Debt to Income Question

Debt to Income Question

Member since 2018 · 72 posts · 46 votes

First, here is the situation - I'm looking to purchase another investment property.  Though I haven't settled on one yet, the high-end is likely to be $300k.  To get there, I'd do 1031 exchange from an existing house that I have, which would net me about $150k.  Therefore, I'd need to finance the remaining $150k.  I've begun calling lenders to try to determine the best rates.  At one lender, he indicated that my debt-to-income ratio is too high, since I currently have three loans (primary residence and two investment properties, one of which I'd sell and 1031).

My income is fairly high, and due to a job change, it's recently increased $20k.  So, I was surprised to hear that my ratio was too high (52%), especially given the fact that I'd be exchanging one loan for another... and the new one would actually be a lower amount.  My question is this... How do investors get around this issue?  Am I looking at the wrong loans?

Ryan

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Lender · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 899 votes
7y

the  rental income for  present and  future rental income  can be  counted to a certain degree  ...so this should make your  dti ratio lower ......in most cases  rental properties will   cash flow  positively  or at least  break even   from a lenders  qualifying perspective  ...fyi - lenders  will use  your schedule E  for analyzing rental income  for properties  owned for  more than 1 year

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  • Lender · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 899 votes
    7y

    is this lender you are using  including the  rental income form the one rental property you are keeping ?  are they including  rental income for the  potential  rental you will be  purchasing ?

  • Member since 2018 · 72 posts · 46 votes
    7y

    @Dave Skow Good questions, and thank you for responding so quickly. :)

    No, when he told me about the issue, he hadn't factored that info in.  He wants to do so, though and is currently waiting on documentation from me to move forward.

    No, he didn't factor in the rental income from the new purchase.  I didn't think that would be allowable, since I cannot show a rental history yet.

    But, I've read about others who have many more than three loans.  How do you suppose they are getting around the the debt-to-income requirement?

    Ryan

  • Lender · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 899 votes
    7y

    the  rental income for  present and  future rental income  can be  counted to a certain degree  ...so this should make your  dti ratio lower ......in most cases  rental properties will   cash flow  positively  or at least  break even   from a lenders  qualifying perspective  ...fyi - lenders  will use  your schedule E  for analyzing rental income  for properties  owned for  more than 1 year

  • Member since 2017 · 20 posts · 7 votes
    7y

    @Ryan Wamsat I would need to see more but it doesn’t sound like he has calculated your schedule e yet. Do you have any other recurring debt other than your properties?

    How long have you been renting out your current rentals?

  • Member since 2018 · 211 posts · 164 votes
    7y

    as long as you owned your rentals for 2 years you can use that towards your income. You should see about that 

  • Member since 2018 · 72 posts · 46 votes
    7y

    @Thomas O. I don't have any debt other than the three houses.  One house (the one I'd be selling) has been rented for about 10 years now.  The other has been rented for about six years.

    I'm sure, after I give him the Schedule E that he's requesting, that I'd qualify for the loan. My question isn't really geared towards the purchase of this house. It's really geared towards my goal of purchasing more rental properties in the next few years. I don't see how I can do so if I keep running into this DTI issue.

    Ryan

  • Lender · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 899 votes
    7y

    key thing  will be to avoid  any huge negative  incomes on your  future  schedule Es 

    the other issue to keep in mind is that many lenders  will  have a  maximum cap on the # of financed  properties a  borrower  owns  when it comes to  making new  investment property  loans ...( eg...ours is 10 )

  • Member since 2017 · 20 posts · 7 votes
    7y

    @Ryan Wamsat make sure it cash flows, properties rented less than 1 year will only count as 75% of the rental rate for approval purposes towards income. (Ie $1000/mo would only count as $750/mo). If you go under contract on a property that is not currently rented, I can offset the DTI with the market rent as income per appraisal. I lend in AL, FL & GA if you're in any of those states and need help.

  • Chris MasonPro Member
    Moderator
    Lender · CA · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Ryan Wamsat:

    First, here is the situation - I'm looking to purchase another investment property.  Though I haven't settled on one yet, the high-end is likely to be $300k.  To get there, I'd do 1031 exchange from an existing house that I have, which would net me about $150k.  Therefore, I'd need to finance the remaining $150k.  I've begun calling lenders to try to determine the best rates.  At one lender, he indicated that my debt-to-income ratio is too high, since I currently have three loans (primary residence and two investment properties, one of which I'd sell and 1031).

    My income is fairly high, and due to a job change, it's recently increased $20k.  So, I was surprised to hear that my ratio was too high (52%), especially given the fact that I'd be exchanging one loan for another... and the new one would actually be a lower amount.  My question is this... How do investors get around this issue?  Am I looking at the wrong loans?

    Ryan

    There's absolutely no guarantee that the lender who said your DTI was 52% knows how to calculate rental income correctly. It's not part of our pre-licensing education, it's not part of our continuing education, and we are never tested on it. A foot doctor could mis-diagnose brain cancer, right? Same thing here.

    Find a local REI-friendly lender. Go to your local REIA meetup and ask who does their mortgages. You need someone that knows this niche.

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