Houston, TX · Member since 2018 · 7 posts · 2 votes
Hello,
New to BP but have been lurking for the past several months. I am curious to know how many physician real estate investors are on the forum and if they can offer up their specific experience of getting into real estate investment? How did you manage your portfolio while still being clinically busy? Did you start investing even with high burden of student loans? Did you start off using turnkey companies or on your own? Most of the information I have gotten so far has been from physician-specific sites like passiveincomemd.com and whitecoatinvestor.com
I am a young physician, early in my career, but really wanting to start getting my feet wet sooner than later. Have finished reading Rich Dad, Poor Dad and now onto The Millionaire Real Estate Investor. Ultimately my goal is to be financially independent from medicine so that I can practice as much or as little as I want. Haven't personally spoken to many physicians about this.
Specialist · Carolina Beach, NC · Member since 2016 · 390 posts · 496 votes
8y
I have personally worked with Joe Fairless at Ashcroft Capital. Their focus is on value add apartment communities primarily in the Dallas, TX market. Very straight shooter.
I also think very highly of @jeredsturm at SNS Capital but I don’t personally know anyone who has invested with them. Read Jered’s post about the source of capital in syndication deals and you’ll understand why I think so highly of him.
@JeremyRoll is also a great source of a wide variety of passive investment opportunities. From real estate, to cell phone towers, to ATM machines, etc.
I work with many physicians, and some of them have a partner who deals with a lot of the ins and outs of the REI business. Depending on how many properties and what types, may depend on what you can handle. A lot of physicians I know invest in NNN retail, or REITs which are pretty passive.
I am a physician and relatively new RE investor. I wasn't sure where to start so I did several things in a short period of time - a couple crowdfunding deals through several platforms, turned a second home into a rental property with a property manager, and a development deal.
Before doing any of these, I read many blog posts on here, the websites you mentioned, and probably some other random blog websites too. I really wanted to know what the risks of each type of investing would bring and how I could mitigate those risks as much as possible.
I am fortunate to not have too much student debt but even if I did, I would do a combination of debt paydown and investing. Personally, I think starting to invest as young as possible is very important. Even if mistakes are made early on, at least there is time to correct the course you're on.
I did a fair amount of researching and reading about turnkey companies. Ultimately, I decided that wasn't for me because the returns aren't as high as I am trying to achieve. My latest research focuses on the MF/apartment space. I am trying to break into that now.
To manage all this, I have had to put my social life on hold. Having a side business in a completely different field is difficult and time consuming. It can be done but it requires sacrifice.
I hope I was able to answer your questions. If you have any more, feel free to reach out.
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
I have dealt with many over my 4 decades of helping investors..
Most that I see are high level
1. they are very bright generally and can understand advanced concepts.. buy a rental house is not an advanced concepts.
2. I think many prefer to align themselves with trusted professionals be that Syndicators, crowdfunders, reits , Developers etc etc.. IE heavy lifting.
3. When I had my HML business in Oakland I had a ton of medical professionals as lenders on deeds of trust.. I think they loved that .. passive totally.. we do all the work scouting and finding the deals.. they collect the cash flow.. and no cash calls. ( as long as note did not default LOL ) which is rare but does happen ..
I personally don't know many that went the SFR route for rentals.. seem to leap frog.. one they usually by the time they are able to invest can count themselves as accredited.. so that opens up a lot of doors.
I have been partnering in the Brooklyn, NY area with 2 Physicians.
One of the Physicians, let's call him Dr. Marshall, also wanted to get started in REI when he was younger.
Unfortunately for him, he took a $40k course from one of the Guru's, which included Coaching. The Coaching sessions had him take over $100k out on Credit Cards to purchase a property in Las Vegas, pre-Financial Crisis.
He wound up buying a SFH and rented it out, but after the crash, Vegas property values plummeted by about 70% of it's pre-Crisis Peak. He was over $250k in the hole.
Unfortunately, Bush had signed in a change to the Bankruptcy laws which took away the advantage of Chapter 7 since his Salary was too high.
He found me through courses that I was teaching in NYC. I helped him out of his predicament. Eventually, I trained him and he invested in multi-family Properties in Brooklyn starting around 2013. Today, he's a Millionaire because he stopped the bleeding on his first investment and the Investments he made with me did great!
The 2nd Physician, Let's call him Dr. Mike. He was a long time friend of mine for over 25 years. Never invested because he grew up with me in Brooklyn, prior to the Gentrification movement. He only saw what Brooklyn was before.
BUT, after visiting with me every year for the last 10 years.... he started to understand the methodology of investing in high appreciating, quality areas in NYC. He became a Partner 2 years ago in multi-family. He has done well, but it will be slower for him than Dr. Marshall because he invested just a little bit more recently.
Anyway, those are a brief history of the two Physicians I work with. I'm expanding working with Physicians mainly because they have a lot of colleagues.
I will say, however, that like a lot of very demanding, highly stressful professions, you are going to be very good at the profession you chose. But that doesn't mean it will translate to REI. There is a lot to learn and I don't consider "Rich Dad, Poor Dad" and Educational Book. I would prefer you try to read What Every Real Estate Investor Needs to Know About Cash Flow
Since you have already proven you can reach a very high level of education, the linked Book should be a book you can understand given enough time to work out anything fuzzy.
Houston, TX · Member since 2018 · 7 posts · 2 votes
8y
@Pam G. Thanks so much for providing details of your experience. I am definitely interested in moving forward but want to do my due diligence as well. I have looked into several turnkey companies and have a phone call with Memphis Invest next week. I do like the idea of starting with a turnkey so that I can kind of be handheld through the process and then delve further into MF and handling a property on my own. I also am very interested in crowdfunding and will likely start investing there soon. What sites do you like? So far I have seen good things about RealtyShares and a few others. If you don't mind expanding a bit further, how did you get into MF investing? What sources do you use to identify properties? Are you doing most of this on your own? If so, I can absolutely understand it being like a second job!
The promising thing for me is that I'm relatively young, have time to learn, and am genuinely interested in real estate!
Houston, TX · Member since 2018 · 7 posts · 2 votes
8y
@Jay Hinrichs Thanks so much for your input! Yes, it seems like physicians for the most part want to be as passive as possible. I want to take a mixed approach. Interesting that they are not interested in SFR route. I am interested in starting there first and then moving upward. What turnkey companies do you recommend or have you seen physicians use more often?
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
@Rashmi Patel I am not saying all physicans eschew SFR's or lower value asset rentals.. I am just talking about the one's I have helped over the years.. most have been pretty to very savvy and went for conservative deals.. or they went in on bigger projects that were more complex.
I don't know any that bought SFR rentals and had to deal with tenants.. Frankly. but I am sure they are out there.. its just the one's I dealt with.
I had the 15 minute phone interview with Memphis Invest. At the time, I was really excited about working with them. I can't explain well or really understand what happened but essentially, I didn't feel like I could connect with the sales rep. I decided not to follow up with them and the feeling seemed mutual. I then turned to other leads.
I completely agree with @Llewelyn A. regarding Frank Gallinelli's book. It is a recommended book on the WCI. It gave me good insight into what real estate investors look at when analyzing a deal. My analysis skills are still rudimentary because I don't push myself to use them day to day as a full time real estate investor would. However, the book is a great starting point to understand the math behind it all.
As for crowfunding sites, I have my hand in a few of them. I personally like Peerstreet and Patch of Land. I used Ian Ippolito's website to get quick, high yield lessons about the capital stack, real estate market cycles, and some things to look for when deciding which online platform to use. I also have some investments in the Fundrise and Realty Mogul REITs. Funny thing, I think I signed up for RealtyShares first but I had shiny object syndrome and was really looking to deploy my investment funds in quick fashion. I decided on a dollar limit I wanted to use for crowdfunding and made it happen. Once the 30 day RealtyShares cooling off period ended, I had already deployed the money. Once my current investments end, I will research RealtyShares again. There are several forum topics on crowdfunding on this site. I would recommend reading through those.
I haven't done a MF deal yet. The main setback I am running into is finding reliable contractors. No one would ever call me handy so the idea of renovating multiple units and coordinating everything needed for a deal of that sort sounds overwhelming to me at this time.
Qualified Intermediary for 1031 Exchanges · St. Petersburg, FL · Member since 2013 · 9k+ posts · 9k+ votes
8y
@Rashmi Patel, The best advice I ever heard on this topic was from a guest on Jaime Tarde's "Eventual Millionaire". He said the most important piece of advice he had ever received was to "only do what you love - nothing else". Because if you do what you don't love you'll suck at it and you'll burn out.
The plumber who loves to plumb but hires plumbers and ends up being a business owner is a great example of this. He didn't want to do payroll. He wanted to plumb.
For physicians especially, your passion (demonstrated by the incredible drive shown to get the license) lies in the healing arts. Straying from that passion is dangerous and it leaves your core competency which puts at risk the engine that can drive your REI career. And you'll resent the time spent on RE that could have been spent advancing your craft. That is why almost ever high level operator in any sector I've run into works with RE advisors and only gets involved at 10,000 ft. Real estate is fun for them but they don't want it to get in the way of their real passion.
Turn Key and other passive RE instruments can be great for your involvement because they allow you to indulge but limit your involvement to the tertiary. The reason why you don't see so much turnkey among physicians today is that it is a relatively new industry as a recognized industry. But the passivity of it and the involvement of management in between you and the assets have all the earmarks of an appropriate investment for a professional.
The unwritten rule but my observed phenomena just like @?Jay Hinrichs is the higher the level of professional the larger and more institutional the asset. This is probably just a function of available dollars and the ability to only do so many deals in a day. So SF quickly becomes a non-starter.
Rental Property Investor · St. Paul, MN · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
8y
@Rashmi Patel I would suggest going at it passively while being consumed with your physician job. Once you start getting the cash flow that you need, then you can look at lowering your hours or quitting all together. Ways to passively invest:
Syndication - Multi-family, self-storage, etc. Invest with private companies and expect 15-20% IRR
NNN lease properties (Walgreens, Dollar Tree etc) - You own the asset yourself and have some management responsibilities, expect 8-12% IRR
REIT's - All commercial, big investment company, expect 6-10%
Turn-key houses - not sure on returns
Hard Money lending - this is semi-active and can get 15-20%+ returns
New to BP but have been lurking for the past several months. I am curious to know how many physician real estate investors are on the forum and if they can offer up their specific experience of getting into real estate investment? How did you manage your portfolio while still being clinically busy? Did you start investing even with high burden of student loans? Did you start off using turnkey companies or on your own? Most of the information I have gotten so far has been from physician-specific sites like passiveincomemd.com and whitecoatinvestor.com
I am a young physician, early in my career, but really wanting to start getting my feet wet sooner than later. Have finished reading Rich Dad, Poor Dad and now onto The Millionaire Real Estate Investor. Ultimately my goal is to be financially independent from medicine so that I can practice as much or as little as I want. Haven't personally spoken to many physicians about this.
Any advice would be appreciated!
RP
Hello and welcome! Investing in Turnkey can be great when you work a 9-5. Some of us do not have time to be a landlord or a flipper full time. A TRUE Turnkey company will own, renovate, and manage the property all in house. They should not use any third parties in the process.
Thanks for the advice! When I am honest with myself, I think I want to be more on the passive side of things. But of course the curious side of me wants to learn as much as I can about the business. It's truly a new field but very exciting! I am looking into syndication, crowdfunding, and turnkeys right now. Will keep exploring but my goal is to pull the trigger with something this year and not be prey to my own analysis paralysis!
Specialist · Carolina Beach, NC · Member since 2016 · 390 posts · 496 votes
8y
I have personally worked with Joe Fairless at Ashcroft Capital. Their focus is on value add apartment communities primarily in the Dallas, TX market. Very straight shooter.
I also think very highly of @jeredsturm at SNS Capital but I don’t personally know anyone who has invested with them. Read Jered’s post about the source of capital in syndication deals and you’ll understand why I think so highly of him.
@JeremyRoll is also a great source of a wide variety of passive investment opportunities. From real estate, to cell phone towers, to ATM machines, etc.
United States · Member since 2015 · 401 posts · 394 votes
8y
You mentioned student loan debt burden - I know this will differ by person and that some prefer to get rid of the debt all together as soon as possible, but my opinion is that it makes the most financial sense to invest that money instead IF you can find an investment with better returns than whatever your student loan interest is.
As some have said, I agree with the recommendation to look at passive opportunities. From what society tells us (since I don't know from personal experience), your day job will keep you very busy and thus actively managing a portfolio will be pretty difficult. Some things to consider - syndication (MF, SS, MHP, etc), crowd funding, turnkey, etc as others have mentioned.
Best of luck and don't catch the analysis paralysis bug!
Dallas, TX · Member since 2016 · 7 posts · 2 votes
7y
Hi Rashmi,
I'm a full-time Internal Medicine Hospitalist and have been investing in real estate for the last 4 years. Most of my investments are through syndications which allow the investor to be passive and enjoy the benefits of investing in real estate without being hands on.
I'm a medical resident about to graduate and would like to know any updates or any new docs on the BG forums exist and how they have fared?
Did you use FHA or Physician Loans?
I'm 100% going to pay down my SL debt first then invest (psychologically it's a burden).
Its only a burden until someone changes your perspective.. As a Physician, you are always going to be employed (or employable quickly), so if you could make the minimum payments to your student loan debt (assuming interest rates are below 4% or so), you should be saving up the rest of your saveable money to invest in appreciating assets (or cash flowing assets atleast).
Hello @Rashmi Patel and @Cherry Chen ! I am an internal medicine primary care physician who also just finished Rich Dad Poor Dad and am interested in investing in real estate. I work full time, am a mom of two , have a considerable amount of student loan debt -- and want to know how I can invest in real estate on a more passive level? Would you still recommend real estate syndications and if so , what companies do you recommend? Any updates to the advice mentioned above?
Contractor · Sheboygan, WI · Member since 2016 · 917 posts · 266 votes
3y
@Serene Tareen take a look at triple net leased RE(NNN). It's a truly passive investment in RE as the company you lease the property to pays for all maintenance, insurance and RE taxes.
You should be able to lock in with a lease 16%+/yr. Cash on cash return.
