guns in rental unit
los angeles, CA · Member since 2009 · 223 posts · 4 votes
guns in rental unit
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Investor · Redding, CA · Member since 2014 · 8 posts · 8 votes
11yA tenant with guns really shouldn't be an issue. The quality of the person is where you should be making your judgements. The the guy is military so obviously the government has trained him on how to use them. Guns aren't bad just the person behind them if they are used improperly.
83 Replies
- Jackson, TN · Member since 2014 · 15 posts · 1 vote11y
So, you have a trained, legal gun owner renting a room in your residence that could possibly provide protection should someone that illegally owns a firearm comes to do you or your property harm? Sounds like a "Thank You" is in order to me. But, don't take my word for it, I've only been involved in one personal defense shooting where someone that was unwelcomed forced their way into a home.
- Vail, AZ · Member since 2015 · 64 posts · 17 votes11y
@Alexander Felice just because a bar or any other place of business can ban guns from the establishment why would anyone want to ban an american from a constitutional right.... weather if your room mate or if your a mogul will hundreds of properties a tenants only responsibilities in my eyes are to pay rent on time and return the unit in as good a condition they got it in... political issues and personal beliefs aside if your are providing someone a home why would you want to cause a conflict with a tenant over personal beliefs.... a gun is tool just like a hammer and if i had a room mate who woke up at 3am and decided to murder me in my sleep i would hope he shoots me in the head instead of bashing me with a hammer a bunch of times.....
If your concerned about guns and other tools than maybe you should move to some european nanny state and pay 2 times the taxes 4 times for the cost of gas but hey you'll get free health care but you won't be able to get a job because they have strict work visa requirements and people out there don't hire illegals like we do here so take your pick... but if your going to live in this country and provide other people a place to live you shouldn't be limiting religious freedoms or rights to protect themselves or speak freely... and regardless of what you feel about the topic its BAD FOR BUSINESS and we are all here for advice in investing right? not about feeling safe at night because of whatever ill gotten fears may have been brainwashed into people these days
God Bless America
- Investor · Jasper GA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes11y
Stephen E.
When used they are intended to be fatal. Looking at this from a business standpoint, I would prefer that tenants in my properties not have lethal weapons at their disposal because they are inherently dangerous.
I shoot all the time and the only thing that has ever died is a deer, hog, turkey, or coyote. Of course the occasional can or paper target.
I guess you don't allow knives, hammers or bats.
- Rental Property Investor · New Martinsville, WV · Member since 2012 · 105 posts · 44 votes11y
I personally would not rent from a landlord that didn't allow me the opportunity to defend myself and family. These properties can become a target if it is known no guns allowed.
- Investor · Avilla, IN · Member since 2013 · 796 posts · 769 votes11y
wow.....just wow
Not to be an ******* but maybe you should run for congress or senate. This is the kind of useless crap they concern themselves with.
I'll trade you 4-5 of my tenants that cause real issues for this guy!
- Residential Real Estate Agent · San antonio, TX · Member since 2013 · 130 posts · 44 votes11y
Originally posted by @Brandon Hicks:
wow.....just wow
Not to be an ******* but maybe you should run for congress or senate. This is the kind of useless crap they concern themselves with.
I'll trade you 4-5 of my tenants that cause real issues for this guy!
The other posts by the OP are hilarious disasters. Landlord from hell. How do all the crazy people end up with all the money, while I stay broke!
- Investor · Kansas City, MO · Member since 2010 · 239 posts · 110 votes11y
Someone who is in the military and owns a gun, what is unique about that? If you rent to a chef who owns knives does this become a problem because there are knives in the house?
It's impossible to fully mitigate the possibility of crime and or bad things happening regardless the steps or processes a property owner takes. If I have a felon tenant who I knew possessed a gun then there is an issue. Most landlords don't rent to felons in the first place. If I have a military professional who I knew possessed a gun that seems like a normal occurrence I don't see what the problem or cause for concern is.
Banning guns from a rental unit for 1) doesn't eliminate the possibility of something bad happening and 2) would be virtually impossible to enforce.
I have a standardized rental application process. Whether or not a law abiding applicant chooses to use the 2nd Amendment right to bear arms has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not I will rent to them. Personally I care whether or not the person can established he or she pay the rent.
- Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes11y
Yes, I have guns too, I have had many tenants who owned firearms.
The only prohibition I know of as to firearms on a tenant's premises is under the Public Housing Authority, they are not allowed and such is federal property.
What can be done is to limit the amount of ammunition kept on premises, I restricted properties to 20 rounds, plenty for protection, yet not so much as to pose a public hazard in the event of fire, It is a hazardous material and I don't want .45 and 30.06 rounds going off during some blaze. I also required ammo cans or proper containers and weapons to be stored and locked according to our ordinances when the owner was not present.
Guess I'll hear it now from the NRA, sorry guys, guns are just fine, what goes bang are the bullets! :( or :) depending on your point of view.
- Real Estate Investor · Lansdowne, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 656 votes11y
Originally posted by @Sarah Jones:
I'm in los angeles california and i found out today one of my military tenant has 2 guns with him.... this is very scary for me... i still have 2 rooms to rent.. for the new people coming in can i put a clause in there for no guns?
I beg to differ as the tenants have a right to bear arms. So long as they are licensed to carry and aren't felons(which would revoke that license anyways) they have the 2nd Amendment on their side. Are you going to not rent to military personnel or other law enforcement personnel (which a very high percentage will have their service weapon(s) at home with them / their families)? Doubtful that you'd want to go down that road. A law abiding citizen has a right to carry concealed weapons per state law. To say none of your tenants have the right to protect themselves in this day and age is horrific and unconstitutional. Remember its those that aren't law abiding citizens that we all need to beware of because they'll have guns no matter what the law or your lease states. My coin.
Kudos,
Mary
- 11yJeff G.Pro MemberInvestor · Wethersfield, CT · Member since 2013 · 371 posts · 191 votes
You've inflamed some passions on this thread. I'd like to lend my perspective here in what I hope comes out as a constructive manner.
I'm genuinely curious as to what drives your fear in specific terms. Are you afraid of being sued because of use, misuse, or theft of the firearm? I'm not trying to be patronizing, I just don't understand.
Note to the Second Amendment crowd: the Bill of Rights protects the abridgment of your rights by the State--generally both the several states and at the Federal level. It's rarely of use when private entities are involved. Why? Because historically private entities could contract for just about anything including mutually agreed upon limitations of the free exercise of rights. (I'm not a lawyer, but I have a good grasp of history.)
As someone else pointed out you can put just about anything in a contract but its enforceability is another matter entirely.
If you're just trying to reduce the business risk arising from a lawsuit, just be sure to be properly ensured. There are two major things you can do here:
- Have a solid umbrella policy to on top of whatever other insurance you already have in place.
- Require your tenants to have renters insurance. Certain renters insurance policies will cover the landlord's money damages upwards of a certain dollar amount (e.g., $10,000) arising from some misconduct of the tenant.
Personally, I don't see a real increase in risk here. If you own several units someone else almost certainly has a firearm that you don't know about. There are a LOT of gun owners in this country. Before you go throwing a "no guns" clause in your lease (assuming it's both legal and somehow enforceable in your state) consider the opportunity cost of doing so. You're disqualifying about 37% of the population from renting from you and this could be reflected in your bottom line by increasing the turn-around time of empty units.
It would be presumptuous of me to tell you what to do, that's not my purpose. I'd just like you to see that this subject has multiple angles. In addition to a good lawyer, you may wish to have a conversation with an insurance agent as well.
- Residential Real Estate Agent · Rochester, MI · Member since 2012 · 152 posts · 52 votes11y
What is your concern with the weapons in the house? Maybe there is a round about way to cover that? (ie: him setting up a shooting range in the basement or something)
- Rental Property Investor · philadelphia, PA · Member since 2011 · 143 posts · 20 votes11y
Taking away the persons right to bear arms is definitely an uncomfortable feeling. If I were a renter, I wouldn't feel comfortable not having the ability to protect myself.
I don't understand why other landlords try to take a person's rights away.??? But it's the people with unlicensed weapons who you have to worry about. And if you're screening correctly then staying away from these types of people shouldn't be a problem.
- Contractor · Blackfoot, ID · Member since 2013 · 149 posts · 52 votes11y
I would assume that most military or prior military have guns in the future.
And I agree. You cant "bump him because he shares a different political view.
- Bedford, NH · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes11y
Originally posted by @Bill Gulley:
Yes, I have guns too, I have had many tenants who owned firearms.
The only prohibition I know of as to firearms on a tenant's premises is under the Public Housing Authority, they are not allowed and such is federal property.
What can be done is to limit the amount of ammunition kept on premises, I restricted properties to 20 rounds, plenty for protection, yet not so much as to pose a public hazard in the event of fire, It is a hazardous material and I don't want .45 and 30.06 rounds going off during some blaze. I also required ammo cans or proper containers and weapons to be stored and locked according to our ordinances when the owner was not present.
Guess I'll hear it now from the NRA, sorry guys, guns are just fine, what goes bang are the bullets! :( or :) depending on your point of view.
Wow Bill. I usually agree with you, but on one of these paragraphs you are simply behind the times, on the other wrong on he facts.
I suggest checking out the SF housing authority case. In a post-Heller world, it is going to be very, very difficult for publicly-owned housing to retain prohibitions on firearms.
As for the ammo point: long time vollie FF here. And ammo NOT contained within a firearm is virtually harmless. If it cooks off it makes a lot of bangs, but it is the gasses being captured and directed within the chamber and barrel that propels the bullet and makes it dangerous.
Personally much rather walk into a fire and find 10,000 boxed rounds than a loaded, single-shot rifle.
- Investor · Jasper GA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes11y
I wonder what your liability would be if you made your tenant give up their guns and as a result they were unable to defend their family in a home invasion and were harmed.
Would they have the right to sue you?
As far as guns being dangerous, I was at a gun show yesterday and saw thousands of guns and to my surprise not one gun jumped off a table and shot someone.
- Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes11y
Originally posted by @Richard C.:
Originally posted by @Bill Gulley:
Yes, I have guns too, I have had many tenants who owned firearms.
The only prohibition I know of as to firearms on a tenant's premises is under the Public Housing Authority, they are not allowed and such is federal property.
What can be done is to limit the amount of ammunition kept on premises, I restricted properties to 20 rounds, plenty for protection, yet not so much as to pose a public hazard in the event of fire, It is a hazardous material and I don't want .45 and 30.06 rounds going off during some blaze. I also required ammo cans or proper containers and weapons to be stored and locked according to our ordinances when the owner was not present.
Guess I'll hear it now from the NRA, sorry guys, guns are just fine, what goes bang are the bullets! :( or :) depending on your point of view.
Wow Bill. I usually agree with you, but on one of these paragraphs you are simply behind the times, on the other wrong on he facts.
I suggest checking out the SF housing authority case. In a post-Heller world, it is going to be very, very difficult for publicly-owned housing to retain prohibitions on firearms.
As for the ammo point: long time vollie FF here. And ammo NOT contained within a firearm is virtually harmless. If it cooks off it makes a lot of bangs, but it is the gasses being captured and directed within the chamber and barrel that propels the bullet and makes it dangerous.
Personally much rather walk into a fire and find 10,000 boxed rounds than a loaded, single-shot rifle.
Don't know what a post-Heller world is. Can't have firearms in a PHA to my knowledge can't have them in a federal court house either and it's publically owned.
Rounds explode when they cook off, there is no telling where the projectile goes because it isn't in a barrel. I got my gun and weapons training in the Army, fired everything the Army had and some we didn't have. Why would it be they don't want smoking in an ammo dump? As I said, you can limit the ammo, ask the fire department if they consider 10,000 rounds a danger.
One of the reasons I have guns is because there are nuts with guns. LOL
- Bedford, NH · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes11y
You know how you are always telling people (quite correctly) that if they are not familiar with current law on a subject (like owner financing) they should refrain from giving advice? If you don't know what Heller is, you really ought not be making blanket statements about firearms on public property. Sorry, not meaning to be harsh. Just the way it is.
And I stand by my position that I would rather be in a fire with thousands of box rounds than one in a firearm. I have personally been in both positions as a firefighter, and it isn't even a close call which is more dangerous.
- San Jose, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes11y
Originally posted by @Bob B.:
I wonder what your liability would be if you made your tenant give up their guns and as a result they were unable to defend their family in a home invasion and were harmed.
Would they have the right to sue you?
As far as guns being dangerous, I was at a gun show yesterday and saw thousands of guns and to my surprise not one gun jumped off a table and shot someone.
Of course, it can go the other way, too. If the LL knowingly allowed guns to be on the property, and someone was hurt because of those guns, the LL could be held liable for gross negligence.
In CA, a LL is free to ban guns on their property, but it must be in the lease:
http://www.starrpm.com/landlords_prohibit_guns.htm...
There is nothing in law that says you can't prohibit guns on your property. But, the PM company above states that this is a contractual right - so it must be in the lease. You have no right to demand they get rid of a gun - if it's not in your contract - if they otherwise have the gun legally.
The site also states that you can't really enforce this, as people will just hide them.
In my opinion, this clause would be worth putting into your leases, just to CYA in case someone gets hurt with the gun on your property.
- Investor · Jasper GA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes11y
Sue:
If the LL knowingly allowed guns to be on the property, and someone was hurt because of those guns, the LL could be held liable for gross negligence.
I had no idea that a LL could be held liable if someone is hurt because they allowed a abiding citizen to have a gun. What if someone is hurt with a knife, bat or shovel?
I'm not a lawyer and if this is the case I might need to make some changes to my lease.
Can you reference where this has happened to a landlord or motel owner or such?
- Bedford, NH · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes11y
Originally posted by @Bill Gulley:
Originally posted by @Richard C.:
Originally posted by @Bill Gulley:
Yes, I have guns too, I have had many tenants who owned firearms.
The only prohibition I know of as to firearms on a tenant's premises is under the Public Housing Authority, they are not allowed and such is federal property.
What can be done is to limit the amount of ammunition kept on premises, I restricted properties to 20 rounds, plenty for protection, yet not so much as to pose a public hazard in the event of fire, It is a hazardous material and I don't want .45 and 30.06 rounds going off during some blaze. I also required ammo cans or proper containers and weapons to be stored and locked according to our ordinances when the owner was not present.
Guess I'll hear it now from the NRA, sorry guys, guns are just fine, what goes bang are the bullets! :( or :) depending on your point of view.
Wow Bill. I usually agree with you, but on one of these paragraphs you are simply behind the times, on the other wrong on he facts.
I suggest checking out the SF housing authority case. In a post-Heller world, it is going to be very, very difficult for publicly-owned housing to retain prohibitions on firearms.
As for the ammo point: long time vollie FF here. And ammo NOT contained within a firearm is virtually harmless. If it cooks off it makes a lot of bangs, but it is the gasses being captured and directed within the chamber and barrel that propels the bullet and makes it dangerous.
Personally much rather walk into a fire and find 10,000 boxed rounds than a loaded, single-shot rifle.
Don't know what a post-Heller world is. Can't have firearms in a PHA to my knowledge can't have them in a federal court house either and it's publically owned.
Rounds explode when they cook off, there is no telling where the projectile goes because it isn't in a barrel. I got my gun and weapons training in the Army, fired everything the Army had and some we didn't have. Why would it be they don't want smoking in an ammo dump? As I said, you can limit the ammo, ask the fire department if they consider 10,000 rounds a danger.
One of the reasons I have guns is because there are nuts with guns. LOL
As an example (one which does not even rely on Heller) see the link. I suggest that you pay particularly close attention to the final paragraph. Also note that this was a unanimous decision of a very "blue" state Supreme Court.
http://www.delawareonline.com/story/news/crime/201...
See Also, San Francisco Housing Authority:
http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Housing-Auth...
See Also this review article:
http://scholarship.law.stjohns.edu/cgi/viewcontent...
...paying particular attention, perhaps, to this:
"Nonetheless, banning legal firearm possession in public housing enables government interference with otherwise legal gun ownership, strips residents of an important means of self-defense, and very likely
- Bedford, NH · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes11y
Exactly, Mr. Martin, thank you. Bill, skip forward to about 12:40 of the video. Unless of course you don't want any of your preconceptions challenged. That was 28,000 rounds.
Or skip to about 18:00, where 120,000 rounds are cooked off.
- 11yCurtis BidwellPro MemberRental Property Investor · Olympia, WA · Member since 2014 · 777 posts · 744 votes
How timely! Yesterday I was swapping out a dishwasher for a coupe nice college girls when I happened to look over at the desk in the living room. There it was!
To be fair, it ended up just being an airsoft rifle, and I got to take shot off into the woods! Reminded them they couldn't hunt squirrels or birds on the premises (didn't mention the neighbors obnoxious dog...) ;)
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