Let's for a moment take the politics out of the plan to allow 4million immigrants to stay here per executive order. I don't want to debate the left or right. I know we all have opinions and most are quite strong either way.
I am looking at this from a rental standpoint. If I am a buy/hold investor this feels like a dream come true. Millions of people who most likely cannot buy a home in the near term and will need a place to live. My initial thought is that many of these people will be forced into lower rental areas and perhaps some a bit better.
I feel like many will begin to travel away from the south and start going towards MW and NE without concern for deportation and the chance to work legally.
Any thoughts out there?
-Caveat - my opinions personally may not match my business view....but then again maybe they do?
I think seller financing and lease to own over long periods (eg 5 - 10 years).
Even a lease and a ROFR.
Immigrants are appreciative and responsible, if you can speak the language!
@Jackie Lange hit send before I finished! After foreclosing on the original gentleman, would it have been possible to claim some sort of trespass charge if no lease agreement was able to be provided?
I tried trespassing, code violations, and eviction but no court would touch it because they were all illegals. They said it had to go through ICE. But ICE would not do anything
If you ever start buying REOs (or other properties forcibly taken from their "owners"), you'll realize that your assertion that only non-legal immigrants cause property damage is completely ridiculous...
I would never buy REOs there are too many better ways to buy houses at much better prices. Of course I know that legals cause property damage too - but I've never seen any to the extent of this property.
It's probably ridiculous to think that people should come in to the country legally too.
Be VERY careful renting or selling to undocumented workers ( previously called illegals). I once sold a property to a guy who had an green card. He had great income. Then he moved 3 other illegal families in to the house. The guy I sold to moved out and no where to be found. I foreclosured for non-payment but the illegals stayed. It was next to impossible to get these illegals out of the property. I called ICE in Dallas, they said call DC. DC said call Dallas. Three illegal families and Immigration nor the police would not do a darn thing.
Finally, the illegals left with the HVAC system stolen, the garage door missing, a sledge hammer taken to the walls, all cabinets stolen. Anything they could remove to sell... they took it.
Anyone who was previously in the USA illegally, obviously has no regard for the rule of law.
So I would not consider the millions of new un-illegals good prospects for renting or selling to.
Strongly disagree. Whilst I understand that you are affected by the experience that you had, I would say that your remarks are unjust. I believe that illegal immigrants have MORE motivation to be good law abiding civilians.
They usually want to live a quiet, peaceful life and pass under the radar.
An illegal immigrant would want to have absolutely no altercations with the police which would put them at threat of being detected and deported.
How do you even know they were in the country illegally?
So, so sorry for my ignorance but I am not a US native so my knowledge on immigration issues is not up to date.
How is Obama turning illegal immigrants into un-illegal immigrants?
Can someone tell me what the proposed policies are and are these actually going to come into affect based on the rumor that Obama probably won't get another term in office?
If this is going to breach any political posting rules, feel free to private message me!
It's probably ridiculous to think that people should come in to the country legally too.
Every market is different, and every time is different. I've bought in markets and at times where REOs were the best deal in town (based on high volume purchasing); and I've bought in markets and at times where there wasn't a single good REO deal within 250 miles. Real estate is local and you can't make generalizations that apply to every market at every point in time.
As to whether people should only come into a country legally, that's a political discussion and not for this thread. But, again, you should be careful with generalizations and broad strokes...
@Bill Gulley perhaps I am better off finding those 7th grade spanish language books! I do believe you are right on with things remaining stable.
Maybe the question here is who will cater to and in turn profit from these folks as they grow their families and incomes/savings. My family is from Ireland and came to Boston. A generation later and we are all over the place.....
Well, if anyone wants to speak with me, they'll speak English. :)
Who will cater to "these folks"? Same ones catering to the rest of the folks needing housing!
I'd say this may end up going to the Off Topic forum, there is no unique RE influence here, it skirts on prejudicial and political.
Implying that any illegal alien is a criminal (other than just being here illegally) is absurd. Bad tenants come in all stripes. To my knowledge I've never had an illegal alien as a tenant, my worst tenant ever was a white red neck idiot who was from this area, who is willing to serve this group?
Dealing in RE, in the public, requires those in RE to set aside their personal views as to race, religion, political views and other areas of discrimination for them to conduct business professionally. Setting people into groups or labeling them in classes is something you can do in privacy if you must, but not publically.
My prejudice is with the stupid, but I have learned to tolerate them the best I can and I will serve them in RE as well, I never gave an IQ test to a tenant, and I'm much more tolerant when I can see that their affliction and circumstance is beyond their control. It's too bad that stupid can't be deported or changed in most cases.
RE is only one element (a large one) to our economy. those to be served include everyone and there are no subsets of people that effect the economic base of RE. I think Native Americans have been against immigration since around 1492! :)
OK, enough. Back to the question at hand about the effect of this executive order on real estate. Further posts off that topic will be removed.
@Bill Gulley thank you for the comment. I am surprised to hear that you do not think there will be a particular way to cater to this new population. I was getting an oil change the other day and all signs were bilingual, not standard in my area. This is what I mean by catering. If I am listing a unit for rent I will be inclined to advertise in English and probably Spanish as well. I will ask my PM to do the same.
It would appear at this point basically no one else on this thread sees this as a "significant" change in the marketplace.
If I was to move to a non-english speaking location I would be inclined to seek out those that speak my language whether it is for directions, a place to live, or anything else for that matter. I see this as opportunity locally regarding my holdings as I speak three languages(spanish and mandarin) and this has allowed me to communicate directly with tenants.
I appreciate all the debate heard thus far and although it seems many see no change coming I will choose to have my contracts in multiple languages and hire PMs that can speak and advertise effectively based on population.
As my father has always said, money is always green and everyone speaks that language!!!
@Bill Gulley thank you for the comment. I am surprised to hear that you do not think there will be a particular way to cater to this new population. I was getting an oil change the other day and all signs were bilingual, not standard in my area. This is what I mean by catering. If I am listing a unit for rent I will be inclined to advertise in English and probably Spanish as well. I will ask my PM to do the same.
It would appear at this point basically no one else on this thread sees this as a "significant" change in the marketplace.
If I was to move to a non-english speaking location I would be inclined to seek out those that speak my language whether it is for directions, a place to live, or anything else for that matter. I see this as opportunity locally regarding my holdings as I speak three languages(spanish and mandarin) and this has allowed me to communicate directly with tenants.
I appreciate all the debate heard thus far and although it seems many see no change coming I will choose to have my contracts in multiple languages and hire PMs that can speak and advertise effectively based on population.
As my father has always said, money is always green and everyone speaks that language!!!
LOL, I think my point was missed, again, you refer to "this new population", there is no new population!
Would you perhaps consider that it's your perception of "those people" being more of the issue than that of reality?
Perhaps up there in your neck of the woods there are Spanish speaking people migrating to your area, that might be new to the Irish folks up there, I'd bet that all languages are spoken in my state, we aren't changing signs or contracts. I think the slip and fall signs included Spanish at Wall-Mart about 20 years ago.
Changing signs and contracts may open up your pool of clients to market to, but they are not some population that just appeared or will be introduced to the country, people who speak Spanish have been here before the country exited.
I'd say you're the only one who perceives this as some change in the marketplace, it may be due to your lack of exposure in society on a national basis. I understand, I've met several in this area who have never ventured outside of a 150 mile radius of their home. Not saying you have ventured out, but the marketplace is not changing do to immigration in any significant manner as much as it may with the natural growth of our population.
Yep, everyone speaks money!
@Bill Gulley My mortgage company estimates that by 2017 almost half of all purchases will be by Hispanics. So a little more education in Spanish wouldn't hurt us Gringos.
From what I keep hearing everybody across the political spectrum seems to agree there is going to be increased wage competition.
downward pressure on wages = lower rents?
@Bill Gulley Thank you Bill. I am certainly not looking to argue. And I have been to 22 states this year per my full time occupation, slightly more than 150miles.
Per census data immigration has massively changed and is dynamically changing.
As a final point, this IS a new population. A new population that will pay taxes, get loans, credit cards and the rest. This is no different than FL developments catering to senior citizens as we have seen a migration to the warmth. I was hoping to foster a conversation on what an investor could do to take advantage of a population that will now have access to capital but mixing politics and business does not allow for this.
Thank you for the input.
I agree, learning Spanish might be a good idea, being old fashion, I can speak to fewer in English and get by.
No argument, I also said I didn't mean to say you had not been away from home, point being, this change has been changing for decades.
We can disagree I suppose, I don't see anything new, but rather a growing population.
I guess, we that may want to increase one aspect of our population could get busy on the production side ;)
I'd say there will be a greater need for affordable housing, a much greater need in a decade. :)
I think we will see a change in housing at many levels we have not seen before. In the past undocumented aliens have tended to stick together in tight communities for the feeling of security I would imagine. Their status has had a bonding effect perhaps. If they no longer have to fear deportation they can move into any segment of housing and not fear a neighbor will turn them in to ICE.
I have never had a problem with a tenant who cannot speak much English. I suspect that will also change. It is kind of like being on probation. For the most part you try to avoid anything that might get you in trouble. With no fear of deportation folks may be willing to push the limits more, so there may be more evictions and damage. The flip side is they will also not be willing to be silent on poor conditions in housing they are afraid to complain about now. Past cultural differences will blur a bit more and they will become more mainstream. On the other hand I could just be seeing things through my own experiences and be completely wrong. :)
both @Jon Holdman and @Brian Gibbons are correct. The people who are currently here illegally are already dispersed throughout the US. In the midwest particularly, Swift and other meat packing plants drew a large number of Hispanic illegals from Texas. Migrant farm workers are employed all over the country as are unskilled laborers, construction workers, landscapers, etc. Those folks can't legally purchase a property through conventional channels. Their options are to rent or find some type of owner financing. The vast majority of them rent. You're not going to see a significant uptick in rental demand. You may see an increase in buy demand in some of the lower end blue collar areas. In the end, the real benefit is not to the REI, it is to these people who will no longer live on the fringes of society and fall prey to scams and corruption.
(No one should assume anything about my personal views on immigration simply because I have compassion for humans.)
@Hattie Dizmond a kind heart goes a long way in life, it as all about service.
If you put a program together for Hispanic Self Employed folks and gave them....
1. a lease w market rent
2. A ROFR
3. Get them to a local Hispanic self employed bank, start a paper trail, especially if they are in a cash business like a restaurant or landscaping.
4. Teach them about a FICO score and building credit card history. See
http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/media/video-0077-credi...
5. Teach them about budgeting.
When I sold life insurance and health insurance in NY, I had this family called Bueti, and I was "Mr Brian". A family of seven turned into their relatives giving me 35 policies. Talk about selling in bunches! I loved their sense of "familia" and being loyal to me. They invited me to weddings!!!
6. Learn every home ownership program there is. Help them own a home, give a **** about being an expert.
Remember George Bailey, Baily Savings and Loan?
Its a Wonderful Life?
Making homes avail for the middle class?
Keeping them away from crappy Potterville?
Great insight Jerry, I agree, the meek and silent will likely be more outspoken regardless of language. :)
My Story...
I am an Irish - French Canadian immigrant son from Arlington, MA, Mom from So Weymouth, Dad from inner city Irish Dorchester.
He used to tell me of the Irish gangs in the 40s and and 50s, before it is now.
He showed me a photo, black and white, on a bar
NO DOGS OR IRISH ALLOWED.
He broke out of that by getting to med school. Orthopedic Surgeon.
But his Dad had to sell his house because he couldn't get a loan for med school tuition. Just a lazy shifty Mick from Mr Banker.
Man, talk about pulling yourself up from your bootstraps!
@Jon Holdman I think we're back on topic but once you here these "pixie dusters" (gurus) posture with the 150 or 500 or 999 deals they've done this year you should play the old theme from Purina Dog Chow "My dog's bigger than your dog...."
@Brian Gibbons Couldn't agree more. I just don't like the fact that their immigration status leaves them vulnerable to unscrupulous individuals.