Septic System insurance
Flipper/Rehabber · West Bloomfield, MI · Member since 2015 · 34 posts · 0 votes
Hello All. I am considering buying MF property with septic system. In both units family with kids and I worry about controlling stuff that can go to sewer system. The house is 45 years old. I do not know the condition and what kind of the system is. It is a very good cash flow but my concern is a septic system. Is the any chance I can buy insurance I can add to my home insurance policy to cover any problems? Or any suggestions to protect any damage or problems/replacement?
Thank you,
Mike Haikin
Much of the advice given already puts you in the right direction. Step 1, know more about what the condition of the system is that you are buying. A key question to ask the seller is how often do they have the tank pumped. If they don't know, inspect closer. The correct answer in most cases is every 2-3 years. Smaller septic tanks require more frequent pumping.
Knowing how the system works should reduce your fear. It is pretty simple, so I will throw in a quick description of the basic principal. You get the picture of what generally goes down the drain. It consists of various liquids as well as solids (paper, etc.). It first flows out of the building and goes into a septic tank. The tank is designed to always be full of SOMETHING, so at any given time, if you take the covers off, it will always LOOK full. Don't let that confuse you over what happens when you pump the tank every couple years. Follow with me another couple minutes. So the tank is always full. At the inlet side (sewer coming in from the house), you have a mix of everything that goes down the drain. At the septic tank, the solids tend to settle to the bottom and grease tends to float to the top. Think of the septic tank as a separation point. There is then a pipe going OUT of the septic tank to the leach field, aka the outlet. The outlet is generally located high in the tank, but SHOULD have a baffle installed on it so that the grease that is floating in the tank isn't permitted to "float" down the pipe. Picture a "T" laying on it's side, with the short leg pointing down a little longer than the leg pointing straight up. The lower leg is how the water enters the outlet (water will seek it's own level, so even though the lower part of the leg is underwater, it will fill up both inside and outside that leg at the same level BUT the water enters the leg at a lower elevation, hopefully below the level of accumulating grease. The upper leg of the "T" or outlet baffle is simply to equalize the air level inside the tank.
Continuing downstream, the liquid going out of the outlet pipe travels to the leach field. The leach field is the point where liquid waste is "spread out" in essence and given a chance to absorb into the ground. Soil is a natural filter.
That gives you a very general idea of how a septic system works. There can be different types of systems, but they all operate on the same general principal. Waste enters a tank to be separated, and the liquid portion of the waste is distributed into a network of pipes that disperse it into the soil.
Here are a few very common problems that you will find.
1) Most common is lack of upkeep. Maintaining a septic system is REALLY easy - have it pumped every 2 years to start and ask the contractor if they recommend more or less frequency. What you NEVER want to let happen is to let the solids build up high enough from the bottom OR the grease layer get so deep at the top so that either is allowed to enter the outlet pipe. Have the pumping contractor inspect the outlet baffle and replace it immediately if there is a problem. This does not cost very much to do. Figure $ 200-400 depending on your location (it is around $ 200 in my area for the average size tank) and maybe $ 100-150 tops for the baffle replacement, which, if done with PVC pipe, will last longer than you and me. Regular pumping removes the solids in the bottom and grease at the top.
2 )trees/bushes allowed to grow too close to any part of the system - the roots infiltrate the system and plug the lines (this happens with traditional city sewers too!). Regular mowing over the top of the leach field does 2 things - it keeps brush from growing on top of it as well as allowing the liquid to evaporate. Contrary to common beliefs, leach fields disperse more water from evaporation than they do by soaking into the ground!
3) Do not every dump grease or oil down the drain, this includes cooking grease. Normal dishwashing is fine. If you have a commercial use, such as a restaurant, then you may also have a separate grease trap and/or a grease separator underground. However, most residential systems don't have one. You will have a reasonable capacity for normal grease from everyday life, but intentionally dumping grease down the drain is bad. Eventually, it will overload the baffles ability to hold that grease and it will allow grease to travel into the leach field. The grease will eventually start to "seal" the leach field and reduce and eventually eliminate it's ability to disperse the liquids.
4) Do not drive cars, trucks, or heavy equipment over the septic system. It can crush lines and collapse the tops of tanks.
5) Do not use chemical drain cleaners (Draino, etc.), they quickly deteriorate the concrete components and cause failure.
6) Adding various enzymes and bacteria is up for debate. Personally, I think it is a waste of money. I'm sure that will spark other various opinions. Nature has it's way of taking care of things all by itself. Regular pumping is a better use of money. When the tank is pumped is also the PERFECT time for a quick check up. You generally have to request this of the pumping contractor. If you don't know what you are looking for, spend the money to have a quick check up done every time it is pumped.
Don't let septic systems scare you. An ounce of prevention is worth a hundred pounds of cash to fix the neglect.
If you have an inspection done before you buy the property, have the tank pumped, the baffle on both the inlet AND the outlet inspected, the distribution box inspected (this is an extra, ask for it!) and the end of at least one line uncovered. Expect to pay anywhere from $ 500 - 1,500 for a thorough inspection, THIS is your insurance policy. If you buy a working system, then do regular preventive maintenance, it will last a very long time. I have seen systems that are 50 years old and still functioning. I have also seen systems that are 5 years old and NOT functioning.
Hope that helps. Good luck
If you have a vacant lot and no house and the PERK test fails, you basically have an unbuildable property.
If you have a house with a failed septic and can't pass the PERK test elsewhere on the lot, in PA, they will use "best technical guidance". In one case we installed a holding tank which required pumping every time it filled up. In some areas where there are many failed systems the state DEP will force the municipality to extend the public sewer to the failed area.
I understand that a PERT test is needed for a failed septic system to see if it can be relocated. What happens if none of the remaining property is suitable for a septic system and assume public sewer is not available.
Quick clarification, it should be "perc" test, shortened from percolation test, which is a method to measure how fast the local soil can absorb liquid.
Just because a particular lot does not perc does not mean that all is lost. In many cases, an engineer can design a system that will work. This may involve any number of variations, some are pretty exotic and engineered systems tend to be more expensive. However, to qualify that statement, this isn't all that unusual. Septic systems are very common in rural areas. Requirements vary by locality too.
For example, in the County that I live in, a 30 minute perc. is acceptable for a standard system. Across the County line (in some cases on the other side of the road) in a neighboring County, the requirement is a 15 minute perc., which is much more difficult to attain with native soils. Sometimes it happens, other times it doesn't.
In both Counties, engineered systems overcome the local soil conditions. The County with the more strict guidelines is more populated and is developing faster, hence the stricter guidelines. But notice too that I say it is developing faster, they are building new properties much faster there, many of which are not served by public sewers.
I used to install septic systems and have been involved in construction and development most of my adult life. In my area, there are a very small percentage of lots that would be considered unbuildable. I will qualify that by saying that some areas have much heavier soil (higher clay content) or bedrock, which becomes a factor.
Above is the long answer. The short answer is that if you fail a perc test, ask questions how you can make it work, then go from there. Don't give up too easy. A failed test initially isn't the end of the world.
@Mike Haikin... was this multi built as a multi or was it a single family converted? If a conversion, did the total number of bedrooms increase?
There's a better chance that the septic system system is capable of handling the intended demands if it was designed for a multi than if a single.
Good afternoon i am in the Process to buy an investment property that need septic system replace,any septic inspection guy or company in wilson nc?? thank you
Looking at a property with septic and even though this thread is old it was still so helpful- and hilarious as well! Thanks for the laughs today.