My Roofer is MADDDD I 1099'd him

My Roofer is MADDDD I 1099'd him

Brownstown, MI · Member since 2014 · 344 posts · 98 votes

So 2015 was my first full year in the real estate business.  Someone published an article a week or two ago about making sure we get our 1099s together out to our contractors and such.  I honestly didn't know I had to do that, so I called my CPA and asked about it.

I told him that I had a roofer guy do 2 roofs for me (I paid him over 10k) and my main contractor which I paid 27k+ last year.

My CPA suggested I 1099 both of those guys, and to try to get their SSN but if not, still 1099 them to protect the business.

I called my contractor and he was ok with it, although he acted a little surprised I was asking.  He even gave me his SSN.  

The roofer,  I didn't bother to even ask.  He's a roughneck type and I knew he would not be happy.  So I just got the phone call.  I saw his name pop up, and I 'gulped' lol.

I'm not sure he was even aware of what the 1099 was, but he was livid. I  couldn't even get a sentence in without getting cut off repeatedly about how I'm acting like he's done 15 roofs for me and "I've done several others for everybody else and nobody's ever 1099'd me".

When i asked if I could explain what the paper was and why I had to issue it he just cut me off and said he didn't care to hear it.  At the end he told me to lose his number and never call him again.

Did I do anything wrong?  Should I not have sent him one?  I was just trying to protect the business and do the right thing.  I lost a good, cheap roofer over it, too.

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Accountant, Enrolled Agent · Grayslake, IL · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
10y

You did right. If they didn't claim it thats their issue. They are due to be SENT Jan 31 or this year Feb 1. If they have an issue that's their problem. If I'm paying 600 or about to hit the threshold I get the W9 filled put before I cut the check. No W9 no check and VERIFY the number they are giving you to make sure it matches their docs...

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  • Contractor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    This are the kind of clients that I want to avoid, I don't know how you could send a 1099 without ssn or ein (llc) details. I am not a CPA, but I don't think you can "protect" the business that way. What will an auditor say? It can be disallowed until you can get the ssn, I mean, how can the IRS "link" your payment to somebody's income?

    To the OP, you need w9 filled and signed, before that ink touches the check, along with lien waivers, invoice, etc. That should weed out all your problems. 

  • Contractor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Stone Teran:
    Originally posted by @Nicole A.:

    Wanting to clarify, these 1099s are issued to individuals who are doing these contractor jobs. 

    The rules differ on it being a corporation. I think you might have to 1099 a LLC contractor?

    I'm fairly certain I have this correct, please tell me if I'm confused.

    You 1099 an individual, (most) LLC's and partnerships.

    You don't 1099 a c-corp, s-corp or LLC's taxed as a corp (which is somewhat rare).

     You 1099 LLCs, period.

  • Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2015 · 374 posts · 120 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Manolo D.:

    This are the kind of clients that I want to avoid, I don't know how you could send a 1099 without ssn or ein (llc) details. I am not a CPA, but I don't think you can "protect" the business that way. What will an auditor say? It can be disallowed until you can get the ssn, I mean, how can the IRS "link" your payment to somebody's income?

     While the 1099 will kick out without a SSN or EIN, sending an incomplete 1099 still demonstrates a valid attempt to be compliant to an auditor, if it were to be questioned during an audit.

  • Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2015 · 374 posts · 120 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Manolo D.:
    Originally posted by @Stone Teran:
    Originally posted by @Nicole A.:

    Wanting to clarify, these 1099s are issued to individuals who are doing these contractor jobs. 

    The rules differ on it being a corporation. I think you might have to 1099 a LLC contractor?

    I'm fairly certain I have this correct, please tell me if I'm confused.

    You 1099 an individual, (most) LLC's and partnerships.

    You don't 1099 a c-corp, s-corp or LLC's taxed as a corp (which is somewhat rare).

     You 1099 LLCs, period.

    Nope.  Per the IRS website:

    Payments for which a Form 1099-MISC is not required include all of the following: Generally, payments to a corporation (including a limited liability company (LLC) that is treated as a C or S Corporation).

    https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/i1099msc.pdf

  • Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2012 · 506 posts · 331 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Stone Teran:
    Originally posted by @Manolo D.:

    This are the kind of clients that I want to avoid, I don't know how you could send a 1099 without ssn or ein (llc) details. I am not a CPA, but I don't think you can "protect" the business that way. What will an auditor say? It can be disallowed until you can get the ssn, I mean, how can the IRS "link" your payment to somebody's income?

     While the 1099 will kick out without a SSN or EIN, sending an incomplete 1099 still demonstrates a valid attempt to be compliant to an auditor, if it were to be questioned during an audit.

     That's right.  It's the same with claiming childcare tax credits.  If you make a good faith effort to get the information and they refuse, still submit the 1099.

  • Nicole A.Pro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Baltimore County Maryland and Tampa Florida · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    10y

    And if one didn't have any other information but their name (no address, no SSN), would that still at least show effort?

  • Residential Real Estate Broker · Chicago Suburbs, IL · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 594 votes
    10y

    My accountant said (although I wonder if you ask ten different accountants you'll get 10 different opinions) that so long as I can prove a good faith effort to get a W9 (she did mention certified mail return receipt requested) that's all that I need to do. She didnt say to send a 1099 with missing info.

  • Real Estate Professional · Dayton, OH · Member since 2015 · 423 posts · 187 votes
    10y

    NO.  You would have done something wrong by not 1099-ing him.

  • Investor · Truckee, CA · Member since 2013 · 546 posts · 445 votes
    10y

    Agree with others regarding getting W9's upfront, that avoids any misunderstanding.

    That said, if the guy is a real jerk, you may want to make it clear to him that he might not want to call people and brag about never getting 1099'd. There is a 15% reward for turning guys like him in after all... https://www.irs.gov/uac/Whistleblower-Informant-Aw...

  • Contractor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    Let's call on the perfect person for this 1099 and W9 good faith effort. @Brandon Hall

  • Vendor · Tempe, AZ · Member since 2016 · 13 posts · 0 votes
    10y

    It is not your choice - you have to comply with the laws, including the tax laws.  Have him be mad at himslef for trying to be too cleaver by half to skip on taxes.

  • Investor · Morgantown, WV · Member since 2016 · 43 posts · 17 votes
    10y

    Ok, please correct me if I am wrong...

    Unless you are a real estate professional (at least 50% of your income is from real estate and you spend 750 hrs per year on real estate activities), you are under no obligation to send a 1099.  

    In 2010 an act was added to require rental owners to 1099 contractors, but in 2011 the President vetoed that act.

  • Tampa, FL · Member since 2016 · 55 posts · 4 votes
    10y

    @James Fisher You are absolutely correct, as confirmed with my real estate lawyer. CPA's will error on the side of caution because "it cant hurt", but most of us investors are under no obligation to 1099.

  • Realtor/Investor · Pensacola, FL · Member since 2015 · 9 posts · 2 votes
    10y
    We have been buying rentals but will start with rehabs next year. Thank you all for this conversation-it wasn't even on my radar.MAKS
  • Investor · Pawleys Island, SC · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 837 votes
    10y

    If the roofer's work is usually for homeowners, rather than business owners, then I can understand why the roofer may have been surprised to get a 1099 and not understand it.  There is no requirement for a private individual to 1099 a contractor.  I know I pay the yard guy who mows my lawn and trims the shrubs more than $600 per year.  But, since he is working for me at my personal residence, doing a job that is a personal expense for me, he does not get a 1099 from me.

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