Should I buy my second house w 30k in bank?

Should I buy my second house w 30k in bank?

Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes

Financial picture: 

I live in the NYC area, union city area. Just bought my first house, around 150k in the summer. 

3.5% 30yr fixed mortgage, 780 total monthly w tax, plus HOA. I rented room so live free.

New money has piled up quick, so have around 30k again just like when I bought the house.

Income around 80k, great credit, just got student loans and this house for loans. Id say i can stash away 3k a month with partying and having a good time in manhattan w my avg incomes.

My questions is: 

- now that i have some cash again, and my goal would be to start having passive income from rent, what should I do? Ideally next move should bring in $300-500/m cashflow NET, ALL months. I know the 100-150k area is quite measly around here, but i def see potential and many of jersey city/union city is quite unknown. Just been to newark too, could pop really big although not sure id walk around even in daytime.

I read so much about creative financing, people putting 10k down or nothing down sometime, buying 5+ properties in months etc.. hard to decipher whats a good choice. 

HELOC? Borrow against current property? Ideally replicate this condo? Is it too soon to buy, is there a 1 year period or sthing? 30k shud be ok for anything around 100-120k. Will interest rate and downpayment be much more on an investment property? Can it be played right that somehow both remain my "primary residence", no tax etc?

Need to be here around NYC, so im not thinking of middle of nowhere good deals detroit iowa florida etc. 

Thanks for any ideas.

0Reply
68 views

Most Popular Reply

Rental Property Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 215 posts · 77 votes
9y

Buying a property with cash is the worst advice you could receive. That is not how you build wealth. What loan did you use to buy your first property? FHA? Conventional? If you move out of your current place and rent it, what is the net cash flow?

Why not buy another owner occupied property with an FHA or Conventional loan, and continue to refi and repeat? Im making over $2500/mo NET on three properties by doing that model. Its a real wealth builder for us young investors who can afford to hold long term, and use smart leverage. Be sure you net at least $300 - $500 per month after PITI, market vacancy, and repair allowance if you are using leverage aggressively.

See this reply in the discussion

22 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    9y

    If you're piling cash up that fast, save it and buy something for cash and get some experience with that before you decide if you want more than one rental property. If you do, then you can cash that unit out and go again. 

    Skyline Properties
    View Page
  • Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes
    9y

    Thanks for the fast reply. Is 3k/month a lot of stashing? It would take me years to pile up 100k.. i dont want to work forever :) 

    The idea or thinking is that my "solid" job right now may not last more than 6month-1yr until I may make a switch to something else and want to use my tax/work/income to quickly get another property, rent it out and add to cashflow. 

    In that case if I move or anything happens, i will have 2 places, hopefully both making 200-300/m or so profit and paying for themselves.

  • Contractor · Milltown, NJ · Member since 2016 · 297 posts · 213 votes
    9y
    Drew Slew First off, congrats on finding a way to live rent free while living in your first property. The area you are in provides a lot of opportunity given its proximity to NYC, so I understand why you wish to stay there. Now for some bad news, as pointed out to several other investors on other BP threads who wish to be creative with their financing, having two primary residences is mortgage fraud, and after that industry had their little meltdown, that act has been frowned upon immensely and successfully prosecuted numerous times. Judging by how you are starting out, and where your head is at, you will most certainly find a legit way to comfortably and creatively finance a plan that will lead to success. You are most definitely on the right track. Keep saving and searching.
  • Investor · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2015 · 6k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    Is there an interest rate on your Student Loan/s? ANY non-income-producing debt should really be cleared out as soon as possible. 

    I believe the answer to your "2 primaries" question is: no. One at a time. 

    Even if you argue "I'm here 50%, there 50%", wouldn't the rest of the time be investment status?

    But my main point is: don't even try that argument - if it's not true! Heard of: Mortgage/IRS fraud?

    Regarding refis, you'll need more than 25% equity (per Lender's appraisal) before ANY cash out!

    It looks like you might have access to an under-valued niche market, so long as you can tell the difference between "quite unknown" and "not sure I'd walk around even in daytime"! Cheers...

  • Investor · Bethel, AK · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 852 votes
    9y

    @Drew Slew something else you need to remember if you switch jobs unless the new job is similar to your old job the bank will want you to work 2 years in the new job before you can get another loan. also you may not be able to count your rental money as income until it shows up on your tax return for 2 years. that means your loans will be limited to whatever DTI your day job wages will support

    RR

  • Investor · Des Moines, IA · Member since 2013 · 137 posts · 49 votes
    9y

    Easy with the "Middle of Nowhere" comments, lest people begin to give their opinions of New Jersey.

  • Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes
    9y

    @Brent Coombs and all thanks for the replies. 

    My student loan is 6.4% interest i have 30k on it, i pay monthly 450, not a lot. 

    Yes the two primary residence wasnt a serious question, i would be buying my next home as an investment property. 

    I just want to make an investment while my situation, savings, job allows it quick.

  • Rental Property Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 215 posts · 77 votes
    9y

    Buying a property with cash is the worst advice you could receive. That is not how you build wealth. What loan did you use to buy your first property? FHA? Conventional? If you move out of your current place and rent it, what is the net cash flow?

    Why not buy another owner occupied property with an FHA or Conventional loan, and continue to refi and repeat? Im making over $2500/mo NET on three properties by doing that model. Its a real wealth builder for us young investors who can afford to hold long term, and use smart leverage. Be sure you net at least $300 - $500 per month after PITI, market vacancy, and repair allowance if you are using leverage aggressively.

  • Aurora, CO · Member since 2016 · 158 posts · 118 votes
    9y
    Personally if you only have 30k in student loans and 30k in the bank. Pay off those loans. You cannot declare bankruptcy on student loans (very rare exception, like I can only think of one time) and if you get behind the government can take money directly out of your paychecks. Personally when I get enough equity and cash on hand to pay my student loans they are gone. But I have considerably more than you and stopping my investing to pay down that debt would be like waiting for my first tree to grow to start on my forest. You have no excuse though, you will have made back your 30k in around 8-10 months.
  • Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes
    9y

    Thanks a lot for the advices. @Michael Randle  yes the student loan payoff is tempting, its on 6.4% interest but i pay only around 450 a month. idk, i hate paying off loans.. 

    my thinking would be why dont i put this little cash I have and buy something quick like my first place around 100k and rent it so i can get that 200-300 cashflow so i now have another income stream.

    @Kevin Moen i bought my first place with normal 30yr mortgage conventional, no FHA. around 3.5% interest, mortgage is around 550/m and tax 200/m.

    yes im open to FHA or PMI now, just want to make a good investment and have cash flow extra. than I can decide how to adjust the two properties, see if they both bring in profit, learn and hopefully repeat.

  • Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes
    9y

    also yes, if i move out of my current place @Kevin Moen as discussed my totals are 1050-1100 with wifi, mortgage, hoa, tax etc all. Realistically it could easily fetch 1400/m but i think i could find ppl paying 1600/m for it because of the nice city views. so $300-500/m cashflow. obv need to calculate vacancies and repairs so less a bit.

  • Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes
    9y

    @Ralph R. you are absolutely sure about this? its not just tax w9-s they look at, its a continued 2yr job at the SAME place when you get a mortgage? i know they did look at that when i got my first mortgage..

  • Investor · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2015 · 6k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    If your mortgage/hoa/tax is $1,075/m (not including vacancies and repairs) and your rent DOESN'T make $1,600/m, you'll likely start hitting negative cash flow each time your hoa hits you with a "special assessment" fee. Have they occurred often, so far?

    You don't want "less a bit" ending up being "less a lot". All the best...

  • Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes
    9y

    no, i bought this place in the summer so nothing changed. HOA seems quite consistent didnt see any hikes previously too. i thought something w total fees at 1000 that rents for above 1500 is a good return. @Brent Coombs

  • Rental Property Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 215 posts · 77 votes
    9y

    @Drew Slew If I were in your position I would buy a new place that would make a good future rental either with a conventional loan, or owner occ FHA. FHA especially if you can force some appreciation through repairs, etc and refi relatively quickly to drop the PMI.

  • Investor · Bethel, AK · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 852 votes
    9y

    @Drew Slew when I bought my first house in alaska I had only had the job about a year. It was running heavy equipment wich I had been doing many years in the lower 48. My lender told me it was ok as I had moved to improve my wages. They will not accept your rent profits as income until you establish it on your income taxes. Most conventional lenders have told me 2 years but I have heard people say they got them with one year. Also if I were you I would take a harder look at what you are calling cash flow. Are you allowing cap ex? Property management? New tenant charges? Turn over costs? You mentioned an HOA that's a huge flag for many land lords. They raise fees, restrict the number of tenants etc etc. you need constant numbers not ones that can change every time the HOA board changes good luck RR

  • Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes
    9y

    @Kyle Tanner very interesting, messaged you. @Ralph R. good advice, yes the HOA is something that is hard to not have around NYC.

    FHA loans are for primary residences only.

    This is a first investment property. My lender says gifting is not allowed, it has to be all my cash. On a 120k property, id need to put down 30k plus closing... tought

    What if someone buys it all cash, does a delayed financing and then I get the mortgage, puts it in my name? Is that possible, too complicated etc? 

  • Investor · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2015 · 6k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    @Drew Slew, er, what was that "very interesting" info from @Kyle Tanner (who does not have any post on THIS thread)? Or was that a typo? Did you message the wrong person?

    Regarding your "What if someone buys it all cash, does a delayed financing" question, I'm curious why you would even ask someone: "please buy this bargain for me, and I'll make your mortgage payments for you"? And - who would agree to such carrying-on?

    But if you CAN find such a bargain - you ALREADY have that $30k down - so why not just borrow conventionally anyway? (And WITHOUT partying, you should have another $1k in the bank since you started this thread a week ago! Do you?) 

    Other creative ideas should probably wait - until you can PROVE your equity! Cheers...

  • Rental Property Investor · Union city, NJ · Member since 2016 · 203 posts · 43 votes
    9y

    @Brent Coombs yes wrong person, typo. 

    someone all cash would be parents. they buy it, and somehow after getting a mortgage on it give it over. not sure if this is feasible or how it would work, just an idea. 

    30k is ALL i have atm, including emergency, savings etc. BUT i do know that id like to get something fast that has cashflow. since gifting is not allowed at investment properties its tought to pay it all out and have nothing left.

    some people said HOA and condos not good investments from investment perspective so thats a good advice, didnt think of that. @Ralph R.  good advice. 

    there is no time crunch, its a different story to buy an investment property than a primary residence, so have to really look for a good deal. if anyone sees anything around newark, jersey city, NJ in general around the 100k range i will look at it.

  • Investor · Bethel, AK · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 852 votes
    9y

    @Drew Slew  if somebody buys a house using a conventional mortgage then deeds it over to you it could trip the due on sale clause causing the loan to be due.  Be careful  doing that. RR

  • Investor · Coppell, TX · Member since 2008 · 2k+ posts · 646 votes
    9y

    Hello and welcome to this website!  I would recommend you should invest in real estate and try to put the deal together in a way does not cause you to make the down payment.  If the owner does not offer you the primary loan maybe they'll do the down payment amount if they trust your honesty to pay them back fairly quick (say 5 years).  If it will be a rental/income producing asset.  Financing on a positive cash flow property could pay your debt payment with the rent.  Small apartment complexes could be your answer and have less competition.  You do not need any experience to do that.

    Look in areas that typically has high equity.  It tends to make the homeowner more flexible.  You might consider a "house hacking" loan that only charges you 3 1/2% down as long as you live there for I year.  It would allow you in a deal with little cash in.  Another way would be to use a "rich" partner that could what you can for a profit split.  Another way would be to get a Private Lender loan and typically be pretty flexible.  There is little bad debt to get on a loan dept payment and still have positive cash flow.  The key is to be creative with your financing.  

    Just getting started is a good sign.  If you are young there is plenty of time to do things more conventional.  Do not get a property with negative cash flow and do not forget anything on your offered cost estimates.  A better neighberhood exterior looks will help you when it becomes sales time.  Good luck to you!

Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.