deal submission online form and other resources, such as basic real estate contracts in PDF format). I read the manual on how to work their program and listened to the audio CD containing a scripted Q&A session. (The supplemental information with links to Internet resources was nothing special that I couldn't find on my own.) The manual they sent was somewhat helpful (as far as a basic real estate information and contracting were concerned, plus how to submit a deal), and they did go to a lot of trouble to explain how the program could work given the right circumstances and perseverance, and why/how it was legal (assignable contracts), but it left me with more questions than it answered. Plus, it had several outdated references, redundant information, poor examples and big holes regarding the execution of current real-world real estate investment deals. I also learned that a big part of the strategy relies on the seller waiting for and putting-off the ernest money until/if an investor picks up the deal (unless you want to risk your own money). In theory, the program sounds good, and might have worked for someone at some point in history, but in reality, it's very difficult to execute in today's market given the very tight investor requirements, deal submission process and "highly motivated" seller assumptions. It's like finding a needle in a haystack just to locate the target property...and then you need to find at least 3 other almost identical, sold "comparables" to prove your good deal and current market price...and still be at least 30% below fair market value for nearby residential listings (on top of deducting necessary repair expenses), and at least 40% for an REO...and don't think you can submit a deal for vacant land, commercial or anything else that is not a standard family residence. There's a lot of home foreclosures out there, but it's difficult to find a property/deal that meets Ameraco investor requirements (and you won't find them on Foreclosure.com or any other well-known source)...and it's still not clear how much commission % will be paid...or how quickly...if at all. The method for calculating the commissions and the details of how it gets paid are ambiguous and not well documented in the manual. You're definitely being paid to be a bird-dog (at best), and you have to find the bird...then you might get paid...but I cannot verify that with anyone.
Much to my dismay, as soon as I was a paid member, I never did get to speak with my sales rep again to get my questions answered (even though he said I would be able to) and I always got transferred to a "Support Line" voice mail when I called. Support never called me back (oh, and they know if the caller is a paid member by the incoming phone number, I found out, and then it's "straight to voice mail" from then on. Before sign-up, the operator would tell me if my sales rep was "in" and she could apparently see him from where she was sitting, but after sign-up, she claimed she couldn't see his desk and he was always "out" for family issues or some other reason unavailable, and my v-mails left with that sales rep were never returned anymore after he got me to sign-up).
Eventually, after not receiving any support call-backs, I asked the Ameraco operator/dispatcher to transfer me to the sales manager. He didn't return my call until many hours later (saying he was in meetings). I mentioned that I wanted a refund (being dissolutioned and dissappointed with the support) and that's when he told me that the program was sold as "non-refundable" and I should have seen that in the terms and conditions. I told him that my sales rep said I could get a refund if I was not happy with the program...so the sales person basically lied to get me to sign-up (one of the many lies). During the call he went to great lengths to blame me for not making the program work...I wasn't trying hard enough or looking in the right places for a deal, apparently. Eventually, during the call and after a lot of hostility on his part, the sales manager agreed to refund my money if I sent all the materials back to him (less shipping, of course). I also told him I would file a complaint with the BBB and post some negative blogs entries. However, it remains to be seen if he really follows through with the refund.
On a side note, I think that at one time in the past Ameraco might have been a viable company...even though their claim of 10,000 investors in the network is doubtful. But in the end, it's becoming clear that Ameraco's primary objective was just a "boiler room" operation on the front end designed to get the $495 out of every caller, and the sales rep will just tell you what you want to hear just to get you to sign-up...such as, deals are easy to find in my area, investors are plentiful with lots of money to spend, and commissions are big, easy and quickly paid. Once you are in the network the relationship immediately changes, there are new surprise conditions that they didn't tell you about before you sign-up, and there's no guarantee that an investor wouldn't steal the deal behind your back (although, I cannot say if that really happens, but they address it in the materials).
I also called the Florida Better Business Bureau to find out more, and I talked with an agent at the BBB. Seems Ameraco has had 11 complaints in the last 36 months, and 4 this year in '09. All complaints have been addressed by the company, so on one hand that is a good sign, but I'll bet that Ameraco bends over backward to rectify those complaints to keep that A+ rating because it's an integral part of their sales strategy. So, I would be very cautious about this rating...it's easy to get an A+ because it's calculated by the BBB computer based on a formula for the number of complaints and the rectification of those complaints.
Oh, one more thing...when I talked with the credit card agent, she looked at the details behind the transaction and apparently the charge is run through a "Barber and Beauty Shop" merchant account, even though on my credit card statement it said "Ameraco". When I told the BBB agent about the "Barber and Beauty Shop" merchant account, she asked to see the detail so they can address it with Ameraco.
I'll post more details about my experience if anyone is interested. Mike.
I joined the beginning of April also. Asked for my money back within a couple of days and got it back. I am working with DC Fawcett now, a double your money back guarentee so we will see what happens.
repeat after me
there are no secrets...........
all of this is real simple math for the most part
these people are preying on newbies dreams
Not everybody has a "Brochure" they can send you in the mail. Your a smart man, I assume you didn't just hand over $495 without doing your due dilligance right? Number 1: How can somebody come to a conclusion that they were never going to do a deal with them or their investor network if they never even submitted a deal. Number 2: It comes UPS, not fed ex. Number 3: Some people don't have the program long enough (just a few days) to determine if it will work. Number 4: People get a refund for several different reasons, but we don't like to give refunds to those who don't try. Number 5: How do you know that the program isn't actually less stringent than it reads unless you try it? Number 6: The difference between a "bird dog" and a property locator (in my opinion) is a bird dog already has Investors lined up and they are birddogging property for them. Through Ameraco, You submit your deals and build your own network via their network (which is great for that "beginner" locator who knows nothing about realestate and wants to learn from the ground up). Number 7: Ameraco does ABSOLUTELY no cold calling. You called them remember? They are advertised nationwide in several magazines, newspapers and several internet sites like realty trac. Advisors are the to handle the nationwide call volume of people that are interested in the program. Ameraco has a support system, so why not let them handle your questions? Oh yeah, I remember, Some people just wait for that brochure to arrive. Number 8: The no refund policy? We have no idea how motivated a person will be when they receive the package. They send you the materials ONLY after you have expressed great interest and do YOUR due diligence. And in YOUR OWN WORDS, they DO bend over backwards to keep their record untarnished. Number 9: Investors stealing the deals? They try to explain every angle in the training manual. If you have the property locked up with a contract then you're covered. That's what the manual says and that's what people read. And last but not least, Number 10: The reason it shows "Barber and Beauty Shop" on a statement is because the computer program they use is a program called Salon Iris. It's an efficient way of keeping track of the clients
And the wingman cometh!!!!
LOL
Based on what mike posted they are teaching very basic things as far as criteria for contracting properties.
Personally I feel their deals would be easy for anyone who is going to be successful in RE investi'n to find. it's not difficult to find proerties for 30 to 40 cents on the dollar regadless of the market.
[SOLICITATION REMOVED]
Folks this is not brain surgery. There is no unique system. Buying and selling real estate has been going on for hundreds of years. Everything you need to know to get started can be found either online or at a REI Club for FREE! The KEY to success is simply hard work. The reason why most people invest in classes or programs etc is that they want to find the "easy way" to get the "vast riches". I don't fault them because that is what they were sold on. However you can with a little effort and by spending time at your library or used bookstore save your self hundreds of dollars by simply reading some of the best books out there. In my opinion here they are:
FLIP: How to Find, Fix, and Sell Houses for Profit http://www.amazon.com/FLIP-Find-Sell-Houses-Profit/dp/0071486100
Buy It, Fix It, Sell It...PROFIT http://www.amazon.com/Buy-Sell-PROFIT-Kevin-Myers/dp/0793169380/ref=pd_sim_b_5
Flipping Properties: Generate Instant Cash Profits in Real Estate http://www.amazon.com/Flipping-Properties-Generate-Instant-Profits/dp/141953551X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1266416946&sr=1-1
These books are selling for under $2.00 USED.
Good luck!
VERY WELL SAID JEFF!
Lease Options have been traced back to about 200 B.C.
In this country, land was given for blankets!
Here is my tip in finding good real estate material-
If they say it's not a scam, don't buy it
If they calim that there is anyting new, don't buy it
If they proclaim to be an expert or a guru, don't buy it
If they gurantee you'll make alot of money, don't buy it
If they claim it's everything you need to know, don't buy it
If they claim they made a million bucks doing it, don't buy it
If you want to spend $495 for a real estate course, take one approved by your state for real estate agents, you don't have to become an agent! Any real estate instructor can give you a basic outline for any residential deal you might be interested in. Just look into it in your area and notice the aspects of real estate that are included in the study. IMO, Bill
I got the system a year ago. I posted 3 deals for sale. They claim they have thousands of buyers but I received NO CALLS - not a single one.
DON'T WASTE YOUR MONEY WITH AMERACO'S finditfundit