The Truth About Lending: Part 1

The Truth About Lending: Part 1

Zack KarpPro Member
Lender · Schaumburg, IL · Member since 2015 · 833 posts · 774 votes

Hi BP family!  I have been reading and absorbing lots of fantastic info from this great community, and I have learned a lot from you all.  Time for me to give back.

A quick story about me, I love real estate.  I just love it.  Everything about it.  From walking through a property, to buying it, to owning it, to financing it, to selling it....every property is different, every person is different, and so it will never be the same thing twice and it never gets old.

My primary business is that I have been a residential loan originator for the past 17 years. I have been a broker, correspondent, and worked directly for a major bank. I have owned my own company, and I have been just a loan officer. So I have been on all sides of Conventional, FHA, VA, and Subprime lending (back in the day).

I have been reading many posts and replies here on BP, and it seems that many people really do not understand what can and cannot be done with lending (which is expected), and while most people are giving great info, some are not.  So I wanted to write an unbiased thread about the truth, and if there is enough interest, I will continue to provide as much info and new topics as I can.

Part 1 of this series is going to be called "Overlays". What is an overlay you ask? An overlay is a lender imposing their own guidelines on top of the actual guidelines from Fannie/Freddie/FHA, etc. Many banks & lenders do this to protect their risk in lending to borrowers. Why? Well there are many reasons, but mostly financial (isn't everything driven by money?). These overlays allow for the lender to write only the highest quality loans, which in turn can help their profits, stock, default percentage, etc.

Overlays come in many shapes and sizes.  It can be the FICO credit score requirements, Loan-to-Value, asset requirements, and/or many other non-numerical lending guidelines.  The list is long for all of the possible overlay opportunities, as the underwriting guidelines are hundreds of pages.

Here's an example.  Fannie Mae (conventional 1-4 unit lending) allows up to 10 financed properties.  But you call your bank, and the loan officer tells you that you can only have 4 financed properties, and then tells you that you need to get a private/hard money loan.  In reality, that bank has an overlay, and you are getting bad advice without even knowing it.  And the worst part it is, that an uneducated loan officer for that bank may not even know that Fannie allows 10 properties, and they don't even know that they have an overlay or what an overlay is!  That lender has decided that they do not want the exposure of borrowers who have more than 4 mortgages in their lending portfolio.  But there are lenders out there that do not have any overlays to the Fannie guidelines, or just a few of them, and will lend on 10 financed properties.

Many of these overlays started after the mortgage meltdown, as lenders wanted to take less risks, and try to improve their default percentages.  Overlays have been around longer than that, but that's when it kicked into overdrive.  Subprime and most Alt-A went away, and suddenly it appeared no one was lending because of all the overlays.  As we distanced ourselves from that time, the foreclosures cycled through, borrowers decreased default, and lenders removed and/or reduced many of their overlays.  But not all of them.  In fact, not even most of them.  Most banks and lenders still have them, and the overlays vary per lender.  Most brokers still have them, because they are actually underwriting to those same bank's/lender's guidelines.

As a borrower, you need to find a good, qualified, educated loan professional to align yourself with that has a strong product line with little or no overlays, especially as an investor.  Many people think they need hard money or private money, and don't know they can qualify for a conventional product.  Do your homework.  Ask questions.  Get referrals.  Use BP and network, this is a fantastic place to find quality lenders.

Hopefully you find this topic useful and informative.  Best of luck and happy investing!

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Developer · Garland, TX · Member since 2008 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
11y

Oh, and thanks for sharing your experience and knowledge. 

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Investor · Little Rock, AR · Member since 2013 · 50 posts · 40 votes
    11y

    @Zack Karpthanks for the posts!  Very informative!

  • Investor · Naples, FL · Member since 2015 · 8 posts · 7 votes
    11y

    Excellent article, very informative. I look forward to more of your writing.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    11y

    @Roy N.

    Yes, I'll do that. I also see more work ahead.

    @Zack Karp 

     I guess you're speaking of lender's requirements as "overlays" in addition to Fannie and Freddie.

    Some of what you mention will pertain to the type of lender as to "prudent lending practices" banks will be different than mortgage companies, credit unions may be different and so may your  insurance company as some originate home loans. 

    That W-2 to a 1099 has exceptions, tax status is not always a determining factor, it depends on the business they go into in relationship to the job they had, they can be doing the same thing. Another point of two years returns for a rental isn't always required, showing enough income and management experience is a compensating factor.

    Some of the "overlays" come from PMI, MIP coverage. The coverage required in the secondary can be made up by a lender sharing at different levels of coverage which can allow different LTVs and this gets into product lines marketing loans as you pointed out. Just saying, let's not make it sound like it's Fannie Mae accepting 85% non-owner occupied loans and it's your competitors having "overlays".

    Doing business in all 50 states also means 50 state regulatory agencies in addition to the federal regulatory oversight institutional lenders fall under. Such is pretty standardized but you do have state laws and exceptions, just any product may not fly in all states. Not saying your products don't, but that the rules can be different that falls under those prudent lending practices.

    I realize you're pointing out matters of difference for marketing, under the radar so to speak, but the differences are not so much as what the secondary requires as what they may accept after some backroom product designs, like adjusting repurchase agreements, mortgage insurance amounts, geographical market requirements and matters beyond the origination level. 

    Your "awakening" in your experience probably came about by seeing some of the exceptions a direct lender may take, especially a non-banking entity if that's the case. But there are many direct lenders and endorsers.

    The other trick is to make loans that do not comply with secondary guidelines, hold them in portfolio and sell them later after they are cured meeting the guidelines, a common practice. 

    You're right, loan officers that don't bounce around much learn the company way. Those that stay with state banks will be accustom to that regulatory world, national banks another, mortgage companies...etc. Going from lender to lender will expose you to different schools of thought and product variations, but still within standardized guidelines. Aspects of prudent lending have been around for decades, underwriting guidelines can change on a dime.

    BTW, welcome to BP! 

    A better place to post about your product line will be in the marketplace. You'd think as much as I post I'd be doing blogs, makes more sense as they can be found, things get lost in the forums. 

    However, @John McConnell, I see you in a uniform, speaking of retirement, lucky you. Good plan. Starting now means 5 or 6 years of experience on your retirement date. You will have your rental income plus your retirement pay which is gold for any lender. (you will be one of the easiest borrowers to collect from with a judgment sent to Ft. Ben, Army I'm guessing). Lenders also like allotments. So, your year 1 isn't going to be bad, you'll have qualifying income and you can continue to march. 

    Both fannie and freddie have exceptions to job tenure for students after college going into their majored profession and military getting off active duty. That should not be an issue. 

    Good luck :) 

  • Flipper · O Fallon, IL · Member since 2014 · 7 posts · 1 vote
    11y

    Zach,   Thanks for the post.  Are you a direct lender to Fannie or Freddie?

  • Zack KarpPro Member
    OP
    Lender · Schaumburg, IL · Member since 2015 · 833 posts · 774 votes
    11y

    @Bill Gulley thanks for the post, you clearly have vast knowledge on the subject matter, and after seeing your profile and career, I can see why.  I was trying to keep the information as close to "high level" as possible, as many members here on BP would get a little lost if I went down the road of explaining secondary, or MI guidelines.

    I think we can both agree that information and knowledge is important to investors, so we can make the best strategic decisions from purchase to exit.  This topic spawned from seeing some incorrect info and bad advice being given on some topics here that I came across, which as an investor myself, knowing what I know, is just frustrating to see because I would not want that happening to me.

    It's great to see someone with your career achievements giving back, I have a lot of respect for that.

    Cheers!

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    11y

    Thanks Zack, the "problem" in finance and banking is that the surface always has some deep holes below it in many areas, almost like looking for the big catfish. I also learned long ago on BP that we are speaking to a very large and diverse group, information can be taken the wrong way if details aren't given. Overall, good job at pointing out that at the street level, lenders will have additional requirements beyond what might slide through into the secondary market. Good luck :) 

  • Zack KarpPro Member
    OP
    Lender · Schaumburg, IL · Member since 2015 · 833 posts · 774 votes
    11y

    The Truth About Lending: Part 2

    Is now posted, here's a link.  Happy reading!

    http://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/49/topics/211185-the-truth-about-lending-part-2

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