Shelf Ripped Out of Wall

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Shelf Ripped Out of Wall

Art M.
Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 414 posts · 94 votes

The duplex I bought was a gut rehab with no shelving, so I installed it myself. The upstairs unit has a walk-in closet and I put a long shelf with a hanger bar on the two long sides and short shelves on the third size. I mounted them using those triangle brackets from Home Depot with 3 50lb anchors per bracket and 3 brackets per long shelf. All the shelves I did in both units are holding, but the one on my wife’s side was collapsed when we got home yesterday.

She has the side the door opens into. I hadn’t noticed this, but she had all of her million stupid little dresses on the stupid little velvet hangers all hanging on one side because she didn’t want the door to touch them for some reason. Better this happen with us than with a tenant when we move on though.

So I’m thinking I need to patch those holes and mount a shorter shelf so the door can open into the wall and not the shelf. Is it more difficult to patch holes this size? I patched and painted over some smaller stud holes and it looks decent, but these are a few inches in diameter. Was this preventable in how I mounted it (did I use the wrong size anchors or should I have used more brackets?) or did I go wrong in mounting a long shelf that the door would open into?

If I hire a contractor to do this, how much would it cost? I’m having an internal debate between continuing to try to do things myself versus hiring a contractor. I eventually want to own more properties and I don’t want to be a professional handyman. But at this point in time, my time isn’t worth that much money. But I also don’t have much time and could be studying for the broker exam or doing a million other things too. If I do it myself, I learn how to do things myself. If I hire a contractor, I become more experienced in dealing with contractors and it’ll probably be done better…

Before: http://tinypic.com/r/razx4j/9

After: http://tinypic.com/r/2e5o6d2/9

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Thomas S.
Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
9y

You need to hire a contractor.

5Reply
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  • James Mc Ree
    Rental Property Investor · Malvern, PA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 936 votes
    9y

    Be sure you anchor the shelf into studs and not just sheetrock.  Sheetrock won't hold weight.  You shouldn't have a problem with the shelf if it is mounted on studs and the supports extend out to near the end of the shelf (far side from wall).  You might want to have several supports if it is a long shelf.

    Holes of a few inches are easy to patch and paint.  You can get a kit to do so at your local HD or Lowes.

    I couldn't open the links due to my employer's security.

    Jim.

    4Reply
  • Thomas S.
    Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    9y

    Shelving brackets must be anchored on wall studs. Dry wall is not strong enough to support any weight regardless of the type of anchors used.

    As for repair, dry wall is very simple to repair, go on line and watch a few videos. There is nothing that can not be learned on line the only question is in regards to whether you want to learn or pay for someone else's skills.

    2Reply
  • Art M.
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 414 posts · 94 votes
    9y

    I did use studs. I used 50lb studs. Should I use the 75lb ones?

    0Reply
  • Dan Mann
    Spokane, WA · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 9 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Art M.:

    I did use studs. I used 50lb studs. Should I use the 75lb ones?

     When they are refering to studs they are referring to the material the sheetrock is mounted to.  Saying a stud is 50lbs implies something else, studs are 2x4 or 2x6 and run from the floor to the ceiling and are usually 16 to 24 inch on center.  

    There are "stud finders" which will detect where the stud is behind the sheet rock.  If you poke a hole in the sheet rock you missed the stud, if you poke a hole and hit wood then that is the stud.

    Hope this helps.

    2Reply
  • Ryan Dossey
    Real Estate Broker · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    You can typically "knock" on the wall and hear where the studs are if you don't have a stud finder. 

    2Reply
  • Thomas S.
    Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    9y

    You need to hire a contractor.

    5Reply
  • Patrick L.
    Real Estate Investor · Saint Petersburg, FL · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 951 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Art M.:

    I did use studs. I used 50lb studs. Should I use the 75lb ones?

     Those are anchors, you need to screw into WOOD.   Those anchors aren't meant to hold up entire shelves of clothing.    If there isn't a stud in the middle where you need to attach the rod then run a piece of wood across and screw that into studs and attach the rod to the wood.  Drywall isn't going to hold a rack of clothes or a shelf full of stuff, it will always pull out eventually. 

    3Reply
  • Michael Fischbach
    Investor · North Augusta, SC · Member since 2016 · 43 posts · 20 votes
    9y

    Actually the wholes are easy to fix in a very short amount of time and if you use what I suggest you can repair and paint it on the same day!  Prep the area of the wholes in the drywall by removing the pulled out material and then do a quick sandpapering of the area and blow the wholes clean of anything loose.  Never ever use Spackle on holes!  Depending where you shop for paints and materials you should be able to find "Fast Set Drywall Patch"  I use Fast Set 20!  Depending on the size of the hole, there are things that are best to do.  From what I see from your pictures Id use mesh tape and fast set!  Now, the reason to use fast set is it dries completely within 20 - 30 minutes depending on what you use and it doesn't shrink and crack like Spackle does.  Prepping, repairing, drying, sanding and painting shouldn't take more than 2-3 hours which allows for a second application if you think you need to!  Second when you re-mount the shelves find the studs and mount your brackets there.  I never use anchor bolts!  Hope this helps you!

    2Reply
  • Art M.
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 414 posts · 94 votes
    9y

    @Dan Mann @Ryan Dossey So what's the point of those plastic anchors that come with screws then? When I by chance try to screw an anchor into a stud, the anchor breaks and I just use the screw on its own.

    0Reply
  • Michael Fischbach
    Investor · North Augusta, SC · Member since 2016 · 43 posts · 20 votes
    9y

    @Thomas S.   Why would you have a contractor come in and do something like that?  That's just throwing money out the window especially if like him he has the time!  The materials for that fix are like $10-12!  A contractor isn't going to come in and do it for less than $50 and probably double or triple that 

    0Reply
  • Tyler Ansell
    Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2015 · 293 posts · 175 votes
    9y

    The plastic anchors are drywall anchors to be used if a stud cannot be hit. However, if this is a big time shelf for clothes and such I would 100% find and hit the studs, no question. 

    0Reply
  • Michael Fischbach
    Investor · North Augusta, SC · Member since 2016 · 43 posts · 20 votes
    9y

    @Art M.  Use Easy anchor screws in wood studs to hold the brackets!

    0Reply
  • Michael Fischbach
    Investor · North Augusta, SC · Member since 2016 · 43 posts · 20 votes
    9y

    https://www.lowes.com/pd/E-Z-Ancor-4-Pack-1-25-in-x-0-375-in-Self-Drilling-Zinc-Alloy-Zinc-Light-Duty-Standard-Drywall-Anchors-with-Screws/3091563?cm_mmc=SCE_PLA-_-ToolsAndHardware-_-HollowWallAnchors-_-3091563:E-Z_Ancor&CAWELAID=&kpid=3091563&CAGPSPN=pla&store_code=2207&k_clickID=e1433c2f-3121-4321-a1b0-3b908b5a1a79

    0Reply
  • Art M.
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 414 posts · 94 votes
    9y

    OK, so lesson learned with the anchors. I understand those are for hanging smaller stuff on drywall now. If I mount on studs though, the brackets won't be evenly spaced. I'll have to put the brackets wherever the studs happen to be. Is that normal? How do other people do it when you see a closet and the brackets are evenly spaced?

    0Reply
  • Patrick L.
    Real Estate Investor · Saint Petersburg, FL · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 951 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Art M.:

    @Dan Mann @Ryan Dossey So what's the point of those plastic anchors that come with screws then? When I by chance try to screw an anchor into a stud, the anchor breaks and I just use the screw on its own.

     They're for hanging pictures, mirrors, decorative shelves, etc when you can't hit a stud.  They're not going to take the abuse/weight of a closet system.....even if they hold the drywall won't.   

    1Reply
  • Art M.
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 414 posts · 94 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Michael Fischbach:

    https://www.lowes.com/pd/E-Z-Ancor-4-Pack-1-25-in-x-0-375-in-Self-Drilling-Zinc-Alloy-Zinc-Light-Duty-Standard-Drywall-Anchors-with-Screws/3091563?cm_mmc=SCE_PLA-_-ToolsAndHardware-_-HollowWallAnchors-_-3091563:E-Z_Ancor&CAWELAID=&kpid=3091563&CAGPSPN=pla&store_code=2207&k_clickID=e1433c2f-3121-4321-a1b0-3b908b5a1a79

     So I would drill the metal anchor into the stud and then screw the metal screw right into the metal anchor? Metal into metal? That's a thing?

    0Reply
  • Dumitru Anton
    Cumming, GA · Member since 2014 · 218 posts · 71 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Art M.:

    @Dan Mann @Ryan Dossey So what's the point of those plastic anchors that come with screws then? When I by chance try to screw an anchor into a stud, the anchor breaks and I just use the screw on its own.

     @Art Maydan,

    i would take a box of donuts and couple coffees to your local home depot/lowes/menards/ace hardware. and talk with the guy in hardware department. and seeing you don't know about studs, to the guy in lumber too. you really need a bit of education on construction side....(don't worry, nobody was born knowing all)

    if you try to drill/punch in the walls to find the studs, remember you may have pipes(water/sewer) and live electrical wires!!! so use a studs detector (they are ones that warn you of electrical thingies in the walls)

    i had to install the same setup: i hit 2 studs for the small shelf, and 3 studs for the long ones (if you use corners, you hit the 4th too)

    i also used wire shelfs for the clothes to be aired. (had seen situations where the wood/laminate shelfs will transfer strange smells to the clothes)

    0Reply
  • Dumitru Anton
    Cumming, GA · Member since 2014 · 218 posts · 71 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Art M.:
    Originally posted by @Michael Fischbach:

    https://www.lowes.com/pd/E-Z-Ancor-4-Pack-1-25-in-...

     So I would drill the metal anchor into the stud and then screw the metal screw right into the metal anchor? Metal into metal? That's a thing?

     @Art Maydan,

    you would drill a pilot whole, use a BIG screwdriver to drive the metal anchor flush with the wall (drywall + portion of the stud) (pray you hit the stud on center and NOT AT AN ANGLE), dump the screw that came with the anchor, buy a longer screw of same type+size, drive the longer screw trough the shelf bracket, trough the anchor, hear a snap sound, continue driving into the stud 'till done.

    pat your self on the back. now you have the rest of at least 2 per bracket...

    or you can use a bolt (pat your self on the back. now you have the rest of at least 2 per bracket...)

    please use a level!

    1Reply
  • Thomas S.
    Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    9y
    @Michael Fischbach

    He does not seem to know the difference between a wall anchor and a wall stud. I suspect he is over his head regarding any sort of building or renovation work and would be better served paying someone that can do it right.

    If he wants to learn that is fine but if not he needs professional help.

    2Reply
  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    9y

    Yup, to most everything in this thread:

    • If you don't know what a stud is, you should do some research before proceeding any further;
    • Once you know what a stud is, you attach the shelf brackets directly to the stud. You don't use any kind of wall anchor, that is for hollow walls and light weight;
    • Stud finders are notoriously inaccurate; knock on the wall to find the studs or start from the corner and measure 16" out and 24" out and look for studs at those locations, they should be close. Once you find one, measure 16 or 24 from that one to find the next one. 16" is most common but some cheapos go 2 feet on center;
    • If you have metal studs you'll need to drill pilot holes first or use a self-tapping screw. 
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    0Reply
  • Dumitru Anton
    Cumming, GA · Member since 2014 · 218 posts · 71 votes
    9y

    @Art M.,

    one thought after looking at the pictures:

    you move your things on the door opening side (right) (do you have any long coats?-send them all the way BAAAACK)

    and

    your wife moves her things to the left

    0Reply
  • Dumitru Anton
    Cumming, GA · Member since 2014 · 218 posts · 71 votes
    9y

    I would like to give and example to that:

    bathroom wall: wall suspended Ikea vanity:

    after 1/2 year of kids use and not much load the wall and vanity is bowing.

    why: the studs where installed on the large side (||||=4) and not (||=2) as a housing/box to building's sewer and water piping. no bracing on the impromptu box (yay to '80's construction)

    imagine what happens when your stud finder finds the main sewer as a stud.....

    hint: is smelly and desintegrates drywall.... some wood too

    1Reply
  • Jesse M.
    Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 60 posts · 45 votes
    9y

    Haha, geez man no wonder you wanted your tenant to install his own tv bracket. I disagree with some people here; I think it's fine to not hit studs if you use the correct anchor and be mindful of the physics. Something like the EZAncor is overkill (and you won't ever get these out of the wall) but they will hold a lot of weight.

    However for your specific installation, yes you should hit studs. I personally like using the Closet Maid system because they distribute weight load very well (along the entire length of the wall) and they are modular. Yeah, the white wire isn't beautiful but my closet is FULLY loaded, top to bottom, with mine and my lady's clothes and there are zero issues. Utility vs beauty I guess.

    If I were you, I wouldn't get a contractor for this. This is good knowledge to have so try to figure it out yourself. Besides, it's your closet, not a tenant's, so you have time to fool around.

    1Reply
  • Michael Karl
    Williamsville, NY · Member since 2015 · 80 posts · 34 votes
    9y

    @Art M. there is a lot of good advise on here for you to choose from, I do agree that you need to find someone that can help you get a little more familiar with construction and building materials.   I have a question regarding the "after" picture who is the paper on the front of the drywall ripped so much and why are the holes so big if you just used the anchors that came with the shelving brackets.  it seems like something else went wrong when that shelf fell.  You also mentioned that this is a duplex, I am assuming you are living in one side and renting the other?  if this is the case you should go over to the other unit and remove the shelving until you can properly install them, the last thing you want is something to fall on a tenant and you end up with an injury.

    0Reply
  • David Dachtera
    Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    @Art M.,

    That Easy Anchor thing looks like a variation on a "molly".

    Anyway, what you want to look at is called a "toggle bolt". It's a screw with a wing-shaped piece which has a spring to "spread the wings" when you stick it through a hole you drill into the drywall. It holds fairly strong - clothes, etc. shouldn't break it. 

    It's a one-time use thing, obviously, because when you unscrew it, the "wings" fall down inside the wall and that's where they stay.

    Yes - talk to the guys/gals at Home Depot or where ever.

    0Reply
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