Seeking advice on building a seller financed deal

Seeking advice on building a seller financed deal

Member since 2020 · 7 posts · 2 votes

TLDR: I found a seller who is open to a financing an off-market 5 unit multi family home near a major hospital in Denver. I am seeking advice on making my offer compelling but also making sure I'm not missing anything/potential expenses. Open to critical feedback.  

Two years ago, I found a multi family home on the MLS that sat on the market until it was eventually taken down. It was listed as a commercial property; a quadplex that also had a single family home on the back of the property (so two structures on one lot, zoned mixed use). It's a 5 minutes walking to a major teaching hospital in Denver, absolutely perfect for mid term rentals and long term rentals.

At that time, it was listed for almost $800k, more expensive than other comps. I reached out then about the sellers willingness to finance the deal and he was open to it but wanted at least $200k down. He needed a large down payment because he was paying for a home to be built. Today, I know that project is complete and so a big down payment up front is likely not a priority. 

Skipping to numbers; the quadplex has 4 1bd/1bth units, all currently rented for $1,100/per month. The SFH is a 3bd/1bth currently rented under market for $1,000/month. In total, it's generating about $5,500/month. The owner owns it free and clear and it's managed by a local property manager. The best comp I found is listed today at $900k, been sitting a month and is only a quadplex. The second best comp closed end of 2022 for $830k, 3 months after being listed and a price reduction of 40k.


I believe there is huge potential for this property. The SFH today is dilapidated and undoubtedly needs a face lift but because of the cashflow, the owner's not motivated to make repairs. Comps on distressed properties within a half mile that have sold in the last 30 days are closing in the $330-350k range alone and renting for $2,500/m with basic updates (think original kitchens) or $3,000/m for completely updated 3bd/1bths. Beyond that, the mid-term rent potential on the quadplex units is at the very least $1,500/unit per month once the leases are up (Mid term rentals listed today have a higher potential but would require updates to the units). Furthermore, based on it's location alone, this property could be sold to a developer because of the unique zoning that has no limit to the building height built on the lot (!!!).

So, back to making an offer... I want to make a compelling offer but want to make sure I set myself up for success too. I'm thinking about starting at 870k with 10% down and an interest rate of 5% with a 20 year term. This way, the seller gets 87k in hand, won't pay nearly as much taxes up front on a huge cash sale, will still be generating about the same amount of income as he is today, consistently for 20 years without the headache of managing it or insuring it.  

I'm open to any and all feedback regarding how I'm thinking about this, what I might be missing or how to make it more compelling. 

Thanks in advance. 


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Chris SeveneyBusiness Member
Moderator
Investor · VA · Member since 2015 · 21k+ posts · 19k+ votes
2y
Quote from @Melanie Wilmesher:

TLDR: I found a seller who is open to a financing an off-market 5 unit multi family home near a major hospital in Denver. I am seeking advice on making my offer compelling but also making sure I'm not missing anything/potential expenses. Open to critical feedback.  

Two years ago, I found a multi family home on the MLS that sat on the market until it was eventually taken down. It was listed as a commercial property; a quadplex that also had a single family home on the back of the property (so two structures on one lot, zoned mixed use). It's a 5 minutes walking to a major teaching hospital in Denver, absolutely perfect for mid term rentals and long term rentals.

At that time, it was listed for almost $800k, more expensive than other comps. I reached out then about the sellers willingness to finance the deal and he was open to it but wanted at least $200k down. He needed a large down payment because he was paying for a home to be built. Today, I know that project is complete and so a big down payment up front is likely not a priority. 

Skipping to numbers; the quadplex has 4 1bd/1bth units, all currently rented for $1,100/per month. The SFH is a 3bd/1bth currently rented under market for $1,000/month. In total, it's generating about $5,500/month. The owner owns it free and clear and it's managed by a local property manager. The best comp I found is listed today at $900k, been sitting a month and is only a quadplex. The second best comp closed end of 2022 for $830k, 3 months after being listed and a price reduction of 40k.


I believe there is huge potential for this property. The SFH today is dilapidated and undoubtedly needs a face lift but because of the cashflow, the owner's not motivated to make repairs. Comps on distressed properties within a half mile that have sold in the last 30 days are closing in the $330-350k range alone and renting for $2,500/m with basic updates (think original kitchens) or $3,000/m for completely updated 3bd/1bths. Beyond that, the mid-term rent potential on the quadplex units is at the very least $1,500/unit per month once the leases are up (Mid term rentals listed today have a higher potential but would require updates to the units). Furthermore, based on it's location alone, this property could be sold to a developer because of the unique zoning that has no limit to the building height built on the lot (!!!).

So, back to making an offer... I want to make a compelling offer but want to make sure I set myself up for success too. I'm thinking about starting at 870k with 10% down and an interest rate of 5% with a 20 year term. This way, the seller gets 87k in hand, won't pay nearly as much taxes up front on a huge cash sale, will still be generating about the same amount of income as he is today, consistently for 20 years without the headache of managing it or insuring it.  

I'm open to any and all feedback regarding how I'm thinking about this, what I might be missing or how to make it more compelling. 

Thanks in advance. 



From a lenders perspective, I would want a larger down payment or a significantly higher interest rate. I can get 5% from the Fed with better tax advantages and its guaranteed whereas I have a LTV of 90%. I would want 9% min with only 10% down. He also could 1031 the monies to avoid taxes as well.

These are just things to consider. Not saying they will not accept it, but showing a comparison of what the seller may consider. 

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  • Chris SeveneyBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Investor · VA · Member since 2015 · 21k+ posts · 19k+ votes
    2y
    Quote from @Melanie Wilmesher:

    TLDR: I found a seller who is open to a financing an off-market 5 unit multi family home near a major hospital in Denver. I am seeking advice on making my offer compelling but also making sure I'm not missing anything/potential expenses. Open to critical feedback.  

    Two years ago, I found a multi family home on the MLS that sat on the market until it was eventually taken down. It was listed as a commercial property; a quadplex that also had a single family home on the back of the property (so two structures on one lot, zoned mixed use). It's a 5 minutes walking to a major teaching hospital in Denver, absolutely perfect for mid term rentals and long term rentals.

    At that time, it was listed for almost $800k, more expensive than other comps. I reached out then about the sellers willingness to finance the deal and he was open to it but wanted at least $200k down. He needed a large down payment because he was paying for a home to be built. Today, I know that project is complete and so a big down payment up front is likely not a priority. 

    Skipping to numbers; the quadplex has 4 1bd/1bth units, all currently rented for $1,100/per month. The SFH is a 3bd/1bth currently rented under market for $1,000/month. In total, it's generating about $5,500/month. The owner owns it free and clear and it's managed by a local property manager. The best comp I found is listed today at $900k, been sitting a month and is only a quadplex. The second best comp closed end of 2022 for $830k, 3 months after being listed and a price reduction of 40k.


    I believe there is huge potential for this property. The SFH today is dilapidated and undoubtedly needs a face lift but because of the cashflow, the owner's not motivated to make repairs. Comps on distressed properties within a half mile that have sold in the last 30 days are closing in the $330-350k range alone and renting for $2,500/m with basic updates (think original kitchens) or $3,000/m for completely updated 3bd/1bths. Beyond that, the mid-term rent potential on the quadplex units is at the very least $1,500/unit per month once the leases are up (Mid term rentals listed today have a higher potential but would require updates to the units). Furthermore, based on it's location alone, this property could be sold to a developer because of the unique zoning that has no limit to the building height built on the lot (!!!).

    So, back to making an offer... I want to make a compelling offer but want to make sure I set myself up for success too. I'm thinking about starting at 870k with 10% down and an interest rate of 5% with a 20 year term. This way, the seller gets 87k in hand, won't pay nearly as much taxes up front on a huge cash sale, will still be generating about the same amount of income as he is today, consistently for 20 years without the headache of managing it or insuring it.  

    I'm open to any and all feedback regarding how I'm thinking about this, what I might be missing or how to make it more compelling. 

    Thanks in advance. 



    From a lenders perspective, I would want a larger down payment or a significantly higher interest rate. I can get 5% from the Fed with better tax advantages and its guaranteed whereas I have a LTV of 90%. I would want 9% min with only 10% down. He also could 1031 the monies to avoid taxes as well.

    These are just things to consider. Not saying they will not accept it, but showing a comparison of what the seller may consider. 

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  • Michael SmytheBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Metro Detroit · Member since 2023 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    2y

    @Melanie Wilmesher why go first and set the parameters of your negotiations?

    What might you find out just by asking the seller what they'd want for a seller-financed transaction?

    They may want less than what you are planning to offer:)

    Logical Property Management4.9454 Reviews
  • Sean RossPro Member
    1031 Exchange Qualified Intermediary · Denver, CO · Member since 2017 · 174 posts · 97 votes
    2y
    Quote from @Melanie Wilmesher:

    TLDR: I found a seller who is open to a financing an off-market 5 unit multi family home near a major hospital in Denver. I am seeking advice on making my offer compelling but also making sure I'm not missing anything/potential expenses. Open to critical feedback.  

    Two years ago, I found a multi family home on the MLS that sat on the market until it was eventually taken down. It was listed as a commercial property; a quadplex that also had a single family home on the back of the property (so two structures on one lot, zoned mixed use). It's a 5 minutes walking to a major teaching hospital in Denver, absolutely perfect for mid term rentals and long term rentals.

    At that time, it was listed for almost $800k, more expensive than other comps. I reached out then about the sellers willingness to finance the deal and he was open to it but wanted at least $200k down. He needed a large down payment because he was paying for a home to be built. Today, I know that project is complete and so a big down payment up front is likely not a priority. 

    Skipping to numbers; the quadplex has 4 1bd/1bth units, all currently rented for $1,100/per month. The SFH is a 3bd/1bth currently rented under market for $1,000/month. In total, it's generating about $5,500/month. The owner owns it free and clear and it's managed by a local property manager. The best comp I found is listed today at $900k, been sitting a month and is only a quadplex. The second best comp closed end of 2022 for $830k, 3 months after being listed and a price reduction of 40k.


    I believe there is huge potential for this property. The SFH today is dilapidated and undoubtedly needs a face lift but because of the cashflow, the owner's not motivated to make repairs. Comps on distressed properties within a half mile that have sold in the last 30 days are closing in the $330-350k range alone and renting for $2,500/m with basic updates (think original kitchens) or $3,000/m for completely updated 3bd/1bths. Beyond that, the mid-term rent potential on the quadplex units is at the very least $1,500/unit per month once the leases are up (Mid term rentals listed today have a higher potential but would require updates to the units). Furthermore, based on it's location alone, this property could be sold to a developer because of the unique zoning that has no limit to the building height built on the lot (!!!).

    So, back to making an offer... I want to make a compelling offer but want to make sure I set myself up for success too. I'm thinking about starting at 870k with 10% down and an interest rate of 5% with a 20 year term. This way, the seller gets 87k in hand, won't pay nearly as much taxes up front on a huge cash sale, will still be generating about the same amount of income as he is today, consistently for 20 years without the headache of managing it or insuring it.  

    I'm open to any and all feedback regarding how I'm thinking about this, what I might be missing or how to make it more compelling. 

    Thanks in advance. 


    @Melanie Wilmesher, if your seller is planning on doing a 1031 exchange coming out of any potential transaction, he is going to find problems with an offer that hinges on seller financing.  It's not impossible to do a 1031 exchange out of a property while carrying back a note, but it's complicated enough -- if you're going to make the deal attractive to him, find out if he plans on looking at a 1031 and come prepared with information to help him navigate the hurdles that come with the seller financing. 

  • Bill S.Pro Member
    Moderator
    Rental Property Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2013 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    2y

    @Melanie Wilmesher so my advise. Ask him what he would take. The one who offers first, loses is the general rule of negotiation. When you counter, make 3 different offers. Make them all in writing and make them all ones that you would accept. Let him choose which offer to accept. With three offers there is less likelihood of him countering. He will just pick the best one for him. It also reduces the chance of him saying "no" as he has 3 offers so what other choices are there?

    Finally, play the long game. A "no" today may be a "yes" in 6 months if you have kept in touch during the in between times.

    Please keep in mind the issue of value. Sure a SFR by itself is worth x but this house is not by itself. The fact that there are 5 units significantly impacts the value due to the financing available for such units (incomes based value for 5 units vs comparable sales value for SFR). Unless you can split off the SFR and sell it individually, it is significantly devalued by being coupled with the four plex. The reality is the resale value might be greater if you combined two of the one bed units to make a two or three bed unit so the property would be a four unit property and qualify for the 30 year debt financing of conventional owner occupied multifamily property.

    Another option would be to split off the house and sell it as a separate unit. Remember that both lots would likely have to conform to the zoning requirements for each lot (not likely in most cases but worth looking at). 

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