Has anyone ever invested in the Poconos area? Any suggestions?

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Has anyone ever invested in the Poconos area? Any suggestions?

Rosaria Pipitone
Rental Property Investor · Haddon Heights, NJ · Member since 2019 · 35 posts · 6 votes

Heard Disney bought some property in the Poconos. Looking to buy a second property up near the Pocono area. Anyone familiar with that area? Do you think buying property in the outskirts of a Disney resort is a good idea?

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Yahav B.Pro Member
West Orange, NJ · Member since 2015 · 20 posts · 15 votes
5y

Hey @Mark Miles, SUPER interested in what areas in the South you are talking about?

Also in general for eveyrone in the forum... I have a property in the Poconos with a 20% cap rate (bought it for $126k, and it AirBnb's about 1.5k net or so depending on the month...) 

Would love to chat if you have any questions

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  • Mark Miles
    Rental Property Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 543 posts · 716 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Rosaria Pipitone:

    Heard Disney bought some property in the Poconos. Looking to buy a second property up near the Pocono area. Anyone familiar with that area? Do you think buying property in the outskirts of a Disney resort is a good idea?

     LOLOL!!! Disney most certainly did not buy any property in the Poconos, nor would they ever buy in such a meth-infested area.

    Things are really tough in the Poconos right now. SUPER tough to turn a large profit (exhorbitant expenses such as high property taxes & exhorbitant electricity costs combined with low annual occupancy rates). If you don’t care about turning a big profit, you can maaayyybe break-even if you’re smart about it.

    Another big problem you’ll have in the Poconos is that contractors & service professionals & cleaners & handymen have a habit of being SOOOO unreliable that there’s actually a term for it: the Pocono Promise. It means when someone tells you they’ll be there at a certain time to clean your house or fix something & you never hear from them again! Seriously, that’s what this area is known for! 😝 Causes major stress & headaches for my friends who owns homes in the Poconos

    Here’s a good thread on the challenges you’ll face in the Poconos:

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/...

    Also beware that the Poconos tends to have a problem with meth & opioids & other drugs. Here’s a funny post from a BP member that basically summarizes the Poconos in his first paragraph:

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/...

    Even though I live nearby to the Poconos, I prefer investing in the Southern US (way higher year-round occupancy rates & way more money to be made). You can only invest every dollar once, so I prefer to maximize my ROI & invest where the ROI is highest.

    If you pick the right spot down south, a 3+ BR house can bring in anywhere from $100k-$250k per year. As I said, you can only invest every dollar once. The Poconos will never pull in this kind of money...

    My final comment is this: if you’re really intent on buying a property in the northeast, remember that the 30 million people in the nyc area tend to vacation more in the catskills, hudson valley, berkshires, adirondacks & green mtns (vermont) more than the poconos. Those areas have far better skiing (WAY taller mtns), far better hiking (WAY taller mtns, better views) & WAY better fall foliage (better in New England than PA).

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  • Rosaria Pipitone
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Haddon Heights, NJ · Member since 2019 · 35 posts · 6 votes
    6y

    @Mark Miles thank you so much for the insight! Just started my research and you’ve clarified a lot. I’m looking for an affordable location where I can have my second home that relatively close to my primary (Philly area) and Airbnb in the winter (not a skier).

    Just FYI- here’s one of the articles about Disney’s purchase of property in the poconos. There’s YouTube videos as well. Not sure of this will change the pocono problem but thought I’d share.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pahomepage.com/news/work-begins-for-pocono-springs-massive-entertainment-destination/amp/

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  • Mark Miles
    Rental Property Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 543 posts · 716 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Rosaria Pipitone:

    @Mark Miles thank you so much for the insight! Just started my research and you’ve clarified a lot. I’m looking for an affordable location where I can have my second home that relatively close to my primary (Philly area) and Airbnb in the winter (not a skier).

    Just FYI- here’s one of the articles about Disney’s purchase of property in the poconos. There’s YouTube videos as well. Not sure of this will change the pocono problem but thought I’d share.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pahomepage.com/news/work-begins-for-pocono-springs-massive-entertainment-destination/amp/

    I think that you’ve misunderstood the article. Disney has not purchased any property in the Poconos. Someone is building an entertainment complex modeled after one that Disney has already built somewhere else, that is all.


    This has nothing to do with Disney, Disney is not involved, Disney would never in 1 million years touch the Poconos, this is just someone else trying to build something in the Poconos that somewhat resembles something that Disney did somewhere else 

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  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    6y

    My suggestion would be to run like hell from there. 

    I lived in the Poconos for 6 years from late 70's to mid 80's. It was a depressed dump back then and it's never changed. Most of the people were horrible. My father is still there, at least part of the year. It's a shame because it has some really beautiful natural lakes and natural scenery, but you can buy houses in the same areas I lived in 40 years ago for the same price as what they cost then - virtually no appreciation whatsoever. I lived in Pocono Summit, Tobyhanna and Effort, and all of those places still look as depressed as they did then. A lot of people today actually live in the Poconos - the Stroudsburgs and the areas closer to Bangor where you can hit 78 - and commute into NYC, which I find insane but that's how cheap the housing is relatively speaking. 

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  • Alex Capozzolo
    Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2016 · 351 posts · 141 votes
    6y

    Same also from the Pokies originally. I'd aim more towards bigger cities in PA if you're thinking of investing, like Pittsburgh or Philly. 

    2Reply
  • Matt M.
    Specialist · Easton, PA · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    @Mark Miles

    @JD Martin

    Look up this address on Zillow and read the entire rental description. This is how trashy landlords roll there-

    Garbage for big dollars

    1317 Brentwood Dr East Stroudsburg, Pa

    I live 35 mins from the Poconos and wouldn’t invest $5 there..

    2Reply
  • Simon W.Business Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Lehigh Valley PA & New York City · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 666 votes
    6y

    Comprehension is very important and can be costly. Had @Mark Miles didn't tell you that it wasn't Disney, you would've made Thousands of dollar mistakes. Please do more Due Diligence when investing in Real Estate. Be careful and good luck.

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  • Angelo Forzano
    Member since 2020 · 54 posts · 30 votes
    6y

    @Rosaria Pipitone hi. Disregarding some of the post that you received concerning drug use there are a lot of high-end areas in the Poconos near the Mount Airy Lodge which is super expensive and a big draw because of the casino. I would definitely check out Mount Pocono, Lake Harmony, Lake Wallenpaupack. Houses are 500 to 800 k. I would say anything in this general vicinity is going to put you in summer and winter activities ..are you looking to Airbnb? Catskills and the Poconos have both seasonal activities I have a rental down the Jersey Shore but its pretty much w 3 month season

    there. Check air bnb prices !

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  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Matt M.:

    @Mark Miles

    @JD Martin

    Look up this address on Zillow and read the entire rental description. This is how trashy landlords roll there-

    Garbage for big dollars

    1317 Brentwood Dr East Stroudsburg, Pa

    I live 35 mins from the Poconos and wouldn’t invest $5 there..

     LOL. Just like how I remember. Dumps masquerading as suitable housing. My favorite line:

    The property has been abused by previous tenants and property has bare minimum of repairs.

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  • Yahav B.Pro Member
    West Orange, NJ · Member since 2015 · 20 posts · 15 votes
    5y

    Hey @Mark Miles, SUPER interested in what areas in the South you are talking about?

    Also in general for eveyrone in the forum... I have a property in the Poconos with a 20% cap rate (bought it for $126k, and it AirBnb's about 1.5k net or so depending on the month...) 

    Would love to chat if you have any questions

    5Reply
  • Scott RankinPro Member
    Investor · Jim Thorpe, PA · Member since 2017 · 32 posts · 32 votes
    5y

    I agree with Yahav, I'm definitely curious where @Mark Miles is investing!  

    Also congrats on a great purchase, 20% cap rate is fantastic!  

    I also have a few properties in the Poconos that have performed very well (over 25% cap rate) and haven't experienced any of the issues discussed in this thread.  There has been pretty significant appreciation in the past two years as well due to investors and second home buyers flocking to the region.  As always, your mileage may vary, so do your own due diligence.  Drive around the region and work the phones, you'll learn more in one day of doing that than months of trolling the forums.  

    4Reply
  • Yahav B.Pro Member
    West Orange, NJ · Member since 2015 · 20 posts · 15 votes
    5y

    Well said Scott! Glad to hear there are more people doing well in this area! I wonder why it has such a bad rap...

    I can definitely see situations where people buy AirBnb properties that are not quite what vacationers are looking for, or decorated poorly, pictures not taken well, etc. Those properties can definitely be a bust.

    1Reply
  • Jorel Medayil
    Member since 2021 · 4 posts · 1 vote
    5y

    @Yahav B. Would love to learn more

    0Reply
  • James Des
    Member since 2020 · 5 posts · 1 vote
    5y

    @Yahav B.

    Would love to learn more too. Will connect

    0Reply
  • James Des
    Member since 2020 · 5 posts · 1 vote
    5y

    @Yahav B.

    Where in the Poconos is your STR?

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  • Yahav B.Pro Member
    West Orange, NJ · Member since 2015 · 20 posts · 15 votes
    5y

    Mine is specifically in East Stroudsburg PA. Bought another one in East Stroudsburg. Right now in the height of STR occupancies (due to COVID, travel issues by plane, etc) our occupancy is about 70-90% depending on whether we lower the price a bit to increase occupancy rates.

    1Reply
  • Xander WeidenbaumBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Stroudsburg, PA · Member since 2020 · 12 posts · 20 votes
    5y

    Yes, I am in the process of repurposing two properties for Airbnb use in the Poconos. That 70-90% occupancy (which seems crazy on the face of it) is what I'm generally hearing as reasonable occupancy. I also have a LOT of clients who are heavily involved in the airbnb game locally. I'm curious to see how occupancy rates fluctuate once we get past the worst of the pandemic - like 2022/23. I usually tell people to anticipate 12 days out of the month (or about 40% occupancy) as a worst-case scenario if their property is nice, properly priced and has good amenities. If the investment still make sense at those numbers for the work involved, it's gotta be a 'go'. 

    0Reply
  • Aj Kholi
    Member since 2021 · 6 posts · 1 vote
    5y
    Originally posted by @Yahav B.:

    Mine is specifically in East Stroudsburg PA. Bought another one in East Stroudsburg. Right now in the height of STR occupancies (due to COVID, travel issues by plane, etc) our occupancy is about 70-90% depending on whether we lower the price a bit to increase occupancy rates.

    Hey yahav can you please tell me more about east Stroudsburg area I'm thinking to buy house there for STR

    0Reply
  • Matthew Niemynski
    Wholesaler · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2021 · 39 posts · 18 votes
    5y

    I have helped a few Airbnb investors start their profolios in the Poconos and many of them are making a killing. Specifically in the areas near the lakes. Stroudsburg, east stroudsburg, jim thorpe, albrightsville, lake harmony, mount pocono all are great opportunities to invest. 



    If you are interested, I think the Poconos is definitely worth looking in to. Feel free to reach out to me and I would be more than happy to give some more info. 

    0Reply
  • Mike Kelly
    Rental Property Investor · Prospect Park, PA · Member since 2014 · 28 posts · 12 votes
    5y

    My Wife and I invest in STR rentals in the Pocono's after vacationing there for the past 12 years. Occupancy rates have been elevated since COVID-19 another factor of occupancy rates is based on your price.

    0Reply
  • Alesandro Breguez
    Investor · NEPA /NJ · Member since 2019 · 44 posts · 15 votes
    5y

    It looks like that the STR market in the Poconos is ''normalizing'' now, there was a spike in the demand in 2020 after the STR ban was lifted and this summer was very busy as well. HOWEVER, there was also a surge in the supply of listings (+25% in Q1 2021) that seems to be balancing the market again.

    Sept has been a bit slow. What are your views and takeaways?

    1Reply
  • Jason Stoltzfus
    Rental Property Investor · Lancaster, PA · Member since 2018 · 56 posts · 57 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Alesandro Breguez:

    It looks like that the STR market in the Poconos is ''normalizing'' now, there was a spike in the demand in 2020 after the STR ban was lifted and this summer was very busy as well. HOWEVER, there was also a surge in the supply of listings (+25% in Q1 2021) that seems to be balancing the market again.

    Sept has been a bit slow. What are your views and takeaways?

    My September was slow and seemed to be across the board in my area. There's an uptick in October and November for me as folks come in for hunting. 

    1Reply
  • Sylvester Szmejda
    Investor · East Stroudsburg, PA · Member since 2020 · 6 posts · 5 votes
    5y

    I just had my house listed on Airbnb starting in July. I am in East Stroudsburg. July and August I was booked solid every single day and was fairly priced at first and then upped the nightly rate once i saw the demand. September i was booked about 80% of the month and right now October is about 55% booked. During the Fall we get a-lot of last minute bookings and mostly weekend getaways but even at that i am still grossing a fairly large amount per month even with just weekends. Yes there is a considerable increase in listings as more people are flocking here from the city but a lot of these listings are average at best. I think if you set up your home with all the right amenities people are looking for and make it stand out with beautiful professional photos you will succeed. 

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