Housing Authority not paying their portion of rent on time.
Real Estate Agent · Milford, ME · Member since 2016 · 12 posts · 3 votes
Housing Authority not paying their portion of rent on time.
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Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes
9yI'd treat the situation just like I would if the tenant did not pay. The housing voucher is a form of payment from the tenant. They fix it or they are a non paying tenant.
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24 Replies
- 9yPatti RobertsonBusiness MemberProperty Manager · Virginia Beach, VA · Member since 2016 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
This can be so frustrating, but if you charge a late fee the tenant will be responsible, not the housing authority. My guess based on experience is there is some paperwork missing. Have them mailed you the HAP agreement to sign and return? That's your official contract with HUD. If not, that's what's holding it up. Have you spoken to the caseworker? If you aren't getting answers there, find out who the director is and get him/her on the phone or send an e-mail. Have you provided a copy of the signed lease? That's usually the last step to getting your payment. This isn't normal. Generally you should get a deposit within 30 days of finalizing the paperwork.
The good news is you will eventually get the income. Good luck!!!
- Real Estate Agent · Milford, ME · Member since 2016 · 12 posts · 3 votes9y
I have signed the HUD contract and they have a copy of the lease. Instead of calling, I have just gone into the office personally so there is no confusion. I've tried to get in touch with the manager there but she's always on lunch or vacation or something that isn't in the office. Is there a way to hold them responsible and not punish the tenant for it? This has caused late fees for my bills and I would charge the tenant late fees in any other situation.
- Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes9y
I'd treat the situation just like I would if the tenant did not pay. The housing voucher is a form of payment from the tenant. They fix it or they are a non paying tenant.
District Invest Group545 Reviews - 9yPatti RobertsonBusiness MemberProperty Manager · Virginia Beach, VA · Member since 2016 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
What date did you return the HAP agreement? The housing offices pay on the 1st and the 15th. The tenant is responsible for their portion of the rent, but the processing of your paperwork is out of the tenant's control. IMHO it would be unreasonable to hold them accountable for a delay related to your paperwork. Is the 60 days you mentioned from the date you turned in the RFTA or the HAP?
- Investor · Vancouver, WA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes9y
The Section 8 Housing Voucher Program is a federal program administered by local housing authorities or other government offices. Unfortunately, local administrators of the program can vary greatly in how well they serve their clients and vendors.
Since you have a signed contract with the housing authority, that should be binding. I assume you have a local contact name and number too. I would attempt contact with them again in person and by writing a letter that clearly states the problem and asks for immediate resolution. I would also double check that the HA has the correct information for direct deposit (if that is what they do) or for mailing the check (if that is what they do).
In most cases, a Section 8 program participant will have a case manager (may be by another title). That is the person you need to contact. If you don't know the name of that person, check your paperwork or ask the tenant... they will know. As with all tenancies, if the rent is not paid when it is due, the tenant is at risk of losing their housing. I would issue a Pay Rent or Quit notice to the tenant and provide a copy to the Housing Authority case manager. I would not charge a late fee at this point if the tenant has been cooperative. But if I did, I would consider waiving it once the situation is resolved. Remember, your rental agreement is with the tenant, not the HA.
Once this is resolved, it is highly likely that all monies due to you will be paid retroactively and you will be made whole. It's always important to keep calm and to maintain sufficient reserves. Good luck!
- Real Estate Agent · Milford, ME · Member since 2016 · 12 posts · 3 votes9y
I signed the HAP contract around November 6th so it has been almost two months. I have checked in with the office weekly to make sure all information was accurate and there was nothing else needed on my end. I am going to serve a pay rent or quit form today and let the tenant know that this needs to be resolved immediately with their case manager.
Treating the tenant the same as any other is the only way you can operate your business. When a tenant does not pay on time, section 8 or otherwise, it does not matter to the landlord where the money is coming from you must immediately serve that tenant with a pay or quit. You are not punishing your tenant you are operating a business.
In your case if you do not get paid and the tenant decides to leave you will never get paid. In the future to protect yourself when the government is late you need to serve the tenant because you do not know why you are not getting paid. The paper work is only to protect you and can be withdrawn at any time.
- 9yLevi T.Pro MemberRental Property Investor · Tucson AZ / Nice FR / Washington DC · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
I'd treat the situation just like I would if the tenant did not pay. The housing voucher is a form of payment from the tenant. They fix it or they are a non paying tenant.
Russell is 100%. Your contract is with the tenant, and the housing authority is only supplanting the tenants income in part or full, you can't charge the anything to the housing authority. Best you can do is start the eviction process, maybe that will spur the caseworker once a court order comes down the line to the tenant.
It's been a while, but if I remember right if a section 8 tenant gets evicted, they lose the voucher program for 3 or 5 years, likely create a lot of internal issues for the case worker. In my experience case workers have a high turnover rate, so you may just need to take a trip down to the office and explain to them that your going to evict a tenant for non-payment on the part of the housing authority.
- Investor · Canton, GA · Member since 2014 · 728 posts · 500 votes9yLove it! Our tax dollar at work ...
- Real Estate Agent · Berlin, MA · Member since 2013 · 130 posts · 95 votes9y
I feel your frustration, I recently had payment delayed because the post office screwed up delivery of the letter, they wouldn't accept an electronic copy of the signed contract, and the caseworker refused to communicate as to whether they needed additional paperwork. I noticed one thing in your complaint that nobody else picked up on: you were charged late fees on your bills. Why? Why wouldn't you pay your bills on time while trying to work out this payment issue? If your apartment were vacant would you not pay your bills? Do you not have enough in reserve? Nobody is going to cry over your own missed payments so please don't try to use that as leverage to speed up the process. Sounds like you're in a trial by fire learning process here. Personally I've changed my policy regarding Section 8 vouchers based on this which may not make tenants happy but will protect my business.
- Real Estate Agent · Southington, CT · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes9y
@Cameron DePaola I've had clients in this situation here in CT. In all cases the check was being sent to the previous landlord. Until that landlord told the housing office nothing got done about it.
- Investor · Princeton, TX · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes9y
@Cameron DePaola On about January 2, 2017 I would call the office of the HUD Inspector General. They will be able to solve the problem very quickly.
I would not be prepared to ever hand over keys to any tenant before I had cash in hand. If the welfare office is not prepared to pay first and last prior to a landlord turning over the unit to a section 8 then no one should be renting to section 8. They need to shape up if they want private landlords to offer their wards housing.
Originally posted by @Cameron DePaola:
I recently purchased a building with pre-existing tenants on section 8 living in one of the units. They did not have a lease so they signed a new one when I purchased the building. They had recently moved into this unit after living in another unit on the property. I have worked with the Housing Authority office and provided all the documents needed to switch the HUD payment into my name. After almost two months of waiting, and being put on hold with them and providing additional documentation, and not getting any real answers, I still have not been paid. Do I have the right to charge the Housing Authority a late fee and demand payment due immediately? The tenants have paid their portion of the rent which is very little and I do not want to take action towards them. They have tried contacting the HA and have had no answers. I am unsure of any regulations regarding Section 8 Program and can't seem to find any answers.
What? Did you actually expect the government to pay you on time?
That was not a wise expectation. You've just discovered one of the risks associated with renting to tenants on section 8 and other government programs... dealing with government bureaucracy. I suggest getting out of it!
Yes, charge the housing authority a late fee! While you're at it, charge your mortgage company a late fee for taking three months to return your overpayment of the mortgage.
That's one of the most hilarious comments I've heard on BP. Good luck enforcing that ahha hha :-)
Here's a more wise assumption...the government or those who have control have the power and make the rules.
- Investor · New York City, NY · Member since 2015 · 808 posts · 417 votes9y
other posters here are spot on. At least when this happened to me, the housing authority provides the voucher but the tenant is on the hook. I would suggest you and even more so the tenant call to find out what is wrong. In my situation the tenant lost their voucher for something but was still eligible (long story). It took months to get the money but I did get the money. Do your best to verify the tenant is still getting a voucher (could be you triggered some type of review or something). Also, assuming your tenant has a pay portion (which they are late on 90% of the time) you should be charging late fees on their portion. If they think they will be kicked out anyway because of the lack of voucher payments they probably won't pay their portion either which means you will be charging late fees the whole time.
- Investor · Vancouver, WA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes9y
We've worked successfully with our local Housing Authority and tenants with Section 8 Housing Choice Vouchers, for over 20 years. We've had nice, clean, responsible, good, long-term tenants who've been supported by this program, so I know it has the potential of being very good for landlords who chose to accept Section 8 tenants.
Remember, your rental agreement is with the tenant, not the Housing Authority. As with all tenancies, if the rent isn't paid when it's due, the tenant is at risk of losing their housing. I would issue a Pay Rent or Quit notice to the tenant and provide a copy to the Housing Authority case manager. But I would consider the timing. I would serve the notice at the beginning of January. This is why....
1. Since this didn't get resolved in November, and you didn't serve the PQ notice in the first week of December, I doubt it will get resolved in late December when people are on holiday break. It's probable that nothing will get rolling until January, so enjoy your holidays and let your tenant enjoy theirs.
2. We're full swing into the holidays and at a time of year when doing a turnover tends to be more difficult, especially in cold weather states such as yours. It's in your best interest, and your tenant's best interest, and the HA's best interest to save the tenancy. This would require rent payments to be paid to you in a timely manner.
3. Posting the Notice to Pay Rent or Quit is the first step in the eviction process. Eviction will result in a loss for you and a loss for the tenant. You stand to lose a significant amount of time and money and the tenant would lose their home. Serving the notice will put your issue on the front burner, fear in the tenant and fire under the case worker at the most inopportune time of the year. Highly unlikely you will get the result you seek in the last two weeks of December. More likely you will see some action in January. Even the courts take time off for the holidays.
4. It's been less than two months since you signed your agreement with the HA, and some government processes take time. It's important to be patient and not let this frustrate you, but continue your attempts to get the answers you need. There's no excuse for the HA's poor communication. You need to know the best method for communicating with them, with whom and in what manner. You need to know when and how the HA will be making payments to you. You need reassurance that the back rent will be paid soon and that it will be paid on-time in the future. You need to know if there are any lose ends that are causing the delay in getting your first payment. If you are new to working with this HA and/or the Section 8 program, you'll need to align your expectations with what they can do. Direct deposit is great, if your local HA will do that for you, I would recommend it.
5. The HA has deeper pockets than the tenant. That's where you will eventually get your rent money. They also have the shortcoming of being a government agency with policies, procedures and processes that take time. It's been less than two months since you got on board with them, at a time of year when everything tends to take longer. Be persistent, but also be diplomatic and don't burn bridges.
6. I can understand why you don"t what to take action towards the tenant, if the tenant is doing all that they can do to fulfill their obligation. That shows compassion and is a good trait to have. We're dealing with people.... human feelings and human shortcomings, including those of overworked case managers and things that the tenant can't control.
7. Take some time to garner additional support.... working with other landlords. Seek out the support of some other landlords in your area who work with your local HA and see if they have some insight as to what might be going on internally at the HA office and/or who is in a position of authority there that can get this quickly resolved. You met with someone at the HA originally, yes? Your unit passed inspection, yes? You've fulfilled your part of the agreement, yes? Your tenant has been keeping up their end of the agreement they have with the HA and paying their portion of the rent to you on time, yes?
8. When you serve the notice, do so with compassion. Do what is required in your jurisdiction, but don't just post it on the door and/or mail it, visit the tenant and explain to them that this is a formal step you need to take and pursue until you receive all the rent in full. Let the tenant know that they need to take action to resolve this with their case manager as soon as possible or pay the rent in full themselves, otherwise you'll need to talk with them about a move-out plan. Personally, and professionally, I would wait until January to take this step. However, if you've already posted the notice, you can still choose to wait until January before enforcing it and paying the associated court fees and/or attorney fees that come with an eviction.
- 9yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
this is actually quite typical in many jurisdictions when you have a change of ownership.. hud payments lag 60 to 90 days.. don't freak out.. as long as you know the voucher is good one day you will end up with 2 or 3 months of rent in your mail box.
vacant unit and a turn over via eviction in the long run will be much more costly.. especially if your in a area heavy to section 8... I would simply go to the offices and follow up in a nice way.
- Investor · Vancouver, WA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes9y
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
this is actually quite typical in many jurisdictions when you have a change of ownership.. hud payments lag 60 to 90 days.. don't freak out.. as long as you know the voucher is good one day you will end up with 2 or 3 months of rent in your mail box.
vacant unit and a turn over via eviction in the long run will be much more costly.. especially if your in a area heavy to section 8... I would simply go to the offices and follow up in a nice way.
Spot on! When we bought a multiplex with some Section 8 tenants, it took about 60 days for everything to fall into place. Fortunately our Housing Authority was clear with us about the process and timeline. The case manager was involved as well and answered our calls promptly. I had forgotten it took that long. In retrospect, I would not even think of serving a Pay Rent or Quit at this juncture, or a late fee. I would work on building relationships... with the tenant and with their case manager. :-)
- 9yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Marcia Maynard in the deep south were section 8 is 10 X more prevelant than in the NW.. this is the case ALWAYS when you transfer ownership and or your setting up a new tenant..
those that want to evict if its a little late probably have not been through the system enough times to understand that the govmit just does not move at the same speed we do :) hope you survived the snow !!!
- I concur with most. Sec 8 doesn't move at the same speed as us. Be patient and visit the office and speak with the case manager. It usually takes 60 days to get the paperwork processed and the first check, but once setup the money comes in like clockwork. They will pay you the back pay from lease start date but no late fees.
Rod Hanks Insurance4.9156 Reviews - Real Estate Agent · Milford, ME · Member since 2016 · 12 posts · 3 votes9y
I have settled the issue with the Housing Authority. The case manager had lost paperwork from the tenant and had to catch up on what was going on. I told them it was two months past due and it was to be due immediately. Miraculously they came up with an answer on the spot after telling them I had served the tenant with a pay or quit notice: which I explained to the tenant was just a formal proceeding and not to worry as long as they were keeping up on their end. They pushed this to the case managers attention and I was paid immediately. I appreciate the advice and in the future, I will have a better understanding of the way this works.
- Staten Island, NY · Member since 2017 · 1 post · 0 votes9y
Hi my issue is that I'm on section 8 and section 8 made a error in caculating my portion of rent for over a year and a half because they where including my full-time students income in the budget. I immediately filed for a rent grievance before the rent error was to take place..but it has taken section 8 over a year and a half to correct the problem it's fixed now as of 7/2017. But Now the landLord is trying to take me to court to pay section 8 portion even though he did not file the forum's with section 8 to see if they would give him their portion he just felt it was easier to come after me the tenant. My portion is paid up to date.can he legally do that???
- Member since 2023 · 1 post · 0 votes3y
Whats wrong with todays world. Is the fact that there are many that do not have any compassion. IF everyone stay at home and sit on your monies these people will stop being rude and nasty. Why is everyone so money hungry? Put yourseives in someone elese's shoes for Gods sake. How many of you have up to date properties? The law also has tenants rights, and if anyone has read their contracts, you very well know the guidelines and procedures so if you charge the tenant or give them a notice, they can countersue you, so how about that! It would be worse if the tenant owed you full rent and unable to it, so try looking for a brighter solution. You are gauranteed payment from housing no matter what. Also, the tenant is allowed to vacate the premises and sue you for harrassment. People need to realize that what you put out you get back! There was motive when you accepted the voucher in the first place not to mention the fact that just because someone receives section 8 does not make them lower or less smart..
when you have ill motive **** happens!.
Quote from @Katrina Brewer:
Whats wrong with todays world. Is the fact that there are many that do not have any compassion. IF everyone stay at home and sit on your monies these people will stop being rude and nasty. Why is everyone so money hungry? Put yourseives in someone elese's shoes for Gods sake. How many of you have up to date properties? The law also has tenants rights, and if anyone has read their contracts, you very well know the guidelines and procedures so if you charge the tenant or give them a notice, they can countersue you, so how about that! It would be worse if the tenant owed you full rent and unable to it, so try looking for a brighter solution. You are gauranteed payment from housing no matter what. Also, the tenant is allowed to vacate the premises and sue you for harrassment. People need to realize that what you put out you get back! There was motive when you accepted the voucher in the first place not to mention the fact that just because someone receives section 8 does not make them lower or less smart..
when you have ill motive **** happens!.
So if a landlord expects the rent to be paid in accordance with the agreement that the tenant signed they are "money hungry"? How so?
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