Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 384 posts · 109 votes
Any Milwaukee investors have a prediction on the impact of ending the City's residency requirements? (for the question assume Mayor Barret's attempts to fight the state law fail).
Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2012 · 109 posts · 42 votes
13y
The problem with the movement out of Milwaukee is the overall abysmal school system. Unfortunately, most of the schools have poor performance ratings. Reading scores for children rate fourth from the bottom in the nation. Most MPS teachers raise their children in private schools. I raised my family in Milwaukee until my kids were about to attend school. My wife and I left because it was cheaper to move to an affluent suburb with good schools than continue to live in Milwaukee and have to send kids to private schools nearby. I just wasn't seeing a value on tax dollars. I am not saying that all Milwaukee schools are bad, but a large portion of them are. I think single employees will continue to live in Milwaukee, but it does not make financial sense to stay in Milwaukee if you are a city employee with a large family. I have talked to many city employees and I believe about 30 percent plan to move out as soon as possible. Milwaukee does have a lot to offer and I hope things will turn out well for the city, but I am skeptical.
Investor · Cedarburg, WI · Member since 2013 · 439 posts · 150 votes
13y
I have a duplex 5 blocks away from Wauwatosa and currently rent to a teacher in the MPS system. Part of the reason they moved in is due to this rule. Based on my location it is really a nice requirement for me as a landlord. One of the things I like about it is typically I would be happy to have a teacher, police officer, or firefighter as a tenant. Certainly not always, but of the teachers who have looked at the duplex most of them seem to have their act together.
We will see what happens. I think it may take years for the full effect to be felt, as I am not sure that someone would immediately move out of the area just because they now can. Their are certainly some nicer areas in the city of Milwaukee.
Real Estate Agent · Milwaukee County, WI · Member since 2009 · 3k+ posts · 525 votes
13y
Just my personal feelings :
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I feel crime rate will go up drastically
City property values was take a major price drop
City rental rates will take a nice drop
More carry conceal permits will be issued in city limits
Outside of city - prices will increase significantly
Outside of city - rental rates will increase over time
More board up housing in the city
More closed down city public schooling
( FYI – city now have over 1000 properties setting vacant )
City dollar housing will once again become popular
Traffic outside of city will become even more of issue
As other BP members have stated
“ people will always need somewhere to stay “
Detroit comes to mind
Again this is just my personal opinion of
potential outcome over next 34 years
Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2009 · 203 posts · 50 votes
13y
I think it will have an effect, although it depends on the neighborhood. Lake Dr. areas will not be affected, neither will low-income, I believe. They mostly don't have the cash to get a place outside the city.
Middle class will over time probably find a different place, but again depends on the neighborhood. I live two blocks away from Tosa, and I can think of only one person of the neighbors being a city employee. But if they're not quite in that price range, whether it is buying or renting, they might be looking at comparatively priced areas in West Allis or southern suburbs.
Just my personal feelings :
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I feel crime rate will go up drastically
City property values was take a major price drop
City rental rates will take a nice drop
More carry conceal permits will be issued in city limits
Outside of city - prices will increase significantly
Outside of city - rental rates will increase over time
More board up housing in the city
More closed down city public schooling
( FYI – city now have over 1000 properties setting vacant )
Detroit comes to mind
That is exactly what happened to the city of Detroit in the mid 90's when the state of Michigan ended residency. While I am against residency and believe people should be able to live wherever they want and can afford to, ending residency had a very negative impact on Detroit. Milwaukee will probably suffer as well.
Investor · Cedarburg, WI · Member since 2013 · 439 posts · 150 votes
13y
Jenkins Ramon - I would tend to agree with you. I like the idea of a possible discount. We will see how it all shakes out and if I will need to offer a discount or not.
Flipper/Rehabber · St. Louis, MO · Member since 2008 · 489 posts · 300 votes
13y
its funny you brought up this subject tonight, I am good friends with a firefighter & teacher(husband and wife) who both work for Milwaukee & we discussed this tonight. They aren't moving, nor are the other teachers on the block. The teacher beside me isn't moving either(although I wish she would)
My thoughts overall is that majority will stay....maybe the ones renting will move, or maybe not if they like the area and the rent is reasonable. I think the biggest problem that many will have is they are upside down on their properties & really can't move at this time.
Also many have made wherever they are their home. They have invested time & money into it & that's not always easy to walk away from. Plus the biggest factor is they would have to sell their home & while the market is picking up that would be another hurdle they would have to face.
The other factor, cost & house prices. While teachers, fireman & policemen make good money, that doesn't mean they will be able to afford something in Brookfield or Wauwatosa.
And there are some nice areas in Milwaukee. Right around Tosa is nice, East side downtown & I am sure there are more.
I could be wrong, but I don't think this will effect Milwaukee as bad as some think it will.
And as for renting, as you know if you have a nice rental in a good location you should always be able to rent it.
Flipper/Rehabber · St. Louis, MO · Member since 2008 · 489 posts · 300 votes
13y
Jenkins Ramon, only time will tell. But from what they said tonight, its not looking like too many are on their way out.
Also, don't know if you heard, but they passed an ordinance that city workers won't get a bonus if they move..http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/city-to-block-raises-for-many-public-workers-who-leave-milwaukee-b9960341z1-216620411.html
Although it doesn't affect teachers, firefighters or policemen.
Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 384 posts · 109 votes
13y
Thanks everyone for chiming in on what they expect with the change in law regarding the City of Milwaukee's residency requirement.
My guess is that the impact will be gradual. I don't think there will be a huge flight of current city employees.
But as new employees are hired on, a good percentage, especially those with kids, will choose to buy in the burbs.
Though the same house in the suburbs costs more, some with children will consider the money they would have spent on private school tuition as money they are willing to spend on a higher mortgage payment in a better school district.
So I think it will affect the 'edges' of the city - the person who would have chosen a bungalow in Washington Heights will choose the bungalow in Tosa; the employee who would have bought the new construction home on the NW side will instead buy a newer home in Meno Falls.
I think this factor will depress prices a bit in these nicer parts of the city. On the other hand, suburbs close to the city who pull in these city employees I would expect a slight boost to the average price over time.
Investor · Clairemont, CA · Member since 2011 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
13y
So for those not in the WI know(that's this guy) :
My question is, coming from areas where cities do not have this "residency requirement", what is behind people's desire to leave. I understand that there has been a requirement for city employees and it is going away. I also understand that there are more desirable suburb areas outside of the city, and some want to live there and that's just swell.
But is it really that bad of an area that people mostly don't want to live there? Or is it more of a high taxes in city? Really really poor schools(significantly more than other non city schools)? High crime?
I get that these things can all contribute, but what is it that is so bad that (it sounds like) so many don't want to live there. I've just never been in a city that people didn't want to live in. I might not have liked downtown and preferred the west side of town, but many of my friends liked downtown and disliked the west side of town, so there was always a market balance.
Investor · Central Valley, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
I'm curious about Milwaukee city schools. Would any educator with school aged children of their own stay in the city system if they could afford to move to Brookfield? Are most educators currently living in the city sending their own children to private schools? There's always that toss up between higher home prices and taxes versus private school tuition.
To me that's where the breakdown is. I don't like residency in principal. But if educators are saying/showing that city schools aren't good enough for their own children, it won't get better when they don't have to live there.
Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2012 · 109 posts · 42 votes
13y
The problem with the movement out of Milwaukee is the overall abysmal school system. Unfortunately, most of the schools have poor performance ratings. Reading scores for children rate fourth from the bottom in the nation. Most MPS teachers raise their children in private schools. I raised my family in Milwaukee until my kids were about to attend school. My wife and I left because it was cheaper to move to an affluent suburb with good schools than continue to live in Milwaukee and have to send kids to private schools nearby. I just wasn't seeing a value on tax dollars. I am not saying that all Milwaukee schools are bad, but a large portion of them are. I think single employees will continue to live in Milwaukee, but it does not make financial sense to stay in Milwaukee if you are a city employee with a large family. I have talked to many city employees and I believe about 30 percent plan to move out as soon as possible. Milwaukee does have a lot to offer and I hope things will turn out well for the city, but I am skeptical.
Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 384 posts · 109 votes
13y
@Account Closed
I don't think that a large percentage of current employees will suddenly leave for several reasons: many would have to take a loss on their home; also they may have already adjusted to whatever accommodation they made for the overall poor schools - either magnet school, charter school, private school or they've been able to transfer their kids into a suburban district (in WI it is possible to send your child to a district you do not live in).
But for new employees the perception of the school district will be an important factor in where they choose to buy.
Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 384 posts · 109 votes
12y
A Milwaukee County judge ruled against the city's residency rule. However it sounds like it can still be appealed further, and Mayor Barrett plans to do so. Just wondering if 6 months later any other Milwaukee investors have any different thoughts on the potential impact, hearing any rumblings from city employees they know, etc?
Broker, Investor, Property Restorer · Fox Point, WI · Member since 2012 · 288 posts · 120 votes
12y
Actually, I know several couples that have kids in MPS (Milwaukee Public Schools) and love the schools. From what I've heard, it sounds like MPS has a number of specialty schools at all grade levels that are actually quite good at educating kids and its the parents that actually care about their kids education that make sure their kids get into those schools. That having been said, I know a lot of MPS schools are definitely in real disarray and are problem schools, but I blame most of that on parents that just don't give a damn about being parents to their kids.