https://reason.com/2020/03/25/...
The state of New York has a bill to CANCEL rent for 90 days for workers affected by the virus! This isn't deferring rent payment; it is waiving it.
Those landlords who have mortgages may not be affected by this if their lenders also waive/delay mortgage payments, but those of us whose only income is from a couple of properties that have no mortgages, it will be catastrophic. I am in that category.
I see this as theft of my private property sponsored by the state. Man has instituted governments to protect our rights (see: Declaration of Independence), not take my private property and give it to someone else. The state is guilty of that which it was commissioned to prevent - theft. Once again those of us who who made great sacrifices to do the best thing would be greatly penalized. The one who works hard would be forced to pay for those who make foolish decisions and live care free.
We're getting closer to mob rule and these LAWMAKERS in NY creating the hashtag: #cancelrent (found in the article) to whip everyone up in a frenzy, is as close to it as I've ever seen.
I wouldn't touch NY with a ten-foot pole.
I wouldn't touch NY with a ten-foot pole.
Wow, that is unbelieveable. I already reached out to my bank and they wouldn't penalize me for a late payment but would probably require the payment the following month. That doesnt help anyone. This would only be right if they cancel my mortgate for the next couple months. New York is becoming a no buy zone.
Even if they waive or postpone payments to the bank, you still OWE the original amount - the bank loses nothing, they're not waiving 3 payments from your balance. NY would be giving away your income for 3 months, incurring massive losses. It would be like forcing grocery stores to give away food for 3 months with no reimbursement, or gas stations to give away gas with no reimbursement. There IS no such thing as ORDERING a merchant to give away their product, except for these NY lawmakers who think a landowner should. This is unthinkable - that someone a citizen could be ordered to give away their product.
This is not going to pass -- the most they will do is issue a rent forbearance for 90 days.
@Tony T.
And rents are about to go way up in about 4 months.....
Wow, that is shocking! I would be okay if I the county waive my property tax for the year to offset my income loss.
The issue is for something like this to work, it needs to be done from top to bottom, not just one or the other. All parties need to agree otherwise it's not going to work. Really a 'pause' on all financials is what needs to be done, and essentials subsidized by the government, but obviously that isn't going to happen, so we're left in this limbo...
Well, this would be fine! As well, the government would need to cancel my mortgage payments on these rentals for 90 days. This should include canceling the interest charges on each rental as well!
Not going to happen.
@Tony T. I hope you reached out to your state representative to complain? If so I'd love to hear what they had to say? Plus, if this does pass, that will just hurt all the banks, whom will pass their costs on to all consumers. So in the end they'll charge more fees, etc. thus hurting everyone.
Unfortunately the trend in NYS appears to be changing to tenant friendly, particularly since last June when major changes came to the state. Those who own properties outright may have to look at SBA loans now to carry unwanted debt. Not only are they forgiving rent possibly but you will not be able to evict. And its not that I don't sympathize with my tenants but as a property owner I have expenses as well.
We are currently doing our best to accommodate tenant hardship but at some point it may warrant further action. I would still start the eviction process, even if eviction is not possible.
Evictions are already on hold. I think most of my tenants will pay their rent coming up for April anyways.
@Tony T. Do you mean liberal morons like the trump administration? They did pretty much the same thing by freezing evictions and ordering forbearance. Try collecting...
You do realize the death figures in NY/NJ approaching a sept 11 every week right? And it shows no sign of slowing down yet. And has the chance of devastating even more first responders.
Before you keep complaining why don鈥檛 u check out the income tax rates during world war 2? Or the draft during the Vietnam war.
Your worst case scenario here is losing a little money. Stop whining.
@Jonathan R McLaughlin: I denounce ANY tyranny - whether from Democrats OR Republicans (you may be directing your comments to the wrong person; I didn't call anyone morons, nor reference liberals/conservatives).
You citing any wartime examples of hardships is not what would be happening here. The government taking my product with no reimbursement doesn't happen in war time; private property rights still existed. If the government orders delaying mortgages, for example, the bank didn't lose anything, it just made a little extra interest - the money owed is simply postponed. If NY orders free rent for 3 months, it's not a postponement. It's ordering a citizen to give away their product for 3 months! ...which is totally different. Point to me a time in our history where ordering a merchant to give away product with no reimbursement occurred. Are grocery stores ordered to give away food? Are Gas stations ordered to give away gasoline for 3 months? No.
Even in the time of death (as you reference 9/11), private property rights still existed. No one was forced to give away product by the government. Your references make no sense, if I may put it bluntly.
Lastly, you say that losing a little money is not something to whine about. If I came and took your money, you'd call the police. That's even stronger whining than me posting a warning of tyranny here on a bulletin board. This country became what it is (or was) because private property was treated as liberty itself, and it indeed is. They are almost one in the same. Taking money or property is the same thing as taking rights and/or liberty. I'd love to explain why, but there's not enough room here to post.
@Jonathan R McLaughlin:
If 9 months of rental income is needed to pay all expenses, and the remaining 3 months are profit and make up my only income and salary, and the government orders free rent for 3 months, I lose my entire year's income because the other expenses (9 months of rent's worth) is STILL DUE.
You saying: "Your worst case scenario here is losing a little money. Stop whining." tells me you don't understand how severe and grave this would be.
Everyone who wants to help oppose this should go here vote NAY, comment on the proposal, as well as email senators. This cannot go through!
https://www.nysenate.gov/legis...
This has to be stopped unless it offers complete reimbursement to the property owner for lost income. Freezing payments for things like property tax, insurance isn't enough (and isn't included in the current bill). Property owners income is being denied and not reimbursed by this bill. Property owners use this income to pay for their own living expenses such as groceries, car payments, and health insurance.
To anybody who wants to stop this you must go onto this site and vote Nay in the public vote section and leave a comment! Also, this page has email links to senators, and you must compose a factual comment about why this is going to create a financial hardship and list your objections to it.
Without a direct reimbursement to the property owner for the lost rent, this should not happen!
This is the equivalent of theft. Do something to stop it.
Here is the link where you can vote NAY, comment, as well as email senators.
https://www.nysenate.gov/legis...
Firstly, I feel very sorry for any investor who is caught up in this mess. Contact me here on BiggerPockets and I would love to help out more. I believe that this is not right and no one should dictate would a private sector or industry should or should not do, especially with private property.
That being said, we can learn a lot.
Firstly, always have reserves. You need cash reserves in order to make sure that you can afford your mortgage payments and you need to make sure that you can save whatever cost you can.
Secondly, establish clear communication with your tenants. Let them know that you are here to help them. It may be there jobs that are jeopardized and they perhaps could have family with them. It is important to understand the situation with ALL your tenants and keep close communication with them. Even if rent may not be something paid, perhaps set up a system or plan in the future where they would be able to repay you.
Third, keep in touch with your lender. It is crucial to talk to your lender. If your lender gave you a federally backed mortgage, you are fine. Just make sure you take care of your taxes and expense then馃槆. But if you are lending from a private lender or a lending company or if you are part of some 100% commercial financing program, then you will need to work with your lender. Once again, call them up, explain to them your situation. Keep a positive and clear communication with them. See how your lender can perhaps waiver that payment for a while and see how you can setup a repayment program. This is extremely important and brings me to another point, you have to be comfortable with your lender. Even if they charge low interest rates, if your lender is someone who you personally dislike, you will have a hard time communicating with them and that is going to be a tough one and it will be on you.
That is why communicate communicate communicate is very important AND make sure that you are happy with who you are working with and ultimately, you are happy with who is managing your property and who is renting from you.
Always contact me for more advice and I am always happy to help!
Cheers,
Sean
@Tony T.
Yes. Remember this when you vote! Class action law suits should ensue. Absolutely theft of property. It鈥檚 the government engaging in economic rape of the American people.
@William Coet: Wow! Thank you for that meaningful contribution! I'll go to the link and vote No and leave a succinct comment. I can't tell you how thankful I am for your post!
I also would like to add:
(1) When the government thinks someone needs something for free, like food or healthcare, they don't order the grocery store owner or the healthcare provider to give away their product; instead, they subsidize it. This means the government pays for the cost through taxation and the merchant/provider isn't the party directly paying for the government's decision. The most ironic thing is that one of the free things the government already provides to people is HOUSING. There are millions of people in our country getting free or reduced cost housing. How is it done? It is NOT done by ordering landlords to give away their apartment/house; it is done by subsidizing housing with grants, section 8, etc. and government pays for the housing on the tenant's behalf. The landlord isn't ordered to pay for the housing itself. Did the NY state senator totally forget that this is how it's properly done?
(2) The stimulus already exists to pay for rent/bills. The stimulus has already taken care of rent by adding $600/week to normal unemployment benefits for 4 months! That's $2500/month ($600 x 4.3 weeks in a month) IN ADDITION to regular unemployment benefits. Add to that a one-time $1200 check. In PA, someone making only $36,000/year would get $1600 + $2500 = $4100/month!! Isn't $4100/month enough to pay rent for a $36,000 income apartment/house (probably around $800-1100/month)?
Firstly, I feel very sorry for any investor who is caught up in this mess. Contact me here on BiggerPockets and I would love to help out more. I believe that this is not right and no one should dictate would a private sector or industry should or should not do, especially with private property.
That being said, we can learn a lot.
Firstly, always have reserves. You need cash reserves in order to make sure that you can afford your mortgage payments and you need to make sure that you can save whatever cost you can.
Secondly, establish clear communication with your tenants. Let them know that you are here to help them. It may be there jobs that are jeopardized and they perhaps could have family with them. It is important to understand the situation with ALL your tenants and keep close communication with them. Even if rent may not be something paid, perhaps set up a system or plan in the future where they would be able to repay you.
Third, keep in touch with your lender. It is crucial to talk to your lender. If your lender gave you a federally backed mortgage, you are fine. Just make sure you take care of your taxes and expense then馃槆. But if you are lending from a private lender or a lending company or if you are part of some 100% commercial financing program, then you will need to work with your lender. Once again, call them up, explain to them your situation. Keep a positive and clear communication with them. See how your lender can perhaps waiver that payment for a while and see how you can setup a repayment program. This is extremely important and brings me to another point, you have to be comfortable with your lender. Even if they charge low interest rates, if your lender is someone who you personally dislike, you will have a hard time communicating with them and that is going to be a tough one and it will be on you.
That is why communicate communicate communicate is very important AND make sure that you are happy with who you are working with and ultimately, you are happy with who is managing your property and who is renting from you.
Always contact me for more advice and I am always happy to help!
Cheers,
Sean
Sean, Please reconsider your post. It is not correct that if you have a federally backed mortgage "you are fine". Far from it. The proposed bill does not reimburse rental owners for property taxes, insurance, maintenance costs, and anything and their own personal living expenses. If you don't have a federally backed mortgage you are get no reimbursement.
I can think of no other time a government has proposed bill telling someone they have to provide a product/service for for free As the poster above said, even with grocery and health care programs, the provider of these items/services is reimbursed by the government. Manufacturers of products to help with the medical response are being reimbursed by the government. It is entirely unacceptable for a state government to consider a law requiring property owners to provide property without reimbursement. If they want to help with rental payments, they need to offer vouchers for the complete amount of rent.
I also would like to add:
(1) When the government thinks someone needs something for free, like food or healthcare, they don't order the grocery store owner or the healthcare provider to give away their product; instead, they subsidize it. This means the government pays for the cost through taxation and the merchant/provider isn't the party directly paying for the government's decision. The most ironic thing is that one of the free things the government already provides to people is HOUSING. There are millions of people in our country getting free or reduced cost housing. How is it done? It is NOT done by ordering landlords to give away their apartment/house; it is done by subsidizing housing with grants, section 8, etc. and government pays for the housing on the tenant's behalf. The landlord isn't ordered to pay for the housing itself. Did the NY state senator totally forget that this is how it's properly done?
(2) The stimulus already exists to pay for rent/bills. The stimulus has already taken care of rent by adding $600/week to normal unemployment benefits for 4 months! That's $2500/month ($600 x 4.3 weeks in a month) IN ADDITION to regular unemployment benefits. Add to that a one-time $1200 check. In PA, someone making only $36,000/year would get $1600 + $2500 = $4100/month!! Isn't $4100/month enough to pay rent for a $36,000 income apartment/house (probably around $800-1100/month)?
Both of these points are excellent, and if you didn't include them in the comment section of the NY senate website, you should go back and add them.
Even with grocery and health care programs,
the provider of these items/services is reimbursed by the government.
Manufacturers of products to help with the medical response are being
reimbursed by the government. It is entirely unacceptable for a state
government to consider a law requiring property owners to provide
property without reimbursement. If they want to help with rental
payments, they need to offer vouchers for the complete amount of rent.
@William Coet: Thanks for the encouragement! I did post in the comments section of the proposed bill site, but they are deleted soon after. I tried again, thinking I did something wrong, but discovered they were deleted. I just went there again and they aren't anywhere to be found. I guess it's possible that they allow only IP addresses from NY.
If you expand the comments to showing ALL, do a search on rita; her several replies are so well spoken, that I think she's an attorney. Her main point is like mine - government forcing free product with no reimbursement.
The real estate laws in New York are a complete joke and you are 100% right in what you are saying. In my opinion if you are going to block income, you should block ALL expenses associated with the property as well (even though nothing should be blocked to begin with).
New York is a classic example of big brother over stepping it's boundaries in a really problematic way. I won't go into any more detail as it won't help the cause but just make your voice heard and I wish you all the best during these times.
I implore all owners of NY State properties, to call their state representatives on Monday. Flood their offices with no votes and they'll get the picture. Just commenting on their websites, will not be effective. Please call your representative as the vocal will be heard.
@William Coet: Thanks for the encouragement! I did post in the comments section of the proposed bill site, but they are deleted soon after. I tried again, thinking I did something wrong, but discovered they were deleted. I just went there again and they aren't anywhere to be found. I guess it's possible that they allow only IP addresses from NY.
If you expand the comments to showing ALL, do a search on rita; her several replies are so well spoken, that I think she's an attorney. Her main point is like mine - government forcing free product with no reimbursement.
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