Fund for Down Payment & Towns for Investment

Fund for Down Payment & Towns for Investment

Lowell, MA · Member since 2014 · 335 posts · 52 votes

Hi BP and Friends,

I realized that after acquiring my first 4-Units investment, there is a big setback financially. This is because the conventional bank required that I put down 25%. It is pretty much all I’ve been saving for.

I’ve a bit extra left for emergency fund and about 5% for the next investment.

I have been doing the following steps in trying to get more down payments for the next investment

FYI: Conventional requirement is 25% down or portfolio is 20% for duplex, triplex and quad.

Proactive Approach so far:

a) I applied to local bank for unsecured line of credit. They grant me $25k. I guess one method is to continue to apply for additional unsecured line of credit to get enough money for down payment. Does anyone know other banks that are doing “unsecured line of credit” for a good rate?

b) I called around and asked for “equity line” or “second mortgage”, but I could not pull out much from my houses. Both my primary and investment property only have about 25% in equity. The equity is only doing 89% LTV for primary and 75% LTV for investment property.

c) I find my deal or property through MLS or drive by.

Not comfortable:

a) Get a partnership – not really desire

b) I know people normally use private lender or hard money lender for flipping. My interest is to buy and hold as an investor. I don’t know how people usually would set up private/HML for buy/hold. Usually, even if the private or hard money group lends me the 20%, I don’t how the conventional bank would feel about given me 80%. The bank required that the 20% is my saving money.

c) Seller finance property is hard to come by through MLS. Is there a website that lists all seller finance within MA?

Question and Finance:

1) Is there a bank or banks out there that is doing 20% (from on bank) and 80% (from another bank) or 10% (from one bank), 10% (from buyer) and 80% (from another bank)? I am trying to get in with “out of pocket – OOP” as much as possible, because I have don’t much saving at this point.

2) I guess my primary question is how I can get down payment fund for my next investment beside all the points I have made above. Assuming, I have good credit, good salary and some cash flow from my first investment. I don’t have much equity from my houses.

3) Does anyone know of a good towns/cities in MA or NH that are good for investment (buy/hold – multifamily or flipping – single family)

FYI: At this point I don't think I will qualify for any owner occupied property. I called and asked a bank that if I could rent out my single house, and move into a multi-family and trying to get a government 3.5% or 5% down loan like FHA etc.... I think they kind like laugh at me.

Sorry for the long note.

Thank you for sharing your though and discussion.

-Chan-

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Landlord and Rehabber · Newton, MA · Member since 2010 · 2k+ posts · 877 votes
12y

Look at Michael's response because he makes several good points.

One thing I will say if you want to use unsecured credit to fund the downpayments it is most likely to get you denied the loan if you tap them after the offer is accepted during the loan process. If you want that money to "count" take it out now and let it sit in your back account. Once it is in there for a few statement cycles they won't ask where it came from.

Now the obvious downside is you will have to pay interest on it for indefinite amount of time. The less obvious thing is that it also might screw up your DTI ratio and still get you denied for the loan (Might not, but make sure you figure that out).

BTW if you really want to try living in a multi and rent out your current place there really should be no reason you would not be able to get an FHA loan. As long as you qualify there is no requirement that you sell your current residence. The only thing is you can't have more than one FHA loan, so if that is what you have on your current home you can't do it or you need to refinance out of it first.

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Investor · Louisville, KY · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    12y

    Hey @Chan K., I have a couple comments on your post...

    1 - You can try to get unsecured loans for a down payment, however you have to disclose this source of funds to the bank for a mortgage and they more likely than not will turn down the loan.

    2 - Back before the housing crash, banks would lend up to and above 100% and would also allow CLTV (combined loan to value, i.e. 10% from bank 1, 10% from bank 2 and 80% from bank 3) to meet or exceed 100%. As far as I can tell, this type of lending practice is gone and may never return.

    At the end of the day, banks are looking for you to have skin in the game, some reserves and enough income to pay the debt off. It sounds like you're trying to get a property with at most 5% skin in the game which may not be doable in today's lending environment.

    There are other approaches to getting into properties with less than 20-25% down, but they won't include a 30 year fixed mortgage at <5% interest unfortunately.

  • Landlord and Rehabber · Newton, MA · Member since 2010 · 2k+ posts · 877 votes
    12y

    Look at Michael's response because he makes several good points.

    One thing I will say if you want to use unsecured credit to fund the downpayments it is most likely to get you denied the loan if you tap them after the offer is accepted during the loan process. If you want that money to "count" take it out now and let it sit in your back account. Once it is in there for a few statement cycles they won't ask where it came from.

    Now the obvious downside is you will have to pay interest on it for indefinite amount of time. The less obvious thing is that it also might screw up your DTI ratio and still get you denied for the loan (Might not, but make sure you figure that out).

    BTW if you really want to try living in a multi and rent out your current place there really should be no reason you would not be able to get an FHA loan. As long as you qualify there is no requirement that you sell your current residence. The only thing is you can't have more than one FHA loan, so if that is what you have on your current home you can't do it or you need to refinance out of it first.

  • Real Estate Investor · Member since 2012 · 28 posts · 6 votes
    12y

    If you are willing to move out of your single family house and move into a multi-family unit, then why not sell your house and use those funds towards a larger, multi family unit that will ideally cash-flow more than your house?

  • SFR Investor · Dallas, TX · Member since 2011 · 604 posts · 243 votes
    12y

    when you get to mortgage #5 you will be required to show reserves equal to 6 months PITI for all investment properties,, they will allow part of a 401k apply toward the reserves

    2008 showed banks people without skin in the game and reserves are more likely to be foreclosed on, so they are tough on both of those items

  • Kent County, DE · Member since 2014 · 147 posts · 22 votes
    12y
    Just to tag on to the original question, how do banks view the use of a home equity line of credit to cover the down payment? Would they consider that as having skin in the game since you are sacrificing your existing property?
  • Lowell, MA · Member since 2014 · 335 posts · 52 votes
    12y

    Hi Everyone for the great discussion.

    @Michael SeekerI have to be careful with the unsecured line of credit now if it is affecting my ability to get the mortgage. FYI: TD Bank has a great rate (8.5%) for $25k. I talked to Well Fargo, their limit is up to $100k, but their rate is ridiculously high (14%).

    @Michael Siekerka I am really interested in the other option you mentioned where I can down less than 20-25%. I guess I don't mind if it is not 30% fixed rate. I will have to find a property that gives me a good cash flow margin. If you don't mind, would you be able to share a few lenders in your database that would accept less than 20% down?

    @Shaun Reilly thank you for sharing the withdraw strategy, where I have to withdraw the line of credit and leave it in my bank for a few cycles.

    @Shaun Reilly thank you for pointing out and clarify on the FHA. I have not taken out any FHA before. I will have to call a few banks to find out if I can take out the FHA loan to buy a multi-family once I rented out my single family. I think you just gave me a method to acquire my third house.

    @David T I guess the idea of selling never crossed my mind. It comes down to my strategy as I have mentioned that I like to hold. The pyramid concept does not seem to sink well yet. I also see more potential in my current single family. I believe it has more potential to rise more in value in the future. The market just rises up. I bought my single about 6 years ago for $235k, and currently appraised above $250k. I want to wait for awhile I guess. The house is located on a good neighborhood in the town.

    @Andy Collins Thank you for mentioning about the 401k credit. I stopped pumping into my 401k about a year ago. Nowaday, I only contribute the minimum to get employer matching.

    I am still fairly new to BP. If I want to follow a person or persons post, how would I set it up? How do I also find out the BP members who are located in MA or near by NH?

  • Investor · Louisville, KY · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    12y
    Originally posted by @Chan K.:

    @Michael Seeker I am really interested in the other option you mentioned where I can down less than 20-25%. I guess I don't mind if it is not 30% fixed rate. I will have to find a property that gives me a good cash flow margin. If you don't mind, would you be able to share a few lenders in your database that would accept less than 20% down?

    I don't know of any banks that will do this (thus I can't just give you contact information). There are approaches to getting into a property for under 20% down but they have to be executed on an individual level...I can't just hand you a contact unfortunately because all of the folks I work with work at a local level. If you invest in Louisville, that would be a different story. Assuming you're not in Louisville, here are some approaches you can take in your market to get into a place with less than 20% down:
    -Owner financing - work out terms that require small down payment with the seller

    -Private Equity - find somebody to partner with you, then purchase property with LLC and get commercial loan

    -Private Debt - find somebody to loan you the money for the entire deal or part of down payment (latter is not a great idea as you should disclose to the bank and as others mentioned this will mess up your DTI)

    -Hard Money - purchase distressed property with short term loan, fix up, refinance with a cashout loan.

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