Approaches to Creating Value

Approaches to Creating Value

Real Estate Coach · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 5 votes

This is from a chapter in the book, [removed] Thought some of you might find it of some value:

Creating value can be as simple as buying a property that’s in great condition and in a great location in a rebounding and growing community. But, creating value can also demand very specialized expertise and knowledge, like buying an underutilized property and re-developing the property into another completely different use. Over the last century, the most used approaches to creating value have been somewhere in middle, where some expertise is required.
In this chapter, we will look at two approaches to creating value that require different levels of expertise and investment horizons.

The first approach is “forced appreciation opportunities†where value investors actively engage in strategies to create value in the short term. Investors search for investment opportunities where they can use their expertise and knowledge to force value creation through hands-on activities.

The second approach is “emerging growth opportunities†where value investors uncover external economic or market activities that are expected to lead to growing opportunities in the long term. Both approaches involve the process of value creation on investments, whether over the short term or long term.

Forced Appreciation Opportunities

Real estate value investors that use the forced appreciation approach like to take control of their investments, not waiting for outside occurrences to happen. The old saying, “If it’s to be, it’s up to me,†is a hands-on approach many investors use to create their own appreciation. These types of investors can create large returns through their expertise, hard work, market intelligence, shrewd observations, relationships and unique strategies.
Back in the early 90’s, I bought a tired 20-unit apartment building in Phoenix from an inexperienced investor. I bought the property well below the market value in a short sale with the seller and his lender. I gave the property a nice swift kick in the butt with new management and some renovations, raised the rents over a four year period and sold a turn-key, fully occupied property to another investor for a nice profit. My investors and I made 10 times our investment in four short years.
Looking back now, it’s easy to see the great profit potential. But, what’s hard to see is all the hard work and hassles that accompanied this property. Was it worth it? Heck yes. Without my effort and hands-on work, the profit may never have happened. Most forced appreciation deals can be quite active and hands-on.

All Properties are Not Fixers

There are many ways to create value through forced appreciation that do not involve fixing properties. Generally, most people believe that to create value you need to get dirty by renovating properties. Not true. Savvy real estate investors that have good negotiating skills, combined with being at the right place at the right time, can buy properties or notes at significant discounts, especially in today’s real estate environment.
For example, real estate value investor, The Magellan Group, purchased a $45M note for $32.2M, a 28.4% discount on a 100% leased, 531,000 sq. ft. industrial building. Current as-is appraisal is $49,500,000, creating a significant value creation for The Magellan Group and a very safe loan for Mesa West Capital.
Properties are available to buy with value creation opportunities that are in great condition. With the distressed debt market, many top properties have been subjected to mortgage defaults. Shrewd investors either buy the notes at a discount or buy the property through a short sale.

Research Leads to Making Great Deals

All value creation opportunities are based on the foundation of research. Good ideas are supported by research. Medical breakthroughs are founded on good research. Technological advances are based on research. Research is the very essence to finding and proving value creation opportunities are viable. Without studying and researching, value investors are stuck with guesswork, speculation, and hunches that may lead to poor investments. It’s like buying your home over the internet without ever seeing it - simply baseless.
It’s amazing the number of investors that buy real estate without researching their investments. Peter Lynch, the superstar money manager, said, “Know what you’re investing in and why.†To find the answer to WHY you are investing in a deal, you need to investigate and research your reasoning.
Value investors that invest in niche tenant bases need to research to find the best tenant base to target. Value investors that are planning to reposition a property need to research to find out who they’re repositioning it to. Ivan Boesky said in the Wall Street Journal back in 1987, "My advice to investors is the same that I give to young investors in my classes. Devote the same earnest attention to investing that $50,000 as you devoted to earning it."

Entrepreneurial and Enterprising Spirit

Forced appreciation opportunities require entrepreneurial foresight when buying real estate deals to plan and budget the value creation. First, an investor needs to see the value potential a property might contain. Many times, the real key to being a real estate value investor is seeing value or missed opportunities that others don’t see.
Are there things you can add to a property that will increase rents? Does the property need better management? Is the property serving the highest and best use tenant profile to get the highest rents? Can you re-design space to generate more revenues? Are there services, features or amenities that you can add to generate higher revenues?
Once you’ve found ways to create value, next you must create a well thought out business plan that lays out your value creation vision. The essence of your plan should very pointedly spell out how you are going to create value and make money with the property. This plan will be used to execute your plan, as well as help you raise debt and equity funds.
Finally, you will need to sell your plan to potential stakeholders. If you have found a rock solid deal with lots of value creation opportunities, getting buy-in from potential partners will be easy. But in the end, the ability to see value in a deal and be able to communicate the value you see will be critical. Let your entrepreneurial and enterprising spirit shine.
I raised $10 million from one investment fund to partner with me to buy a three property portfolio of multifamily properties in the Phoenix area. The value creation opportunity was to reposition the assets toward the Hispanic theme tenant base. I presented a detailed business plan that clearly supported the underserved niche opportunity to my investor. When we met in Phoenix to see the properties, I was able to factually communicate the value creation opportunity. We eventually partnered to buy the properties. Be entrepreneurial with your thinking. Find better ways to do things that create value, and the support from stakeholders will be there for you.

Emerging Growth Opportunities

Jim Cramer of “Mad Money†says, “There is always a bull market somewhere.†Even when the stock market is in a bear market and going down, Jim Cramer finds buying opportunities in stocks that are in a bull market going up. The real estate market is made up of smaller submarkets located throughout the world. Real estate prices may be going down in Las Vegas, Nevada, but they’re going up in Sydney, Australia. There is always somewhere to find emerging growth opportunities to create value.
Earlier, we were talking about the importance of research. The only way you’re going to find emerging growth opportunities is through research. Emerging growth opportunities aren’t yelling out saying, “Over here!†Part of your research should include watching the big whale investors. What are they doing and why? At the very minimum, find out what they’re doing so that it gives you something to research to confirm their strategy. [REMOVED]

Search For Undervalued Communities

Can you uncover the next Orange County California? Until 1950, Orange County was a heavy agricultural area with acres of orange trees and strawberry fields. By the mid-1950s, Orange County’s farms were being replaced by tract housing faster than any other community in the United States. Existing cities began annexing territory in every direction, and new cities incorporated almost every year. Between 1953 and 1962, Buena Park, Costa Mesa, La Palma, Garden Grove, Cypress, Westminster, Fountain Valley, Los Alamitos, San Juan Capistrano, and Villa Park all voted to incorporate. In 1963, the county population topped one million. Tourism, manufacturing, and the service industry began to dominate the local economy. The opening of Disneyland in 1955 made Orange County an international tourist destination. By 1980, the population had doubled in size to over 2 million people in just 20 years time. This undervalued community became a real estate bonanza for investors.
There are many undervalued communities around the world where real estate value investors can find emerging growth opportunities. Could Brazil be the next Orange County? Bloomberg wrote about Sam Zell, famous value investor, in a May, 2010 article, “Zell’s Firm Raising $500 Million for Brazil Propertyâ€:

“Billionaire investor Sam Zell’s Equity International is seeking to raise about $500 million to step up investment in Brazilian real estate, betting interest rate increases will fail to stem demand as the economy grows at the fastest pace in two decades. The firm will invest as much as two-thirds of the money in Brazilian companies tied to the residential and commercial property industries and the rest in other countries outside the U.S.,†Chief Executive Officer, Gary Garrabrant said. The new funds will bring the Chicago-based company’s total invested capital to about $2 billion.
“Our enthusiasm for Brazil could not be higher,†Garrabrant, who co-founded Equity International with Zell in 1999, said in a May 18 interview in Sao Paulo. “You’ve got this local demand that’s unparalleled.â€
“Rising incomes among Brazil’s burgeoning middle class will ensure that a cycle of rate increases won’t suppress housing demand,†Garrabrant, 53, said. The economy will grow 6.3 percent this year, according to a central bank survey published this week. Brazilians’ average monthly income has risen close to 40 percent in the past five years 1,400 reais, according to the census bureau.

You don’t need to fly across the world to find emerging market opportunities; they’re right in your back yard. Research your local market and look for the following clues:

• What part of town has the highest job growth?
• What part of town is experiencing well above average population growth?
• Speak with local realtors to find out popular spots.
• Are there any new industries emerging with expected growth?
• Where are the best schools?
• Is government growing anywhere?

Discovering Rebounding Growth Markets

Many high flying, high growth markets tend to have more severe real estate boom and bust cycles. Markets like Las Vegas, Phoenix, Atlanta and others tend to experience rapid growth from high population and job growth, causing real estate construction to overbuild and create a glut of space. This leads to a bust in the real estate market leading to foreclosures and severe pricing reductions. As these markets begin to gain strength from supply of empty space being absorbed, job growth and population growth will again propel these markets.
Real estate value investors are presented with inefficient markets when the prices drop below rising strong fundamentals.

Find Inefficient Markets

Market forces drive real estate prices higher or lower than intrinsic values. Emerging growth opportunities exist by researching and understanding mispriced real estate because of inefficient market pricing. Inefficiency means that certain players continue to have preferred access to information and expertise that allow them to capitalize upon these inefficiencies.
Everything boils down to supply and demand dynamics. Where can you find expected demand real estate needs? If supply for the demand is low, then an inefficient market exists because real estate prices are undervalued.

We Are Value Creators

Here’s how I want you to look at yourself. You are a value creator. Your sole focus as a real estate value investor is to hunt down, uncover and find value creation opportunities for you and your investors. Find opportunities where you can use one of many strategies to create value on your real estate investments.
As Warren Buffet said, “Rule No. 1 is to not lose money.†Find properties that offer a margin of safety, properties where you can purchase them below their intrinsic value to create a margin of safety so that you don’t violate Rule No. 1. Once you find an undervalued property, conduct thorough research that supports and proves that you have found a value investment. Then, execute a value creation strategy with your investment that generates attractive returns.
In the next chapter, we will talk about strategies you can use to create value.

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Will BarnardPro Member
Moderator
Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
15y

Craig, I see you are new to our board here and perhaps your post is an effort to pitch for sales of your products/services. Please keep in mind that BP Nation frowns on spam ads and those who come to us with tactics to sell something to us rather than engage the community with previous experiences, knowledge, and other beneficial tidbits. Stating you are an expert does not make you an expert. An expert will be known here from the content they post.

With that said, I want to encourage you to stick around and be a valued member in our community, this comes with time and contributions (for free) here on our site. By helping others by answering questions rather than posting ads for your services/products, you will do much better here for your business.

So let me toss a few questions at you:

You stated you have "unique experience" in value add plays, what specific experiences can you share with us?

You also stated you have done "dozens of interviews" with "the most successful investors" - this does not make YOU an expert, but perhaps them. How do these interviews make you an expert?

You also stated:

That is quite an arrogant statement to assume that none of us can find infomation you have anywhere else. In fact, it is quite possible that some of us have information you do not. I do not think making such statements benefits you at all, rather hinders your efforts to being accepted here as an expert.

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    Hope you didn't pay much for that book!

  • Developer · Garland, TX · Member since 2008 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    15y

    Craig, what is the title of this book?

    Bill, what is it that you don't like about this excerpt?

  • Investor · McKinney, TX · Member since 2009 · 405 posts · 160 votes
    15y

    I'm working on a deal that would have significant opportunity for creating increased value. Will know in a couple hours if it's something I can work with or not.

    What was discussed with sellers yesterday would work, meeting with them again this morning to hear what they came up with overnight, hopefully it's not far from what we discussed yesterday.

  • J ScottPro Member
    Moderator
    Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Jon Klaus:
    Craig, what is the title of this book?

    If I recall, it's a book that he wrote that he "gives away" if you sign up on his website, which also has a paid subscription component as well...

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    Oh, I'm sorry, didn't know he was an expert. Gave him a bump on the vote peg then! LOL, nothing at all! I agree with what he said, and what all the sound bites from all the well known "investors" quoted. I got my monies worth from reading the whole thing.

    Wasn't clear to me, was the OP the author of that book?

    Now for the details.....specifically how to identify properties with forced appreciation potential.

  • J ScottPro Member
    Moderator
    Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Financexaminer:

    Now for the details.....specifically how to identify properties with forced appreciation potential.

    I'm guessing you'll have to sign up for his paid website for that information! :D

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    LOL, don't think so, it's an elementary topic and comes from common sence. Wouldn't you clean and polich your car before selling it? If it was a really old car, wouldn't you take it to a classic car event?

    If you have a property in a run down neighborhood, how do you improve the neighborhood?

    If you have a an older building in an area along a proposed municipal venue, why not ask to get the property rezoned to a higher and best use?

    Forced appreciation is not hard to grasp, identifying where and what can be done is a little harder, actually accomplishing it is even harder for new investors. And how to do it won't come from a class, a book or a program, it takes trial and error and knowing your market and political issues. A basic knowledge of planning and development as well as financing projects helps too.

    I thought we have had this discussion here....

  • Real Estate Coach · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 5 votes
    15y

    The name of the book is The Inside Game to Real Estate Value Investing.

    This book comes from my unique experience and dozens fo interviews I'v done with some of the most successful VALUE real estate investors on Wall Street and Main Street.

    My expertise in value investing and everthing involved with it...nothing else.

    If you have any real experience in this speical niche, you'll find information found no where else.

    Question: What is intrinsic value and how do you find it?

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    Better question Craig, how would you value it?

    What's the name of that subdivision sign really worth?

    How do you value being closer to the community pool or closer to the boat dock?

    How would you value that large oak in the backyard?

    Changing the image and desirability of a project usually takes time, effort and money. It can be a speculative venture and one that pays well if you're good at it.

  • J ScottPro Member
    Moderator
    Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Craig Haskell:

    Question: What is intrinsic value and how do you find it?

    It depends on your perspective...

    From a "guru" perspective, I'm sure the answer would be the qualitative as well as the quantitative value of a real estate asset, as opposed to it's pure market (quantitative) value. Blah, blah, blah...

    From an actual investor standpoint, the intrinsic value of a piece of property is going to be it's current value based on future discounted cash flows at its "highest and best use."

    Bill hit on it in his above response when he said that understanding zoning, (re-)development, political issues, rehabbing, marketing, etc, is the key to unlocking intrinsic value of real estate when the intrinsic value is not already equal to the market value...which in many cases it already is.

    And that kind of stuff you're not going to learn from reading an eBook or a full book...that's the kind of stuff you learn by doing deals and spending years gaining experience "in the field"...

  • Real Estate Coach · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 5 votes
    15y

    One of the biggest problems real estate investors have is not understanding value. Sharp investors are able to find, create and see value most others don’t see. Many investors think they understand value, but really don’t.

  • J ScottPro Member
    Moderator
    Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Craig Haskell:
    One of the biggest problems real estate investors have is not understanding value. Sharp investors are able to find, create and see value most others don’t see. Many investors think they understand value, but really don’t.

    This is one of the biggest problems ALL investors have, not just real estate investors.

    Those who have the ability to recognize value -- and more importantly, to recognize when real value is misaligned with market value -- will succeed in any aspect of investing far beyond the masses.

    This is the lesson that Warren Buffett has taught us for 30 years now...and it's the reason he's been able to amass a $40B fortune.

    It's certainly not a new or revolutionary concept, but again, the underlying principles behind understanding value aren't something that can be taught in a book, on a website, or through a seminar...it takes years of experience, hard work and above-average intellect...

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    15y

    Craig, I see you are new to our board here and perhaps your post is an effort to pitch for sales of your products/services. Please keep in mind that BP Nation frowns on spam ads and those who come to us with tactics to sell something to us rather than engage the community with previous experiences, knowledge, and other beneficial tidbits. Stating you are an expert does not make you an expert. An expert will be known here from the content they post.

    With that said, I want to encourage you to stick around and be a valued member in our community, this comes with time and contributions (for free) here on our site. By helping others by answering questions rather than posting ads for your services/products, you will do much better here for your business.

    So let me toss a few questions at you:

    You stated you have "unique experience" in value add plays, what specific experiences can you share with us?

    You also stated you have done "dozens of interviews" with "the most successful investors" - this does not make YOU an expert, but perhaps them. How do these interviews make you an expert?

    You also stated:

    That is quite an arrogant statement to assume that none of us can find infomation you have anywhere else. In fact, it is quite possible that some of us have information you do not. I do not think making such statements benefits you at all, rather hinders your efforts to being accepted here as an expert.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    Absolutely Jason, great point that this holds true with any investment or asset.

    If you look closely at a residential appriasal you'll find a question for the appraiser to answer asking if the subject property is being utilized at its highest and best use. After reviewing thosuands of appraisals I probably have not seen 10 that said no and less than 100 that even mentioned that the property could be utilized for an alternative use as or possibly a better use than its current use.

    That tells me three things real quick:1. That your local RE expert who has great influence over your proposed deal (the appraiser) usually will not give much consideration to an alternative use, and 2. that intrinsic values are difficult, if not impossible, to acertain from the market and can not be readily justified; and 3. that in their opinion, most properties are used at the highest and best use.

    Therefore, for a newer investor starting off in real estate and attempting to design your investment strategy around this aspect of speculating or investing in real estate will likely ensure failure.

    The field is limited for a new investor, not only identifying such properties but also justifying it for any financing request. Getting an appraiser to go along might be a trick to qualify any forced appreication technique and bring it to reality.

    It often requires deep pockets to get a property rezoned. It can easily take a year or more to accomplish depending on what changes are proposed. I know!

    Every deal is different and in the beginning will be based on your perception of the situation and the possibilities. Honing those skills, as Jason mentioned, takes time and expertise and can't be picked up from any quick source. While there are basic aspects that can be pointed out, executing the strategy is something else.

    It took my momma a long time to teach me to be so perceptive, I don't think I could teach someone in a month or two what took her years to accomplish. (LOL)

  • Real Estate Coach · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 5 votes
    15y

    Since joining this site, I have been beaten up because I wrote a book. This is a tough crowd.

    I have worked with some of the most sophisticated institutional and private investors on Wall Street both on consulting jobs and in partnerships. Have bought and sold 7,200 units and almost 3 millions square feet of commercial space in many states throughout the country. I’ve helped turnaround large real estate companies. I have been in the trenches for almost 30 years and have accumulated some valuable experience and information that I was trying to convey.

    Value investors follow three core principles:

    1. Preservation of capital
    2. Thorough analysis
    3. Attractive returns

    Value investors are risk averse and are not speculators…they are investors. To achieve attractive returns, they buy with a margin of safety, which means they need to understand the intrinsic value before bidding on a deal. Finding an intrinsic value is simple, including for beginners.

    Arrogant? If you didn’t have such a big ego, you would find some pretty valuable information from large investors buying and selling billions of dollars of real estate. You can’t find this kind of information anywhere else in the value investing space. I spoke with Jerome Fink, co-founder of the Bascom Group (bought and sold 52,000 units) who told me some pretty cool stuff that investors should be doing. Where do you find that kind of information?

    Regarding the interviews. I got them because who I am. I’m pretty confident that most others could never have gotten in to see these people.

    I thought this site was about learning new ways of doing things, what others are doing to be successful. But with all the heat I’ve taken, it sounds like you already know everything, especially about houses.

    Best of luck!

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    Craig, if you/re as battle tested as you claim then you have thicker skin than that! I didn't get that at all from the posts.

    I'm sure you would have something to share here, if you are willing to do so and the returns, like any investment are down the road, not immediate.

    Keep in mind, there is no one on this site that knows it all and there are probably a few who know as much anyone but that's not to say that what one knows is identical, so we share it.

    You can start by telling me something I don't know, make it new, different and exciting....seriously, throw out something we can sink our teeth in!

  • J ScottPro Member
    Moderator
    Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Craig Haskell:
    Since joining this site, I have been beaten up because I wrote a book.

    No, you've been beaten up because you seem to care more about promoting that book than you do about providing concrete and usable information here on the site. Your information is vague and high-level, and is essentially a teaser to entice people to provide you their email address in return for your book, which may or may not be worth it.

    If you start seriously contributing to the forum -- as opposed to trying to use the forum to help yourself -- than I can vouch for the fact that you will be repaid in terms of networking and traffic to your site.

    But, until you start seriously contributing -- as opposed to just cutting and paste vague high-level ideas from your book -- you're going to take heat from some people here.

    Btw, it's clear that you are knowledgeable and have a lot to contribute...we're not beating you up because we don't believe that; we're beating you up because you haven't indicated that you want to really use your knowledge and experience to help those here as much as you want to help yourself.


    This is a tough crowd.

    Yup, we are. And we tend to be a relatively altruistic crowd. Many of us are happily giving more than we expect to receive here (though many of us receive a great deal as well).

    That's why this forum is so valuable and so packed with great information from both novice and experienced investors alike...and we do whatever we can to keep it that way!

    Welcome...and we hope you stay! And contribute... :D

  • Altus, OK · Member since 2008 · 2k+ posts · 690 votes
    15y

    I've said this before and I'll say it again. No matter how many books,courses,camps,seminars,etc you read or go to, it's not going to do you any good unless you get out there and do deals. It's one thing learning it's another doing.

    Experience comes from being in the trenches not reading books.

  • Landlord · Seattle, WA · Member since 2010 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Craig Haskell:

    I have worked with some of the most sophisticated institutional and private investors on Wall Street both on consulting jobs and in partnerships. Have bought and sold 7,200 units and almost 3 millions square feet of commercial space in many states throughout the country. I’ve helped turnaround large real estate companies. I have been in the trenches for almost 30 years and have accumulated some valuable experience and information that I was trying to convey.

    Value investors follow three core principles:

    1. Preservation of capital
    2. Thorough analysis
    3. Attractive returns

    Value investors are risk averse and are not speculators…they are investors. To achieve attractive returns, they buy with a margin of safety, which means they need to understand the intrinsic value before bidding on a deal. Finding an intrinsic value is simple, including for beginners.

    I tend to believe that you have a lot to add to the site. I don't doubt that you have a lot of experience and have met with a number of investors. Your creditability is low partly because you come on selling yourself and offering little to the community.

    Perhaps you can explain what you mean by intrinsic value? Others have offered there definitions and viewpoints.

    Originally posted by Craig Haskell:

    Arrogant? If you didn’t have such a big ego, you would find some pretty valuable information from large investors buying and selling billions of dollars of real estate. You can’t find this kind of information anywhere else in the value investing space. I spoke with Jerome Fink, co-founder of the Bascom Group (bought and sold 52,000 units) who told me some pretty cool stuff that investors should be doing. Where do you find that kind of information?

    Regarding the interviews. I got them because who I am. I’m pretty confident that most others could never have gotten in to see these people.

    I thought this site was about learning new ways of doing things, what others are doing to be successful. But with all the heat I’ve taken, it sounds like you already know everything, especially about houses.

    Best of luck!

    I believe the arrogance comes in when you seem to purport holding the keys to the mysteries of the universe and purport that you hobnob with billionaires. There are many new investors on this site, but I know that there are also many very seasoned investors here that have done large and small deals. I think that exploring the site and getting to know the members could prove worth your time. I could be wrong perhaps you really do know everything there is to know about RE.

    I also happen to know a local investor that is doing quite well investing in value plays in an area few others currently would venture. He has a very good eye for what can be done with a property to significantly increase value and cash flow. He tends to hold for 2 -5 years and then sell.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    I think Craig left the building with Elvis.

    If I were a guru with books, I think I would participate occassionally on BP and "work the crowd" giving them ideas and guidance. That is if I really had a valued product and then selling it, at a lower price, to the masses would probably be more profitable. I could also pick up coaching opportunities.

    OTH, if all I had was fluff and puff I might consider just blasting in on sites with my self procalimed expertise and make my pitch keeping my fingers crossed that the law or large numbers would work in my favor.

    I'm a hard one to impress and claiming to have had conversations with anyone other than Jesus in person won't impress me and that will be a hard one to prove. I sure wouldn't use someone on Wall Street as my center of influence, in fact I'd probably not even admit it I talked to them.

    So, Craig, if you're out there, we can start over and I won't lower the hammer on you, we can laugh this off.....so long as you provide sunstance over promotional claims......if you can do that, we'd like to have you here!

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    15y
    Craig, I thought I was clear, but perhaps not or perhaps you just cant see that my post was constructive, not attacking. I stated that it was arrogant to state that nowhere else could one find specific information and I stand behind that. I have information that many may not have, but it would be arrogant of me to state that I was the ONLY one who had it.

    Jason made a great reply and I hope you can take it in a constructive way as it was meant to be.

    My post to you was meant to be inviting and to provide you my opinion (and most others here) of how to approach our community as a new member. It is clear with your background, that you have expereince and expertise that many others do not. If you are willing to share some of that with us, then as they say, one hand washes the other.

  • Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2008 · 557 posts · 70 votes
    15y

    Hats off to the "tough crowd." That is why this site rocks. This is a real community that shares it's experience from being in the trenches.

    I agree with the others. I like some of the post. But the way you're going about it here is going to garner a "tough" response, and it elucidates that you have not spent much time here checking things out before posting.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    Unfortunately, no response. This is a topic that I do not recall being brought up in the forums. No insight without paying first !

    Adding value is what every investor should be doing, landlords, rehabbers, even quick flipers pointing out the possibilities that others have missed add value.

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    15y

    I for one was truely hoping that Craig would understand where I was coming from in my constructive advice/criticism and perhaps adjust his approach here at our community. It appears he has extensive experience and knowledge, the only question that remains is if he is willing to put forth his time and energy giving to the community, then receiving rather than the reverse.

  • Real Estate Broker · Fort Pierce, FL · Member since 2009 · 221 posts · 95 votes
    15y

    Value added principles do not change based on the number of zero's, right Craig?

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