NY Bill Would CANCEL Rent for 90 Days, Not Postpone.

Real Estate Investor · Harrisburg, PA · Member since 2010 · 73 posts · 217 votes

https://reason.com/2020/03/25/...

The state of New York has a bill to CANCEL rent for 90 days for workers affected by the virus! This isn't deferring rent payment; it is waiving it.

Those landlords who have mortgages may not be affected by this if their lenders also waive/delay mortgage payments, but those of us whose only income is from a couple of properties that have no mortgages, it will be catastrophic. I am in that category.

I see this as theft of my private property sponsored by the state. Man has instituted governments to protect our rights (see: Declaration of Independence), not take my private property and give it to someone else. The state is guilty of that which it was commissioned to prevent - theft. Once again those of us who who made great sacrifices to do the best thing would be greatly penalized. The one who works hard would be forced to pay for those who make foolish decisions and live care free.

We're getting closer to mob rule and these LAWMAKERS in NY creating the hashtag: #cancelrent (found in the article) to whip everyone up in a frenzy, is as close to it as I've ever seen.

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Nicole Heasley Beitenman

Investor · Youngstown, OH · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes

I wouldn't touch NY with a ten-foot pole.

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Christian D.
Real Estate Broker · New York, NY · Member since 2013 · 125 posts · 63 votes
6y
Here is another article regarding this topic.
https://commercialobserver.com/2020/03/new-york-rent-freeze-cancellation-coronavirus-tenants/

0 Reply
Hrant A.
Forest Hills, NY · Member since 2016 · 5 posts · 2 votes
6y
As am from Queens, am totally against free rent. Why not free food? Free clothes? Free taxes? Free restaurants?, free shopping? Free everything?
Believe the govt should give moneys out, and encourage people to pay their bills, including rent. Not encourage negative, and destructive behavior! Call all the politicians, especially in your states, and let them be aware of your thoughts. We are going on the road to be like Venezuela! (in case you don't think so, they were the richest country in South America about 20 yrs ago!- now poorest!)
Am always amazed at the lack of action on the part of landlords all over the country, as usually they don't vote, nor write letters, yet just complain. Each one of us should do all we can to avert disaster in the making. As is, I have an eviction in process, of a tenant that vacated in Oct 2019, yet did not tell me, left some stuff/junk in unit, so I had to go to eviction...5-6months, No rent, no payments, etc...worst is, this month would have been changing locks w/Marshall, as no reply from him, and not fighting it at all, yet now 90 days frozen, no evictions! No evictions! Another min of 3months...now will go into 9months, w/no one living there...and they complain there is a shortage of apartments?!?
Also, if vacancies are coming up, and there are situations like this, do you think any landlord who is not very certain will rent to a prospective tenant w/a low or average FICA score? Again, exacerbating the situation. Perhaps people should rethink socialism, and go out and vote against it! Yes, every one of us! Be fair, and be active, as one day will be too late!
2 Reply
Joe SeegersPro Member
Investor · Appleton, WI · Member since 2011 · 29 posts · 29 votes
6y
the biggest them all of us landlords have to do now is communicate with you tenants.we have offered payment plans with ones that can prove they are infected in their job.but we still are telling are tenants no free lunch.because even with the stimulus check ,their our strings down the road coming.the goverment, at the national and state level will be loaded with debt from this situation.i am glad will are spending big amounts of money to save lives.but i also realize someone will have to pay it back.that means higher taxes,which means higher rents.which in turn ,hurts the tenant ,that certain polotitions are trying to protect.so it is our job to get the unwise tenants the knowledge ,their is no free rent .because even on our end mortgage forbidance is not free.
0 Reply
Linda King
Member since 2020 · 6 posts · 5 votes
6y
I am a die-hard conservative (at least financially). So much so that I'm not really a fan of Donald Trump because I think he's a RINO. I am 100% against socialism in the United States. I am 100% pro-landlord, pro-business owner, pro-make your own way.
With all of that said, the statements I've read here and elsewhere from landlords makes me chuckle a little bit.
a) Landlords always preach that tenants should have 6 months+ savings. Let's be real -- there would be a lot fewer landlords out there making money if this were the case. Also, I think some of the more frantic and angry landlords in this situation are worried because they, themselves, don't actually have 6 months+ in savings. It's very easy to overextend yourself when investing in property.
b) I hate to use such an overused word right now, but the current situations in the US (and around the world) truly is "unprecedented." So many people are and will be affected by this...it most certainly isn't just restaurant and retail store workers. We see right here that real estate investors are seriously impacted, or will be. My main line of work is in online marketing....do you think business is booming for me? Marketing is a quick line item to wipe out of the budget for a company that might lose everything, that doesn't know when they will open, that doesn't know IF they will open. Heck, even healthcare workers -- typically one of the most stable and reliable jobs on the planet -- are being laid off.
c) People keep bringing up all of the free money that their tenants are getting. Newsflash...states all over the country are having SERIOUS unemployment system issues. People have been unemployed for 7 or 8 weeks and still haven't received a payment. The sites don't work, the phone lines don't work. As for the "stimulus checks," they have been a nightmare...a lot of "wrong" people got them (including dead people and foreign workers), and a lot of "qualified" people haven't received them yet. My mom JUST got approved for her unemployment after 7+ weeks. She still only got the amount from the state, though...nothing about the $600/wk from the feds, at least not yet.
d) Other than the most extreme of people, I don't think anyone actually thinks that landlords should be giving FREE rent. From what I understand, the #CancelRent hashtag was SUPPOSED to be in support of Rep. Ilhan Omar's bill, which "cancels" all rent and mortgage payments for a year. If you read the bill, landlords who lose rental income are supposed to ask the federal government for it. Seems like those who are so amped up about tenants getting all of this "free money" from the government would be excited and supportive of this bill, since it would guarantee a year's worth of rent from all of your tenants, without worrying about their late payment issues. But let me guess...you don't find it exciting because you know how government anything works. Bureaucracy sucks, there is always some reason why YOU aren't eligible, there's TONS of paperwork to fill out, there are long lines or long phone call wait times, and it might be months before you get your money...if at all. Revisit my point C.
e) PLEASE stop using the gas station and grocery store analogies. If a customer leaves a grocery store with a cart full of groceries, those groceries no longer belong to the grocery store...they're gone. If a tenant doesn't pay rent for a month, the property doesn't suddenly belong to the tenant...it STILL belongs to the landlord. Same thing with the landlords who are crying about how they still have mortgage payments and property taxes, etc. due. You aren't paying property taxes for your tenants...you are paying property taxes on property that YOU own. You aren't even paying mortgage payments for your tenant. At the end of the day, the property still belongs to YOU, and the bills that you are paying (property taxes, mortgage, etc) are for a property that you do and will continue to own. And if your tenant moved out tomorrow, all of those things would still be due. (Now, I do feel extra sorry for landlords who have to pay utility payments for their tenants right now...ouch.)
f) You aren't the only ones who are losing money or going without income right now. IT SUCKS FOR ALMOST EVERYONE RIGHT NOW. They should have never "shut the country down" in the first place...then, we wouldn't all be in this mess. But they did, and almost all of us are affected in one way or another.
4 Reply
William Coet
Lititz, PA · Member since 2013 · 595 posts · 272 votes
6y

This post is in reference to the previous one:

This entire thread is in reference to a New York State Bill that was proposed over one month ago. You are obviously not familiar with the bill.

It did not reimburse the housing provider for the majority of their costs. It gave them a break only on a federally backed mortgage which many housing providers don't have (if a housing provider didn't have a federally backed mortgage they received no break). It did not remburse for the myriad of other property owner costs including school and other property taxes, insurance, and maintenance budgets (regularly scheduled maintenance contracts, long-term maintenance budgets, and unexpected repair budgets).

Many of your other points are inaccurate, including suggesting the NYS bill was different than requiring a grocery store, restaurant, or service provider to give their product away for free. It is exactly what the bill proposed. When you are ready to provide your services for free for three months, then you can lecture to housing providers who have to answer to tax collectors, mortgage providers, insurance companies, and maintenance contractors.

Any time a government program is mandated it provides reimbursement to the provider of the good or service, whether it is health care, food, or housing. This bill did not do that. It was theft.

6 Reply
John Vesky
Residential Real Estate Broker · New York City, NY · Member since 2016 · 10 posts · 2 votes
6y
@Tony T. That’s assuming they qualify for unemployment. I know of employers that have reduced the hours of their employees drastically. They don’t want to lose the employees so instead of letting them go and letting them collect on their employment insurance, they reduce their hours. This puts the employee in a bind. They want and need their jobs after things get better, but because they still have jobs they do not qualify to get unemployment. This one person is fee for service. Her income is dependent on the amount of clients she evaluates weekly. Employer pays her medical insurance if she meets a minimum amount of clients a week. They are not holding her to the minimum since there is less work now , but her income is reduced drastically because of the amount of clients she meets now .
Not sure how this situation applies to ride share workers but another example is when a family has two incomes and one of the incomes is below the income tax requirement. Some work part time in bars and get paid mostly cash. Will they qualify for unemployment? Then of course there are people like Nannies, Baby sitters etc that are not on the books and contribute to family income. Even if they were qualified as far as income when they rented the apartment, many of them live beyond their means , including landlords, not expecting something like this to happen. There are a bunch of other scenarios that apply to both sides as with homeowners in foreclosure who depend on the rent from the multi family they live in , until the auction is scheduled
or Bankruptcy is resolved. I know people in that situation also. The government should convert tenants to section 8 and perhaps scale back on the unemployment. Give them options.
1 Reply
Tony T.
OP
Real Estate Investor · Harrisburg, PA · Member since 2010 · 73 posts · 217 votes
6y
@Linda King If I force you to perform a service, have you lost anything? ...like your reference to groceries? No. But you'd surely object to it, because forcing you to perform services with no compensation is slavery.
Your philosophy that it's OK to allow the government to use your property with no compensation because you've "lost nothing" would unleash terrible tyranny against your fellow citizens. This tyranny was so obvious and easily predicted by the lawmakers who formed the constitution that it was referenced DIRECTLY in the 5th Amendment "...nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."
3 Reply
Tony T.
OP
Real Estate Investor · Harrisburg, PA · Member since 2010 · 73 posts · 217 votes
6y
@John Vesky Your post assumes if someone has reduced hours, they do not qualify for unemployment; this is false.
Furthermore, if hours are reduced, not only is unemployment compensation awarded, but an additional $600/week (= $2600/month with 4.33 weeks in a month) is also awarded above normal compensation, so reducing an employee's hours give most MORE income than they previously earned by working.
0 Reply
Linda King
Member since 2020 · 6 posts · 5 votes
6y
@Tony T., no I don't think it's okay. Personally, I think the whole shutdown was a mistake.

But just like I don't think it's okay for the government to take your income away from you, I don't think it's okay that the government took the income away from a lot of other people, either. Landlords aren't exempt in this...so many people have lost their livelihoods and are hanging by a thread..

I wish this never happened to anyone. But since our government chose to take away the option for people to make a living, it left a lot of people in a very bad position. So what now?
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Llewelyn A.
Investor / Broker · Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2016 · 665 posts · 1k+ votes
6y
@Linda King

I would like to give an example of a person who loses his $30k per Year Job.

This person will apply for NYS Unemployment. They will get $288 per week.

See snapshot:

On top of that, this person will get $600 per WEEK from the Federal CARES act.

The combined weekly will be $288 plus $600 = $888 per WEEK.

Compare it to the situation where the person WAS employed at $30k per Year. Take $30k and divide it by 52 weeks. That comes out to $577 per Week GROSS.

In other words, the SINGLE unemployed $30k worker who used to make $577 per week GROSS is now bringing home $888 per week CASH. That's an increase of $311 per week!

Now let's take the $311 per week increase and multiply it by 4 to get a rough monthly increase = $1,244.

Now, imagine that it's a couple who both make $30k each AND are now both unemployed. Their Monthly NET income increases by $1,244 each or a total of $2,488 per month!

In fact, because of this situation, a few friends told me of people that they know who had begged their employers to lay them off. When the employers chose to keep them, they called the various City departments ANONYMOUSLY to get the businesses to close down!

In other words, instead of wanting to work to keep the business going, because they were making more money in Unemployment they chose to force the business to close so that they can just get better pay.

This is CRAZY but it's actually happening.

What's even WORSE is that there are rumors the Advocates who have sponsored these Bills seem to be the ones that are showing them how to do this.

NOW, throw on top of that the Unemployed Tenant Couple who is now making $2,488 MORE monthly than when they are working gets FREE Rent!

Something is wrong in our Politics. If we don't fix this, we are going to wind up like Venezuela.

I think what's really happening here is that the Progressive LEFT in the Democratic party is buying Votes on the backs of the Landlord.

In other words, despite the FACT that the Unemployed Workers who are Renters are getting MORE money than what they were making before, let's screw the Landlords to ensure that these same Renters vote for the Progressive LEFT (whom they call themselves Democrat Socialists) down the road!

That's what's happening. The Progressive LEFT party is at War with anyone that doesn't think their way. They don't believe in Capitalism or Entrepreneurship. They know that when people are hurting, if you give them a lot of money, they will vote their way.

It certainly looks like buying votes to me.
4 Reply
Linda King
Member since 2020 · 6 posts · 5 votes
6y
@Llewelyn A. I have big suspicions about this all being exaggerated to promote a socialist agenda. I don't think the shutdowns were a good idea in the first place. Maybe there were good intentions in the beginning, but it has definitely turned into a political battle at this point.
Still, there are a lot of people being hurt in-between.
What about the person who normally works in the busy bar in a restaurant, surviving mostly off tips. Now, the bar is closed, and their manager switches them to working in the back, packaging food to-go. They lost their tips, and now they're getting a lot fewer hours, too. They don't qualify for unemployment, but they have lost most of their income.
I'm a freelancer, involved in the marketing business. I'm still working, but my work has been cut almost in half. The clients that I still have are lagging a bit in paying me. Now, I'm financially stable enough to handle it, but it's definitely affecting me.
To me, this is also a good reason why the feel-good welfare policies don't work. The ones who aren't working right now (admittedly, due to no fault of their own) are making MORE money (IF they have gotten their unemployment...a big IF in some places), and the ones who are still working are making LESS. The people who need the money the most aren't getting it. The distribution of the stimulus payments has been a nightmare...the IRS' website has been obsolete and driving me nuts for YEARS now anyway. This whole thing is a big mess, and the sooner they get the country back up and running, the better.

All I'm saying is that times are hard for everyone, and it isn't fair for landlords to buck up and act like they are the only ones who shouldn't be impacted. And although I agree that people should be better prepared (financially), I don't feel like this is a fair time for landlords to say "Shoulda, woulda, coulda."
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Kevin Priester
Investor · Lake Mary, FL · Member since 2009 · 63 posts · 20 votes
6y
Typical American whoa is me crap.. We always jump to conclusions before we know what the full details are. “ theft” “stealing”??? Really?? Now if we landlords as a whole could all be trusted to do the right thing in this situation, we would not have to be policed and told what to do. These are trying times for both sides. I think in situations where your tenant is out of work because of this pandemic you should give them free rent or work with them as best you can without the government mandating you. Claim it as a loss on next years this years taxes and when this is all over you won’t remember it and the universe will reward you for your good stewardship . Three months of your income is not a catastrophic event. Especially if you own these properties free and clear. if You are financially savvy enough to own multiple properties free and clear, then you are savvy enough to make it 90 days with no income.. Does it suck?? Yes I get that. I have lost money too. Let’s find solutions...and I agree stop whining!!!
0 Reply
Tony T.
OP
Real Estate Investor · Harrisburg, PA · Member since 2010 · 73 posts · 217 votes
6y
@Kevin Priester :
Forcing someone to perform services with no compensation is slavery.

Your philosophy that it's OK to allow the government to use your property with no compensation because you've "lost nothing" would unleash terrible tyranny against your fellow citizens. This tyranny was so obvious and easily predicted by the lawmakers who formed the constitution that it was referenced DIRECTLY in the 5th Amendment "...nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."
1 Reply
Llewelyn A.
Investor / Broker · Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2016 · 665 posts · 1k+ votes
6y
@Linda King

@Kevin Priester

I have been thinking of a way to help people who just collected Cash and not reported it.

That's a very difficult situation and I only have a few tenants that are in that type of sitatution because generally they have to be employed to qualify to be one of MY tenants.

The only reason why I have a few tenants that generally collect Tips in the Gig economy is that they "snuck" into the Apt through a Sublet or other kind of situation by the current or former tenants.

Tenants who generally don't qualify for an apt tend to look for "rooms" that are for rent by tenants. The tenants sublet illegally to help reduce their share of the rent.

A lot of Tenants don't even know how to sublet appropriately, for instance, using a Sublet Agreement Lease. So they then get themselves in trouble as they are now a "Landlord" for the Sublet.

While I try to rent only to families, I also have rental near Universities. One of my Apts has 3 Bedrooms and a very large walk-in closet.

The young people who rented that apt converted the walk-in closet illegally to a bedroom. Over time, I discovered it. Now I am bearing the burnt of that action as most of those young people worked in the Gig economy as a 2nd job (waitress, baby sitter, etc.).

The person in the Closet was a friend of theirs and has lost all of his jobs (he had 3 different gig jobs).

I told the tenants that they are responsible for that person, not me. You are THEIR landlord. HOWEVER, I am helping them by forgiving 20% of their rent to compensate for the loss of their 2nd jobs.

Given this scenario, this plays out even worse in immigrant neighborhoods. I have Landlord friends that have rented their apts where the tenants, over time, bring lots of people, their 2nd or 3rd cousins who came over and over stayed their VISAs now they are undocumented workers, etc.

These poor Landlords find it difficult to go to court to throw them out because it will just happen again and the Laws and Judges are completely pro-tenant here in NYC.

These Landlords are TRAPPED for the most part. They are Entrepreneurs, trying to do a good business, but the Tenants snuck in more people.

When the Landlords confront the tenant and their extra sublets, it's always a sob story and the Landlord just tells them to pay a little extra for the increase in costs like Water Bills, etc.

What sometimes happen is that the tenant then moves out and the Undocumented Workers stay, but continue to pay rent.

That happened to a number of Landlords I know in Queens where this has devastated that community.

The real issue is the Strong tenant laws and the sneaky tenants that allowed the situation to become so much worse for the Landlord.

This doesn't happen in higher priced Apts. This is VERY normal in lower priced Apts in immigrant neighborhoods.

What happens is that they Landlords then are accused of being the Greedy ones, seen as charging more rent (because of the increase of utilities), allowing undocumented workers to live there in large amounts to have more rent money!

It's a scenario that unfolds NOT because of the Greedy Landlord, but of the Greedy and sneaky tenants.

This is one reason why I don't buy Buildings in these areas. I know exactly what's going on. And even I got caught with ONE of my apts!

Tenants want relief from Rent from the Landlords. I get it.

BUT, Tenants need to understand their future when they decide to collect Cash and not save for times when they are NOT working.

For instance, if you are a Nanny, getting paid cash, you are not adding to your qualification to Social Security or your retirement. Why are these people so unconcerned about their future?

If we were to go to the Individual Tenants situation and really look into their history, I have a feeling that there would be a very high percentage, maybe 90% that would have been able to take Unemployment and get the Stimulus if they actually got paid legally.

A friend of mine that was one of these Undocumented workers said that there is a long road ahead but if you truly loved America, you do it.

When he was Undocumented, his got a Federal Taxpayer Identification Number (TIN) and operated throught that, paying Taxes. Over time, and it was more than a Decade, he finally was able to apply and get his Citizenship, claiming that he was paying Taxes for all this time as well as a good Resident of the US.

That's the proper way to do it. He said to me that those receiving Cash in the Gig economy, while he's sympathetic, hurts both America AND themselves in the long run.

I'm saying that Landlording is not so easy. We HAVE to think of the future when some of our Renters don't pay the rent and so we have Reserves.

For Tenants, don't think they are not part of their own problems. THEY ABSOLUTELY ARE.

I'm not trying to point the finger of blame here, but tenants that are NOT receiving financial help from NYS nor the Federal Government maybe a victim of their own past history as well as circumstances beyond their control.

That being said, I believe there needs to be a better way to help Undocumented workers. My friend who started out as Undocumented suggested that the Government give money to those with Taxpayer Identification Numbers (TIN).

His thoughts are that everyone else shouldn't get it unemployment benefits. This is America. If you are here to take advantage of a cash job without paying taxes, it's questionable if America should then help you.

He's now a Landlord. He knows the situation more than anyone else. And he REFUSES to rent to tenants that sneak in others. But it still continued to happen. He throws them out if they do.

I tend to agree with his general sentiment.

If we are to help those that can't get benefits, then give it out to those with TINs.

But forcing Landlords to support a system that's broken is completely unfair and can lead to Landlords losing their business, which then leads to the tenants losing their Apts anyway.

This is much more complex than anyone can imagine.

I have a feeling that after this Pandemic ends, Landlords in immigrant neighborhoods will crack down on over-crowded apts. They need to do this regardless of the strong Tenant Laws.

That will be bad for those tenants.

In the end, some Landlords will lose their business, but most tenants who can't prove their income and sneak in their "relatives" will just not be able to find an apt. Landlords will figure it out and will choose better tenants.
That may accelerate Gentrification as Landlords start feeling that these immigrant tenants can lead to these situations that can hurt their business financially.
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Account Closed
Flipper/Rehabber · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2020 · 300 posts · 417 votes
6y
I agree with most of the general sentiment I'm seeing on here. The product that landlord's offer is housing, just like a department store might offer clothes or kitchenware or other goods. When someone can't afford food, the government doesn't tell grocery stores to let people come in and take food for free. There are programs set up through the government to assist these people in getting food. Likewise, the government should not force landlords to go unpaid for the services they offer.
The stipulations set forth in L.A. seem pretty extreme to me, but they still say that tenants must pay landlords all overdue rent from the COVID-19 crisis, within a year of the pandemic's declared end. I would argue this is also not necessarily ok, but at least the tenant doesn't get completely off the hook when it comes to paying rent.
Unfortunately, so many tenants see landlords as these big bad guys who take all their money, and don't realize that most landlords really are just trying to feed their families as well, along with paying off mortgages, etc. Sadly, the media tends to side with the "underdog," in these situations, further demonizing landlords.
3 Reply
James Hamling
Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes
6y
Originally posted by @Llewelyn A.:
@Linda King

I would like to give an example of a person who loses his $30k per Year Job.

This person will apply for NYS Unemployment. They will get $288 per week.

See snapshot:

On top of that, this person will get $600 per WEEK from the Federal CARES act.

The combined weekly will be $288 plus $600 = $888 per WEEK.

Compare it to the situation where the person WAS employed at $30k per Year. Take $30k and divide it by 52 weeks. That comes out to $577 per Week GROSS.

In other words, the SINGLE unemployed $30k worker who used to make $577 per week GROSS is now bringing home $888 per week CASH. That's an increase of $311 per week!

Now let's take the $311 per week increase and multiply it by 4 to get a rough monthly increase = $1,244.

Now, imagine that it's a couple who both make $30k each AND are now both unemployed. Their Monthly NET income increases by $1,244 each or a total of $2,488 per month!

In fact, because of this situation, a few friends told me of people that they know who had begged their employers to lay them off. When the employers chose to keep them, they called the various City departments ANONYMOUSLY to get the businesses to close down!

In other words, instead of wanting to work to keep the business going, because they were making more money in Unemployment they chose to force the business to close so that they can just get better pay.

This is CRAZY but it's actually happening.

What's even WORSE is that there are rumors the Advocates who have sponsored these Bills seem to be the ones that are showing them how to do this.

NOW, throw on top of that the Unemployed Tenant Couple who is now making $2,488 MORE monthly than when they are working gets FREE Rent!

Something is wrong in our Politics. If we don't fix this, we are going to wind up like Venezuela.

I think what's really happening here is that the Progressive LEFT in the Democratic party is buying Votes on the backs of the Landlord.

In other words, despite the FACT that the Unemployed Workers who are Renters are getting MORE money than what they were making before, let's screw the Landlords to ensure that these same Renters vote for the Progressive LEFT (whom they call themselves Democrat Socialists) down the road!

That's what's happening. The Progressive LEFT party is at War with anyone that doesn't think their way. They don't believe in Capitalism or Entrepreneurship. They know that when people are hurting, if you give them a lot of money, they will vote their way.

It certainly looks like buying votes to me.

I believe you touched on the root of this issue, and it's a sh#* terrifying one. You said it, the policy makers and promoters refer to themselves as SOCIALIST Democrats, review the history of any and every Socialist movement ever in history anywhere and a universal fundamental of Socialism in any and every form is the REMOVAL of private property ownership.
Go ahead, say I'm a nut and wrong because I can not tell you how much I hope I am so totally wrong, but it is the only plausible explanation because the math and facts simply don't make a drop of sense in any other scenario. This thing we see acting out right in front of our faces answers the question "how do we collapse a private property ownership system and grow a socially accepted socialist property system", this is how, or more accurately said this is a perfect step 1 to create a scenario of financial harm that creates that event, the last ingredient is a "Gov. Bail-out for LandLords" where it says don't worry landlord, just sell your rental to the government, we will pay you for it.
Already capital for acquisition is drying up, now all that has to happen is accentuate the problem so there is a form of mass tenant rent defaults and as groundwork is in place for no remedy for landlords, thus a financial catastrophe situation. Than the solution will appear, government corporate ownership of property. You say "but no way, that can't be done, it's not legal", and your correct, at this time. "yeah, but no one would allow such a law" right again, under normal circumstances, but if faced with a catastrophe, people will not only allow it but will applaud it especially as they will add in how they can affect rent controls and this and that, it will be championed as a great thing. And poof, there you go, the beginning of the end.
Funniest thing, Adolph wrote a book that literally detailed every step he was going to do and published it years upon years before he did any of it and everyone said "oh my gosh, we had no idea, if we only ever knew" yeah, like maybe of he wrote about it in a step by step book... And now today there is this nifty book out there called "Rule Book For Radicals" that all but details everything we have been experiencing the last while, a guide book on how to turn a democracy into a Socialist/Communist "utopia", and everyone says "gee, I wonder why all this is being done, it just doesn't make any sense"..... If only we had an idea what the socialist democrats were after, like, if there were some way we knew, like, a book maybe (yeah, intense sarcasm here people).
When hubris meets power.......

1 Reply
Steve O.Pro Member
Rental Property Investor · West Caldwell, NJ · Member since 2019 · 104 posts · 65 votes
6y
@Nicole Heasley...you mean -now you wouldn’t!
0 Reply
Nicole Heasley Beitenman
Investor · Youngstown, OH · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
6y
Originally posted by @Steve O.:
@Nicole Heasley...you mean -now you wouldn’t!

I wouldn't have before this all started! It's like that state wants it's buildings to be abandoned. I don't get it.
1 Reply
Tony T.
OP
Real Estate Investor · Harrisburg, PA · Member since 2010 · 73 posts · 217 votes
6y
As long as there is money in the treasury, unethical politicians will always use that money in abusive ways in exchange for votes. It's just that NY has more of these politicians than other states and we see these horrible, destructive economic decisions coming out of NY and CA. They will CONTINUE to use money from the treasury in unethical ways because the people/citizens are also unethical and do not hold them to account. This stuff could have never happened 50 to 200 years ago because the people would have thrown them out for such immoral practices. Now, citizens DEMAND other people's money/property on a regular basis.
1 Reply
Sam Cherry
Member since 2017 · 66 posts · 91 votes
6y
The winds of the Fourth Turning are blowing hard. The Constitution is like Clorox to Politicians and Congress is a toilet bowl right now. Congress and The People who think they need free rent right now need a good disinfecting of Constitutional Clorox.
The problem is the Federal Reserve must be dissolved because this is were the Treasury gets the money.
0 Reply
Tracy Munger
Kellogg, IA · Member since 2019 · 21 posts · 21 votes
6y
Originally posted by @James Hamling:
Originally posted by @Llewelyn A.:
@Linda King

I would like to give an example of a person who loses his $30k per Year Job.

This person will apply for NYS Unemployment. They will get $288 per week.

See snapshot:

On top of that, this person will get $600 per WEEK from the Federal CARES act.

The combined weekly will be $288 plus $600 = $888 per WEEK.

Compare it to the situation where the person WAS employed at $30k per Year. Take $30k and divide it by 52 weeks. That comes out to $577 per Week GROSS.

In other words, the SINGLE unemployed $30k worker who used to make $577 per week GROSS is now bringing home $888 per week CASH. That's an increase of $311 per week!

Now let's take the $311 per week increase and multiply it by 4 to get a rough monthly increase = $1,244.

Now, imagine that it's a couple who both make $30k each AND are now both unemployed. Their Monthly NET income increases by $1,244 each or a total of $2,488 per month!

In fact, because of this situation, a few friends told me of people that they know who had begged their employers to lay them off. When the employers chose to keep them, they called the various City departments ANONYMOUSLY to get the businesses to close down!

In other words, instead of wanting to work to keep the business going, because they were making more money in Unemployment they chose to force the business to close so that they can just get better pay.

This is CRAZY but it's actually happening.

What's even WORSE is that there are rumors the Advocates who have sponsored these Bills seem to be the ones that are showing them how to do this.

NOW, throw on top of that the Unemployed Tenant Couple who is now making $2,488 MORE monthly than when they are working gets FREE Rent!

Something is wrong in our Politics. If we don't fix this, we are going to wind up like Venezuela.

I think what's really happening here is that the Progressive LEFT in the Democratic party is buying Votes on the backs of the Landlord.

In other words, despite the FACT that the Unemployed Workers who are Renters are getting MORE money than what they were making before, let's screw the Landlords to ensure that these same Renters vote for the Progressive LEFT (whom they call themselves Democrat Socialists) down the road!

That's what's happening. The Progressive LEFT party is at War with anyone that doesn't think their way. They don't believe in Capitalism or Entrepreneurship. They know that when people are hurting, if you give them a lot of money, they will vote their way.

It certainly looks like buying votes to me.

I believe you touched on the root of this issue, and it's a sh#* terrifying one. You said it, the policy makers and promoters refer to themselves as SOCIALIST Democrats, review the history of any and every Socialist movement ever in history anywhere and a universal fundamental of Socialism in any and every form is the REMOVAL of private property ownership.
Go ahead, say I'm a nut and wrong because I can not tell you how much I hope I am so totally wrong, but it is the only plausible explanation because the math and facts simply don't make a drop of sense in any other scenario. This thing we see acting out right in front of our faces answers the question "how do we collapse a private property ownership system and grow a socially accepted socialist property system", this is how, or more accurately said this is a perfect step 1 to create a scenario of financial harm that creates that event, the last ingredient is a "Gov. Bail-out for LandLords" where it says don't worry landlord, just sell your rental to the government, we will pay you for it.
Already capital for acquisition is drying up, now all that has to happen is accentuate the problem so there is a form of mass tenant rent defaults and as groundwork is in place for no remedy for landlords, thus a financial catastrophe situation. Than the solution will appear, government corporate ownership of property. You say "but no way, that can't be done, it's not legal", and your correct, at this time. "yeah, but no one would allow such a law" right again, under normal circumstances, but if faced with a catastrophe, people will not only allow it but will applaud it especially as they will add in how they can affect rent controls and this and that, it will be championed as a great thing. And poof, there you go, the beginning of the end.
Funniest thing, Adolph wrote a book that literally detailed every step he was going to do and published it years upon years before he did any of it and everyone said "oh my gosh, we had no idea, if we only ever knew" yeah, like maybe of he wrote about it in a step by step book... And now today there is this nifty book out there called "Rule Book For Radicals" that all but details everything we have been experiencing the last while, a guide book on how to turn a democracy into a Socialist/Communist "utopia", and everyone says "gee, I wonder why all this is being done, it just doesn't make any sense"..... If only we had an idea what the socialist democrats were after, like, if there were some way we knew, like, a book maybe (yeah, intense sarcasm here people).
When hubris meets power.......

As easy as it is to yell omg they're getting more money than they deserve, you should also realize the majority have YET to get any money at all and still don't know when they will - and many have been off work for 2 months at least. Heck with things opening up (before they should in my mind) people are going back to work before they've received 1 cent from unemployment or stimulus. However, as usual, the big wigs seem to have got their money first.

In the realm of real estate, what is happening here is the potential punishment to property owners for living by the 'use your debt to your advantage' scenario that everyone is used to. Perhaps this is a wake up call, however the stimulus has already given big benefits to rental property owners. It's a tough situation where everyone (including property owners) expect people to have 6 months of bills available in savings, but most of the the companies and property owners don't.

1 Reply
Curtis Mears
Property Manager · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2014 · 729 posts · 596 votes
6y
@Tony T.
Wow,that is crazy. Why does anyone invest in ny?
0 Reply
Ana R.
Real Estate Consultant · New York, NY · Member since 2019 · 40 posts · 40 votes
6y
This was just said this morning by the governor wow!
0 Reply
Tony T.
OP
Real Estate Investor · Harrisburg, PA · Member since 2010 · 73 posts · 217 votes
6y
@Ana R. Thank you for that update Ana!

How can the government change the terms of a contract? It's their very job to enforce contracts.

The reason our civilization puts things in writing is so that the rules cannot be changed in the middle of the game ...why is this important principle we all rely on (EVERYONE, not just landlords) suddenly OK to ignore?
2 Reply
Sam Cherry
Member since 2017 · 66 posts · 91 votes
6y
This is why everyone who is a landlord in NY should write the Governor and inform him that you will be taking as a CREDIT (not deduction, big big difference) on any lost rent and any and all damages and legal fees when you finally get to evict again from your NY State and local taxes this year.

See how he likes that that.

The unfortunate thing is everyone is trying to escape from New York and unfortunately they will be trying to move to states that don't have Communists as Governors.
5 Reply

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