Landlord Won't Return Deposit San Diego, CA

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Landlord Won't Return Deposit San Diego, CA

Chase Cline
Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes

We rented a vacation rental property in the Ocean Beach neighborhood of San Diego from 1/16/16 - 4/16/16. We paid a $2,500 deposit and $2,500/month for a total of $10,000. Upon departure, we went through a walk-through with the property manager (who even recorded this walk-through on his GoPro) and he said without hesitation that the place looked great and we should be getting our full deposit back. I have sent probably 30 communication attempts in the past few months and haven't heard anything from the owner of the property who handles the money. I know this owner is getting these messages because when we were first inquiring on the property he was very responsive. Obviously the 21 day limit to return out deposit is up by now and I have sent 4 separate letters using Certified Mail requesting our deposit back to every address I could find for this guy/company. The only thing left for us to do is move forward with a lawsuit in small claims court. So my question is, if we move forward in small claims everything I have read states that we will likely be getting double our deposit amount back for a "bad faith" penalty. Is this accurate? If so, would our initial claim be for $5k or for our original deposit amount if $2,500 and the judge will double it? Surprisingly enough, the property manager has still been in contact with me and apparently is really sick of this owner not refunding people's deposits and has even told me to drag him through the court system to teach him a lesson. He also stated that he has only seen this guy refund ONE deposit since they started renting back in 2015. I looked this company up in the city records and there have been multiple lawsuits against them and there is already a current lawsuit for the exact same issue from a couple that rented one of the other units on the property while we were there. How can he get away with this over and over? Public Service Announcement: DO NOT RENT FROM LIGHTHOUSE RESIDENTIAL, LLC OR YOU WILL NOT GET YOUR DEPOSIT BACK. The property manager says there have been at least 10 people with the same issue. The properties are at 5063 Long Branch Ave and 5065 Long Branch Ave. San Diego, CA 92107. SAVE YOURSELF THE HASSLE AND DO NOT RENT FROM THESE GUYS!

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Brandon L.
Real Estate Agent · Falls Church · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
10y

@Chase Cline have you retained an attorney? these seem like questions that are best fit for an attorney representing you. 

My advice would be to send a demand/intent to sue letter certified/return receipt requested, then speak with a lawyer about the merits of the case.

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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    Adding on even more here..... The other couple I mentioned above did a lot of digging when they started their lawsuit and apparently the property is only permitted for 2 rentals and they have been renting 3 and 4 units out of it.  According to this couple, their lawyer says we are all due all rents paid since we were renting an illegally subdivided property.  The term is "Rental Abatement."  Is this true?  Can we really get all $10k of our money back?  

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  • Brandon L.
    Real Estate Agent · Falls Church · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    @Chase Cline have you retained an attorney? these seem like questions that are best fit for an attorney representing you. 

    My advice would be to send a demand/intent to sue letter certified/return receipt requested, then speak with a lawyer about the merits of the case.

    2Reply
  • Justin R.
    Developer · San Diego, CA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    I'd be shocked if you'd legally be able to get all $10k worth of rents back - the two issues (not receiving your deposit back and whether the property strictly follows municipal code) are separate issues.  What you're concerned with here is the contractual breach.

    That said, I know jack squat about this particular situation, so any advice I give beyond that wouldn't be useful.  :)

    1Reply
  • Chanelle Carlin
    Okanogan, WA · Member since 2016 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    10y

    @Chase Cline - I agree with Brandon. This seems like a matter to discuss with an attorney. If you're note sure about the type of attorney to contact, reach out to the County Bar Association in San Diego. They'll be able to give you a list of members who specialize in these matters. It's best not to act on the Property Manager's opinion or the actions of previous tenants.

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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @Brandon L. we have not retained an attorney.  The other couple I mentioned got an attorney and said they wish they wouldn't have and that we can easily go through the process ourselves with their help since they have already been through it.  They are giving us all of the information that their lawyer tells them so that's fortunate to have. And I have already sent 4 separate Certified Mail letters saying that they have "X" days to return the deposit or we will pursue in small claims.  Those due dates have past now.....

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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @Justin R. I think it sounds too good to be true myself, but this other couple is hearing it directly from their lawyer.  So we are trying to decide if we should just go for out deposit and hope the judge doubles it for "bad faith" or go ahead and go for the full $10k that small claims allows.  I see you are located in San Diego.  DO NOT get involved with Jesse Thomas or Lighthouse Residential or Lighthouse Construction.  The guy and the companies are complete frauds and according to the city records have had lawsuits after lawsuits.

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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @Chanelle Carlin we don't want to consult a lawyer and go to small claims as it only allows up to $10k in small claims, including damages.  If we go after the full $10k then we would have to come out of pocket for all lawyer fees.  I'm not really acting on the previous tenants case, but with that being said their case is exactly the same  and we will have the exact same documents (except for names and dates) and they have a lawyer so any documents their lawyer tells them they need we will need as well.  We have a good relationship with those tenants so why not take advantage that they are farther down the process than we are?  

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  • Chanelle Carlin
    Okanogan, WA · Member since 2016 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    10y

    @Chase Cline - it sounds like you have made your decision and I can completely understand not wanting to have pay legal fees if not necessary. Just as an FYI - many attorneys offer free consultations, which gives you the benefit of having someone with local legal knowledge and experience as well as personal relationships with the judges (not just experience with the process) look at your case.  I'm really sorry that you've had such a bad experience and hope you're able to resolve it soon...thanks for the heads up on the company putting you through this.

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  • Rick S.
    Fort Collins, CO · Member since 2014 · 397 posts · 161 votes
    10y

    @Chase Cline how did you pay the deposit, by check, credit card, etc.?  

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  • Julien Plouffe
    Investor · Miami, FL · Member since 2015 · 23 posts · 10 votes
    10y
    Chase Cline hopefully he paid by credit card and can initiate a chargeback
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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @Rick S. the initial $2,500 deposit was paid via Venmo, the company's name is the Venmo account's name.  The rest of the $7.5k for rent was paid via cashiers check upon arrival.  We can clearly show records of the transactions and who they went to.

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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    I originally contacted the owner through an AirBnb listing, I should have known when they tried to take the transaction offline that something was going to happen.  Now I know why

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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @Julien Plouffe I have never heard of a Chargeback before.  I actually just looked up Venmo's User Agreement and they mention a chargeback so hopefully it's possible.  I'm assuming I would have to wait for a court decision before attempting that though?

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  • Rick S.
    Fort Collins, CO · Member since 2014 · 397 posts · 161 votes
    10y

    Thanks @Chase Cline as I was thinking you could initiate a chargeback if paid by credit card like @Julien Plouffe also mentioned.  Venmo is doing an ACH, most likely, so you would typically only have 60 days from the time it appeared on your statement to request a reversal through your bank as unauthorized so that won't be an option unfortunately.  Sorry, I was hoping there was some way to reverse the payments if paid by card.  

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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @Rick S. Oh I gotcha.  Yea we paid everything up front almost 6 months ago now.  Was hoping maybe there was some outside chance someone had an idea before we officially served the papers.  Was really hoping to avoid going to court as I know that is a huge headache, but it looks like we don't really have any other options.  

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  • James K.
    San Diego, CA · Member since 2014 · 48 posts · 22 votes
    10y
    I once took a land lord to small claims here in San Diego for the same issue. I was only awarded the deposit amount. I still haven't seen it.
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  • Sam Shueh
    Real Estate Agent · Cupertino, CA · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    I think your initial $10K is a typo.  Tell the property manager why they did not check out the owner credit and did he misreprent you? Can they refund a portion of his management fee?  I will talk to a legal guy,,,,,

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  • Kimberly H.
    Residential Real Estate Broker · Chicago Suburbs, IL · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 594 votes
    10y

    What are the online reviews for this guy? If this is happening all over how are there not bad reviews? Or is there some "if you write a negative review you owe me $XX" clause in your lease with him?

    1Reply
  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @James K. that's what I'm afraid of. That's why I've done everything I can to avoid that but I have no other options. 

    @Sam Shueh thanks. The property manager is part of the company as well. It's all under the same company. When I talked to the property manager last he said he is sick of seeing his boss treat people like this and encouraged me to drag him through the court system. Its a very strange situation. Would really just like to know if I do, in fact, have an opportunity to pursue all paid rents ($10k) due to the property being illegally subdivided (which another couple in the same situation said their lawyer says we do). Or if I can only pursue deposit plus bad faith to equal $5k.

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  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @Kimberly H. when I first contacted through AirBnb they took the transaction offline "to avoid fees and save us all money." Now I know why they do that. If they went through Airbnb they would be bashed hard. I found out today via city records that another lawsuit against the company has been filed so there are currently two active plus ours which will be active next week.

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  • Kimberly H.
    Residential Real Estate Broker · Chicago Suburbs, IL · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 594 votes
    10y

    @Chase Cline Can you contact AirBnB and let them know that this person is advertising on the site, and then moving things offline so AirBnb doesn't get paid? I'm sure that's a violation of AirBnb terms. Or leverage that if it is...ask AirBnb if that is what they would do without telling them who it is...and then tell this landlord that if you don't get your deposit back by X date, you are going to fill AirBnb in on the scam this landlord is doing to scam AirBnb out of their cut.  

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  • Account Closed
    San Jose, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Chase Cline:

    @Kimberly H. when I first contacted through AirBnb they took the transaction offline "to avoid fees and save us all money." Now I know why they do that. If they went through Airbnb they would be bashed hard. I found out today via city records that another lawsuit against the company has been filed so there are currently two active plus ours which will be active next week.

     Can you look into combining your lawsuit with the other tenants?  One lawsuit, multiple tenants?

    And, you should be suing the property manager, too.  This is someone who knew the owner intended to rip tenants off, and did nothing about it.  They are also liable, in my opinion.

    Suing in civil court would get you more satisfaction, in my opinion.  The guy will have to hire an attorney.  And you won't have to show up.

    And yes, if the rental was an illegal unit, then the contract was illegal.  So, you could probably get your money back. But, the judge may decide that you did get some value out of renting the place.  But, in theory, you are not liable to perform under an illegal contract.  And if it was illegal to contract with you for that unit, then you have an illegal contract.

    I'd talk to an attorney about representing the other tenants. And they could also subpoena the landlord for the names and deposits withheld of any other previous tenants.

    And as to your question about why he does this and why does he get away with it? Because he's renting to people who don't want to have to travel back to San Diego to sue him or hire a lawyer to do so.  But, proving that he deals in bad faith should not be a problem, so you could get back, in theory, all of your rent, and twice your deposit back.  But, then of course, you have to pay your lawyer.

    See if you can find a lawyer who would be willing to represent all of the tenants, and whether or not that would be more affordable for all of you.  Good luck.

    Here's the CA Bar lawyer referral page:

    http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Public/LawyerReferralServ...

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  • Justin S.
    Investor · Jackson, OH · Member since 2014 · 64 posts · 20 votes
    10y

    Retain counsel. Any person who represents himself has a fool for a client. 

    Good luck. I hope you are able to recover your deposit and all other damages available. I'm not familiar with California law. However, there are many states that offer up to treble damages in the event of fraud or bad faith. But, generally, there are specific requirements of pleading if you are alleging fraud and/or bad faith. If nothing else, spend the money to have a consult. 

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  • Account Closed
    Investor · LOUISVILLE, KY · Member since 2013 · 299 posts · 137 votes
    10y

    Following this one.

    On the judgment recovery,  you don't automatically get a check.  You have to pursue.  Google "how to recover a judgment" if you don't know how.  Much of the process is state-specific.  Even more specific on the county level (sometimes).

    Cool thing is, you can attach ALL his assets immediately upon winning.  Have the sherriff seize his vehicles.  Garnish his wages.  File on his house.  He won't be able to do anything until he takes care of it.  Don't do it piecemeal.   Rain hell fire down on him all at once.  I HATE bullies.  When they get a taste of their own medicine, they start to understand.

    Make certain you do interrogatories during the case.  You want to know everything about this d****e-wad in order to pursue.

    1Reply
  • Chase Cline
    OP
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX-Texas · Member since 2015 · 81 posts · 56 votes
    10y

    @Account Closed I appreciate the enthusiasm! It pisses me off to no end as well. I just don't understand and you can do this to people and think you can get away with it. I have looked into collecting a judgement in that area and will go all out upon judgement. 

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