Best Method For Wholesale Leads?
Real Estate Consultant · longview, TX · Member since 2010 · 10 posts · 21 votes
Best Method For Wholesale Leads?
Most Popular Reply
Fresno, CA · Member since 2009 · 116 posts · 85 votes
15yA waste of time?
The very first letter campaign I did was 100 absentee letters (pre-1995 transfer). I received ONE phone call which turned into my very first deal. $10,000! How's that for a waste of time?
It's only a waste of time if:
1. You don't know what you're doing.
2. You're sending to the wrong people.
3. You write the wrong info. (Too much or too little)
4. You're just plain lazy.
Tips:
1. KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid. If you are sending a letter, you should be able to get your point across in about 3 sentences. Post cards should be even fewer; like a tiny bandit sign you can hold in the palm of your hand... Get to the point.
2. Timing - I've found that direct mail as well and bandit signs do terrible around the beginning of the school year. I've had the best response around mid to late spring; 8-10% return.
3. Don't spend too much money - I get lists for free through my Title Company.
4. Know where investors buy - target areas where you know your buyer's list will buy, then you won't be wasting time with property nobody wants. You should never put a property in escrow that you don't know you can sell.
5. Use a local number - Get internet voicemail. Skype, Voicemailoffice.com, Google Voice. Especially if you are a busy person. Call back EVERY person, even if they don't leave a message. I have separate numbers for mail and bandit signs.
6. Follow up with more letters or postcards.
7. Expect A LOT of RTS'. I usually get about 8% returned. Go back and edit/delete from your list.
8. Follow up on the phone calls - The laziest people I've ever met have been agents and people who CALL themselves "Wholesalers." If you don't want to work hard to make money, don't even waste your time in Real Estate.
9. Keep track of EVERYTHING you do! It is so unbelievably easy to lose track! Every phone call or letter that you forget to follow up on is money potential lost. Worst case scenario - you lose the $00.60 you spent in marketing.
Still, bandit signs have worked best for us. Hands down. For every $230 we spend, generally make about $25,000.
37 Replies
- Mobile Home Investor · Spanaway, WA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 578 votes15y
While I was a realtor, I found direct mail rather expensive, bulky and not much return for your effort and time. You had another post on time wasters. I would classify direct mail in the category of being a time waster.
- Real Estate Consultant · longview, TX · Member since 2010 · 10 posts · 21 votes15y
But I also made 20k from a 500 dollar direct mail campaign last month- (not to shaby_-targeted leads are awesome!
- Real Estate Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2010 · 5 posts · 1 vote15y
Those are really good results but it hasn't been my experience either.
- Investor · Willow Spring, NC · Member since 2009 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes15y
Prince, can you break down the $500 you spent? How much for the list, postage, mailing... and how many cards did you send vs. the calls you received? I don't know how clickbank fits in. What exactly do you say on the postcard to get a good return? Are you targeting one specific geographic area,or town... and I assume your goal is to just wholesale vs. subject-to or other acquisition method?
- Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes15y
Direct mail works !
In fact many people today don't have a pot to p%ss in so they do social networking all day because they just have TIME in it.
Now if you are going to mail TARGETED mailing always out pulls blanket mailing.
My father who has been passed away for some time was a supervisor at the main mail center in Atlanta,Ga and was over thousands of mail employees at the distribution hub.
I personally do not like postcards.The reason is many postal letter carriers are lazy and get paid by the route so they want to finish as fast as possible.
Many put postcards even if paid for with standard licked stamps put inside the junk circulars.Many people throw in the trash without ever seeing your piece.
Also different days of the week have different mailing volumes.You want to be on a lower volume day so your piece gets more exposure.
I like handwriting the outside of an envelope so it looks like it's from a friend. The whole goal is to keep the letter short and sweet.You just want to peak their interest and get them to call you,text you,call an 800 number where you get there number to follow up,go to your website and fill out a form etc.
With less mail volume I am finding out better returns with direct mail.
The message of your piece and how it is laid out will drive response as well.This is where you test and track all of your marketing material.
Not everyone will respond immediately.Sending out letters has a building effect. Some will respond now and others in a few months.Being consistent is the key to success.
It is much better to send 100 letters once a month for a year then to send 1,200 letters all at once and run out of money.
If you send the wrong message to 1,200 people even if they are targeted you will get low to zero response.If you start small and experiment you will find the sweet spot that generates the best result over time.
The goal is to constantly tweak your control to improve response.First start out with a small mailer such as 50 or 100 and then start tracking.After you have the increased response to a fantastic level then you go bigger and scale it up.
Usually 1 to 2% is average,5% is really good,10% and you are hitting a grand slam.
This process I am mentioning has been tested thousands of times to be most effective in successful mailings.
- Real Estate Investor · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2008 · 55 posts · 99 votes15y
I get great results using the yellow letter and these lists:
1. absentee landlords original mortgage date 1995 and below.
2. Inheritance List
3. Probate
4. Pre-foreclosures original deed date 1999 and below.My other top sources are bandit signs and internet marketing.
Cheers :)
Sean - Real Estate Investor · Lawrenceville, GA · Member since 2009 · 27 posts · 4 votes15y
Sean,
How do you get the absentee landlords with a dated mortgage?
I can pull Absentee landlords for free from MLS but wondering how you able to find the mortgage origination. Do you pay for it? How much? - Real Estate Investor · Mesa, AZ · Member since 2010 · 11 posts · 6 votes15y
Get the billboard/TV guys to send you leads for property types they get calls on but don't deal with. Build your buyer list, wholesale those properties, and pay the billboard guys 20% of what you make. That's the best lead source there is because you're coat-tailing on their 15k/month ad budget.
Nobody in Phoenix has an ad budget anymore, but it was nice while it lasted. I was the go-to guy for mobile homes for about a dozen Homevestors franchises and a few other locals with big ad budget.
For anyone else in Phoenix: I'm BACK doing mobile homes now, along with mobile home parks and other multi-unit properties if the CAPs are high enough. Send 'em if ya got 'em. Greater Phoenix area only, and I mean that.
@Prince - You can't be doing this well by just targeting absentee owners as such. You've gotta be hitting absentee owners in foreclosure or in some other distress situation.
In any major metro, you should be able to get NOTS lists off your MLS, or from 3rd parties who compile them immediately as they are filed at the County.
And some County Assessor offices will run just about any search you want for $100-200-ish.@Realtyman - direct mail IS a time-waster if not specifically targeted and appropriate for current market conditions. And personally, I avoid sales pitch bs and useless guru-speak filler text like "bankruptcy, foreclosure, divorce". They know their situation. I use that space to tell them simply and clearly them what I do, else I leave it blank.
Many title companies used to make up free postcards off the county NOTS filings (you'd pay only for stamps). Maybe they still do. I never used them just because I'm a control freak about my stuff.@Joel - you didn't tell us which the lower volume mail days are. I'll call the Post Office, because I never actually bothered to check on that before.
Scary thought about lazy carriers slipping postcards into the junkmail. Homemade postcards are good enough otherwise for low to medium residential properties.
Just who are you going to mail to for A YEAR? Tired landlords and owners of vacant properties is about it. The other stress situations are generally resolved by then. Yes, some people rescue themselves from foreclosure only to fall back into it, so just always mail to the current NOTS list and you'll catch them every time.@Sean - more power to those who can do deals from probate. I worked it just long enough to learn that the people who step up to be PR are the responsible ones who aren't desperate sellers, and that the probate attys I targeted told me that rarely did anyone open probate unless they already had a buyer.
Maybe you know something I don't, but to me the "JG Banks" kind of PR list is absolute crap. You gotta get in earlier than that. I was working Death Certificates for a while (targeting the "Mail To:" names), but then I started up the mobile home referral thing, and just showed probate the door.@Jack - I can't speak for Sean, but on the MLS I use there's a sub-system called "IMapp" which pretty much rules the earth. Original loan date is one of the 50 or so fields in the .csv files I download and process in MS Access.
But as said to someone else, many County offices will run searches for a couple hundred bucks. - Real Estate Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2010 · 5 posts · 1 vote15y
I get a lot of my lists, including absentee owners from ListSource.
- Real Estate Broker · Member since 2010 · 15 posts · 4 votes15y
My experience with direct mail pieces were not great. I did letter mailers and it worked out a little bit better, still not great. Although, when you close a deal from a mail piece and make upwards of $10,000-100,000 you have to ask the question, was it really THAT expensive and time consuming to just keep a mailer active.
My results on mailers are roughly 2%. I've had a 20% return on a mailer but it was because I was offering something I won't do twice. My experience is that people will open an envelope addressed to them with a return address on it, whether hand written or printed and they'll read the letter.
post cards are more easily thrown in the trash bin before reading, I do the same thing, I go through my mail over my trash can and I drop promotions without reading them, I just don't have the time, I think that's common. But I've read other investors letters to me because I didn't know what the package was so I opened it and read it...still dropped it in the trash lol, what you say and who is reading it is key. - Lender · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2008 · 166 posts · 46 votes15y
The key with direct mail is consistency. Its not the first 500 letters or postcards you send...its the following 2-3x's they see your mail. Most of your competition will send a big one time mailer and gauge the effectiveness from that. And never follow up. Send mail for 1 year month after month, then see where you stand.
- Fresno, CA · Member since 2009 · 116 posts · 85 votes15y
A waste of time?
The very first letter campaign I did was 100 absentee letters (pre-1995 transfer). I received ONE phone call which turned into my very first deal. $10,000! How's that for a waste of time?
It's only a waste of time if:
1. You don't know what you're doing.
2. You're sending to the wrong people.
3. You write the wrong info. (Too much or too little)
4. You're just plain lazy.Tips:
1. KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid. If you are sending a letter, you should be able to get your point across in about 3 sentences. Post cards should be even fewer; like a tiny bandit sign you can hold in the palm of your hand... Get to the point.
2. Timing - I've found that direct mail as well and bandit signs do terrible around the beginning of the school year. I've had the best response around mid to late spring; 8-10% return.
3. Don't spend too much money - I get lists for free through my Title Company.
4. Know where investors buy - target areas where you know your buyer's list will buy, then you won't be wasting time with property nobody wants. You should never put a property in escrow that you don't know you can sell.
5. Use a local number - Get internet voicemail. Skype, Voicemailoffice.com, Google Voice. Especially if you are a busy person. Call back EVERY person, even if they don't leave a message. I have separate numbers for mail and bandit signs.
6. Follow up with more letters or postcards.
7. Expect A LOT of RTS'. I usually get about 8% returned. Go back and edit/delete from your list.
8. Follow up on the phone calls - The laziest people I've ever met have been agents and people who CALL themselves "Wholesalers." If you don't want to work hard to make money, don't even waste your time in Real Estate.
9. Keep track of EVERYTHING you do! It is so unbelievably easy to lose track! Every phone call or letter that you forget to follow up on is money potential lost. Worst case scenario - you lose the $00.60 you spent in marketing.Still, bandit signs have worked best for us. Hands down. For every $230 we spend, generally make about $25,000.
- Appraiser · Austin, TX · Member since 2014 · 162 posts · 19 votes11y
@Sean Terry You rule man!!
@Chris Williams 100% accurate
- Real Estate Lender · Hunt Valley, MD · Member since 2014 · 24 posts · 0 votes11y
Direct mails works THE BEST if
1 - Targeted properly
2 - Has great and relevant content. With a call to action
3 - Complimented by excellent customer service and follow up
- New to Real Estate · Ogden · Member since 2014 · 107 posts · 19 votes11y
Originally posted by @Sean Terry:
I get great results using the yellow letter and these lists:
1. absentee landlords original mortgage date 1995 and below.
2. Inheritance List
3. Probate
4. Pre-foreclosures original deed date 1999 and below.My other top sources are bandit signs and internet marketing.
Cheers :)
SeanI love Sean Terry's advice. I would have to say that it all depends on how the direct mail is presented. Also, who you're targeting matters. Yellow paper with handwriting, short simple & genuine would make the most sense to me.
Sean Terry? Omg! --) Sean, you are the whole reason I became interested in REI. You're free blueprint about "How to Quit your Job in 19 weeks," Is a great eye opener of a book! I find direct mail, using Sean Terry's advice, works. Okay, maybe my P.O.V. Is a bit biased, but honestly Mr. Sean Terry. I love you're Flip2Freedom.com program and books. I'm a beginner in the whole process, but I'm loving all I'm learning.
- Real Estate Investor · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2011 · 60 posts · 17 votes11y
Greetings All,
Personally I like a "Targeted" direct mailing campaign for probate. In which I pull my own data from public records separating the junk from the actual motivated sellers. Then I send letters every month until they call or the property is sold. I get an 18% callback and close about 83% of those deals.
I have a much smaller pool that I send to by doing my research up front. I spend a lot less time and money by doing my marketing this way. It takes me about 30-45 seconds to vet each potential lead. And another 30-45 seconds to add the info into my database. Since I do it every day it only take me 15-30 minutes to go through the new leads each day.
I tried buying the leads from the big listing services but found a lot of junk leads. With my method I can target just the leads I know have property, must sell, and are motivated to sell. Yes it takes more effort but the shotgun approach is a waste of resources IMHO.
It's the not number of leads, it's the quality of the leads.
Regards,
Keith Saunders
- East Haddam, CT · Member since 2015 · 5 posts · 1 vote11y
Keith... Those are impressive numbers. Thanks for sharing. It is good you weed out the less than ideal leads by scrutinizing. Excellent idea for those who may be just getting their feet wet with low budgets.
- Homeowner · Saint Peters, MO · Member since 2015 · 32 posts · 2 votes11y
Great info in here for a newbie like me
- Professional · Baldwin, WI · Member since 2015 · 2 posts · 0 votes11y
I have found a platform like no other. I can get all standard lead information plus, web site link, email, phone dailer, recording, mass contact, customer management, and more. I sit down, log on to my web site included. I get free unlimited leads in what ever local, state, federal, customized demographic I need. I click call and I get my script, contact history, call date history, recorded calls, scrubbed lists, web, email, mass marketing abilities, its seemingly endless. www.cold-miner.com.
- Clifton, NJ · Member since 2016 · 13 posts · 2 votes9y
@Keith Saunders Hi Keith! I really like your method, could you explain to me in a little more detail how I could go about getting public records and how to vet them to find the quality leads....I am still new to RE and originally thought that I wanted to focus on Buy&Hold, but now that I see all the options, I have decided to get my feet wet networking with serious investors in my area to build a buyer list and beginning a methodical marketing campaign. That way, I can hopefully save up even more capital to invest comfortably in flips & BRRRR. I would appreciate any suggestions!
~Jenn
- Rental Property Investor · Oklahoma City, OK · Member since 2016 · 8 posts · 2 votes9y
This was the article I needed to read. My only question is this: is their a better rate of calls from a hand written bandit sign vs a nice printed sign or is there not much difference?
- Real Estate Investor · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 1 vote9yIsaac Schweitzer We are 3 1/2 months in FRESH & NEWBIES We do hand written. They get taken down anyways We get calls still no deal close to 3 already, Phoenix Az Save your $
- Surprise, AZ · Member since 2016 · 11 posts · 4 votes9y
https://www.mypostcardmania.com/api/files/76615255...
Mailing these postcards to absentee owners and trustees in all around Phoenix 1700 total leads every 60 days. Any advice? Very nervous as I am a noob. I have been studying wholesaling for a little over a year.
- Rental Property Investor · Houston, TX · Member since 2017 · 63 posts · 18 votes8y
@Todd Lisonbee your postcard design looks pretty nice. Any results so far?
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