Purchasing Performing Notes with my self directed IRA

Purchasing Performing Notes with my self directed IRA

Rehabber · Keller, TX · Member since 2013 · 137 posts · 20 votes

Hi, A prominent local investor recently sent out a list of performing notes he has available for purchase. The information he provided includes the following information:

Address, City, State, Loan Date, Rate, Term, Last Payment, and Balance as of 04/30/13.

They are accepting offers on the notes. So, I'm looking for some guidance on how to evaluate each property and what a reasonable offer might be. I've started reading some of the links from previous threads but most refers to purchasing NPN's (which looks really cool too!)

The note I am particularly interested in has the following numbers:
Loan date: 3/3/11
Rate: 9.25%
Term (or maturity, I'm guessing in this case) 4/1/16
Balance as of 4/30/13 - $48,743

I don't normally use websites like Zillow or Trulia to get an opinion of value, but I don't have access to the MLS where this property is located here in Texas. So in this case, I did look the property up on Zillow. There is is valued at $137,992.

I'm really looking to understand the way in which note purchases should be evaluated and would love to speak with someone here on BP over the phone about it.

Thanks!

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Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 928 votes
13y

It's fairly common to sell properties on owner-financing for top dollar to credit-challenged buyers, and then to sell the notes after they've seasoned, all as part of a strategy. So I don't think it's automatically a red flag. Heck, Mitch Stephen of "My Life and 1000 Houses" book made a great living doing this in TX.

This a 1st mortgage or a 2nd? (assume that it's a 1st)
Is this a ballooning note (likely) or fully amortizing?
Are their any other liens on the property?
Any 30-day lates in the borrower's payment history?
Is the loan being handled by a servicing company? (preferable in order to get concrete validation of borrower payment history)
Are taxes and insurance escrowed?
You need an updated BPO to establish value (request from a real estate agent)
You need an updated title report.
Verify that property taxes are current.
These last three are vital to get at the actual equity in the property, in the worst-case event that you had to foreclose.

Marc Faulkner, Dion Depaoli, and Dave Van Horn are the professional note experts that post on the site, so you may want to page them, but the questions above will be on anybody's list of things to know to establish note value, so if you post the answers then those with knowledge can weigh in.

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  • Real Estate Investor · Englewood, CO · Member since 2013 · 988 posts · 258 votes
    13y

    You MUST educate yourself about all the ins and outs of this part of the real estate business prior to making any purchases. MUST. There are a huge list of problems and information you must obtain prior to any purchase.

    Secondly, why would a prominent investor want to sell the note? Huge red flag to me. There are so many other ways to pull the money out, especially if the investor has an established successful history. The only thing I can think of is the investor is fishing for someone with no experience or knowledge to buy the loans.

    I have bought and sold loans since the 1960s.

  • Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 928 votes
    13y

    It's fairly common to sell properties on owner-financing for top dollar to credit-challenged buyers, and then to sell the notes after they've seasoned, all as part of a strategy. So I don't think it's automatically a red flag. Heck, Mitch Stephen of "My Life and 1000 Houses" book made a great living doing this in TX.

    This a 1st mortgage or a 2nd? (assume that it's a 1st)
    Is this a ballooning note (likely) or fully amortizing?
    Are their any other liens on the property?
    Any 30-day lates in the borrower's payment history?
    Is the loan being handled by a servicing company? (preferable in order to get concrete validation of borrower payment history)
    Are taxes and insurance escrowed?
    You need an updated BPO to establish value (request from a real estate agent)
    You need an updated title report.
    Verify that property taxes are current.
    These last three are vital to get at the actual equity in the property, in the worst-case event that you had to foreclose.

    Marc Faulkner, Dion Depaoli, and Dave Van Horn are the professional note experts that post on the site, so you may want to page them, but the questions above will be on anybody's list of things to know to establish note value, so if you post the answers then those with knowledge can weigh in.

  • Rehabber · Keller, TX · Member since 2013 · 137 posts · 20 votes
    13y

    Thanks for the response, Tom. That was the purpose of the post. I am seeking education from experienced investors like yourself. Do you have time to speak live?

    Would it be ok for me to send over the email they sent to me?

  • Real Estate Investor · Englewood, CO · Member since 2013 · 988 posts · 258 votes
    13y

    Dan,

    I appreciate you seeking more knowledge from this blog. However, it is not enough. This is not only your hard earned money, it is your retirement money. I imagine you are already familiar with the laws concerning self-directed retirement funds concerning investments.

    My concern is your protection. Plus, there are so many options to consider to protect your investment.

    I know other investors such as myself who are the originators of notes and sell notes to self-directed retirement funds. They not only have a very long successful history, they guarantee the loans and payments. The investor or investment fund will not miss a single payment or not collect a single penny.

    Even then, I still will not recommend you doing any business with them or any other person or company until you have a better understanding of the note investment world. I am thinking of you, your money, your future, and the future of your children.

    A telephone conversation with me or some emails is not enough, in my opinion.

    I will offer two suggestions. Diversify. Invest in several small notes to spread the risk. Should one go bad, it is not a big deal. Secondly, acquire a cash flow stream secured by a note or notes of equal or greater value.

    Again, I have been buying, selling, and originating notes since the 1960s. My father has been doing it much longer, and my grandfather before him.

  • Real Estate Investor · Englewood, CO · Member since 2013 · 988 posts · 258 votes
    13y

    Dan,

    This morning a company was mentioned on the TV program CBS Sunday Morning. You may want to check out the company to give you ideas on safer ways to invest your money.

    This is not an endorsement or recommendation. Please do your homework.

    Website: www.lendingclub.com

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