Unfair madness! Landlords getting hosed.

General Landlording & Rental Properties
6yFollow

Unfair madness! Landlords getting hosed.

David J.
Investor · shawnee oklahoma · Member since 2017 · 194 posts · 148 votes

Some Perspective... 0.15%

That's the percent of American people who have Covid-19 at the time of this writing.  NOT even 1% of the total population.

Suppose the disease were to quadruple before this is over, that would only be 0.6%. Still not even 1%

I am not saying the Covid-19 pandemic is not serious. It is serious! But bear with me, I'm going somewhere here.

Percent of tenants with eviction protection 100%

Specifically in California landlords have been totally neutered.

THIS IS NOT RIGHT, THIS IS NOT FAIR!

Private citizens should not be compelled by law to provide free housing at their own detriment. As a landlord for 20+ years this is the most backwards and un-American situation I have ever seen. What good are constitutional protections, checks and balances if they only serve us when convenient? We need our rights, and freedom most when times are difficult. Where is the ACLU?

Do I think a tenant who has suffered a hardship outside of their control should be thrown out into the street? No of course not. But, 99.9% of landlords will do everything in their power to work with a tenant ALREADY, if for no other reason because they don't want to pay for turnover and vacancy.

I think some responsible laws could be put in place that prohibit abusive landlords from unfair evictions and also require landlords to work with tenants, but the current situation is totally 1 sided and unfair!

Consider, if a tenant loses their job they have options. They can apply for aid, they can look for an online job. They could take a temp position at a grocery store if they like. However, if a landlord has a tenant who can't (or wont') pay rent they can ask for rent and hope for cooperation but can do nothing beyond that to improve their situation.

This absurd! Is anyone thinking this through? How can this possibly not end badly? Allow me to list some problems.

  1. If a tenant hears they "don't have to pay rent", many will simply push it as far as they can regardless of their actual ability to pay or not pay. Why not cease the moment? Wouldn't you?
  2. If a landlord does put a 3 days or quit notice and the tenant doesn't comply. Normal law states that the landlord can not collect anymore rent AFTER the 3 days are up, or the 3 day pay or quit notice is invalid. Does this mean landlords should just allow the tenant to live free till September or until (heaven only knows) when they are able to evict? Does letting a tenant free load till September seem like a good idea?
  3. Most landlords would agree that tenants who get behind really land themselves in a circle of debt they can't climb out of anyway. Thinking a repayment plan with landlords can work is basically fiction. AKA nonsense.
  4. How long till landlords start getting stretched too thin and start taking matters into their own hands? Anything is possible, Violence, fake insurance claims etc? That is a scary outcome that I don't want to even think about. (Please nobody do this)
  5. How long till landlords get fed up and say screw it and just let the bank have the property back?
  6. How long till word gets out about how landlords are being treated and many future (would be landlords) say, no thank you? How many current landlords will just get out of the game. (never want to take that risk again)

TL:DR; This is a disaster and I don't even know what to do anymore.

PS: I do have abusive tenants who are purposely leveraging the situation and not paying simply because they don't have to.

17Reply
572 views

Most Popular Reply

Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
6y
Originally posted by @David J.:

@Jay Hinrichs Simply because it's not a problem for you or 90% of others does not mean it's not a valid problem. Landlords are being denied their civil liberties and property rights. The implications of this are huge! 
Also restaurants and hotels all each have their own arguments to wage but it's apples to oranges. At least restaurants can do take out, and hotels can claim insurance or sell their space to the government as a make shift hospital. But I maintain this is out of scope for my point. Regardless, how unfair it is for them, it doesn't suddenly make this fair for landlords. Landlords should NOT be denied their rights!

@Amer Mallah I agree about not making projections. Only casting some perspective. We have a whole lot of fear and irrational thinking taking place. I sure hope we see some changes. We need solutions that protect tenants without allowing landlords to be helpless victims themselves. That's just trading one problem for another. 
I also agree that the screening process is going to get much more intense. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if rents go up to compensate for the whole new level of risk landlords were just made aware of. 

these are once in a lifetime issues ..  I mean just think of all the small business's that were forced to close.. who is going to rescue them

if anything landlords to my way of thinking have gotten massive help.. their tenants got 1200 bucks ( at least most) and increased unemployment.. then you have section 8.. If the tenants choose to pocket the money and not give it to the landlord that's not the govmits fault..  it just is what it is everyone is suffering..  I mean there is no bail out for us homebuilder developers  !!!  Or real estate agents who cant show houses  it goes on and on.. so like I said to me landlords have gotten huge help far more than many.. Not to mention mortgage forbearances etc..

If the landlord for whatever reason gets in financial difficulty because tenant misses one a few rent payments.. then I think landlord needs to revisit their reserves policies.

Podcast Guest on Show #222
JLH Capital Partners51 Review
WebsiteView Page
21Reply
See this reply in the discussion

166 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • Brian Van Pelt
    Specialist · Owings Mills, MD · Member since 2017 · 485 posts · 415 votes
    6y

    @Gary L Wallman

    I hear you and agree, When this thing started , My wife and I thought it would have been better to shut down everything,  the stock market, payments of mortgages, credit cards, auto payment's, everything but the basic necessities for 4 to 9 months. Give the whole world a chance to slow the spread and and possibly get a vaccine started. Sure we would have taken  a hit to the global economy, but just like the Great Depression, Bank holidays served a purpose. Once this slows down, and it will, The Butchers Bill will come due with all of this "Whatever it takes" nations are playing Musical Chairs with the world economy and REITS will be just one of the many future shocks waiting to happen.

    1Reply
  • David J.
    OP
    Investor · shawnee oklahoma · Member since 2017 · 194 posts · 148 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Jeb Shookman:

    Some common issues I see in this thread that annoy me:

    1. The difference between voluntary charity (landlords helping troubled tenants) and forced charity via the government (extremely over-broad).

    2. The idea that if someone can find people in a worse situation than you, then your troubles are not legitimate.  You can always find worse off people, even after this crisis ends.  Doesn't mean our concerns aren't legit.

    3. The idea that if you are concerned about being forced to house unwanted people and concerned about the hit to your business, that apparently means you have no cash reserves and haven't planned for problems at all and will go bankrupt immediately based on your poor planning.  I have cash reserves for quite a long time, but vast amounts of cash lost still significantly hurts my goals and my family.  We don't get to judge each other's goals.


    I think most people want to be compassionate and can weather bad things for a certain amount of time.  I personally am worried more about the indefinite nature of these orders.  ... and the illusion that the stimulus bill helps landlords when it really doesn't.

    I loved reading this, and I agree on all accounts. #3 keeps coming up a lot and it's just such a ridiculous point to make.

    #3 can either come in the form of "real estate has risk" (yeah who cares, not the point AKA MOOT)... OR ... "you should have 6 months reserves".

    It's like LOOK, I don't care if I have 10 years reserves, I STILL do not want the government to take away my rights. Forcing me to accept theft is and of itself criminal. My problems should not be less important than someone else's problems.

    I'm just happy to see some people do indeed get this. 

    1Reply
  • Kathy Utiss
    Specialist · O'Fallon, MO · Member since 2010 · 148 posts · 46 votes
    6y

    The government will do whatever they want to do. At least that's my theology. How did I come to such a conclusion? Well in my case my story starts before birth. Only it's taken me year's to figure out just how much they really operate with "Unclean Hands." I'm not saying the crisis isn't real. As I'm now a essential employee vs one of America's top 3rd party mortgage collectors for two of the top banks in our country. 

    For the million's that have to face eviction for whatever reason you would never think you would face eviction over the way you have to pay. As being one of America's top mortgage collectors I'm limited in how many ways I can pay. As I lost my job over a couple of circumstances. The 1st being an employer who lied    (for 2.5 YEARS) about their contractual ability to sell mortgage notes for one of the largest banks in the world. The 2nd being a rogue debt investor whose only intent is to put money in her pocket. Who has no hindrance suing a bank or homeowner just the same. She really takes the cake. I found out in the last few years she got accused even of hiding assets in court. 


    At any rate the only way I could pay is if I could get honest biz done for my investors that I've gained a repore with. One was willing to buy NPN to the tune of like $150,000 per month. But they wouldn't sell them the notes because they weren't spending $3-$4 million per month on NPN's. My other investor had $10 million to $50 million per month for deficiency balance notes. They couldn't get biz done either. As once said bank sold the worst possible notes they still wanted to make money on them! Excuse me but how the hell do u continue to make money on something you just sold? It is the equivalent of paying cash for an auto at $5,000 then saying give me an additional $300 a month indefinitely!

    To summarize I lost my job as my employer once again lied about their written ability to sell mortgage notes for one of our largest banks. I went to court with the only way I had to pay. My attorney sold me under the bus after I did everything I was supposed to in order to have a way to be responsible. As I was raised to be such like many other millions of American's. It really defeats having a way to pay if no one will listen! 

    After what my attorney did I sued a Fed Judge for all the people that go to court with no way to pay it defeats having a way to pay if no one will listen! I made two separate federal judges recuse. The 1st summarily denied everything as frivolous.( That I filed everything to harass the court!)  Yet I've always stayed out of court, and had/have a fiduciary responsibility to speak if I can do things to avoid bad things happening for millions of people.

     Then Sua Ponte-On Her Own Motion--Came back disqualified, and recused.  The next judge recused as well. Thereafter, I was surprised she (1st Judge) sounded like a "Wild West" character as she was known as "Hang Em High Jackson". 

    My grandmother unfortunately died in 2011. Prior to death she wanted me to find out as much as I could about our family history. Omg I figured out I have been DNA tracked. And that it never mattered that I went to court with a way to pay. As any KYC-Know Your Client-Form I would or could do would be inaccurate. As I've figured out my uncle was the miner for the man over the 1st Holding Co in all America. And even if they lost the assets somehow they have still claimed for over 80 years my family never existed. And everyone in the country knows my grandmother by the world famous fictional name they gave her. They as well have made over $200 million claiming she was FICTIONAL! Then I found out the man my uncle was a miner for someone has put my grandmother in this family tree. The man who paid to say she never existed is in this family tree as well. Even one of the family members had the farm the "White-house" sits on!

    How I figured out I was DNA tracked is I was threatened by a rogue POS who tries to demoralize people by threatening their jobs.(Not Trump) He knows why I'm tracked! As I was threatened when I informed one person of what I know and they went blabbering him. I was then threatened that even if I found out about the money I'd NEVER GET TO IT! Only I didn't know at the time what he was talking about!

    Yep most jobs lie to get you in the door...In the biz a few years do you think I didn't ask them if they had the written ability to sell the notes prior to taking the job?   Of course they did is what I was told. Who would think a company could get by with lying about such written ability? But what employee is going to get such a bank to show that WRITTEN ABILITY? Or that you would have to decipher everything you learn to understand what they really have coming next for all of US?

    0Reply
  • Matthew Paul
    Severna Park, MD · Member since 2013 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    6y

    Landlords need to wake up and see this harsh reality for what it is . Courts are closed for evictions , they have been for a month . It will probably go another month or 2 . In my area you usually have a 30 day wait . When all this is over the courts will be FLOODED with evictions . You wont see the inside of a court room for 3 months after that . ( tenants will be 6 months plus paying no rent ) . The sheriffs will be backlogged for months after that for scheduling the physical ejections .  Throw politics into the mess , how will it look if the courts are throwing out thousands of families  on the street ? 

    The government , without putting it in exact terms , has basically forgiven the tenants from paying rent at the landlords expense . 

    For some landlords , this will be a blood bath . 

    3Reply
  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Kathy Utiss:

    The government will do whatever they want to do. At least that's my theology. How did I come to such a conclusion? Well in my case my story starts before birth. Only it's taken me year's to figure out just how much they really operate with "Unclean Hands." I'm not saying the crisis isn't real. As I'm now a essential employee vs one of America's top 3rd party mortgage collectors for two of the top banks in our country. 

    For the million's that have to face eviction for whatever reason you would never think you would face eviction over the way you have to pay. As being one of America's top mortgage collectors I'm limited in how many ways I can pay. As I lost my job over a couple of circumstances. The 1st being an employer who lied    (for 2.5 YEARS) about their contractual ability to sell mortgage notes for one of the largest banks in the world. The 2nd being a rogue debt investor whose only intent is to put money in her pocket. Who has no hindrance suing a bank or homeowner just the same. She really takes the cake. I found out in the last few years she got accused even of hiding assets in court. 


    At any rate the only way I could pay is if I could get honest biz done for my investors that I've gained a repore with. One was willing to buy NPN to the tune of like $150,000 per month. But they wouldn't sell them the notes because they weren't spending $3-$4 million per month on NPN's. My other investor had $10 million to $50 million per month for deficiency balance notes. They couldn't get biz done either. As once said bank sold the worst possible notes they still wanted to make money on them! Excuse me but how the hell do u continue to make money on something you just sold? It is the equivalent of paying cash for an auto at $5,000 then saying give me an additional $300 a month indefinitely!

    To summarize I lost my job as my employer once again lied about their written ability to sell mortgage notes for one of our largest banks. I went to court with the only way I had to pay. My attorney sold me under the bus after I did everything I was supposed to in order to have a way to be responsible. As I was raised to be such like many other millions of American's. It really defeats having a way to pay if no one will listen! 

    After what my attorney did I sued a Fed Judge for all the people that go to court with no way to pay it defeats having a way to pay if no one will listen! I made two separate federal judges recuse. The 1st summarily denied everything as frivolous.( That I filed everything to harass the court!)  Yet I've always stayed out of court, and had/have a fiduciary responsibility to speak if I can do things to avoid bad things happening for millions of people.

     Then Sua Ponte-On Her Own Motion--Came back disqualified, and recused.  The next judge recused as well. Thereafter, I was surprised she (1st Judge) sounded like a "Wild West" character as she was known as "Hang Em High Jackson". 

    My grandmother unfortunately died in 2011. Prior to death she wanted me to find out as much as I could about our family history. Omg I figured out I have been DNA tracked. And that it never mattered that I went to court with a way to pay. As any KYC-Know Your Client-Form I would or could do would be inaccurate. As I've figured out my uncle was the miner for the man over the 1st Holding Co in all America. And even if they lost the assets somehow they have still claimed for over 80 years my family never existed. And everyone in the country knows my grandmother by the world famous fictional name they gave her. They as well have made over $200 million claiming she was FICTIONAL! Then I found out the man my uncle was a miner for someone has put my grandmother in this family tree. The man who paid to say she never existed is in this family tree as well. Even one of the family members had the farm the "White-house" sits on!

    How I figured out I was DNA tracked is I was threatened by a rogue POS who tries to demoralize people by threatening their jobs.(Not Trump) He knows why I'm tracked! As I was threatened when I informed one person of what I know and they went blabbering him. I was then threatened that even if I found out about the money I'd NEVER GET TO IT! Only I didn't know at the time what he was talking about!

    Yep most jobs lie to get you in the door...In the biz a few years do you think I didn't ask them if they had the written ability to sell the notes prior to taking the job?   Of course they did is what I was told. Who would think a company could get by with lying about such written ability? But what employee is going to get such a bank to show that WRITTEN ABILITY? Or that you would have to decipher everything you learn to understand what they really have coming next for all of US?

     I have to be completely honest - I'm not sure I understood a word of this. The best I could make out is that you worked for someone who let you go, you sued your employer, the federal courts and some other people, and that you have some people in your family tree who were allegedly swindled out of your family's inheritance years ago including the land the White House sits on. And that some rogue Rothschild-type conspiracy has tracked you down. Do I have this right? 

    Podcast Guest on Show #243
    Skyline Properties
    View Page
    4Reply
  • Kathy Utiss
    Specialist · O'Fallon, MO · Member since 2010 · 148 posts · 46 votes
    6y

    In Sept 2001 I accepted employment with an agency that lied for 2.5 years about their written ability to sell mortgage notes. Had they not lied I wouldn't have been selling mortgage notes. After, I lost my job because they lied I still had a way to pay my bills. But no amount of money was enough to get honest biz done. 

    It's after this that I started to doing my ancestry work. Having been one of America's top mortgage collectors the 1st thing I did was check to see if my great grandfather updated any info I didn't have that would enable me to understand what happened to him. 

    As he was in early "Hollywood" he was a "Showman." He had a sideshow/freak-show he traveled our country with.  It was known as "The Hollywood Sideshow." By researching him thru out "The Billboard" I found out he was biz associates with "Johnny Coons."

    If you don't know who this was he was the son of "Carleton Coon." If you've still never heard of these names I invite you to look at "The Coon Sanders Nighthawks" the 1st Novelty Orchestra on radio. The 1st band to make radio famous vs radio making someone famous. As their initial touring fee's earned helped start MCA. 

    "Johnny Coon" ended up staying in the music biz. He worked for the ARA-American Recording Artists. He represented the likes of Red Foley, Roy Acuff, and Maurey Amsterdam. His grandfather "Claude Coon" sold the syrup that went on to become Coca-Cola.

    A magician who knew my great grandfather wrote a book including information that show's my great grandfather once worked for "Ripley's in Hollywood."  I'm sure this is probably when "Lou Dufour" was still with "Royal American Shows."  When I checked to see if he updated info he gave the names we knew him by. His stage name of "Johnny Howard." The supposed family name of "John Edward Sundstrom."  His father he put down as both a Howard/Sundstrom as well. His mom he put down as "Katie O'Hara as in "Gone with the Wind." I thought it was all a fluke of information. Who wouldn't right? 

    Yet my great uncle whose wife was my great grandmother's sister was a miner. He was involved in many industries gold, copper, silver, steel, coal,rolling mills, and railroads. He also was involved with the quarry that provided the stone for many courthouses, post offices, and other buildings in Texas, and Arkansas.

     The list goes on and on. One of the main men he was a miner for was "William Collins Whitney." If you don't know who he was well he was over the "1st Holding Company in all America." It was his grandson "Jock(John Hay)Whitney" who PAID to say my great grandmother NEVER EXISTED. "Jock" was the son of "Helen Hay" the daughter to "John Hay" the right hand man to "Abe."

    "Mr. Whitney" was married twice his 1st wife married him into "The Standard Oil Fortune." His 2nd wife was "Edith Randolph." The daughter of Dr. Frederick May. He is the Doctor who examined both "Abe" and "John Wilkes Booth." In doing more family research there are people who put my grandmother down with a different father into the Whitney family tree. The same tree Jock is a part of. His sister was Joan Whitney Payson. Her husbands family once owned the farm the "White house" sits on. She also once owned "The NY Mets. 

    https://www.amazon.com/Side-Show-Geeks-Freaks-Vagabonds/dp/0941543285

    http://www.archive.org/stream/twentiethcenturyv1padd#page/n565/mode/2up

    0Reply
  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Kathy Utiss:

    In Sept 2001 I accepted employment with an agency that lied for 2.5 years about their written ability to sell mortgage notes. Had they not lied I wouldn't have been selling mortgage notes. After, I lost my job because they lied I still had a way to pay my bills. But no amount of money was enough to get honest biz done. 

    It's after this that I started to doing my ancestry work. Having been one of America's top mortgage collectors the 1st thing I did was check to see if my great grandfather updated any info I didn't have that would enable me to understand what happened to him. 

    As he was in early "Hollywood" he was a "Showman." He had a sideshow/freak-show he traveled our country with.  It was known as "The Hollywood Sideshow." By researching him thru out "The Billboard" I found out he was biz associates with "Johnny Coons."

    If you don't know who this was he was the son of "Carleton Coon." If you've still never heard of these names I invite you to look at "The Coon Sanders Nighthawks" the 1st Novelty Orchestra on radio. The 1st band to make radio famous vs radio making someone famous. As their initial touring fee's earned helped start MCA. 

    "Johnny Coon" ended up staying in the music biz. He worked for the ARA-American Recording Artists. He represented the likes of Red Foley, Roy Acuff, and Maurey Amsterdam. His grandfather "Claude Coon" sold the syrup that went on to become Coca-Cola.

    A magician who knew my great grandfather wrote a book including information that show's my great grandfather once worked for "Ripley's in Hollywood."  I'm sure this is probably when "Lou Dufour" was still with "Royal American Shows."  When I checked to see if he updated info he gave the names we knew him by. His stage name of "Johnny Howard." The supposed family name of "John Edward Sundstrom."  His father he put down as both a Howard/Sundstrom as well. His mom he put down as "Katie O'Hara as in "Gone with the Wind." I thought it was all a fluke of information. Who wouldn't right? 

    Yet my great uncle whose wife was my great grandmother's sister was a miner. He was involved in many industries gold, copper, silver, steel, coal,rolling mills, and railroads. He also was involved with the quarry that provided the stone for many courthouses, post offices, and other buildings in Texas, and Arkansas.

     The list goes on and on. One of the main men he was a miner for was "William Collins Whitney." If you don't know who he was well he was over the "1st Holding Company in all America." It was his grandson "Jock(John Hay)Whitney" who PAID to say my great grandmother NEVER EXISTED. "Jock" was the son of "Helen Hay" the daughter to "John Hay" the right hand man to "Abe."

    "Mr. Whitney" was married twice his 1st wife married him into "The Standard Oil Fortune." His 2nd wife was "Edith Randolph." The daughter of Dr. Frederick May. He is the Doctor who examined both "Abe" and "John Wilkes Booth." In doing more family research there are people who put my grandmother down with a different father into the Whitney family tree. The same tree Jock is a part of. His sister was Joan Whitney Payson. Her husbands family once owned the farm the "White house" sits on. She also once owned "The NY Mets. 

    https://www.amazon.com/Side-Show-Geeks-Freaks-Vagabonds/dp/0941543285

    http://www.archive.org/stream/twentiethcenturyv1padd#page/n565/mode/2up

     Well, all that is a fascinating story - not sure how it relates to landlords getting hosed, but nevertheless interesting. That said, I don't think I would lay claim to owning the Mets in public - I'm a longtime Mets fan and as every Mets fan knows, Mets ownership sucks and has always sucked! 😅

    Podcast Guest on Show #243
    Skyline Properties
    View Page
    3Reply
  • David J.
    OP
    Investor · shawnee oklahoma · Member since 2017 · 194 posts · 148 votes
    6y

    Just look at what we are up against. This news article is so manipulative it makes me want to puke. They are trying to make landlords look like monsters. Meanwhile the attorney in the clip says it could be 12 months till property owners have their rights back and not one person bats an eye. How is this called journalism????????

    https://abc7news.com/video/emb...

    1Reply
  • Alberto Marin
    San Diego, CA · Member since 2018 · 12 posts · 3 votes
    6y

    @David J. its shocking to me how many people in this post don't understand your point..........

    3Reply
  • Paul Doherty
    Rental Property Investor · Mc Kinney, TX · Member since 2013 · 50 posts · 50 votes
    6y
    To OP, why aren't you moving to take advantage of the CARES Act which has provisions for two 6 month forbearances without penalties or interest (throws the loan payments to the end of the loan, extending the loan by the same number of months)?  That's precisely the situation this is for (non-paying tenants due to the virus).  Just document the non-payment and if possible get the reason documented from the renter and then contact your mortgage servicer.  

    https://www.natlawreview.com/a...

    "Federally Backed Mortgages Borrowers under federally backed family mortgages may submit a forbearance request if they are experiencing financial hardship due to the COVID-19 crisis. The lender must grant the request, without penalties, fees or interest, for a period of up to 180 days (subject to another 180 day extension at borrower’s request). Foreclosure action is prohibited for the 60 day period beginning March 18, 2020. Multi-family borrowers (assets designed for occupancy of 5 or more families) are entitled to forbearance and foreclosure protection on slightly different terms, and renters of such dwellings are provided eviction protection."

    https://assets.documentcloud.o...

    Starting on page 567

    FEDERALLY BACKED MORTGAGE LOAN.— The term ‘‘Federally backed mortgage loan’’ includes any loan which is secured by a first or subordinate lien on residential real property (including individual units of condominiums and cooperatives) designed principally for the occupancy of from 1- to 4 families IN GENERAL.—During the covered period, a borrower with a Federally backed mortgage loan experiencing a financial hardship due, directly or indirectly, to the COVID–19 emergency may request forbearance on the Federally backed mortgage loan, regardless of delinquency status, by— (A) submitting a request to the borrower’s servicer; and (B) affirming that the borrower is experiencing a financial hardship during the COVID– 19 emergency. DURATION OF FORBEARANCE.—Upon a request by a borrower for forbearance under para-graph (1), such forbearance shall be granted for up to 180 days, and shall be extended for an additional period of up to 180 days at the request of the borrower, provided that, at the borrower’s request, either the initial or extended period of forbearance may be shortened. ACCRUAL OF INTEREST OR FEES.—During a period of forbearance described in this subsection, no fees, penalties, or interest beyond the amounts scheduled or calculated as if the borrower made all contractual payments on time and in full under the terms of the mortgage contract, shall accrue on the borrower’s account."

    Over 90% of residential mortgages (4 unit or less properties) are covered by Fannie/Freddie/Ginnie.

    0Reply
  • Richard Mace
    Rental Property Investor · Montclair, VA · Member since 2020 · 11 posts · 3 votes
    6y

    @Jason J.

    TLDR

    The world is unfair... you sound like, well.

    0Reply
  • David J.
    OP
    Investor · shawnee oklahoma · Member since 2017 · 194 posts · 148 votes
    6y

    @Richard Mace Cool Story Bro!

    @Paul Doherty "throws the loan payments to the end of the loan, extending the loan by the same number of months"

    Not my service provider. They want me to pay a balloon payment at the end of the forbearance. It's a joke. Tenants won't come up with the corresponding balloon payment. I don't have a need for forbearance as I am in no risk of not paying my loan. What I need is the ability to evict bad tenants who are taking advantage of this crisis.

    5Reply
  • Richard Mace
    Rental Property Investor · Montclair, VA · Member since 2020 · 11 posts · 3 votes
    6y

    @Jason J.

    Lol I was kidding.

    But I definitely had to scroll for a minute to get to your reply.

    1Reply
  • Brad D.
    San Diego, CA · Member since 2011 · 85 posts · 67 votes
    6y

    What's happening to property rights right now via Landlords inability to evict or have controlling authority over their property is scary. What's scarier is that Property Rights are probably as secure in the US as anywhere on the planet.

     If you look at past past revolutions in Russia, China, Cuba and many others, they involve the government expropriating land from 'evil' landlords 'in the name of the peasants.' South Africa is doing something similar now to the Farmers. The Government gets to enrich itself, be the 'good' guy, and the peasants have their lives improved slightly (at least in the short run). The only loser in this is the evil, feudal landlord who had it coming anyway for his sins against the poor. Obviously I don't think this is happening in the US for many years, and hopefully not ever; but this is a pattern for how revolutions usually unfold. The top and bottom against the middle. 

    1Reply
  • Susan O.
    Fresno, CA · Member since 2015 · 552 posts · 181 votes
    6y

    I couldnt agree more Jason. It's like certain industries have to hold up others and they're picking and choosing. It's easy for the government to scapegoat landlords as everyoneone paying rent feels a little hatred for them since it's recurring.  
    @Jason J. do you have any more political updates or how we can fight this back? I think too many get pulled through the mud but we don't have a strong voice like big businesses do or unions since they're more centralized.

    0Reply
  • Susan O.
    Fresno, CA · Member since 2015 · 552 posts · 181 votes
    6y

    A lot of renters are hosing landlords and theyre also just starting up tenant unions whle they take advantage of small landlords



    This is from Time magazine too

    https://time.com/5846383/coronavirus-small-landlords how devistating the eviction moratorium is on small landlords and how theres very little help for small biz landlord

    You can organize join your landlord or apartment association locally to prevent this and also network with like minded people.  Please help spread word

    https://www.facebook.com/CAAnet/

    AB 1436 Allows Tenants to Live Rent Free for Years
    Tell the State Legislature to vote NO

    Oppose AB 1436 Now

    San Francisco Assembly Member David Chiu just unveiled AB 1436, a proposal to force landlords to defer rents for 15 months after a state or local state of emergency is lifted - which can translate to years of unpaid rent - if a tenant is unable - or unwilling - to pay rent due to COVID-19.

    CAA is committed to finding common sense so

    0Reply
  • Fernan Nava
    Rental Property Investor · Barstow, CA · Member since 2015 · 131 posts · 102 votes
    6y

    Ladies and Gentlemen this is raw and undiluted politics. The party in control of this state can and is doing anything it wants, that will cement their power for eternity. This is the mentality of let no crisis go to waste. Wake up fellow residents and fight these suckers in their own turf, the political arena. I know you are  not one but for the sake of our kids and generations to come, you are gonna have to wear that hat as well,

    2Reply
  • Susan O.
    Fresno, CA · Member since 2015 · 552 posts · 181 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Fernan Nava:

    Ladies and Gentlemen this is raw and undiluted politics. The party in control of this state can and is doing anything it wants, that will cement their power for eternity. This is the mentality of let no crisis go to waste. Wake up fellow residents and fight these suckers in their own turf, the political arena. I know you are  not one but for the sake of our kids and generations to come, you are gonna have to wear that hat as well,

     Agreed they're basically using the "let no crisis go to waste" to shove anything that destroys investments.  It's headed downward but it's actually a national thing.  They say where california politics go so does the national politics but decades later. So CA should be the first place to stand up, educate yourself and do what you can

    This is the National Apartment Association

    https://www.naahq.org/

     also a non profit- that advocates for landlords, prop investors etc.  It's about investing into housing to improve community 



    https://www.naahq.org/advocacy/naapac

    Politicians playing hot potato with who's going to hold the bill and it looks like nationally it's handed to commercial investors the most followed by multifamily and housing

    1Reply
  • David J.
    OP
    Investor · shawnee oklahoma · Member since 2017 · 194 posts · 148 votes
    6y

    Here we are MONTHS later. About 1.8% of Americans have (or have had) Covid-19
    Of that 1.8% , 97% Recover.

    I still can't evict for ANY REASON.

    I don't care what anyone says, this is ludicrous! 

    3Reply
  • Ron Flatt
    Investor · Hillsboro, TX · Member since 2017 · 358 posts · 245 votes
    6y
    I am so sorry for those of you that have the dead beat tenants, in states that will not allow evictions.  I have had one eviction and it was pre-Covid, (so he got to me for 4 months, but he is out now). 
    We all need to look at what has happened and learn from it. 
    #1)  Do not over leverage.
    #2)  Keep some cash in reserve
    #3)  Screen prospective tenants
    #4)  Look out for new deals
    Let's all learn, grow stronger and continue along.  
    Be Blest
     

    0Reply
  • Ron Flatt
    Investor · Hillsboro, TX · Member since 2017 · 358 posts · 245 votes
    6y

    I am so sorry for those of you that have the dead beat tenants, in states that will not allow evictions.  I have had one eviction and it was pre-Covid, (so he got to me for 4 months, but he is out now). 
    We all need to look at what has happened and learn from it. 
    #1)  Do not over leverage.
    #2)  Keep some cash in reserve
    #3)  Screen prospective tenants
    #4)  Look out for new deals
    Let's all learn, grow stronger and continue along.  
    Be Blest
     

    0Reply
  • Rick K.
    NJ · Member since 2018 · 3 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    @Jason J.   Totally agree with you. Surprised there isn't outrage!  Or at least the media isn't showing the outrage and hardship landlords are taking. Our liberal media only encouraging no payment of rent.  Landlords are handcuffed and nothing can be done about it.

    See NJ Governor Phil Murphy's press conference for no evictions.  Ignorant!  He states to show 'compassion'... "To all landlords... those who try to evict we will make an example out of you." Make an example of you!  Go ahead, make an example of hardworking individuals who have a family of their own provide shelter for and feed. Who worked, saved, and made sacrifices to get where they are today.  In addition, Murphy signed a bill to allow tenants to use security deposit for rent.

    Owner of several SFRs. One tenant who we have showed 'compassion' to for years due to an incident, has constantly played rent catch up. Eventually, fell behind too much and once too often, right before pandemic hit. Filed for eviction in February, court date March postponed. Tenant taking advantage of situation and refuses to pay any rent.

    Another tenant, who was in good standing, asked to use the security deposit for rent since "the governor said she could."

    1Reply
  • Susan O.
    Fresno, CA · Member since 2015 · 552 posts · 181 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @David J.:

    Here we are MONTHS later. About 1.8% of Americans have (or have had) Covid-19
    Of that 1.8% , 97% Recover.

    I still can't evict for ANY REASON.

    I don't care what anyone says, this is ludicrous! 

     Super unfair gov

    1Reply
  • Colleen F.Pro Member
    Investor · Narragansett, RI · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    5y

    I am curious how people feel about things now 8 months down the road with eviction moratoriums still in place in many areas.  

    1Reply
  • Ricardo P.
    LakeWood , CA · Member since 2018 · 268 posts · 331 votes
    5y

    @Colleen F. 8months where did you hear this great news?? Let’s remember we now have a democratic president. We are easy looking at a 12month eviction moratorium. Easy! 

    2Reply
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.
Log InJoin for Free