BEWARE of fraud by erentpayment.com
Karen HigginsPro Member
Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2017 · 83 posts · 89 votesBEWARE of fraud by erentpayment.com
Most Popular Reply
Property Manager · Blaine · Member since 2015 · 209 posts · 276 votes
8yMy wife found this company on bigger pockets. She most definitely is in the right, and boarder line obligated to inform the public that a company that used to accept payments from tenants, and disburse the funds to landlords is no longer longer disbursing the funds to landlords. Furthermore, they have shutoff their phones and customer service department, not updated their customers as to the status of their funds, and refused to name their banking institutions or legal representation that they are using.
This is most certainly a fraud, and a large one. If not, they should be updating their customer base as to where their money is at, and when they will get it. This rent collection and payment scheme is the perfect Ponzi scheme. They take a clients money and can move it from bank to bank like it's their own money. (Matt, thats apparently what you think happened). Thus, proving the lack of oversight involved in this kind of business/industry. As long as they can grow their customer base the scheme continues. The creator doesn't even have to put himself out there as the frontman of the scheme, and can hide behind an LLC. Interestingly, Rick S is a "pro" member, claims to be the manager or owner, and has 397 post on bigger pockets. I encourage him to comment, or better yet send me my 13,000$. At this point I doubt either will happen.
I hope I'm wrong, but when the company shuts off the phone and fails to deliver on the "updates" they promise. You have to fear the worse. This company is still accepting "new" money and the public needs to know. I don't want to come across as confrontational, but the public needs to be made aware of the problem/fraud.
345 Replies
- Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes8y
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
I would love to hear everyone's alternative to using e-rent. Everyone wants to pull business, fine. I would be happy to do the same given their response to people. However, show me another company who will transfer the rental funds just as quickly, if not quicker, for a similar price and with an easy to use platform and I am all ears to switching.
I don't think there's an easy answer to that question. If you go with a true ACH service then you have to accept the delay. Otherwise you can go to a customer initiated push, which is much faster and virtually instantaneous (ie Zelle). I have had a couple of customers ask to use their own banking on an ACH push and I have allowed it if the customer has been one in good standing. You could even set up your own Stripe account (I have one) and either push the processing fee to the customer or pay it yourself. But even a Stripe account takes a couple of days.
Personally, I don't find the Cozy delay an issue. The downside to it is if the customer is NSF, it will take a few days before you know - but that's no different than getting a paper check and having it returned. As far as I'm concerned, once I see the Cozy transfer initiated I quit worrying about it as a couple of days in either direction has zero effect on me financially.
Skyline Properties - Pensacola, FL · Member since 2017 · 26 posts · 50 votes8y
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
I would love to hear everyone's alternative to using e-rent. Everyone wants to pull business, fine. I would be happy to do the same given their response to people. However, show me another company who will transfer the rental funds just as quickly, if not quicker, for a similar price and with an easy to use platform and I am all ears to switching.
If you "have deep reserves on each property" and "not getting by on the skin of one's teeth" what makes an additional 1-2 days in time a deal breaker? After this debacle, I will gladly wait on my money those 1 to 2 additional days for a guarantee it gets there.
- Brookhaven, PA · Member since 2017 · 5 posts · 14 votes8y
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
I have used ERP for 2+ years, I have multiple accounts that use their service. I haven't noticed one issue and no properties that I manage have notified me about an issue either. It sounds like the way they handled something was incorrect but it also sounds like people are getting a little too hysterical.
People who have $20k plus tied up and are basically told that your money may not ever be found/submitted to you are a "little too hysterical" ?
This is another case of "I'm not affected so it must not be a major deal."
Everyone can pretty much agree ERP users and non-users that this was a MAJOR screw up and will most likely sink the company.
Not every single person ITT freaking out has 20k tied up so calm down. It's a few people freaking out and then other people having fake outrage and saying they will leave ERP because of it. I have 5 figures in rent flow through ERP monthly. Have not had one issue. Not one. A thread on BiggerPockets is going to sink their company? Get a grip.
I'm also not freaked out because I have deep reserves on each property. But too many people on here never have time to talk about that and likely skirt by the skin of their teeth on rentals.
I'm really new but your line of logic hit a nerve. It's akin to blaming a victim of crime for not having the means to afford a better neighborhood. And, to add insult to injury by castigating those of us who have, and are still boot strapping our business (many with a W2) until we can have "deep reserves" is not only offensive but disconnected. Especially since you haven't experienced any losses...yet. And I hope you don't my fellow investor, but if you do I wonder if your attitude will be as cavalier as it seems to be now.
- Syracuse, NY · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 33 votes8y
For those defrauded wondering about the effect of closing their accounts with ERentPayment:
Just spoke to my lawyer and he says it's cool for me to close my erentpayment account. Now that it's confirmed that the processing company filed for bankruptcy and ERentPayment is doing business with another company, returned funds from 10/5 through 10/12 wouldn't be going through that company anyway. He did recommend that I save all my files from my account before closing my account, just in case we need it for court.
And a side note: Bigger Pockets community has been great through this, but let's try to keep it civil and focus on passing on helpful information for those defrauded and to those unsure of what to do next. Debate and venting is nice (and I've certainly done my share), but never forget what this forum and community is all about. Whether a person unaffected chooses to stay or leave ERentPayment doesn't mean much as much to me as information that can help get my money back.
Make sure your tenants check to see if the money left their account, as a stop-payment can be placed and the money returned. Speak to your lawyer and, if you get information that can help others, post it here and on the ERentPayment Facebook group. And for those looking for alternatives to Erent, there are several. Check the forums to see which ones people recommend and, if you have questions, ask.
- 8yPeter TverdovBusiness MemberDeveloper · New Brunswick, NJ · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
Originally posted by @Oscar Cabarcas:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
I have used ERP for 2+ years, I have multiple accounts that use their service. I haven't noticed one issue and no properties that I manage have notified me about an issue either. It sounds like the way they handled something was incorrect but it also sounds like people are getting a little too hysterical.
People who have $20k plus tied up and are basically told that your money may not ever be found/submitted to you are a "little too hysterical" ?
This is another case of "I'm not affected so it must not be a major deal."
Everyone can pretty much agree ERP users and non-users that this was a MAJOR screw up and will most likely sink the company.
Not every single person ITT freaking out has 20k tied up so calm down. It's a few people freaking out and then other people having fake outrage and saying they will leave ERP because of it. I have 5 figures in rent flow through ERP monthly. Have not had one issue. Not one. A thread on BiggerPockets is going to sink their company? Get a grip.
I'm also not freaked out because I have deep reserves on each property. But too many people on here never have time to talk about that and likely skirt by the skin of their teeth on rentals.
I'm really new but your line of logic hit a nerve. It's akin to blaming a victim of crime for not having the means to afford a better neighborhood. And, to add insult to injury by castigating those of us who have, and are still boot strapping our business (many with a W2) until we can have "deep reserves" is not only offensive but disconnected. Especially since you haven't experienced any losses...yet. And I hope you don't my fellow investor, but if you do I wonder if your attitude will be as cavalier as it seems to be now.
Please spare me the "I'm offended" line. I work 2 jobs (first one working 12 hours a day) and have been working around the clock to build my own business. People on here never want to talk about reserves. THAT is what is disconnected IMO. Go search the forums about things like that, it's sparse discussion. I am very conservative and have 6 months of reserves on every property and always will. People don't like to talk about reserves on here and I feel a lot of people are not properly prepared for a storm. This thread is a perfect example of that. An unfortunate situation happens and people are ** bricks (for good reason) because they can't pay their bills. If missing one month of payments means you can't pay your mortgage then you are insanely overextended. I am concerned about this entire thing and looking into other online rent collection systems but some of you apparently have the thinnest of skin based on my earlier comment.
- Pensacola, FL · Member since 2017 · 26 posts · 50 votes8y
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Oscar Cabarcas:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
I have used ERP for 2+ years, I have multiple accounts that use their service. I haven't noticed one issue and no properties that I manage have notified me about an issue either. It sounds like the way they handled something was incorrect but it also sounds like people are getting a little too hysterical.
People who have $20k plus tied up and are basically told that your money may not ever be found/submitted to you are a "little too hysterical" ?
This is another case of "I'm not affected so it must not be a major deal."
Everyone can pretty much agree ERP users and non-users that this was a MAJOR screw up and will most likely sink the company.
Not every single person ITT freaking out has 20k tied up so calm down. It's a few people freaking out and then other people having fake outrage and saying they will leave ERP because of it. I have 5 figures in rent flow through ERP monthly. Have not had one issue. Not one. A thread on BiggerPockets is going to sink their company? Get a grip.
I'm also not freaked out because I have deep reserves on each property. But too many people on here never have time to talk about that and likely skirt by the skin of their teeth on rentals.
I'm really new but your line of logic hit a nerve. It's akin to blaming a victim of crime for not having the means to afford a better neighborhood. And, to add insult to injury by castigating those of us who have, and are still boot strapping our business (many with a W2) until we can have "deep reserves" is not only offensive but disconnected. Especially since you haven't experienced any losses...yet. And I hope you don't my fellow investor, but if you do I wonder if your attitude will be as cavalier as it seems to be now.
Please spare me the "I'm offended" line. I work 2 jobs (first one working 12 hours a day) and have been working around the clock to build my own business. People on here never want to talk about reserves. THAT is what is disconnected IMO. Go search the forums about things like that, it's sparse discussion. I am very conservative and have 6 months of reserves on every property and always will. People don't like to talk about reserves on here and I feel a lot of people are not properly prepared for a storm. This thread is a perfect example of that. An unfortunate situation happens and people are ** bricks (for good reason) because they can't pay their bills. If missing one month of payments means you can't pay your mortgage then you are insanely overextended. I am concerned about this entire thing and looking into other online rent collection systems but some of you apparently have the thinnest of skin based on my earlier comment.
The fact that you freely admitted to losing nothing then accused others of "false outrage" for losing money is the disconnect...
If I was in your position, I would have thanked people for the heads up...instead you chose your first 2 post...as others have stated luckily your funds weren't affected.
Having reserves isn't really the point...people feel like they have been robbed of their money...If they get any amount stolen they have a right to be mad...for some that might not have an impact on them for others they might lose a property over it...but guess what they can all be equally upset over the issue and try to get the word out.
Coming in not having a clue as to what was going on and saying victims were "few" and "too hysterical" and "fake outrage" was over the top. Do you still stand by those statements even now?
- Merrillville, IN · Member since 2016 · 5 posts · 0 votes8y
Major Fraud --- $4M has basically been stolen. Squeaky wheel gets the grease....
- 8yPeter TverdovBusiness MemberDeveloper · New Brunswick, NJ · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Oscar Cabarcas:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
I have used ERP for 2+ years, I have multiple accounts that use their service. I haven't noticed one issue and no properties that I manage have notified me about an issue either. It sounds like the way they handled something was incorrect but it also sounds like people are getting a little too hysterical.
People who have $20k plus tied up and are basically told that your money may not ever be found/submitted to you are a "little too hysterical" ?
This is another case of "I'm not affected so it must not be a major deal."
Everyone can pretty much agree ERP users and non-users that this was a MAJOR screw up and will most likely sink the company.
Not every single person ITT freaking out has 20k tied up so calm down. It's a few people freaking out and then other people having fake outrage and saying they will leave ERP because of it. I have 5 figures in rent flow through ERP monthly. Have not had one issue. Not one. A thread on BiggerPockets is going to sink their company? Get a grip.
I'm also not freaked out because I have deep reserves on each property. But too many people on here never have time to talk about that and likely skirt by the skin of their teeth on rentals.
I'm really new but your line of logic hit a nerve. It's akin to blaming a victim of crime for not having the means to afford a better neighborhood. And, to add insult to injury by castigating those of us who have, and are still boot strapping our business (many with a W2) until we can have "deep reserves" is not only offensive but disconnected. Especially since you haven't experienced any losses...yet. And I hope you don't my fellow investor, but if you do I wonder if your attitude will be as cavalier as it seems to be now.
Please spare me the "I'm offended" line. I work 2 jobs (first one working 12 hours a day) and have been working around the clock to build my own business. People on here never want to talk about reserves. THAT is what is disconnected IMO. Go search the forums about things like that, it's sparse discussion. I am very conservative and have 6 months of reserves on every property and always will. People don't like to talk about reserves on here and I feel a lot of people are not properly prepared for a storm. This thread is a perfect example of that. An unfortunate situation happens and people are ** bricks (for good reason) because they can't pay their bills. If missing one month of payments means you can't pay your mortgage then you are insanely overextended. I am concerned about this entire thing and looking into other online rent collection systems but some of you apparently have the thinnest of skin based on my earlier comment.
The fact that you freely admitted to losing nothing then accused others of "false outrage" for losing money is the disconnect...
If I was in your position, I would have thanked people for the heads up...instead you chose your first 2 post...as others have stated luckily your funds weren't affected.
Having reserves isn't really the point...people feel like they have been robbed of their money...If they get any amount stolen they have a right to be mad...for some that might not have an impact on them for others they might lose a property over it...but guess what they can all be equally upset over the issue and try to get the word out.
Coming in not having a clue as to what was going on and saying victims were "few" and "too hysterical" and "fake outrage" was over the top. Do you still stand by those statements even now?
You seriously need to log off today and calm down. You are attacking people.
- Pensacola, FL · Member since 2017 · 26 posts · 50 votes8y
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Oscar Cabarcas:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
I have used ERP for 2+ years, I have multiple accounts that use their service. I haven't noticed one issue and no properties that I manage have notified me about an issue either. It sounds like the way they handled something was incorrect but it also sounds like people are getting a little too hysterical.
People who have $20k plus tied up and are basically told that your money may not ever be found/submitted to you are a "little too hysterical" ?
This is another case of "I'm not affected so it must not be a major deal."
Everyone can pretty much agree ERP users and non-users that this was a MAJOR screw up and will most likely sink the company.
Not every single person ITT freaking out has 20k tied up so calm down. It's a few people freaking out and then other people having fake outrage and saying they will leave ERP because of it. I have 5 figures in rent flow through ERP monthly. Have not had one issue. Not one. A thread on BiggerPockets is going to sink their company? Get a grip.
I'm also not freaked out because I have deep reserves on each property. But too many people on here never have time to talk about that and likely skirt by the skin of their teeth on rentals.
I'm really new but your line of logic hit a nerve. It's akin to blaming a victim of crime for not having the means to afford a better neighborhood. And, to add insult to injury by castigating those of us who have, and are still boot strapping our business (many with a W2) until we can have "deep reserves" is not only offensive but disconnected. Especially since you haven't experienced any losses...yet. And I hope you don't my fellow investor, but if you do I wonder if your attitude will be as cavalier as it seems to be now.
Please spare me the "I'm offended" line. I work 2 jobs (first one working 12 hours a day) and have been working around the clock to build my own business. People on here never want to talk about reserves. THAT is what is disconnected IMO. Go search the forums about things like that, it's sparse discussion. I am very conservative and have 6 months of reserves on every property and always will. People don't like to talk about reserves on here and I feel a lot of people are not properly prepared for a storm. This thread is a perfect example of that. An unfortunate situation happens and people are ** bricks (for good reason) because they can't pay their bills. If missing one month of payments means you can't pay your mortgage then you are insanely overextended. I am concerned about this entire thing and looking into other online rent collection systems but some of you apparently have the thinnest of skin based on my earlier comment.
The fact that you freely admitted to losing nothing then accused others of "false outrage" for losing money is the disconnect...
If I was in your position, I would have thanked people for the heads up...instead you chose your first 2 post...as others have stated luckily your funds weren't affected.
Having reserves isn't really the point...people feel like they have been robbed of their money...If they get any amount stolen they have a right to be mad...for some that might not have an impact on them for others they might lose a property over it...but guess what they can all be equally upset over the issue and try to get the word out.
Coming in not having a clue as to what was going on and saying victims were "few" and "too hysterical" and "fake outrage" was over the top. Do you still stand by those statements even now?
You seriously need to log off today and calm down. You are attacking people.
Please spare me the "You are attacking people" line.
Not once have I called you a name or attacked you:
You however did call victims all the things I listed and still stand by them. I will leave this conversation with you as it is going nowhere and you can't admit your tone was off base. Good luck in your future investments.
- Architect · Papillion, NE · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 840 votes8y
Here is a link to their facebook page with more information.
- Syracuse, NY · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 33 votes8y
I appreciate the link, Jim, but they've already moved on and stopped talking about the people who lost money because of them. All of their posts are now focused on the people whose business relationships they can salvage, namely, those who weren't or were minimally affected. My lawyer, so far, hasn't been able to get a hold of theirs.
Has anyone thought about sharing the legal advice they're getting? A lot of people are talking about lawsuits and legal ramifications but what actions have you taken legally? Sharing that can help, but I think I'm the only one doing it. If you get information from your lawyer (if you've contacted your lawyer), share any information you think can help. Thanks.
- Peoria, IL · Member since 2017 · 17 posts · 7 votes8y
Originally posted by @Dima Kassim:
For those defrauded wondering about the effect of closing their accounts with ERentPayment:
Just spoke to my lawyer and he says it's cool for me to close my erentpayment account. Now that it's confirmed that the processing company filed for bankruptcy and ERentPayment is doing business with another company, returned funds from 10/5 through 10/12 wouldn't be going through that company anyway. He did recommend that I save all my files from my account before closing my account, just in case we need it for court.
And a side note: Bigger Pockets community has been great through this, but let's try to keep it civil and focus on passing on helpful information for those defrauded and to those unsure of what to do next. Debate and venting is nice (and I've certainly done my share), but never forget what this forum and community is all about. Whether a person unaffected chooses to stay or leave ERentPayment doesn't mean much as much to me as information that can help get my money back.
Make sure your tenants check to see if the money left their account, as a stop-payment can be placed and the money returned. Speak to your lawyer and, if you get information that can help others, post it here and on the ERentPayment Facebook group. And for those looking for alternatives to Erent, there are several. Check the forums to see which ones people recommend and, if you have questions, ask.
My tenant went to the bank and requested the transaction to be returned, but the bank said they can't legally do it because the transaction was in fact authorized. Rick's reply "No, they may request an R10 but say it is due to an Incomplete Transaction and not due to it being Unauthorized. Most banks will assume an R10 is only for an Unauthorized return, however NACHA states that a Transaction Incomplete also applies to R10s. So they may tell the bank to dispute the debit as R10 - Incomplete Transaction and the bank should contact NACHA for additional details on Incomplete Transaction."
If they refunded me for the $3 transaction fee, why not refund me for that as well... - Pensacola, FL · Member since 2017 · 26 posts · 50 votes8y
Originally posted by @Dima Kassim:
I appreciate the link, Jim, but they've already moved on and stopped talking about the people who lost money because of them. All of their posts are now focused on the people whose business relationships they can salvage, namely, those who weren't or were minimally affected. My lawyer, so far, hasn't been able to get a hold of theirs.
Has anyone thought about sharing the legal advice they're getting? A lot of people are talking about lawsuits and legal ramifications but what actions have you taken legally? Sharing that can help, but I think I'm the only one doing it. If you get information from your lawyer (if you've contacted your lawyer), share any information you think can help. Thanks.
https://www.facebook.com/search/top/?q=erentpaymen...
Is a group of victims pooling info together has over 426 members.
- Syracuse, NY · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 33 votes8y
Thanks Myron. Unfortunately my cave dwelling self doesn't have Facebook. If you see anything that can help would you be kind enough to post it here? You can ask others in the group to do the same, just for the very few people like me who don't have personal social media.
- Pensacola, FL · Member since 2017 · 26 posts · 50 votes8y
*****POTENTIAL NEXT STEPS*********
Hello Everyone,
So I know all of you are wondering what the next steps should be in this crisis. At the end of the day, only you know what’s going to work best for your individual situation. However, I strongly believe that there is power in numbers. Therefore, I emphatically urge you to keep filing complaints with the Attorney General Office in your respective states of residency and with the FTC. The strategy behind this is if enough complaints and/or class action suits are filed within many different states, then it increases the chances of the Department of Justice picking this case up.
With that said, the below next steps are for those of you who are playing around with the idea of organizing and filing a class action lawsuit. If you’ve already decided to go at this alone, then these steps probably won’t work for you.1. Break-up Into Sub-Groups according to the State You Reside In. For example, everyone who resides in Georgia should create their own group. Our Facebook group is now at almost 400 people, so there’s no way we can organize effectively without breaking up into smaller groups.
2. Appoint a Chairperson for your group. This chairperson will be responsible for communicating with the Chairpersons representing groups from other states, which will ensure that information is being shared across groups.
3. Seek an attorney in the state of Colorado, to provide a FREE consultation to your group. I say Colorado because although there are multiple companies and jurisdictions involved in this issue, the company that we have an agreement with is Erentpayment, which is based out of Colorado
4. After presenting your case to the attorney, find out if the attorney will take the case with no upfront fees as a class action suit or if the attorney would prefer to obtain a retainer upfront
5. *****ONCE THE ATTORNEY PROVIDES YOU WITH HIS/HER ANSWER, THIS IS WHERE YOU AS AN INDIVIDUAL HAVE TO DECIDE WHAT’S GOING TO WORK BEST FOR YOU***** Obviously, we have people with money being held ranging from hundreds to thousands to tens of thousands of dollars. For example, if you only have $1000 being held, then it may not be beneficial for you to continue in the legal process if a large retainer is required upfront. However, if no fees are required upfront, you may want to stick around for the ride. On the other hand, if you have $50,000 being held and a retainer is due up front, it’s probably in your best interest to continue in the process b/c that’s not an amount that most of us can afford to lose.
Unfortunately, this strategy offers no guarantees, but it is a start. To help facilitate the formation of the groups, I’m going to post how many members we have in which states based on the data we’ve collected from you so far, so please continue to complete the surveys (link below). Once I post these numbers, I will need 1 person from each state to volunteer to be a Chair/Spokesperson for their respective state/group. Our committee will then meet again and provide the next steps for each Chairperson to help them organize their group. In the meantime, please feel free to share your comments, questions, concerns regarding this strategy. Thanks so much!
-Rasheda Mayner
- Syracuse, NY · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 33 votes8y
Originally posted by @Fernanda B.:
Originally posted by @Dima Kassim:
For those defrauded wondering about the effect of closing their accounts with ERentPayment:
Just spoke to my lawyer and he says it's cool for me to close my erentpayment account. Now that it's confirmed that the processing company filed for bankruptcy and ERentPayment is doing business with another company, returned funds from 10/5 through 10/12 wouldn't be going through that company anyway. He did recommend that I save all my files from my account before closing my account, just in case we need it for court.
And a side note: Bigger Pockets community has been great through this, but let's try to keep it civil and focus on passing on helpful information for those defrauded and to those unsure of what to do next. Debate and venting is nice (and I've certainly done my share), but never forget what this forum and community is all about. Whether a person unaffected chooses to stay or leave ERentPayment doesn't mean much as much to me as information that can help get my money back.
Make sure your tenants check to see if the money left their account, as a stop-payment can be placed and the money returned. Speak to your lawyer and, if you get information that can help others, post it here and on the ERentPayment Facebook group. And for those looking for alternatives to Erent, there are several. Check the forums to see which ones people recommend and, if you have questions, ask.
My tenant went to the bank and requested the transaction to be returned, but the bank said they can't legally do it because the transaction was in fact authorized. Rick's reply "No, they may request an R10 but say it is due to an Incomplete Transaction and not due to it being Unauthorized. Most banks will assume an R10 is only for an Unauthorized return, however NACHA states that a Transaction Incomplete also applies to R10s. So they may tell the bank to dispute the debit as R10 - Incomplete Transaction and the bank should contact NACHA for additional details on Incomplete Transaction."
If they refunded me for the $3 transaction fee, why not refund me for that as well...The transaction fee is something that comes directly from ERentPayment, so they can refund the fee without dealing with another company. The rent money that was stolen is no longer in their control, so that's much more complicated.
- Syracuse, NY · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 33 votes8y
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
*****POTENTIAL NEXT STEPS*********
Hello Everyone,
So I know all of you are wondering what the next steps should be in this crisis. At the end of the day, only you know what’s going to work best for your individual situation. However, I strongly believe that there is power in numbers. Therefore, I emphatically urge you to keep filing complaints with the Attorney General Office in your respective states of residency and with the FTC. The strategy behind this is if enough complaints and/or class action suits are filed within many different states, then it increases the chances of the Department of Justice picking this case up.
With that said, the below next steps are for those of you who are playing around with the idea of organizing and filing a class action lawsuit. If you’ve already decided to go at this alone, then these steps probably won’t work for you.1. Break-up Into Sub-Groups according to the State You Reside In. For example, everyone who resides in Georgia should create their own group. Our Facebook group is now at almost 400 people, so there’s no way we can organize effectively without breaking up into smaller groups.
2. Appoint a Chairperson for your group. This chairperson will be responsible for communicating with the Chairpersons representing groups from other states, which will ensure that information is being shared across groups.
3. Seek an attorney in the state of Colorado, to provide a FREE consultation to your group. I say Colorado because although there are multiple companies and jurisdictions involved in this issue, the company that we have an agreement with is Erentpayment, which is based out of Colorado
4. After presenting your case to the attorney, find out if the attorney will take the case with no upfront fees as a class action suit or if the attorney would prefer to obtain a retainer upfront
5. *****ONCE THE ATTORNEY PROVIDES YOU WITH HIS/HER ANSWER, THIS IS WHERE YOU AS AN INDIVIDUAL HAVE TO DECIDE WHAT’S GOING TO WORK BEST FOR YOU***** Obviously, we have people with money being held ranging from hundreds to thousands to tens of thousands of dollars. For example, if you only have $1000 being held, then it may not be beneficial for you to continue in the legal process if a large retainer is required upfront. However, if no fees are required upfront, you may want to stick around for the ride. On the other hand, if you have $50,000 being held and a retainer is due up front, it’s probably in your best interest to continue in the process b/c that’s not an amount that most of us can afford to lose.
Unfortunately, this strategy offers no guarantees, but it is a start. To help facilitate the formation of the groups, I’m going to post how many members we have in which states based on the data we’ve collected from you so far, so please continue to complete the surveys (link below). Once I post these numbers, I will need 1 person from each state to volunteer to be a Chair/Spokesperson for their respective state/group. Our committee will then meet again and provide the next steps for each Chairperson to help them organize their group. In the meantime, please feel free to share your comments, questions, concerns regarding this strategy. Thanks so much!
-Rasheda Mayner
Thanks Myron! I live in NY, so if anyone in the Facebook group wants to communicate, tell them to DM me here. Thanks again!
- Pensacola, FL · Member since 2017 · 26 posts · 50 votes8y
@Dima Kassim I will try and keep you up to date but everyone is still in a panic/information gathering stage as the group continues to grow. We we 1st started the group it was 45~ but now the number of those affected continues to grow.
- Syracuse, NY · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 33 votes8y
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Oscar Cabarcas:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
Originally posted by @Myron Cummings:
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
I have used ERP for 2+ years, I have multiple accounts that use their service. I haven't noticed one issue and no properties that I manage have notified me about an issue either. It sounds like the way they handled something was incorrect but it also sounds like people are getting a little too hysterical.
People who have $20k plus tied up and are basically told that your money may not ever be found/submitted to you are a "little too hysterical" ?
This is another case of "I'm not affected so it must not be a major deal."
Everyone can pretty much agree ERP users and non-users that this was a MAJOR screw up and will most likely sink the company.
Not every single person ITT freaking out has 20k tied up so calm down. It's a few people freaking out and then other people having fake outrage and saying they will leave ERP because of it. I have 5 figures in rent flow through ERP monthly. Have not had one issue. Not one. A thread on BiggerPockets is going to sink their company? Get a grip.
I'm also not freaked out because I have deep reserves on each property. But too many people on here never have time to talk about that and likely skirt by the skin of their teeth on rentals.
I'm really new but your line of logic hit a nerve. It's akin to blaming a victim of crime for not having the means to afford a better neighborhood. And, to add insult to injury by castigating those of us who have, and are still boot strapping our business (many with a W2) until we can have "deep reserves" is not only offensive but disconnected. Especially since you haven't experienced any losses...yet. And I hope you don't my fellow investor, but if you do I wonder if your attitude will be as cavalier as it seems to be now.
Please spare me the "I'm offended" line. I work 2 jobs (first one working 12 hours a day) and have been working around the clock to build my own business. People on here never want to talk about reserves. THAT is what is disconnected IMO. Go search the forums about things like that, it's sparse discussion. I am very conservative and have 6 months of reserves on every property and always will. People don't like to talk about reserves on here and I feel a lot of people are not properly prepared for a storm. This thread is a perfect example of that. An unfortunate situation happens and people are ** bricks (for good reason) because they can't pay their bills. If missing one month of payments means you can't pay your mortgage then you are insanely overextended. I am concerned about this entire thing and looking into other online rent collection systems but some of you apparently have the thinnest of skin based on my earlier comment.
Peter T., bringing up the topic of reserves is a good idea, but it really has nothing to do with the original topic here. Since you brought up the fact that no one talks about it, could you start a thread about reserves?
I say this not to antagonize, as I agree that reserves don't get talked about enough. But it's also your responsibility as a BiggerPockets member to talk about things you feel others aren't talking about enough.
Tell you what, if you don't start one then I will do so tomorrow. After all, it's my responsibility too!
- Rental Property Investor · Concord, NC · Member since 2015 · 23 posts · 10 votes8y
Has anyone that had a transaction after 10-12-17 received or show a pending transaction in their account for any of those funds yet?
- Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 3k+ votes8y
Great idea @Dima Kassim. For those who are interested, I started a thread about cash reserves here: https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/48/topics/500...
- 8yPeter TverdovBusiness MemberDeveloper · New Brunswick, NJ · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
@Dima Kassim I have started 2 threads on this topic in the past year. Barely any discussion on it back then...
https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/48/topics/437525-reserves-per-property
https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/62/topics/361163-managing-the-risk-of-your-properties
Only confirms my suspicion that a lot of people on this forum swim naked.
- Syracuse, NY · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 33 votes8y
Originally posted by @Peter Tverdov:
@Dima Kassim I have started 2 threads on this topic in the past year. Barely any discussion on it back then...
https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/48/topics/437525-reserves-per-property
https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/62/topics/361163-managing-the-risk-of-your-properties
Only confirms my suspicion that a lot of people on this forum swim naked.
Good man! I've got to post on that tomorrow because I'm equally curious to see how everyone does reserves. Thanks Peter
- Rental Property Investor · Concord, NC · Member since 2015 · 23 posts · 10 votes8y
Also, has anyone had success with this R10 method? My bank had never heard of it and I’m not sure I like the idea of teaching the tenant how to take back rent paid is a good idea anyway.
- Syracuse, NY · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 33 votes8y
Originally posted by @Cody Plemmons:
Also, has anyone had success with this R10 method? My bank had never heard of it and I’m not sure I like the idea of teaching the tenant how to take back rent paid is a good idea anyway.
My tenant tried it and the bank said it will not work for a transaction that had already been accepted. Fernanda B. also tried it on this thread (Page 6) but also had the same issue with accepted transactions:
From Fernanda B.:
My tenant went to the bank and requested the transaction to be returned, but the bank said they can't legally do it because the transaction was in fact authorized. Rick's reply "No, they may request an R10 but say it is due to an Incomplete Transaction and not due to it being Unauthorized. Most banks will assume an R10 is only for an Unauthorized return, however NACHA states that a Transaction Incomplete also applies to R10s. So they may tell the bank to dispute the debit as R10 - Incomplete Transaction and the bank should contact NACHA for additional details on Incomplete Transaction."
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