California ADU business

California ADU business

Rental Property Investor · Santa Maria, CA · Member since 2019 · 158 posts · 81 votes

What's up guys,

I just finished building a permitted ADU (accessory dwelling unit) on my sfh. Converted my garage into a 488 sq ft 1cbed 1 bath apartment. final cost with permits was about 37k. I built most of it with my old man and only had to outsouce a few things. The cash flow is great from this unit alone and I plan on building another unit on the right side of my house. Ca just passed SB 13 along with 2 accessory bills effective Jan 1st 2020 that no longer require owner occupancy, city's can't charge impact fees, and can add up to 2 units per lot (not including the home itself). From what I read the bill allows 1 jr adu (under 500 sq ft) and 1 adu (above 500 sq ft, max 1200). Luckily where I live there is rarely ever any need for AC or heater use). Does this seem like a good market to hit in y'alls opinion? From my research, there is way more money in this at least for my area. A typical duplex goes for about 400k in my area and doesn't bring you cashflow nowhere near close to what an ADU brings. I'm just curious to see how much value the units will add to a home since this is fairly new (from a legal perspective anyway). The only drawback from this I see besides needing the cash to fund it, is for an investor who prefers to get all their cash invested back from a deal will more than likely not get everything back at the end especially if they contract everything out ( the lowest quote I got for the ADU was about 60-70k but that was just an estimate and could have been more).

Average rent for ADUs in my area:

1 bed 1 bath- $1000-$1300

2bed 1 bath- $1300-$1600

Something tells me they can go for a little bit more because I had tenants bidding for my unit within the first week of construction.

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Chris MasonPro Member
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Lender · CA · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 10k+ votes
6y
Originally posted by @David Maldonado:

What's up guys,

The cash flow is great from this unit alone and I plan on building another unit on the right side of my house. C

Danger Will Robinson, Danger!

A single family home with multiple ADUs cannot be financed using Fannie, Freddie, FHA, VA, or USDA. Basically, there went good 30YF financing, both for you (should you ever want to refinance) and for your pool of buyers (should you ever want to sell).

A house that can't be institutionally financed with good 30yf rates is going to lose a LOT of resale value. Your buyer pool is essentially reduced to cash buyers, and a savvy cash buyer will figure out why they are the only offer on the table, and reduce what they are willing to offer in turn (since they know they can't refi to pull the liquidity back out of the house for redeployment elsewhere).

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Real Estate Agent · FRESNO, CA · Member since 2016 · 60 posts · 42 votes
    6y

    @Ronnie S. I guess it would depend on whether Santa Monica decides to go off the date of the permit or the certificate of occupancy, which hasn't been issued yet. I like Jin's idea of letting it lapse and then reissuing it. Taking advantage of this investor friendly window would be worth it!

  • Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2019 · 145 posts · 49 votes
    6y

    Nate not being silly here but will your power lines be close to or over your ADU?

  • Member since 2020 · 2 posts · 0 votes
    6y

    The power lines are close, but we're building far enough away from them. My architect knows the rules, and we have also double checked with LADWP on minimum distances, including higher above on the second floor. LADWP actually has to come out and verify things too once we have our plans I believe, to make sure we're far enough away. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Fullerton, CA · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 7 votes
    6y

    I’ve got my Long Beach property under contract where I plan to permit 2 ADUs!

    What are your opinions on separate meters for utilities for each unit vs not separating if I don’t intend for the property to be owner-occupied?

  • Poway (San Diego) · Member since 2018 · 25 posts · 7 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @David Maldonado:
    Originally posted by @Adam Bileckyj:

    David, thank you for sharing! Besides the technical aspects how has it

    been knowing there is someone living so close and dealing with any

    potential noise conflicts (loud TV or whatever)? I don't see how its much

    different then how people live in an apartment separated by a wall but I

    am curious as to your thoughts and your wife's. I am considering something similar, the wife is hesitant. 

     Hey Adam,

    You're right its not that different than living in a multifamily but on the plus side we get to live in a residential neighborhood. I built a double wall with RC channels and inside that minimize the noise (could barely hear anything coming from the unit. I also have a decent size back yard and added a fence to the unit to separate the yards. My wife doesn't mind it at all because we still have our privacy It's not bad at all especially for some excellent cash flow.

     Thanks for the input! 

  • Rental Property Investor · Santa Maria, CA · Member since 2019 · 158 posts · 81 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Marinelle Tan:

    I’ve got my Long Beach property under contract where I plan to permit 2 ADUs!

    What are your opinions on separate meters for utilities for each unit vs not separating if I don’t intend for the property to be owner-occupied?

     It might be more convenient and will ease the utitlity cost between the units but I heard it can cost up to 10k for separate meters. I would just take over utilities, find a way to add a submeter to the adus, calculate power usage and then bill the adu tenants accordingly. You can just add the gas and water bill on top of the rent. 

  • Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2014 · 205 posts · 123 votes
    6y

    Very interesting thread. Maybe someone can clarify for me. If you build a detached ADU from the ground up you are required to put solar but if you convert something existing you are not?

    Anyone with experience on this? 

  • Santa Clara, CA · Member since 2018 · 100 posts · 71 votes
    6y
    @Nate Whitaker:

    Are you able to share what is your understanding of vertical and horizontal distances from power-lines and easements?

  • Rental Property Investor · Lancaster, CA · Member since 2015 · 103 posts · 55 votes
    6y

    @David Frandsen. If It is an existing structure you will not need solar. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Santa Maria, CA · Member since 2019 · 158 posts · 81 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @David Frandsen:

    Very interesting thread. Maybe someone can clarify for me. If you build a detached ADU from the ground up you are required to put solar but if you convert something existing you are not?

    Anyone with experience on this? 

    According to my city's inspectors: solar is only required if its a detached ADU separate from the house so for your scenario yes you be required to add solar. But if you build an attached adu (shares a wall with the main house) you do no need solar. It will also be considered an addition.

  • Poway (San Diego) · Member since 2018 · 25 posts · 7 votes
    6y

    So, I just spoke to engineering/permits at the city hall and they told me there is a residency requirement if I build both an ADU and JADU. I thought there was a grandfather clause until 2025. Who is right here?

  • Rental Property Investor · Santa Maria, CA · Member since 2019 · 158 posts · 81 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Adam Bileckyj:

    So, I just spoke to engineering/permits at the city hall and they told me there is a residency requirement if I build both an ADU and JADU. I thought there was a grandfather clause until 2025. Who is right here?

     Yeah someone brought that up as well. My question is what if someone who met their 1 year occupancy for on their home wants to move into another owner occupied home but they have a jadu and an adu?

  • Real Estate Agent · FRESNO, CA · Member since 2016 · 60 posts · 42 votes
    6y

    The confusion regarding the JADUs and owner occupancy comes from the information source. If you read AB 68, it clearly states renting out a JADU requires owner occupancy. If you read the revised 65852.2, (Section (a)(6) & (e)(1)), it seems to tie the JADU to the ADU non occupancy requirement until 2025.

    https://www.hcd.ca.gov/community-development/housing-element/docs/ADU_TA_Memo_Final_01-10-20.pdf

    After 2025, those who permitted ADUs/JADUs will continue to be able to rent out their properties without living in them. Those permitted after 2025 will not.

  • Poway (San Diego) · Member since 2018 · 25 posts · 7 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Barbie Steele:

    The confusion regarding the JADUs and owner occupancy comes from the information source. If you read AB 68, it clearly states renting out a JADU requires owner occupancy. If you read the revised 65852.2, (Section (a)(6) & (e)(1)), it seems to tie the JADU to the ADU non occupancy requirement until 2025.

    https://www.hcd.ca.gov/community-development/housing-element/docs/ADU_TA_Memo_Final_01-10-20.pdf

    After 2025, those who permitted ADUs/JADUs will continue to be able to rent out their properties without living in them. Those permitted after 2025 will not.

    Thanks for clarifying that. Looks like there is a "grandfather" clause here if you build by 2025. 

  • Ronnie S.Pro Member
    Investor · Coeur d Alene, ID · Member since 2013 · 109 posts · 29 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Barbie Steele:

    The confusion regarding the JADUs and owner occupancy comes from the information source. If you read AB 68, it clearly states renting out a JADU requires owner occupancy. If you read the revised 65852.2, (Section (a)(6) & (e)(1)), it seems to tie the JADU to the ADU non occupancy requirement until 2025.

    https://www.hcd.ca.gov/community-development/housing-element/docs/ADU_TA_Memo_Final_01-10-20.pdf

    After 2025, those who permitted ADUs/JADUs will continue to be able to rent out their properties without living in them. Those permitted after 2025 will not.

    @Barbie Steele I want to make sure I understand what you said so I can apply it to my situation. I am in Santa Monica and started my ADU project in 2018 but was permitted in 2017. Would I be able to rent out both my main house and ADU and not be subject to the owner occupancy rule? Sorry for the repeated question. thank you

  • Dan H.Pro Member
    Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Ronnie S.:
    Originally posted by @Barbie Steele:

    The confusion regarding the JADUs and owner occupancy comes from the information source. If you read AB 68, it clearly states renting out a JADU requires owner occupancy. If you read the revised 65852.2, (Section (a)(6) & (e)(1)), it seems to tie the JADU to the ADU non occupancy requirement until 2025.

    https://www.hcd.ca.gov/community-development/housing-element/docs/ADU_TA_Memo_Final_01-10-20.pdf

    After 2025, those who permitted ADUs/JADUs will continue to be able to rent out their properties without living in them. Those permitted after 2025 will not.

    @Barbie Steele I want to make sure I understand what you said so I can apply it to my situation. I am in Santa Monica and started my ADU project in 2018 but was permitted in 2017. Would I be able to rent out both my main house and ADU and not be subject to the owner occupancy rule? Sorry for the repeated question. thank you

    ADU in state of Ca for 5 years no owner occupied requirement.

    JADU in state of Ca can have owner occupied requirement but I suspect senator Wienkowski, or another senator or member of the assembly, may work on this soon.  If you have a good JADU candidate you may be best served by being patient. 

    Good luck

  • Aliso Viejo, CA · Member since 2020 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @John A Murray:
    Originally posted by @Leah Anderson:

     

    Hi Leah

    We are just getting started, and are waiting on the city to plan check our ADU; our architect submitted it on January 29. Don't foresee any problems but keep hearing conflicting info about solar panel requirement. That's my only question/concern at this point.

    Very good that you had it built to code. Is the contractor who converted the garage still around? He might have info that would assist you in permitting the ADU, and would be the best guy to deal with the city on your behalf. In any event you'll find out soon enough what needs to be done. 

    We are going to update here as we progress and it would be good to follow your progress.

    Hi John,

    Thank you for sharing that info. I hired an architect last week and he will submit plans to the city next week. I chose to higher an architect to draw up the plans and get them approved. I found that it was hard to get an accurate quote, because we are unsure as to what current modifications the city will allow us to keep (plumbing and electrical). Once I have the city’s OK to move forward, I then plan to get construction quotes. Has the city approved your plans yet? If so, what was the experience like? Did they mandate any changes to your submitted plans?  

    Thanks! 

  • Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2019 · 145 posts · 49 votes
    6y

    Originally posted by @Leah Anderson:

    Still waiting on it...30 days so far. New state law says cities have 60 days so we shall see. They used to approve these over the counter. Just hope they aren’t going to come up with new way(s) to separate my money from me.

    FYI my architect says he was told at the counter that I do not have to “solarize” my existing detached garage conversion.

  • Aliso Viejo, CA · Member since 2020 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @John A Murray:

    Originally posted by @Leah Anderson:

    Still waiting on it...30 days so far. New state law says cities have 60 days so we shall see. They used to approve these over the counter. Just hope they aren’t going to come up with new way(s) to separate my money from me.

    FYI my architect says he was told at the counter that I do not have to “solarize” my existing detached garage conversion.


    That seems correct, solar only applies to brand new construction and does not apply to an additions or conversions. I am paying $5000 for my architect. Half of that ($2500) will go toward the construction cost if I use his company for the construction. Does that sound about right to you? 

  • Real Estate Investor · Orange County, CA · Member since 2013 · 39 posts · 4 votes
    6y

    Does anyone know how much it'll cost to add solar panel to a detached ADU 800 sq ft? Also how would we even know how many panels to get if it's a newly built ADU that no one has ever lived in? The requirement seem so loose and so could I technically just have like 1 panel to fulfill that requirement? Thanks

  • Rental Property Investor · Santa Maria, CA · Member since 2019 · 158 posts · 81 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Leah Anderson:
    Originally posted by @John A Murray:

    Originally posted by @Leah Anderson:

    Still waiting on it...30 days so far. New state law says cities have 60 days so we shall see. They used to approve these over the counter. Just hope they aren’t going to come up with new way(s) to separate my money from me.

    FYI my architect says he was told at the counter that I do not have to “solarize” my existing detached garage conversion.


    That seems correct, solar only applies to brand new construction and does not apply to an additions or conversions. I am paying $5000 for my architect. Half of that ($2500) will go toward the construction cost if I use his company for the construction. Does that sound about right to you? 

     5k for architect fees is pricey but since he's offering half of that to go towards construction that's not bad. My architect did mine for 1800.

  • Investor · Walnut, CA · Member since 2017 · 72 posts · 37 votes
    6y

    So a main house has solar panels and produces about 10-15% over than the needed. No battery. A 1200sqft detached ADU would prob consume 25-30% the rate of the main house making it about approx 15% lacking in producing enough power for equal production to usage on the entire property. It would be a undue financial restriction for solar on the ADU to produce that 15%. Think I would be successful to petition this requirement?

  • Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2019 · 145 posts · 49 votes
    6y
    I found the answeR in one of the Title 24 notices, and if I remember correctly they required around 2kw, which here in So Cal costs $5500, after 28% Federal Tax Credit it would be around $4,000.Cant find the notice/site but if you look long enough you’ll find it.

    Originally posted by @David T.:

    Does anyone know how much it'll cost to add solar panel to a detached r in one oftADU 800 sq ft? Also how would we even know how many panels to get if it's a newly built ADU that no one has ever lived in? The requirement seem so loose and so could I technically just have like 1 panel to fulfill that requirement?




  • Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles · Member since 2018 · 25 posts · 11 votes
    6y
    I would be interested in connecting with 1-2 people based in SoCal that would like to meet in person periodically to compare notes. The goal is to become an expert on ADU's and the sub-topics that relate to them. Current financing available, construction costs and how to reduce them, appraisal trends, best practices when building on investment properties, rental values, design trends, how to minimize the construction time, which cities are helpful and which aren't, etc. I also have a couple great ideas up my sleeve that I would be happy to share with this proposed group, but that I won't be posting on any blog! Please reach out if you are interested.
  • Real Estate Investor · Orange County, CA · Member since 2013 · 39 posts · 4 votes
    6y

    @John A Murray

    Thanks for the info John. I couldn’t the info you posted anywhere. Maybe I need to dig deeper.

    If anyone has any info on the solar requirement, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks

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