Consistently being blown off by REA's
Most Popular Reply
Joseph CacciapagliaBusiness Member
Lender · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2020 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votesIf you're running into this consistently, then there is probably a problem with your approach. Most agents have been burned by would-be investors that ask tons of questions, waste a lot of their time, but never actually close a deal with them. Many decide not to deal with new investors at all, and others become much more selective with whom they choose to work with. Depending on the type of properties you're looking at, you may be asking for more information than the typical seller is willing to provide. This varies greatly by market, property type, and price point.
42 Replies
- 6yJoseph CacciapagliaBusiness MemberLender · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2020 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
If you're running into this consistently, then there is probably a problem with your approach. Most agents have been burned by would-be investors that ask tons of questions, waste a lot of their time, but never actually close a deal with them. Many decide not to deal with new investors at all, and others become much more selective with whom they choose to work with. Depending on the type of properties you're looking at, you may be asking for more information than the typical seller is willing to provide. This varies greatly by market, property type, and price point.
- Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes6y
Sellers disclosures may or may not be published with the listing. Ages of those items won’t typically be published and rental histories typically are not available on sfr’s. Those are all things you look at while/after you look at the property.
Have you given them a solid Preapproval/POF? - 6yTerry A.New to Real Estate · Member since 2020 · 28 posts · 12 votesOP
Yes we have given the agents POF's, pre qual letters, etc. With us being out of state it is hard to walk through. If I am coming down to visit the house, I am 99.99% going to purchase. I want all information before I go.
Its just frustrating, we have even been ghosted when we asked for the information.
I have had 1 or 2 realtors provide all of the information without a problem, or even when they send the listing over, they say "Hey Terry I think you will love this property, here is all of the information, let me know if you want a walk through".
- Rental Property Investor · Clarksville, TN · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes6y
How many times do you ask that question per offer you write? And how long have you been on a MLS drip from these realtors?
It's probably most challenging to get traction with a realtor on your first deal, because so far they have been compensated for zero in exchange for what limited services they've offered you.
Next one you like, make a couple assumptions and put an offer in, you can always balk at the inspection if you assumed wrong. Include a narrative about what you assumed with your offer so the seller understands if you take exception with something. You'll force investment from your agent and hopefully build a little momentum.
- 6yTerry A.New to Real Estate · Member since 2020 · 28 posts · 12 votesOP
I could see that. Usually, I say, "I am pretty confident in making an offer on this property at this moment, BUT I would like to see this information. The owner says it is rented out, can I see the rental history/breakdown or what the current rental rates are." Once I have all of the proper information I wll make an offer
- 6yJoe S.Pro MemberInvestor · San Antonio · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
Originally posted by @Terry A.:
We are just starting out in our journey to buy rental properties. We have ran into numerous Real Estate Agents who just really do not care about doing business with us. Is this a common theme or are we doing something wrong?
We contact them to talk about properties, tell them what we are looking for, budget, area, etc. They sent us listings and when we respond with, can we get the Seller's disclosure, age of equipment (HVAC, Water Heater, Roof) Rental history, etc we get met with push back or silence.
It appears by what you have posted....That you have talked with multiple agents. If you find one good agent and close a deal then that agent will definitely take you serious. I personally have known of people that had agents show them multiple properties. The people asking to see these properties could not get a loan and did not have the money to buy the property without selling their personal residence first. Some of the agents did not even think to ask How the perspective buyer would close the transaction. Wanna- be buyers of this nature have definitely went through more than one agent. I even heard one of the potential buyers that could not really buy a house complaining that they need better service from the agents. LOL
I am definitely not inferring that you are that kind of Buyer. What I am trying to point out is many agents have wasted their time on folks that talk big game and never close on a deal. Therefore they view all new clients as a potential time waster. Once you close a deal or two through an agent I can assure you that you will be one of their new best friends.
- Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 45 posts · 22 votes6y
Unfortunately Terry, just like any other sales gig, it's a numbers game. Out of 100 agents you will have your fair share of ones that never respond, say they will send you deals and never do, send you "deals" but they're really not, and ones that actually do send you deals.
Keep following up with them, add them on social media, send them interesting articles, etc. Show them you are serious and not just another would-be investor. Unfortunately some REA have been burned one too many times or think they are too big time for new investor clients. Pay that no mind and keep doing what you're doing. Also try different approaches to see what is working better.
Things to keep in mind: What value can you provide to them to make their job easier? How can you prove you're serious? Do you sound like you've done your homework and know exactly what you're looking for?
- 6yTerry A.New to Real Estate · Member since 2020 · 28 posts · 12 votesOP
@Josh Gorokhovsky I appreciate it. I could understand how being burned scorns them.
As far as making their job easier, I do not know much more I can do, besides getting my license and representing myself sometimes. I research the properties, rent, area, neighborhood, schools, etc and literally just call and say hey I found this property, can I get x, y, and z, to tie it together and make an offer.
I guess I just have to test out a few and use new ones and keep rolling until I find the right one in each area.
- 6yMike CumbieBusiness MemberREALTOR® · Brockport, NY · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
Hi @Terry A.
Welcome!
First the Bad news. To me it sounds like someone at home with a spreadsheet that is out of town. If the property is even Luke Warm, it will be gone by the time I get a response from the other agent about something like the water heater (Investors in my area don't pay much weight to that) etc. Because once I ask them they have to call the seller for a mundane piece of information. (if a couple hundred dollar water heater is going to establish if it falls perfectly into a formula.... it won't). The other issue is that it sounds like I am just here to gather some information and then you will take it and do what you want. Like call some other agent, try to go right to the seller etc. There is nothing at all saying, once I tell you that one piece you are going to call me to put the offer in. I know it won't be the minute you get the info. You are going to have to think about it and I may get a call back or some other agent might get the call because they offer you a $400 rebate or something.
Now the Good News! It's totally fixable and coach able! It should go something like this. "Hey Mike this is Terry. I'm an investor from (City/State), I am looking at a property for a rental in your area, do you know anything about 123 Main street?". If I have been in it I can provide all sorts of information. If I know the listing agent or an agent in my office that has been in it, I can get you info that isn't listed. If my only value is to get a water heater age, then Meh, If I can provide something of value, now we are establishing a relationship! My opinion of value AS/IS, Ease of renting, how security deposits work in this area etc. If you are looking for a professional opinion, we are now a team with the combined goal of finding you a piece of property. If it sounds like you have it all figured out and my opinion isn't a piece of information you will be using in your analysis. I'm a retail clerk who has the job of pulling it off the shelf. Plenty of those around.
Good questions to ask: Is it vacant? Is the renter under a lease and when does it end? How long has the renter been there? What do you think it can rent for? (My expertise means something).
If vacant say "Hey Mike can you do a virtual tour of that house with me soon? (I actually want to go in because if you don't like it one of my other investors might unless I have been inside it already, in which case I can tell you what I think the value of it is). If occupied fully it's bad form to disturb tenants unless you are ready to pull the trigger and there will have to be something big like a foundation for you not to offer. Some people require an offer before they will let you in. Are you prepared to offer after the virtual? If so that sounds like an investor. If that's just one more step in the long process before a trigger gets pulled,
Asking for rent rolls up front is a huge turn off to some investors without you ever stepping foot in the property. If you are looking for information and then may decide to fly out next Thursday in this market, It's a waste of a trip (Unless you are in a highend market with few buyers)
Hope my ramblings help some and Good Luck!
- Member since 2018 · 6 posts · 4 votes6y
@Terry A. Kemp II we ran into this same issue buying our first property. Try contacting listing agents directly trying to get into their listing. We had best luck doing that.
- Member since 2018 · 1 post · 2 votes6y
@Terry A. Kemp II
Just make certain that you do close a deal with those extra helpful agents. And stop wasting your time (and their’s!) with all of the rest.
Pick a couple of good agents within your area and do all your business with them.
As a previous REA I was very frustrated by those that wanted me to be a wealth of information and a tour guide but never wound up purchasing anything.
- Morris County, NJ · Member since 2020 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes6y
@Terry A. Kemp II
I pretty much agree with everything above. Also, I am thinking these are all things that I never relied on my agent to figure out in twenty years. It’s more expected that when I see the property I need to take a look or will find out more when the home inspection is done.
As a REA, when I get these questions I roll my eyes over the phone since more likely than not for an investment property, the listing doesn’t know either. So I have to spend time asking that agent to tell me they don’t know or they have to ask the seller who doesn’t know anyway. I can see how this is a point where people like to speak with listing agents more than buyers agents. I still think it’s silly since, at least in my area, agents listing investment properties usually have incorrect or missing info on the listing partially because they don’t take the time because the commission is so low, I think.
So, it’s going to be tough to find an agent that will basically “show themselves” the property to gather all that info for you, any other general perspectives on the property and not be worried about you potentially getting pissed over a misrepresentation issue. Misunderstandings / miscommunication happen all the time. Agents won’t specifically “get” lots of the info unless the seller provides it because of liability. Sure, i could read the plate on an ac unit for its mfg date. But, as real agents that’s not our “specialty” so it could be said that we are working outside of our “area of expertise” (remember, barrier to entry for REA is pretty low) which is ‘bad.’
I get what you are doing. Maybe 40 to 50 years ago there was time to do that and the Code of Ethics didn’t make agents afraid to gather info that they didn’t know about. Fast forward to the past 10 to 20 years, serious or even idiot agents are just going to recite whatever paperwork they have. In personal experience, when agents start coming up with that kind of house data without a paper backing really are trying to “sell” me something.
Even when showing a house to regular clients, I always try to point out the ages / quality of the utilities. I guess part of my investor mindset. But that is during showings.
Just my two cents. Hope it helps. Good luck.
- 6yJonathan GreeneBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Madison, NJ · Member since 2016 · 6k+ posts · 7k+ votes
@Terry A. as many have mentioned above and based on your responses to their responses, your issue lies in a couple areas:
1. You are talking to too many agents which indicates that you may not be building the relationship that you need with the one good one. If you are looking in other markets and they know you are buying one property, but looking with them in one state and with others in other states, they will not help you. The conversion chance is just too low for a first-time investor out-of-state.
2. Your budgets and offer expectancy is too low. If you are new, out-of-state, and using a mortgage or some other kind of financing and want to make low offers, again, there isn't much in it for the agent to do all of that work for a one-off if they don't know you are looking into that area for multiple properties in the future.
3. You aren't taking into account that a single sale of an investment buy isn't a real lure for any agent, even an investor-friendly one. How would they think or know it is going to continue? Do you have an investment plan for the area or to continue focusing there?
It's likely you are interested in different OOS markets or contacting too many agents. Do the research, pick one, have a long conversation up front about your goals and then see what will work. They all put you on MLS drips and don't respond because if you aren't buying sight unseen and are going to fly or drive in to buy, all the good deals will be gone by the time you organize that.
- 6yShawn McenteerBusiness MemberRealtor · Boonton Township, NJ · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
Originally posted by @Terry A.:
I could see that. Usually, I say, "I am pretty confident in making an offer on this property at this moment, BUT I would like to see this information. The owner says it is rented out, can I see the rental history/breakdown or what the current rental rates are." Once I have all of the proper information I wll make an offer
Most information is disclosed verbally prior to an offer being made. Once an offer is accepted during the due diligence/ attorney review phase is when information regarding the property will become official by requesting or contingencies put in place.
House Hacking New Jersey563 Reviews - Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes6y
Unfortunately it has been easy money for these agents over the past 6 years. 3% commission to do nothing. They don't need to waste time providing that information because there are plenty of buyers who do not care.
Trust me, I get it.. Your approach is probably fine. Just have to keep at it, and you will have better luck going directly to the listing agent. Because they will be making double the commission so they may be more inclined to provide you that information.
- 6yTheresa HarrisPro MemberMember since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
Are these places you've looked at? Find something that looks good on paper and then look at the property with your realtor. At that point, if you want to put in an offer, you can get that additional information. Call an office and ask to talk to someone who works with investors.
- 6yTerry A.New to Real Estate · Member since 2020 · 28 posts · 12 votesOP
I appreciate everyone's response and insight. So that brings me to some questions. As an Investor if I am playing $120k+ or any amount of money for a property, I shouldn't worry about the age of very costly things (HVAC, Water Heater, Roof?) stuff that has to be replaced anyway? It seems to me that even though it is an investment property, you would want to know as much information going in, especially if it isn't a total rehab. I can understand cosmetic stuff (paint, floors, etc) but, knowing if something that is very costly to replace is at the end of its life should be a no brainer to want to know.
- Member since 2020 · 1 post · 3 votes6y
If you are interested in making rental property investments in areas that are outside of the area that you live, you might look into companies that offer "turnkey" rental properties. Often these types of properties have been fully renovated and have property management that will work towards finding long-term (greater than 1 year) tenants.
Additionally, your local Real Estate Investment Association (REIA) should have recommendations regarding "investor friendly" Real Estate Agents in your area.
- Morris County, NJ · Member since 2020 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes6y
Of course you do. But, even in the pre-COVID-19 market, is a "competing interests" issue. At least in my market, properties were moving pretty fast already. By the time you attempt to research, the property is gone. You need to go look at the property and see for yourself. Sure, people can complain about buyer's agents not doing any work for their 2.5% to 3% commission (there is more to being a Realtor, however, than just opening a door or asking for a seller's disclosure..). However, many times when I've asked the listing doesn't know and has to ask the seller. Or, the the seller's disclosure is incomplete, "i don't know," or could be wrong as we've found out during inspection (they were mostly just homeowner ignorance).
I suppose if I was your agent I could visit the property for you --- its no different than if you were here and we both went. However, I'd basically be doing a partial home inspection to look for all the machine plates to see if there is a mfg date, or else send you the info. With the advent of smart phones, you can say that its not hard. But, its not my job and probably not even covered under my E&O policy (e.g. I'm not a home inspector and I don't know of any other Realtor who would be doing this). So, to ask somebody who only knows your voice on the phone to do all this (assuming my case described here) is a little iffy.
Furthermore, for a commission in the $120k range, I'm certainly not doing all that work. I do "market" myself to not having a problem working with investors, but that means to me running around to see "crappy" properties which may or may not be a worthy investment which I'll get a low payout because the price point is so low. Also, I'll have probably about twice as much work to do to get the transaction done since in distressed home sales all the onus is on the buyer. So, I'm already at a third less in gross commission for twice the work for people who I actually show the property and decide on the spot if they want it.
I'm not trying to speak out of turn, but if I was helping you I'd be running around not-so-distressed properties for some voice on the phone who I have no idea is actually going to work with me, or actually buy anything. This where some "organizations" utilize "boots on the ground." Realtors being compensated on commission to do the "rest" of their jobs does not qualify, in my opinion, as "boots on the ground."
Just my two cents...
- Member since 2019 · 35 posts · 87 votes6y
If the listing doesnt include the age of the major appliances as a selling feature, then i would make the assumption that i will need to budget for replacement in the not to distant future if i plan on being a oos investor.
- Morris County, NJ · Member since 2020 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes6y
@Mitch Harold That's a good point. I like that.
@Terry A. Also, you can perhaps get a feel from the age of the house. Also, if you are really interested, submit your own OPRA and see what that tells you. Yeah, I had a client who basically started doing that but then realized he was losing too much time (this was pre-COVID-19) doing all this research when he should have been taking the effort when looking at the home to get an idea of the utilities. I know you are are out of state so its tougher for you...
- Investor · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2019 · 576 posts · 307 votes6y
I've worked with several out of state investors for the San Antonio market, primarily as a wholesaler. I always give more attention to the people that stay in my ear or reply to the listings I send them with feedback. If you're feeling ignored by agents you need to reach out more. Being out of state it's easy for you to get thrown on the back burner. If you're starting conversations regularly they are much more likely to pay attention to you. Just my perspective.
- Real Estate Broker · Wesley Chapel, FL · Member since 2020 · 15 posts · 10 votes6y
@Terry A. Kemp II most likely because most landlords wants to know how serious you are and will only provide an answer only if there’s a contract pending on the property in question. I was helping a client with the same questions as you and the listing agent/landlord responded with “ the property can be viewed and other questions answered only if there’s an offer on the table” then comes to find out it’s because most buyers don’t want to buy severely damaged properties and the landlord want serious buyers only.
- Developer · NY/NJ/PA · Member since 2018 · 758 posts · 935 votes6y
Originally posted by @Terry A.:
I appreciate everyone's response and insight. So that brings me to some questions. As an Investor if I am playing $120k+ or any amount of money for a property, I shouldn't worry about the age of very costly things (HVAC, Water Heater, Roof?) stuff that has to be replaced anyway? It seems to me that even though it is an investment property, you would want to know as much information going in, especially if it isn't a total rehab. I can understand cosmetic stuff (paint, floors, etc) but, knowing if something that is very costly to replace is at the end of its life should be a no brainer to want to know.
Most places in competitive markets, that are listed for decent price, has 20 buyers that aren't asking for that stuff. Many of them are going to walk the property and inspect the big ticket items themselves.
I usually get something under contract almost every month. Experienced people don't ask for a sellers disclosure. We go walk the property and put in an offer after that. Some of us (me) put in no inspection contingency to make our offers look even more aggressive, while others include the inspection contingency to cover their ***.
If I was doing long distance investing, I would pay someone in the market to go take pictures and do a walkthrough for every property you want to place an offer.
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