I'm looking for strategies to handle a tenant situation.

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I'm looking for strategies to handle a tenant situation.

Sierra Hatley
Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 8 posts · 1 vote

I had a tenant move in on the 1st of October. he informed us on the 12th that his freezer isn't freezing. I have a warranty but they didn't have a contractor that works the weekend. so I wasn't able to schedule them to come out until that Tuesday, after speaking with them on Monday. That contractor informed us that freon was needed and they would have to contact the warranty company to see who pays for that. After finding out warranty company pays, they came back out Thursday and added freon. Friday the tenant calls and the freezer still isn't freezing. The tenant is completely agitated and is becoming difficult with his tone. I tell him that I will get the company back out there but of course it won't be until Monday because they're closed on the weekend. The contractor comes back out and says they didn't add enough freon and adds more and says it will be freezing by the following day.

Of course, that wasn't the solution either and now the tenant is furious and is a bit irate, he feels that we should reimburse him for $180 for food that he wasted. I call the warranty company and they send out a new repairman for a second opinion. The new repairman says it's the compressor and it will take 2 weeks to repair. 

I'm debating on buying a new refrigerator to get the tenant off my back and paying him for what he says he lost. I'm conflicted because the warranty company which we have paid for in full is responsible for buying a new appliance if it's not fixable. I also don't believe $180 is reasonable, it's just him and a new born baby and a 5 year old. Although I understand his frustration I do feel he is being unreasonable. His refrigerator works just fine and There wasn't any food in the freezer when we went by to check on the refrigerator originally. 

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Karl B.
Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
7y

When I was in graduate school this happened to me. I had to throw out the food in my freezer and the owner refused to cover the food. Like a brat, I remember tossing a package of hot dogs in the flower bed outside my front door. lol

The fridge/freezer was ancient but they did correctly repair it. 

One option is to purchase a new fridge for the tenant (I buy mine at the Sears scratch and dent store because they're often 50%-60% of the price of a new, undamaged fridge). 

Then have the warranty company fix the broken one and you can have that fridge as a backup for a different unit. 

I can understand the tenants'  anger. If it happened and was fixed properly the first time then I'd say tough luck. But due to the fact the repair guy was inept I have more sympathy for the tenant, though if there wasn't any food in the fridge initially, that's strange (unless it had been days and was already spoiled). 

Now, having said that, in my lease I specify that the tenant is responsible for the maintenance and repair for the refrigerator and range. :-)

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  • Kim Meredith HamptonBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · St Petersburg · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    Sierra,

    This is why we require tenants to have a renters policy.

    In this circumstance, I would probably split it down the middle. This should help alleviate the bad blood at this point. It’s tough just moving, and two kids 

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  • Sierra Hatley
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 8 posts · 1 vote
    7y

    Thank you Kim, We do have that written in the lease and we covered our buts for that reason but I'm honestly afraid that he would become even more irate if we bring that to his attention. I feel that he came from a landlord that had in house maintenance and he's use to things being handled immediately and there on the spot, but I have been nothing but transparent with him and I don't want any problems but it's becoming stressful. I don't want to seem like a bad landlord or like i don't have his best interest at heart but he simple doesn't understand that this is out of my hands. 

    @Kim Meredith Hamptonundefined

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  • Kim Meredith HamptonBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · St Petersburg · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    I guess I’m jaded after 20+ years!!! I am fair and consistent across the board, but I get where you are coming from.

    If it is bothering you that much, then give him half and let him know the next time something like this happens, he will need to make a claim on his renters policy. As managers and owners, we don’t know and can’t control everything that happens! Xxxx happens 

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  • Sierra Hatley
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 8 posts · 1 vote
    7y

    @Kim Meredith Hampton Thank you so much for responding. I simply needed to bounce this off of someone who's informed and hearing back from you was a enough to help me come back to calm. Thank you!

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  • Dennis M.
    Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    7y
    @Sierra Hatley Why are you providing a freezer anyways? The more stuff you leave furnished the more calls your going to get when there’s an issue . There’s no way I’d give this tenant squat and I wouldn’t put up with the disrespect either . Unless the lease specifically says you will pay 100% of the repairs on the freezer I would certainly not be jumping through hoops for the guy . He couldn’t buy a few bags of ice to keep it cool till the repair guy got it straightened out . Your tenant sounds like a complainer . I think I’d reconsider renewing this persons lease . Sounds like a total flake
    0Reply
  • Chris C.
    Raleigh, NC · Member since 2017 · 347 posts · 94 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Dennis M.:
    @Sierra Hatley

    Why are you providing a freezer anyways? The more stuff you leave furnished the more calls your going to get when there’s an issue . There’s no way I’d give this tenant squat and I wouldn’t put up with the disrespect either . Unless the lease specifically says you will pay 100% of the repairs on the freezer I would certainly not be jumping through hoops for the guy . He couldn’t buy a few bags of ice to keep it cool till the repair guy got it straightened out . Your tenant sounds like a complainer . I think I’d reconsider renewing this persons lease . Sounds like a total flake

     Renting a fully unfrurnished unit? No stove, refrigerator, etc? That seems hard to get tenants

    3Reply
  • Karl B.
    Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    When I was in graduate school this happened to me. I had to throw out the food in my freezer and the owner refused to cover the food. Like a brat, I remember tossing a package of hot dogs in the flower bed outside my front door. lol

    The fridge/freezer was ancient but they did correctly repair it. 

    One option is to purchase a new fridge for the tenant (I buy mine at the Sears scratch and dent store because they're often 50%-60% of the price of a new, undamaged fridge). 

    Then have the warranty company fix the broken one and you can have that fridge as a backup for a different unit. 

    I can understand the tenants'  anger. If it happened and was fixed properly the first time then I'd say tough luck. But due to the fact the repair guy was inept I have more sympathy for the tenant, though if there wasn't any food in the fridge initially, that's strange (unless it had been days and was already spoiled). 

    Now, having said that, in my lease I specify that the tenant is responsible for the maintenance and repair for the refrigerator and range. :-)

    4Reply
  • Sierra Hatley
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 8 posts · 1 vote
    7y
    Originally posted by @Karl B.:

    When I was in graduate school this happened to me. I had to throw out the food in my freezer and the owner refused to cover the food. Like a brat, I remember tossing a package of hot dogs in the flower bed outside my front door. lol

    The fridge/freezer was ancient but they did correctly repair it. 

    One option is to purchase a new fridge for the tenant (I buy mine at the Sears scratch and dent store because they're often 50%-60% of the price of a new, undamaged fridge). 

    Then have the warranty company fix the broken one and you can have that fridge as a backup for a different unit. 

    I can understand the tenants'  anger. If it happened and was fixed properly the first time then I'd say tough luck. But due to the fact the repair guy was inept I have more sympathy for the tenant, though if there wasn't any food in the fridge initially, that's strange (unless it had been days and was already spoiled). 

    Now, having said that, in my lease I specify that the tenant is responsible for the maintenance and repair for the refrigerator and range. :-)

    Thanks a ton for your thorough and very helpful response. I’ll definitely be taking your advice. There’s no telling when one of the other units will need a refrigerator repair. 

    1Reply
  • Dennis M.
    Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Chris C.:
    Originally posted by @Dennis M.:
    @Sierra Hatley

    Why are you providing a freezer anyways? The more stuff you leave furnished the more calls your going to get when there’s an issue . There’s no way I’d give this tenant squat and I wouldn’t put up with the disrespect either . Unless the lease specifically says you will pay 100% of the repairs on the freezer I would certainly not be jumping through hoops for the guy . He couldn’t buy a few bags of ice to keep it cool till the repair guy got it straightened out . Your tenant sounds like a complainer . I think I’d reconsider renewing this persons lease . Sounds like a total flake

     Renting a fully unfrurnished unit? No stove, refrigerator, etc? That seems hard to get tenants

     I’m not saying don’t furnish anything in the unit , I’m saying the more stuff /electronics / appliances you add the more calls your going to get when those fail (and they will ). No reason to have more than a stove and refrigerator in the unit . 

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  • Sierra Hatley
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 8 posts · 1 vote
    7y
    Originally posted by @Dennis M.:
    Originally posted by @Chris C.:
    Originally posted by @Dennis M.:
    @Sierra Hatley

    Why are you providing a freezer anyways? The more stuff you leave furnished the more calls your going to get when there’s an issue . There’s no way I’d give this tenant squat and I wouldn’t put up with the disrespect either . Unless the lease specifically says you will pay 100% of the repairs on the freezer I would certainly not be jumping through hoops for the guy . He couldn’t buy a few bags of ice to keep it cool till the repair guy got it straightened out . Your tenant sounds like a complainer . I think I’d reconsider renewing this persons lease . Sounds like a total flake

     Renting a fully unfrurnished unit? No stove, refrigerator, etc? That seems hard to get tenants

     I’m not saying don’t furnish anything in the unit , I’m saying the more stuff /electronics / appliances you add the more calls your going to get when those fail (and they will ). No reason to have more than a stove and refrigerator in the unit . 

    Gotcha. I’m learning the hard way 

    0Reply
  • Lee L.
    Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2014 · 285 posts · 142 votes
    7y

    I would probably get them a new fridge and pay him the $180 bucks for food spoilage. It's not major money, and it's probably worth a lot more to him than  it is to you, especially now he also needs to go to the grocery store and deal with the mess, and he won't be able to cook things. Even if the food he lost was worth less than $180, I'd feel bad that my appliance failed on him ... and not just be all... "oh too bad, I'm not responsible, it says it in the lease, so I can't help you." 

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  • Sierra Hatley
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 8 posts · 1 vote
    7y

    Thank you! that’s the direction I chose to take. I discussed my position and explained that if everyone expected payment for an inconvenience then every tenant would insure an inconvenience every month. I told him I’d honor his request this time and I ordered a new refrigerator. Hopefully him and I can get back on good terms.

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  • Anthony Wick
    Rental Property Investor · Ankeny, IA · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    $180?! Did he just buy half a steer? 

    I had the identical thing happen to me, when I bought my duplex. Tenant says; "hey, did the seller tell you our fridge isn't working properly, for like 3 weeks". Well no, he did not. Anyway, spent $100 on deductible for home owners warranty. Long story short, 4 trips from 3 different repairmen, and the fridge was replaced with new one. My tenants were very nice. I went ahead and gave them $100 discount on next months rent for "lost food and troubles". I didn't have to do it, but I wanted to set this relationship on the right foot. Longer story shorter, they signed a new lease at a higher rent when the time came. 

    I'm not saying you should give him $180. I personally don't believe he lost that much food. I bet my freezer has about $30 of food at any one time. But I tend to eat fresh.

    0Reply
  • Thomas S.
    Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    7y

    "oh too bad, I'm not responsible, it says it in the lease, so I can't help you."

    Do you expect your tenants to honour the lease. Is there a reason to put language in your lease you have no intention of enforcing. If you are intending to give tenants a break or free ride the first time there is a problem then put that in the lease.

    If you are not going to honour and abide by your own lease why would you expect your tenants to honor the same lease.

    For those landlord that have a problem enforcing their lease you need to sit down a rewrite it before a tenant discovers your weakness.

    0Reply
  • Greg M.
    Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    7y

    Stuff breaks, that's life. You have an obligation to have it repaired in a reasonable amount of time. That's it. My personal opinion is that two weeks is not reasonable and if it were going to take that long, I'd just replace it. I do wonder if it would take significantly less time to repair if there was no warranty company involved. I feel that home warranties are pretty useless and it wouldn't surprise me if they intentionally slow things down knowing that you will just give up and replace the item.

    You also need wording in your lease about who pays if an appliance fails, so this won't come up again. I use: Owner is not responsible for items damaged by the failure of the appliances or the supply of water/gas/power to those appliances, including but not limited to the loss of food. This has saved me several times. You should also have wording about not being responsible for damage to the tenant's property from other issues such as a leaky roof.

    1Reply
  • Thomas S.
    Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    7y

    I personally only buy used appliances for rentals and keep spares that I can swap out immediately when there is a failure. Warranties....no thanks. I usually find appliances a couple of years old for dirt cheep, far less expensive than repairing major parts. Fridge compressors fail and are not worth repairing, stoves are easy to repair as long as main board does not fail. If it does it is not worth repairing. 

    A good used appliance for a couple of hundred or less will last as long as a new one and you don't waste time waiting for a warranty repair.

    1Reply
  • Matt K.
    Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    This is why I don't use those home warranty companies.... not worth the time or the headache. I've dealt with this as landlord and a tenant....  Simply put, I pay my rent on time and make no issues for my landlord. I don't expect the world, but if it came with the unit working... then it should work while I live in it. If it can't be repaired in reasonable time then replace it with similar unit. But the food, that's on the renter and their insurance... 

    Like said above, used appliance with warranty and forget about it. Once that breaks, get another one.... If it's a high end unit all the big box stores do 0% interest and same/next day instal...

    0Reply
  • Wesley W.
    Rental Property Investor · The Vampire State · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Greg M.:

    Stuff breaks, that's life. You have an obligation to have it repaired in a reasonable amount of time. That's it. My personal opinion is that two weeks is not reasonable and if it were going to take that long, I'd just replace it. I do wonder if it would take significantly less time to repair if there was no warranty company involved. I feel that home warranties are pretty useless and it wouldn't surprise me if they intentionally slow things down knowing that you will just give up and replace the item.

    You also need wording in your lease about who pays if an appliance fails, so this won't come up again. I use: Owner is not responsible for items damaged by the failure of the appliances or the supply of water/gas/power to those appliances, including but not limited to the loss of food. This has saved me several times. You should also have wording about not being responsible for damage to the tenant's property from other issues such as a leaky roof.

    I am adding that clause to my lease right now.  Excellent!

    0Reply
  • Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
    7y

    I own a nice home and pay a mortgage every month. You know what happens when my fridge breaks? My food goes bad and I am stuck without a fridge until a technician is available to repair it.

    You know what happens when a tenant's fridge breaks? The same thing.

    I empathize with people that lose all their food and the ability to store food but it's happened to me as an owner and it's part of life. Your responsibility as a Landlord is to fix the problem as soon as reasonably possible, which you did. It's not your fault that the technician was a bum. I recommend asking them for a refund but that's got nothing to do with the tenant and his food loss.

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  • Lee L.
    Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2014 · 285 posts · 142 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Thomas S.:

    "oh too bad, I'm not responsible, it says it in the lease, so I can't help you."

    Do you expect your tenants to honour the lease. Is there a reason to put language in your lease you have no intention of enforcing. If you are intending to give tenants a break or free ride the first time there is a problem then put that in the lease.

    If you are not going to honour and abide by your own lease why would you expect your tenants to honor the same lease.

    For those landlord that have a problem enforcing their lease you need to sit down a rewrite it before a tenant discovers your weakness.

    @Thomas S. 

    Yes, I expect them to honor the lease. I agree that it would be a good idea to have that kind of language in the lease. I also agree that there is a need to enforce the language if it is in the lease. But my decision would also depend a lot on these three factors: the amount of rent I was receiving, the cost to remedy, and the extent to which the tenant is a pain.

     My point is that if I can keep tenants happy - relatively easily and cheaply - I'd probably just do it ... on a case by case basis of course ... and my decision would depend a lot on those three aforementioned points. If by my own actions, I end up breaking my own lease to make them happy, I would definitely let them know that it does not set a precedent in any way, that I appreciate their tenancy, and hope they feel special, so they will keep paying me rent. 

    Here's how I would have probably dealt with it: 1) Check the lease. 2) Order a new fridge and cut a check for $180 to tenant. Do not attempt to repair fridge. Get a nice $500-$600 with SS finish, or if there's not enough money go on Craigslist or Habitat Humanity Restore. But do not pursue warranty or home warranty, those aren't even worth it for something trivial like this. 3) If there is language in the lease, explain to tenant how it's a 1 time thing. If there isn't the language , let tenant know there will be a letter in the mail which they must comply and sign.  (But here in my I can't do that because there's rent control ... but that's another story).  

    Anyway, for my smaller operation here in L.A. of less than 10 units (plexes and SFRs) that I self-manage, I find there is a benefit in maintaining good relationships with tenants. That's why I sometimes try to exceed their expectations on the small things, so hopefully they'll be more willing to work with me on the big things should they ever come up. 

    0Reply
  • Sierra Hatley
    OP
    Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 8 posts · 1 vote
    7y
    Originally posted by @Nathan Gesner:

    I own a nice home and pay a mortgage every month. You know what happens when my fridge breaks? My food goes bad and I am stuck without a fridge until a technician is available to repair it.

    You know what happens when a tenant's fridge breaks? The same thing.

    I empathize with people that lose all their food and the ability to store food but it's happened to me as an owner and it's part of life. Your responsibility as a Landlord is to fix the problem as soon as reasonably possible, which you did. It's not your fault that the technician was a bum. I recommend asking them for a refund but that's got nothing to do with the tenant and his food loss.

    This is such a great point. Thank you! 

    0Reply
  • Nicole A.Pro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Baltimore County Maryland and Tampa Florida · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    @Lee L. The cost of a new fridge/freezer plus $180 to "keep good relations" is  honestly a waste of money and not good business practice. You can't just throw money at problems. You also can't think that just because you did something nice for someone that they actually appreciate it. A day will come when you have to finally say "no" to them, and you will be the worst landlord in the world in their eyes despite all the previous times you said "yes".

    Yes, definitely get items fixed as soon as possible, but also giving in to any whim demand they make (such as paying for their food when they probably don't even have proof of the cost) is setting yourself up for drama, stress, and profit loss. It doesn't matter if you have just a couple of rentals or hundreds. 

    Plus, at some point with multiple tenants, you might end up saying "no" to one tenant's situation and "yes" to anothers....and they talk, and they find out you treat them all differently. Drama and trouble.

    You can be firm, friendly, and helpful but also not just throw away money simply because a tenant showed anger or other negative emotions.

    1Reply
  • Colleen F.Pro Member
    Investor · Narragansett, RI · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y

    My brand new fridge broke. LG had a qualified repair person come take a look. It was going to take 2-3 weeks to fix. The part was backordered. They said wait,   I said no way and lobbied for an alternate resolution and got one.  As you can see, I do not consider 3  weeks reasonable.  You know now it is broke I would get it replaced and move on.  The initial wait was reasonable, another 2 weeks no.   $180 is about 30 lbs of meat , it could be accurate but that is a renters insurance issue.  I would not offer half I might just offer something for this inconvenience they have experienced.

    0Reply
  • Lee L.
    Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2014 · 285 posts · 142 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Nicole A.:

    @Lee L. The cost of a new fridge/freezer plus $180 to "keep good relations" is  honestly a waste of money and not good business practice. You can't just throw money at problems. You also can't think that just because you did something nice for someone that they actually appreciate it. A day will come when you have to finally say "no" to them, and you will be the worst landlord in the world in their eyes despite all the previous times you said "yes".

    Yes, definitely get items fixed as soon as possible, but also giving in to any whim demand they make (such as paying for their food when they probably don't even have proof of the cost) is setting yourself up for drama, stress, and profit loss. It doesn't matter if you have just a couple of rentals or hundreds. 

    Plus, at some point with multiple tenants, you might end up saying "no" to one tenant's situation and "yes" to anothers....and they talk, and they find out you treat them all differently. Drama and trouble.

    You can be firm, friendly, and helpful but also not just throw away money simply because a tenant showed anger or other negative emotions.

     Whole-heartedly agree with you about the potential for drama. I haven't given much thought about that aspect, but I definitely will. I'd probably tell the tenants, "you get what you pay for," but probably in nicer terms. 

    Re: "Throwing money at problems"- At this specific case yes, but it is a problem that can be cured relatively easily and cheaply. I don't agree that it's "throwing away money" though. Get a new fridge and no problems or service calls. And tenant wouldn't be all pissed. Definitely there is a "gray" area about the responsibility. The way in which it tilts against your favor will be magnified in the eyes of the tenant if you don't comply, and he may mess up your stuff otherwise.  or spread metc. 

    Re: "Worst landlord in the eyes of the tenant" -  I say no to tenants all the time. After saying "no" I haven't found that to be the case. When I explain "no", I explain to them why their request isn't reasonable, constraints, etc. 

    0Reply
  • Chris C.
    Raleigh, NC · Member since 2017 · 347 posts · 94 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Karl B.:

    When I was in graduate school this happened to me. I had to throw out the food in my freezer and the owner refused to cover the food. Like a brat, I remember tossing a package of hot dogs in the flower bed outside my front door. lol

    The fridge/freezer was ancient but they did correctly repair it. 

    One option is to purchase a new fridge for the tenant (I buy mine at the Sears scratch and dent store because they're often 50%-60% of the price of a new, undamaged fridge). 

    Then have the warranty company fix the broken one and you can have that fridge as a backup for a different unit. 

    I can understand the tenants'  anger. If it happened and was fixed properly the first time then I'd say tough luck. But due to the fact the repair guy was inept I have more sympathy for the tenant, though if there wasn't any food in the fridge initially, that's strange (unless it had been days and was already spoiled). 

    Now, having said that, in my lease I specify that the tenant is responsible for the maintenance and repair for the refrigerator and range. :-)

     So you supply the refrigerator and stove initially, but if they break, you make your tenants fix or get a new one? 

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