First House or First Investment Property?

First House or First Investment Property?

Investor · Fishers, IN · Member since 2012 · 12 posts · 2 votes

I apologize in advance if this topic is covered elsewhere... I've searched around and all I've found is a topic about purchasing a vacation home instead of an investment property. But here's my situation... I'm a 25 year old college graduate with a good job in Accounting. I'm wanting to start investing early, but I've been told that I should buy my own first house and settle in before starting to purchase investment properties. This advice was given by a successful real estate/business investor that lives in the same city as I do, to his own son as well as to me. It should be noted that I live in an Indiana city of 100k people, so this isn't a "I live in LA and couldn't afford a house even if I wanted to" situation. Is this advice that I should take to heart, or is owning investment property while renting acceptable? Also, feel free to ask any questions about myself, my strategy, or my finances that would help respond to the topic. Thanks everyone!

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FL · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 357 votes
14y

Ken Barrett,
Welcome to the best Real Estate forum on the net.!!!

Do you want to be a landlord?

Have you thought about purchasing a 2, 3, or 4 unit property, and occupy one of the units?

An Owner Occupied property, will qualify for a low interest rate.

Raymond

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  • FL · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 357 votes
    14y

    Ken Barrett,
    Welcome to the best Real Estate forum on the net.!!!

    Do you want to be a landlord?

    Have you thought about purchasing a 2, 3, or 4 unit property, and occupy one of the units?

    An Owner Occupied property, will qualify for a low interest rate.

    Raymond

  • Joel OwensBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
    14y

    Ken,

    My answer would be to know the market you are living in.The nation is struggling as a whole but certain markets have recovered and values are actually going up.

    Buying your own house could be a good investment if values are rising.If values are flat or declining and a bunch of short sales or foreclosures are looming then you might want to invest first.

    Also how much space do you need?? If you only need 800 sq ft and can rent an apartment for 800 a month then it might be better for you than buying a 2,000 sq ft house that cost you much more in maintenance and taxes each year.

    If you bought your first house to live in that might affect your debt ration to qualify for an income property.Then if you have to wait a few years interest rates can be higher and prices could have risen more.

  • Investor · Fishers, IN · Member since 2012 · 12 posts · 2 votes
    14y

    Raymond B. Thanks for the warm welcome! My initial strategy and financial analysis that I've set up in my excel spread sheet would included hiring a property manager to do the landlording for me, while still giving me a $125 per month profit. Having said that, I'm not opposed to doing it myself for my first few investments to really learn the ropes and all aspects of the industry.

    I have considered buying a multi-family property as my first investment/residence. Unfortunately, there aren't any on the market currently in the area that I live in (I actually was looking today!). Well, I should clarify that comment... there aren't any on the side of town that I would actually live on. There are a few in a area of town with a higher crime rate, drug houses, etc.

    Joel Owens I'm currently renting a 2 bedroom 1200 sq ft house for $900 per month with a roommate ($450 per person), and that includes utilities and cable. This was one of the reasons that I thought it would be a good idea to start investing while renting. My total cost of living, per my home, is only $450 per month. It wasn't until I was given the advice to wait until I've purchased my own home that I even gave it any thought to put my savings towards a down payment on a house instead of an investment property. So not only would I have to re-save another down-payment, but I would have the debt ratio working against me, and the opportunity cost of lost income.

  • Investor · El Paso/Socorro, TX · Member since 2012 · 365 posts · 75 votes
    14y

    We started out with our first house being a home. I would not do it again knowing what I have learned. You have a great situation with your rental being so cheap. I was discussing this same topic with a friend who is living at his parents, perfect opportunity to invest!

  • Investor · Orlando, FL · Member since 2012 · 431 posts · 106 votes
    14y

    If I was in your situation i'd wait on the personal residence and buy a rental. Getting into the game early in your career is a big benefit, especially with the current interest rate environment.

    Odds are you'll probably move or shift careers in the next few years anyway, so why anchor yourself down at your age? I don't think anyone I know well is still on the same career track that they were at 25.

  • Investor · Fishers, IN · Member since 2012 · 12 posts · 2 votes
    14y

    Charles Morgan Steve K Thanks so much for the feedback guys! I was thinking the same thing, especially the bit about my probably moving within the next few years. I just wanted to gain some affirmation though, because the advice was given by a successful investor. I would have hated to ignore him just on my own standing only to find out that he was right. Going along the lines of what Raymond B. mentioned, I would love to be able to adopt both philosophies and just move into a multifamily residence, unfortunately the only ones up for sale are in the worst neighborhoods.

  • Real Estate Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2008 · 122 posts · 46 votes
    14y

    Ken Barrett, I definitely think the ideal situation is to buy a 2-4 unit where you live in one of the units and rent out the rest. That being said, if you can't find one that is both a good investment AND a place you would consider living in, I'd go with the next best thing-- buying an investment property first. This way, you start building your investment portfolio earlier to get the ball rolling. Plus, it would be easier for your to obtain financing without a home mortgage. I think delaying the gratifcation (and cost) of owning your own home to purchase investment real estate is prudent and will pay huge dividends down the road.

  • Investor · Fishers, IN · Member since 2012 · 12 posts · 2 votes
    14y

    Thanks for the feedback Kyle Koller! After hearing the responses so far, I'm definitely thinking that buying an investment property first is going to be the way to go, especially in terms of my future. I think I would rather be more of a buy and lease type of investor, in which case the sooner I start, the sooner the property gets paid off and my profit goes from $125/month to $500/month!

  • Real Estate Professional · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2012 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    14y

    The mistake I made at age 27 (two years ago) was buying my first home. Looking back, I should have bought a duplex and have the other one rented out. This way, the renter pays for my mortgage and I live for free.

  • Mobile Home Investor · Spanaway, WA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 578 votes
    14y

    You want to get the investment properties first. Then when you have enough income coming in from the investments you get a home and your tenants pay for it for you. We got our first rental home while living in a 2 bedroom apartment. The real estate agent looked at us like we were crazy. You want to stay in an apartment and rent out a house? We did it and it gave us a good foundation to build on. Good Luck in your investing!

  • Investor · San Jose, CA · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    14y
    Originally posted by Ken Barrett:
    Thanks for the feedback Kyle Koller! After hearing the responses so far, I'm definitely thinking that buying an investment property first is going to be the way to go, especially in terms of my future. I think I would rather be more of a buy and lease type of investor, in which case the sooner I start, the sooner the property gets paid off and my profit goes from $125/month to $500/month!

    Well, I was going to chime in, but it looks like you already got a lot of good advice above. However, I believe you might have misunderstood the suggestion from the "successful" investor. I believe this was his intention.

    Buy your primary residence first, which would get you the best interest rate and lowest down payment. Then you move up to your 2nd house, which again can be accomplished with the best interest rate and lowest down payment, and rent out your first home. You do this 4 times, and you will achieve the best of all world. That would be my educated guess, but what the heck do I know? :0)

  • Investor · Union, NJ · Member since 2011 · 838 posts · 295 votes
    14y

    Welcome Ken.

    I'd agree with the rest here in that with your living expenses so uniquely low, coupled with this incredible down market topped off by historically low interests, i'd say take advantage and try and pick up 1 or 2 multi family investment properties or even sf if no multis are available in your area.

    good luck,
    chris

  • Investor · Fishers, IN · Member since 2012 · 12 posts · 2 votes
    14y

    I'm thinking that with the over whelming response of "invest first, buy your own later" I'm going to have to do just that. I especially like the idea that several of you have mentioned about purchasing a multi-family, moving in, and having them pay off the mortgage with their rent payments. I truly have been on the look-out for that opportunity, however, none of risen as of yet. I guess the next question would be, how long should I continue looking/waiting for that multifamily opportunity before deciding on going with a SF?

  • Involved In Real Estate · Rochester Hills, MI · Member since 2010 · 812 posts · 178 votes
    14y

    Ken,

    Invest first. Don't buy anything unless you're getting $300 positive cashflow MINIMUM, even with management. Anything under that isn't worth the hassle. Read up on all the different expenses that are involved with landlording. The general 50% rule is garbage in my opinion. Take a realistic breakdown of expenses, PITI, vacancy. A $125 cashflow after PITI = a negative cashflow and it isn't even close.

  • Developer · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2012 · 132 posts · 32 votes
    14y

    Hi Ken,

    I'm new to RE Investing I have acquired 4 properties in the last 6 months. I currently rent as it is more beneficial for me to do so as I continue acquiring properties. I toyed with the idea of buyer a SFH first and it didn't make sense. I hope this helps.

  • Investor · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 450 votes
    14y

    I don't think your next property has to be an investment property right now. If you find a place where you think you could live for the nest 10 years, I'd say just make sure the mortgage is the same or less than what you would otherwise pay for rent. If you think you will be unhappy and desire to move within the next 10 years, make sure you only pay as much as what would permit it to be a profitable rental the day you buy it (even if you do decide to live there for 5 years or so). Either one of these strategies are prettly likely to reduce the risk that the purchase will put you in financial stalemate.

  • Investor · Union, NJ · Member since 2011 · 838 posts · 295 votes
    14y

    Ken,

    Are you working with a Realtor or Broker in your search for a multi family? IF there just arent any in your surrounding area or area you are comfy with than go for a SF just make sure the numbers make sense of course.

    My first was a 4 family with a 5th finished basement apt. in which I rented out all 5 units and stayed living at home with my Mom. That allowed me to sock away a ton of cash very quickly and put me on course for my next several houses.

    good luck,
    Chris

  • Lender · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2008 · 351 posts · 40 votes
    14y

    Hey Ken, I think what Joel said is smart. Knowing your market is key.

    I am in pretty much the same situation as you just turned 25, good job, and real estate is starting to finally take shape. Honestly, part of the reason I bought was because I didn't want to commute (in Chicago were talking 3 hours of windshield time a day). But I knew the good areas of the city that will never go bad (at least we think). I was lucky enough to find a 2/2 in my price range. I rent out to someone now and all but $400 is paid for my mortgage. I addition to that, I have been looking at my place and it comps out, on the low end, with 65k in equity.

    If you are going to be somewhere for a while and can rent part of it out to cover your payments I would buy. Just buy right, if you can look at it as an investment but it is nice enough to feel "home" I wouldn't pass it up with how cheap money is right now.

  • Investor · Fishers, IN · Member since 2012 · 12 posts · 2 votes
    14y

    I'm glad that this topic has been able to benefit others as much as it has me! While I've been reading a ton, working on financial spreadsheets, etc. this questions was still one of the biggest, and as it seems, most simple questions that I needed answered. It's awesome to have such a great community of investors that I can easily reach and communicate ideas and strategies with! Also, it's nice to hear that not only is it solid advice to purchase the investment first, but that several of you were in a very similar situation to me and that was the strategic route that you took and it has paid off for you (I apologize for the run-on sentence). Chris Masons I currently am not working with a broker. I've spoken with a few, but none of them actually are real estate investors themselves. From what I've read, its a good idea to build my team based off of like-minded investors. So as of right now, I'm still searching for an agent that actually invests. However, its not a really big deal for me, because I'm still in the 20% down payment saving stage (but not for long though :)). Joe Delia the $125 per month income that I mentioned would have included PITI, management fees, and a 10% emergency savings fund. Do you think that still isn't enough? If so, I may have to re-work my strategy as far as my finances and how many rentals I would be able to take on per year. Thanks again everyone!

  • Involved In Real Estate · Rochester Hills, MI · Member since 2010 · 812 posts · 178 votes
    14y
    Originally posted by Ken Barrett:
    I'm glad that this topic has been able to benefit others as much as it has me! While I've been reading a ton, working on financial spreadsheets, etc. this questions was still one of the biggest, and as it seems, most simple questions that I needed answered. It's awesome to have such a great community of investors that I can easily reach and communicate ideas and strategies with! Also, it's nice to hear that not only is it solid advice to purchase the investment first, but that several of you were in a very similar situation to me and that was the strategic route that you took and it has paid off for you (I apologize for the run-on sentence). Chris Masons I currently am not working with a broker. I've spoken with a few, but none of them actually are real estate investors themselves. From what I've read, its a good idea to build my team based off of like-minded investors. So as of right now, I'm still searching for an agent that actually invests. However, its not a really big deal for me, because I'm still in the 20% down payment saving stage (but not for long though :)). Joe Delia the $125 per month income that I mentioned would have included PITI, management fees, and a 10% emergency savings fund. Do you think that still isn't enough? If so, I may have to re-work my strategy as far as my finances and how many rentals I would be able to take on per year. Thanks again everyone!

    Not enough. 10% could be eaten up in vacancy alone, do you DD. Talk to PM companies about the vacancy time to expect if you were to have them manage whatever address you're considering buying.

    I'd also budget 1-2 months maintenance depending on the age and condition of the home. I typically find the stinkiest smelliest places I can, and rehab the majority of the building so our on going maintenance is pretty low. Others buy newer pretty houses and it's low for them.

  • Investor · Fishers, IN · Member since 2012 · 12 posts · 2 votes
    14y

    Joe Delia Thanks for the great advice! I'm still in the process of working out my new strategy, but I'm definitely going to implement the $300 minimum so that I can make sure to account for the items you listed like vacancy. Thanks again for the help!

  • Involved In Real Estate · Rochester Hills, MI · Member since 2010 · 812 posts · 178 votes
    14y
    Originally posted by Ken Barrett:
    Joe Delia Thanks for the great advice! I'm still in the process of working out my new strategy, but I'm definitely going to implement the $300 minimum so that I can make sure to account for the items you listed like vacancy. Thanks again for the help!

    Just to be clear, I meant $300 minimum cashflow after taking into account 1-2 months of rent towards maintenance, and a 10% vacancy, PITI, management fee's.

  • Lender · Tyngsboro, MA · Member since 2009 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    14y

    Another slant: If you buy a property that needs rehab, move in and rehab, or rehab and move in, live there for 2 years. Since it was owner occupied, you are exempt from tax on the gain if you live in it for 2 of the last 5 years, I believe. Then take that gain and do it again. That allows you to get owner occupied mortgage rates, and not pay tax on the capital gains.

    I'm not an accountant, so if one would like to jump in and correct my statements, feel free

  • Investor · Asheville, NC · Member since 2012 · 184 posts · 76 votes
    14y

    I was 24 when I bought my first property, a duplex. I lived in one and rented the other. My mortgage was $288 and rent was $600. Life was good.

    By buying right, I made sure I could sell fast if I wanted to get out, which I did 3yrs later.

    I'm with Ann, along with your other strategy, consider owner occ rehabs for capital gains (if your area is not in long term decline). This is easier when you are young (single helps too). We did that every two years for several years. Then we settled down for the kids. Love getting that check and keeping it all!

  • Real Estate Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2009 · 339 posts · 126 votes
    14y
    Originally posted by Ann Bellamy:
    ... you are exempt from tax on the gain if you live in it for 2 of the last 5 years, I believe.

    I'm not an accountant, so if one would like to jump in and correct my statements, feel free

    Ann, I am not an accountant either but I believe this benefit got taken away by the current administration. I think they pro rate it now... I wish I could remember where I read this...

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