Tenant Smoking Marijuana In Apartment

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Tenant Smoking Marijuana In Apartment

Enyi Ajoku
Rochester, NY · Member since 2016 · 107 posts · 19 votes

I have 3 young lads who are renting one of my apartments (a 2 unit multifamily) I will use names as Mr A, Mr B and Mr C. Mr A  is signatory to the lease but on the lease is states that MR B and Mr C will also be living in the apartment. On the lease it states no smoking on the property. On Thursday i got a call from the fire department that the shed on the property was destroyed by fire. The information i got from Mr C was that there were kids on the property and neighbors called the police on them and after the time he got back he saw police and the fire department trying to quench a fire. I immediately called the other tenant (Miss B and a 10yr old daughter) and the information i got from her was that these gentlemen smoke and sell marijuana to those kids.

 I also was able to get pictures from Mr B social media account smoking on the enclosed porch of the apartment, which i saved to my phone. My question is can i use these images in eviction court or any court as evidence. Thank You and happy holidays 

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James Wise
Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
7y
Originally posted by @Enyi Ajoku:

I have 3 young lads who are renting one of my apartments (a 2 unit multifamily) I will use names as Mr A, Mr B and Mr C. Mr A  is signatory to the lease but on the lease is states that MR B and Mr C will also be living in the apartment. On the lease it states no smoking on the property. On Thursday i got a call from the fire department that the shed on the property was destroyed by fire. The information i got from Mr C was that there were kids on the property and neighbors called the police on them and after the time he got back he saw police and the fire department trying to quench a fire. I immediately called the other tenant (Miss B and a 10yr old daughter) and the information i got from her was that these gentlemen smoke and sell marijuana to those kids.

 I also was able to get pictures from Mr B social media account smoking on the enclosed porch of the apartment, which i saved to my phone. My question is can i use these images in eviction court or any court as evidence. Thank You and happy holidays 

 My man I suspect you are going to be in for a rough rough ride. These aren't the 1st tenants of yours who smoke weed & they certainly won't be the last. If the Police determine that illegal drug activity is going on at the property they will typically let you know. The city will actually force you to evict tenants who've been proven to be doing that type of stuff & as a landlord it would be required by law for you to act.

Outside of that though you aren't a cop or detective. Don't get involved in that nonsense. Stop snooping through their Facebook pages. Your job is to collect rent. Collect the rent. Nothing more & nothing less. Otherwise you'll be evicting people every 3 weeks & you'll be running around doing a bunch of nonsense that doesn't pay your bills. Rent pays your bills. Collect the rent. 

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  • Tami R.
    Clive, IA · Member since 2013 · 141 posts · 89 votes
    7y
    @Mary Mitchell. Didnt say that but you have solid citizen high quality tenants. Btw they smoke weed.
    1Reply
  • Dave DeMarco
    Rental Property Investor · Pittsboro, NC · Member since 2016 · 97 posts · 85 votes
    7y

    Just collect rent? Really? Did I miss something in this post? 

    These people are selling drugs out of your property AND just burned down a shed on the property and the advise you get is just collect rent. And there is a 10 year old living there with them...Yeah, just keep collecting rent. What else could possibly go wrong? 

    8Reply
  • Charles Kao
    Specialist · Grand Rapids, MI · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 611 votes
    7y

    @Enyi Ajoku

    If you make the complaint it will be hard but if you have another tenant on record of complaining then you can get a 30

    day granted by judge because you are arguing not only is it against lease but it is preventing your ability to provide a undisturbed living environment for tenant. I would actively ask if any tenants have issues with it so you can take that to judge. Photos will help but best case is a 30

    day notice.

    1Reply
  • Mary M.
    Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Tami R.:
    @Mary Mitchell. Didnt say that but you have solid citizen high quality tenants. Btw they smoke weed.

    not understanding your comments, sorry.  

    0Reply
  • Tchaka Owen
    Real Estate Agent · Merritt Island, FL · Member since 2017 · 986 posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Enyi Ajoku - I would send written notice that you're terminating the lease because they violated it by smoking. If they don't leave, file an eviction. I wouldn't mention marijuana unless necessary because it doesn't matter what they're smoking. Lease says no smoking, that's all that matters. If it goes to court, then yeah you can point out it's an illegal substance. IMO, that's not relevant.

    0Reply
  • James Wise
    Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Dave DeMarco:

    Just collect rent? Really? Did I miss something in this post? 

    These people are selling drugs out of your property AND just burned down a shed on the property and the advise you get is just collect rent. And there is a 10 year old living there with them...Yeah, just keep collecting rent. What else could possibly go wrong? 

    It has not been proven that these tenants sell drugs. It also hasn't been proven that these tenants burned down the shed. You can't evict paying tenants in this country because you have a feeling that they are doing something. They have rights. The legal system doesn't work that way. If you don't want to take my word for it here you'll have to take the judges word for it after setting some of your money on fire.

    2Reply
  • Dave DeMarco
    Rental Property Investor · Pittsboro, NC · Member since 2016 · 97 posts · 85 votes
    7y

    Dude, the person who LIVES THERE says they are selling drugs...

    There are pictures of them smoking it up in the property (on Facebook? Seriously?).

    I'll grudgingly give you the fire point, but we all know this most likely happened because of them. But hey, you go ahead and wait on our glorious legal system to get that handled for you before these geniuses do something even MORE serious and keep collecting that rent. 

    You may need it. 

    0Reply
  • James Wise
    Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Dave DeMarco:

    Dude, the person who LIVES THERE says they are selling drugs...

    There are pictures of them smoking it up in the property (on Facebook? Seriously?).

    I'll grudgingly give you the fire point, but we all know this most likely happened because of them. But hey, you go ahead and wait on our glorious legal system to get that handled for you before these geniuses do something even MORE serious and keep collecting that rent. 

    You may need it. 

     Not enough evidence to win the case my man. A neighbor saying they are smoking weed is irrelevant in the court of law. What would be relevant is the tenant being convicted of a possession with intent to distribute charge. Landlord's only job is to collect then rent until that does or does not happen.

    0Reply
  • Dave DeMarco
    Rental Property Investor · Pittsboro, NC · Member since 2016 · 97 posts · 85 votes
    7y

    @James Wise Damn! A witness, photographic evidence that literally millions upon millions of people can see, and a fire that's GOING to expose these guys, and that's to flimsy to evict in a court of law???

    We're doomed... ;)

    0Reply
  • Enyi Ajoku
    OP
    Rochester, NY · Member since 2016 · 107 posts · 19 votes
    7y

    My lease says no smoking on the property.

    The tenant with the 10yr  old said they smoke and sell weed. 

    So Rochester NY have areas where one block could be D,E class neighborhood and like 3 or 5 blocks down its A,B,C neighborhood. This property in my opinion is a C neighborhood (this is me being highly pessimistic)  

    There lease ends in May

    I had to go over there today and i saw sticks of smoked cigarettes on the porch. I will be sending out a notice, i also took pictures.

    I will be going out there a lot more often and will be doing a monthly inspection of the apartment 

    3Reply
  • Dave DeMarco
    Rental Property Investor · Pittsboro, NC · Member since 2016 · 97 posts · 85 votes
    7y

    @Enyi Ajoku Exactly what any good business owner would do. Good luck!

    1Reply
  • James Wise
    Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Dave DeMarco:

    @James Wise Damn! A witness, photographic evidence that literally millions upon millions of people can see, and a fire that's GOING to expose these guys, and that's to flimsy to evict in a court of law???

    We're doomed... ;)

     Lol, am I to assume you haven't been involved in too many eviction proceedings?

    2Reply
  • Bryan S.
    Rental Property Investor · CA · Member since 2018 · 225 posts · 180 votes
    7y

    @Enyi Ajoku LIL BIT OF REEFER MADNESS. GOLLY G.

    in all seriousness, not something I would be concerned about if they are smoking outside.

    0Reply
  • Marcia Maynard
    Investor · Vancouver, WA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y

    Your property, reputation, and peace of mind are at risk.

    You must actively manage your properties and address issues as they arise, real or perceived.

    There is more than one issue here:

    1.  Property damage. Who is culpable? Who is liable?  How will you be properly compensated? What steps will you take to prevent something like this from happening again? Verify the insurance coverage of the tenant named on the lease. They can be held culpable if they or one of their invitees caused the damage. Contact your insurance agent for guidance.

    2. Local ordinances. What ordinances might apply to this situation?  What support can you get from the Fire Department and Police Department? Were any laws breached? Selling drugs within a certain distance from a school can be very serious.

    3.  Lease violations. Review your rental agreement. Identify all terms that have been violated. Serve the appropriate notices to "comply or vacate." Name the person on the lease and all "other occupants" to cover your interests.

    4.  Improve your rental agreement. All adults who reside at the property should be properly screened and named on the lease as "jointly and severally liable". Require every person who resides there to recommit to your rental agreement terms.  If your terms are not clear or easily misunderstood, rewrite them at the next possible interval. This is where MTM rental agreements shine; with one you can change the terms much more readily to meet your needs. Consider not renewing the lease when it expires. Consider using a MTM agreement in the future.

    5.  Improve enforcement of your rental agreement. Sit down with all of the occupants of this property and review the terms of the rental agreement. Increase monitoring of the property. Seek out information that may shed light on the situation. Google the names of all occupants. I see no problem with checking social media sites for clues and evidence. If you see evidence that the tenant violated terms of your rental agreement, address it head on. Remember that every move will potentially elicit a counter move. Know the landlord-tenant laws for your jurisdiction better than the tenants. Have the moxie to do what you need to do.

    Good Luck!

    5Reply
  • Matthew Olszak
    Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Enyi Ajoku:

    I have 3 young lads who are renting one of my apartments (a 2 unit multifamily) I will use names as Mr A, Mr B and Mr C. Mr A  is signatory to the lease but on the lease is states that MR B and Mr C will also be living in the apartment. On the lease it states no smoking on the property. On Thursday i got a call from the fire department that the shed on the property was destroyed by fire. The information i got from Mr C was that there were kids on the property and neighbors called the police on them and after the time he got back he saw police and the fire department trying to quench a fire. I immediately called the other tenant (Miss B and a 10yr old daughter) and the information i got from her was that these gentlemen smoke and sell marijuana to those kids.

     I also was able to get pictures from Mr B social media account smoking on the enclosed porch of the apartment, which i saved to my phone. My question is can i use these images in eviction court or any court as evidence. Thank You and happy holidays 

     So did the fire department tell you that the fire was set by someone smoking in the shed? If not, your note about them smoking (anything) on the property is about as relevant as the brand of cereal that they feed their children in the morning. There is always that one neighbor who is a problem - they have too much time on their hands, bored sitting around home on disability or retirement, and always trying to rile up problems for lack of any other activity in their lives.

    As such, when a neighbor calls me about "fighting couples" or "drug dealing" or "too many people coming through late at night", I then ask them, "So you called the cops, right?". Response is almost always, "Well, no, but I wanted to give you a heads up". Same thing with nosy tenants. If there is something illegal going on, give me a police report and I can take action based on that (and at my discretion). Otherwise, my company isn't a police department and I'm not going to interrupt my PAYING tenants based on a HUNCH from an unrelated 3rd party.

    My advice - investigate the shed fire, determine if the tenant is at fault based on the HARD FACTS. If no firm determination can be made, you have to eat that cost. The drug dealing - tell the reporting neighbors to call the cops. Its their job to investigate, and you can then act based upon the results of their professional investigation.

    4Reply
  • Chris Virgil-Stone
    Rental Property Investor · Cape Coral, FL · Member since 2015 · 206 posts · 83 votes
    7y
    As @Bryan Scott said, I'd do inspections, however frequent is necessary. While I personally don't consider smoking some marijuana highly concerning, groups of people smoking it and selling it in a multi family is and I would start the eviction process immediately upon evidence of doing so. You don't want your properties to be known as places to buy drugs. Also, with the multi family it can make other tenants feel uncomfortable and unsafe which will lead to higher turnover. If a fire was truly started because of it, then it becomes a safety concern. Depending on local laws- knowledge of this and doing nothing to correct the issue can lead to liability suits. I let tenants know and is stated in my leases that use or sale of any illegal drugs is grounds for eviction.
    1Reply
  • Cheryl Butler
    Professional · Delaware, OH · Member since 2017 · 52 posts · 39 votes
    7y

    Maybe it's an Ohio thing, but I'm with @James Wise. As long as these guys are paying their rent and not making my life miserable, I would not start stirring. We all have plenty of horror stories about tenants, and this isn't really one of them. BTW, is smoking weed still considered criminal activity? 

    2Reply
  • Henri Meli
    Investor · Morrisville, NC · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 673 votes
    7y

    @Enyi Ajoku . Tons of great tips and gems in this thread. Please write down some of these tips. Some of us learned these the very hard way. A poor decision can cost you a lot.

    Being a successful real estate investor really depends on your ability to master some of the lessons provided here. 

    1Reply
  • Tracy Horn
    Lender · Colorado, Missouri & Alabama · Member since 2018 · 21 posts · 16 votes
    7y

    while smoking may not be a concern to some, you’re limiting your potential client base as non smokers, those with allergies, parents and those recovering are adverse to renting when units have smoke.  Also consider the resale value.

    The cost to TSP the walls and all surfaces remediating the oil residue is expensive as is replacing carpet and furnishings.

    3Reply
  • Account Closed
    Lender · Pensacola, FL · Member since 2017 · 658 posts · 626 votes
    7y

    I'm not a lawyer, but when landlords know of illegal activities happening on their properties, they risk being accused of being an accomplice if they don't take action. Insurance companies might also have a say in the matter regarding whether they will pay a claim or not.

    0Reply
  • Brian Juris
    Real Estate Agent · Palm Springs, CA · Member since 2018 · 19 posts · 12 votes
    7y

    In the future, you should aim to be more clear with your no smoking policy within the terms of the lease. It should be more well-defined so that you are covering your bases in terms of notice to your tenants. There's also the human side of it. It depends on how frequent this is, and the level of disturbance that it's causing to other tenants or neighbors. Over communication on the front end is always better. 

    1Reply
  • Account Closed
    Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Enyi Ajoku:

    I have 3 young lads who are renting one of my apartments (a 2 unit multifamily) I will use names as Mr A, Mr B and Mr C. Mr A  is signatory to the lease but on the lease is states that MR B and Mr C will also be living in the apartment. On the lease it states no smoking on the property. On Thursday i got a call from the fire department that the shed on the property was destroyed by fire. The information i got from Mr C was that there were kids on the property and neighbors called the police on them and after the time he got back he saw police and the fire department trying to quench a fire. I immediately called the other tenant (Miss B and a 10yr old daughter) and the information i got from her was that these gentlemen smoke and sell marijuana to those kids.

     I also was able to get pictures from Mr B social media account smoking on the enclosed porch of the apartment, which i saved to my phone. My question is can i use these images in eviction court or any court as evidence. Thank You and happy holidays 

    So, with all due respect, you have not yet figured out how to be a landlord/property manager. Maybe after the entire building is set ablaze, instead of just the shed, you might get around to evicting the arsonist living in your property. Maybe after attending the funeral of the 10 year old kid who lives in the building, you might decide to not live in perpetual fear and prejudice and take some action.

    This business is NOT for everyone. If you do not know how to be assertive, you need to learn how to be so like yesterday. OMG - you think dope smoking is the issue at hand here...dude. The problem is you.

    2Reply
  • Al Pat
    Rental Property Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2016 · 325 posts · 253 votes
    7y

    @Enyi Ajoku, first and foremost, you need to give them a lease violation notice due to property damage and ask them to cure it within seven days or pay for erecting the shed. Also, since fire department was called, would this become public record that can adversely impact your landlord insurance? I don’t know.

    Besides the point, you need to evict the tenant because this is an eye opener.

    1Reply
  • Amber Gonion
    Real Estate Broker · Hugo, MN · Member since 2016 · 688 posts · 596 votes
    7y

    @Enyi Ajoku when I first started in property management I chased my tail trying to figure out which unit was smoking pot, and calling to police, evicting them etc. now after years of management and 800 units as a regional manager I know better than to waste my resources on it.

    Someone selling drugs is different, but some things are just better to let go and give them a warning than to spend money to fix a problem.

    0Reply
  • Marcia Maynard
    Investor · Vancouver, WA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Matthew Olszak:
    Originally posted by @Enyi Ajoku:

    I have 3 young lads who are renting one of my apartments (a 2 unit multifamily) I will use names as Mr A, Mr B and Mr C. Mr A  is signatory to the lease but on the lease is states that MR B and Mr C will also be living in the apartment. On the lease it states no smoking on the property. On Thursday i got a call from the fire department that the shed on the property was destroyed by fire. The information i got from Mr C was that there were kids on the property and neighbors called the police on them and after the time he got back he saw police and the fire department trying to quench a fire. I immediately called the other tenant (Miss B and a 10yr old daughter) and the information i got from her was that these gentlemen smoke and sell marijuana to those kids.

     I also was able to get pictures from Mr B social media account smoking on the enclosed porch of the apartment, which i saved to my phone. My question is can i use these images in eviction court or any court as evidence. Thank You and happy holidays 

     So did the fire department tell you that the fire was set by someone smoking in the shed? If not, your note about them smoking (anything) on the property is about as relevant as the brand of cereal that they feed their children in the morning. There is always that one neighbor who is a problem - they have too much time on their hands, bored sitting around home on disability or retirement, and always trying to rile up problems for lack of any other activity in their lives.

    As such, when a neighbor calls me about "fighting couples" or "drug dealing" or "too many people coming through late at night", I then ask them, "So you called the cops, right?". Response is almost always, "Well, no, but I wanted to give you a heads up". Same thing with nosy tenants. If there is something illegal going on, give me a police report and I can take action based on that (and at my discretion). Otherwise, my company isn't a police department and I'm not going to interrupt my PAYING tenants based on a HUNCH from an unrelated 3rd party.

    My advice - investigate the shed fire, determine if the tenant is at fault based on the HARD FACTS. If no firm determination can be made, you have to eat that cost. The drug dealing - tell the reporting neighbors to call the cops. Its their job to investigate, and you can then act based upon the results of their professional investigation.

    The fire department notified the owner of the duplex about the fire.

    The owner contacted the tenants on both sides of the duplex and inquired about what happened.

    One tenant from the first unit (Mr C) told the owner there were kids on the property and a neighbor (not clear which neighbor) called the police about it. A fire broke out and the police and fire department responded.

    One tenant from the second unit (Miss B - the woman with the 10 year old daughter) told the owner that the three tenants in the first unit (Mr A, Mr B, Mr C) smoke and sell marijuana to those kids.

    The tenants in both units of this duplex have a right to peaceful enjoyment of their home. They are all PAYING tenants. They have all agreed to the terms of the rental agreement. Neither the tenants from the first unit nor the second unit contacted the owner about the fire. The owner reached out to the tenants of both units to collect more information. It's in the best interest of the owner to followup on the information he received from both Mr C and Miss B.  He certainly needs to find out more about what is happening at his property and investigate the matter of the fire. In the course of following up on what he was told (the impressions of both Mr C and Miss B) he finds evidence of lease violations, then he must respond appropriately and issue proper legal notices. It appears from the most recent post from the owner, he is doing that.

    @Michael Olszack...   This has nothing to do with the type of neighbors you talk about in your post. As a residential rental property owner myself, who manages 17 units of our own, I've found neighbors can be quite helpful in alerting me to problems at our properties or in the neighborhood. I don't negatively stereotype neighbors. Instead, I reach out to neighbors and give them our contact information. I ask them to contact me if any problems arise at our property.  I'd much rather get a heads up about a perceived problem, than deal with the fall out after things have gotten out of hand. A few times when neighbors have called me, I've been able to get to the property and witness the disturbance and take care of the matter without police involvement.  We've developed a reputation for being good neighbors and community players. When it's warranted for the police to respond, they readily do. I believe we have a civic duty to effectively manage our properties and reduce the number of calls to 911.

    5Reply
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