Alternatives to Yellow Letters

Marketing Your Property
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Alternatives to Yellow Letters

Brandon Foken
Wholesaler · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2012 · 259 posts · 147 votes

Warning: Lots of Questions!!

I'm in the process of sourcing my envelopes, paper, etc. for my direct mail campaign for Absentee Owners. My initial plan is to use a "handwritten" font for the marketing copy on the yellow letter while actually handwriting the envelopes (prevents me from buying another printer that can accept envelopes). I'm having a very hard time finding any lined yellow paper that comes separately and not linked together in some way like gum top or in note pads.

When people say they are mailing "yellow letters" are they really yellow? Or do people use lined white paper instead? Has anyone done any testing to see if there is an appreciable difference between "handwritten" letters on different types of paper? What about using no lines and printing your marketing copy on a blank sheet of yellow paper?

I've seen ideas of using lined paper templates and printing those and your marketing copy at the same time, but that seems like a waste of ink to me. In addition, I only have a black/white laser printer so the blue and red lines would not show up. Anyone have any success with this method or alternative ideas?

Finally, I want to do this myself and not use one of the yellowletter.com companies that are out there.

Who would've thought that buying paper would take up this much time and effort? Not me! Any insight is greatly appreciated.

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Michael Quarles
Flipper/Rehabber · Bakersfield, CA · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y

Paper should only cost .06 cents.

Handwritten vs font. Handwritten wins however fonts not bad just not as great.

Color of paper. Yellow, white and pink

Ink color. Red, blue and pink. Red wins. After millions sent this is not even a question.

Envelope. Invitation A6. Then a #10. Beige and baby blue unless pink letters then pink

Address. Match ink color and handwritten

Lined vs letterhead. Lined unless the letter is really long, the sender must be a professional.

Bottom line is do something. Anything even crappy is better than nothing.

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  • Jerry PuckettPro Member
    Wholesaler · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    13y
    Originally posted by Michael Quarles:
    You guys need to be writing them anyway.

    So I've heard. I haven't sent out millions of pieces of mail yet, but I did send over 100,000 yellow letters last year, and my split testing favored letters where the "handwriting " on envelope and letter matched. So if I literally handwrite the address, my testing tells me it will lower my response rate ever so slightly.

    Tweeking the tray isn't easy to explain. It took some time tinkering with it. But even without modification, it will take 30 easy. I'm sure it would hold A6 or other invitation style, but I dont use them. I get the best open and read with 3 x 5 envelopes that Aunt Mary would send.

    Yes, I've used red ink. The numbers say use royal blue or black. I just had a client ask for pink paper and pink envelopes. I have no idea what color ink I'll use yet!

    0Reply
  • Michael Quarles
    Flipper/Rehabber · Bakersfield, CA · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    13y

    Jerry I get it. About 3 years ago I too went the font method for a moment then changed back to humans. Machines are so much cheaper and a bunch easier. Heck I own a printer that will print 4500 envelopes an hour. And won't use it.

    However we are developing a font program that changes both the configuration of width and height of a font while using 4 fonts and randomly choosing which font to use and not in order. When it's perfected we will probably go back to machines. As long as our test prove the machines over the manual writing.

    Congrats on your 100,000 plus.

    0Reply
  • Tom Panucci
    Real Estate Investor · Member since 2009 · 8 posts · 1 vote
    13y

    "This is how we do it"

    http://warehouse-shop.washk12.org/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=300

    https://store.schoolspecialty.com/OA_HTML/ibeCCtpItmDspRte.jsp?minisite=10206&item=467586§ion=116184

    0Reply
  • Tami Cox
    Seward, NE · Member since 2013 · 2 posts · 0 votes
    13y

    There is a lot of great info on paper, envelopes, fonts, etc. here. Thank you all so much for the links, ideas, and advice. I just have one question still. Does anyone have a template or MS Word settings so the font actually prints on the lines of the paper?

    0Reply
  • Mark S.
    Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2013 · 17 posts · 0 votes
    13y

    This thread was very helpful and informative, thanks to the senior members for solid contributions. I'm taking a lot of notes!

    0Reply
  • Phil Z.
    Real Estate Broker · Orange, CT · Member since 2013 · 951 posts · 218 votes
    13y

    You should be able to find either loose yellow lines paper or paper than can easily be seperated. Most all printers can handle printing envolopes also and I would highly recommend having the printer do the work as it is very tedious.

    0Reply
  • Tiffany H.
    Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2011 · 102 posts · 12 votes
    13y
    Like Blair said, be careful about the "fake factor". I throw those fancy "hand-written" mailers away without opening them because they seem so scammy. Thanks to the others for specifics on paper and font!
    0Reply
  • Al Bunch
    Realtor · Houston, TX · Member since 2013 · 128 posts · 27 votes
    13y

    Here's two questions for the Yellow Letter gurus (or just the folks with more than a fair bit of experience doing it).

    1) Yellow legal paper (~16# newsprint) has a definite different feel than offset printed bond paper made to look like legal paper. Have you noticed an appreciable difference in response between the two?

    2) If you're printing your letters and the type isn't close to being between the lines, have you noticed a difference in response between that and one where the text is carefully positioned to line up with the ruled lines on the paper?

    0Reply
  • Blair Halver
    Real Estate Entrepreneur · Winston-Salem, NC · Member since 2008 · 101 posts · 40 votes
    13y
    Originally posted by Tiffany H.:
    Like Blair said, be careful about the "fake factor". I throw those fancy "hand-written" mailers away without opening them because they seem so scammy. Thanks to the others for specifics on paper and font!

    @Tiffany H. - thanks for the word! Glad to know it's not just me.

    0Reply
  • Tiffany H.
    Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2011 · 102 posts · 12 votes
    13y

    @MichaelQuarles, I just ordered some labor day special letters on discount through this company called yellowletters... :) My initial thought was to mail monthly for 12 months and slightly change each mail piece in a drip-style campaign. But, I don't want to have to pay extra for new proofs or changes. Have you found that sending the same letter to the same people month after month has any different effect than mixing it up? My idea is to send 6 months of letters, then postcards for a few months. Any suggestion on whether that order makes sense as well?

    0Reply
  • Michael Quarles
    Flipper/Rehabber · Bakersfield, CA · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    13y

    same letter verbiage however every three months. On the months between use a zip letter and postcard.

    And THANK YOU.

    0Reply
  • Tiffany H.
    Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2011 · 102 posts · 12 votes
    13y

    @MichaelQuarles and others: I'm budgeting for 500 mailers per month for 6-12 months. It seems really low to me in terms of number of owners reached. Is it better if I mail that small amount 12 times or 1000 mailers 6 times?

    0Reply
  • Melanie Noblin
    Soldotna, AK · Member since 2013 · 32 posts · 5 votes
    13y

    For blank stock contact your local SMALL mom n pop printing company. Not a place like a UPS store, Not a Kinkos. Ask them if they will retail you a ream of canary bond. Or they can also print lines on it like legal ruled paper if you need it that way. They will typically be much more affordable than a photocopy or office supply store.

    0Reply
  • Michael Quarles
    Flipper/Rehabber · Bakersfield, CA · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    13y

    I would look at a 90 day program then reevaluate. the reality is that in 90 days you'll have made money and will want to increase your marketing budget.

    500 is on the low side. Keep in mind the number you're searching for is a budget of 10,000 pieces a month. Once you hit that you'll be super frustrated that your list size is too small.

    0Reply
  • Jane George
    Residential Real Estate Agent · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2013 · 59 posts · 17 votes
    13y

    Originally posted by Jerry Puckett:
    [quote=Michael Quarles]You guys need to be writing them anyway. [/quote]
    Yes, I've used red ink. The numbers say use royal blue or black. I just had a client ask for pink paper and pink envelopes. I have no idea what color ink I'll use yet!

    @jerry puckett - I think blue ink would be nicest on pink. Just a ladies opinion :)

    0Reply
  • Ryan Norman
    Real Estate Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2013 · 20 posts · 10 votes
    13y

    I'm a newbie, so forgive me for arriving late to the party. In my first two months of marketing, I "hand wrote" each piece...around 100-250 total. Nothing to sneeze at, and I certainly wasn't expecting a deal from those low numbers. For me, it was an exercise in taking action to get started, and seeing what I could learn along the way.

    I used standard yellow legal pads, and I took them to Office Depot to have them cut just below the "gum-line." I took them a total of about 10 legal pads, each containing 50 sheets of paper. They cut all 10 pads for around .75 cents. On the receipt it's called a "CUTTING, HRZNTL." Consequently, the sheets came out a couple cm shorter than standard, but still fed into my Epson WorkForce 600 just fine.

    If you're still doing it all by hand, give this a shot. Otherwise, if your budget allows, I'd certainly recommend outsourcing as much of your marketing as possible, so you can focus on the less administrative duties of your business. After two months of going at it alone, I worked a few extra hours at the day job so that I could increase my marketing budget, and partner with @Jerry Puckett for the next three months of my campaign. I'm finding that working a full-time job, and reaching the number of mailings necessary to find motivated sellers, is a quick path to getting burned out, frustrated, and impatient.

    Great job so far! You're already a success.

    2Reply
  • Tiffany H.
    Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2011 · 102 posts · 12 votes
    13y

    Hi. @Jerry Puckett thanks for sharing your blue font color codes that work for you in word. @Michael Quarles I thought I saw a post from you where you described your codes for different colors, including red. But, I've been searching for about a half hour and I can't find it. Will someone point me in the right direction, please?

    0Reply
  • Tiffany H.
    Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2011 · 102 posts · 12 votes
    13y

    Thanks for the paper/printer update @BrandonFoken. How did you get the wording to line up correctly? Did you use particular spacing?

    0Reply
  • Mike G.
    Rehabber / Flipper · Simi Valley, CA · Member since 2010 · 597 posts · 259 votes
    13y
    Originally posted by Tiffany H.:
    How did you get the wording to line up correctly? Did you use particular spacing?

    @Tiffany H. , here's what I did that worked surprisingly well: I held a sheet of the paper up to my monitor and I adjusted my view on the computer (I was using Word) until it was almost exactly the size of my paper. Then I adjusted the spacing between the lines until it matched the spacing of my paper. This worked beautifully for me, but it will depend on how well your printer matches what the computer sends it.

    1Reply
  • Tiffany H.
    Rental Property Investor · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2011 · 102 posts · 12 votes
    13y

    @Mike G. that's creative printing! I'd be interested to see what you can do with real estate. :)

    0Reply
  • Mikhail Sazonov
    Saint Albans, WV · Member since 2013 · 24 posts · 2 votes
    12y
    Originally posted by @Jerry Puckett:
    Oh, I should mention that I use the smaller, half sized tablets of yellow paper. I haven't found those ungummed at Amazon, or anywhere else.

    Jerry, thanks for the printer info. Here is actial priner specs for envelopes:

    Epson WorkForce 645

    Envelope Types:

    • No. 10
    • Plain paper
    • Bond paper
    • Air mail

    It doesn't really say All envelopes. Did you have good experience with different sizes?

    On yellow paper - here is a great paper with lines BUTT! it run about 5 cent a peice! http://www.printpps.com/yellow-notebook-filler-paper/

    Another option many recommend is printing your own lines using yellow canary paper. That could drop the price to 1.5 cent per sheet. that looks more like a deal!! http://www.costco.com/Boise-Fireworx-Paper%2c-Letter%2c-Crackling-Canary%2c-20lb%2c-500ct-CAS-MP2201CY.product.11136620.html

    BUT how to print lines on a paper so they go to the very edges??

    Did anyone tried that? Any recommendations?

    1Reply
  • Derrick H.
    Real Estate Investor · Buffalo, NY · Member since 2009 · 151 posts · 49 votes
    12y

    I would like to offer my 2 cents of assistance. I know a lot of people would like to save money when it comes to yellow letters and I found a method to make it appear more natural and handwritten on the lines. I know people are frustrated like I was with printing on the "lines" to look correct. This is gonna be a quick tutorial on how I get it correct every time with my home printer. I have a 5-n-1 home printer so it helps to have a scanner. Here it goes.....

    1.)Scan a blank copy of the yellow paper you would like to print on and save it to whatever format. *.png or *.jpg

    2.)Open "Word" or whatever program you use to write/edit your letters.

    3.)Remove the margins down to 0.00.

    4.)Insert the scanned copy of the yellow paper(Picture). It should fill the whole edit format.You may have to adjust if it doesn't.

    5.)Once you have your scanned copy uploaded. Insert a Text Box with Draw Text Box.

    6.)Under "Shape Fill" click "No Fill"

    7.)Under "Shape Outline" click "No Outline".

    8.)You should have a TEXT BOX that is transparent. That you can modify the size and move to the location you would like.

    9.)Once you move it the location you would like, type in Whatever "HandWritten" Font you use. You going to have to play around with the Box and Font Size to line up correctly.

    10.)Important Note: One TEXT BOX is needed PER LINE you want to Write.

    11.) Repeat Steps 5-9 for Each Line of the TEXT you want.

    12.) You will have to play around with the Boxes to Line Up correctly

    12.) Remember you will to remove the background image when you're ready to print.

    13.) Print a couple of Samples and you should have a nice looking Yellow Letter

    14.)Once you're satisfied with the outcome. You can start your MAIL MERGE to send out the letters.

    This technique will work on whatever Yellow Letter you have. You will have to scan a new image when you start a new batch. Every Yellow Letter design is different. I hope this Helps everyone. It works great for me.

    3Reply
  • Bob E.
    Queen Creek, AZ · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    12y

    Here is and Idea, why not use blank yellow paper and print the lines along with the text? Would work really well in Excel.

    If you want, since most printers don't print to the very edge of he paper, trim the edges when you are done.

    0Reply
  • Andrew Hofing
    Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2013 · 82 posts · 17 votes
    12y

    @Bob E. I am not beyond a basic user with excel, so how is it one sets this up in excel?

    Thanks

    0Reply
  • Bob E.
    Queen Creek, AZ · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    12y

    Select the row you want to print the line on and goto format cells

    0Reply
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