Clearlake Area Multifamily

St. Helena, CA · Member since 2016 · 147 posts · 59 votes

I'm curious about prospects in the Clearlake area, it is the most affordable and accessible area to me. I really can't touch Napa prices. I'd love to find something in Middletown and I've heard that Lakeport is a good option. Can anyone recommend an investor savvy realtor in the area? General thoughts are also appreciated!

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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member

Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes

Originally posted by @Merv Screeton:

Go check the area before investing. A lot of the business there like Konocti Resort has shut down. Hwy 20 has so many meth addicts walking along it that you will think you are in a zombie movie. I'm not saying don't invest there but you better be aware of the current situation so you make an educated decision. I drive through there from the Sacramento area to dive in Mendocino. The countryside is beautiful and I would consider living there myself in retirement except for the unemployment and drug problems. If it's made of copper or aluminum kiss it goodbye.

Anytime you see grown men cruising around on BMX bikes that are too small for them you are in a meth area.

Merv Konocti Harbor in has open closed open closed for the 50 some years our family has been involved with Lake county.. and actually a colleague of mine right now is trying to buy it and get it repositioned. Will have to check in on him and see if he made any head way. there is no question lake county has always been a place that had great potential but never could quite get there.

And there is reasons for that.

right after the gold rush Clearlake area was quite popular as resorts.. mineral bath resorts abounded all around the area.. reason proximity to SF populations..

Once CA started to dam up all the rivers coming out of The Sierras and hwy 80 was made into a freeway to Tahoe.. those resort dollars started to filter to a bunch of different areas and markets..

There used to even be a TWA flight into a little strip on the North East side of Mt. Hannah.. this flew people into the Hobergs resorts in DC 3s in the 30s and 40s

So then when they lost the tourist trade and really no industry.. it became a place were more modest second homes were being bought and used.. and it was very much a SF based area.. and had some pretty big SF Italian communities.

in the 1920's over 60,000 lots were platted from NICE to Clear lake Oaks and the city of Clearlake Including 7k lots behind Lucerne which virtually none of them were ever built on .. a Guy Named George Triphon bought most of those lots in the early 60s surveyed them all pushed roads through but never followed through with water or sewer leaving them unbuildable and a environmental mess. you can see that as you drive hwy 20 up behind the city of Lucerne.. those lots were left to rot and then become the fodder of the guys who buy worthless tax sale lots and resell them on line.. we know all about the land geek and those dudes.

Another big company developed Konocti Riveria's they at least put in paved roads and water but not enough water capacity to build out and all the lots need septic and many don't perc... so that was an issue.

then you have Boise Cascade comes in and builds Hidden Valley lake following their theme of big development private lake golf course etc.. think Lake Wildwood etc Boise built 27 of those up and down the Seirra water sheds.. Same issue though create all the lots but water system only designed to handle the first 500 homes and there was over 4,000 lots and a bunch of the lots did not perc..

all of these issue have led to sporadic growth.. then the city of Clearlake had dirt road level ground and no restrictions on mobile homes so you had people moving in single wides as vacation homes which become full on rural ghetto situations..

So there have been many many developers and people come in after the guys made the big money in the 50 60s and early 70s then have to use modern development standards and just could not make it work..

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Casey Maib
Investor · Napa, CA · Member since 2015 · 28 posts · 8 votes
8y
@Ryan Heywood,
My personal opinion would be to avoid Lake County,if you were heavily untwined in the community and knowledgeable of the area it could be profitable. But that could be said of anywhere.
If I were to invest in Lake county my advice would be to avoid Lake port. But you should do your own due dilligence.
All that said we went to school together once upon a time, and I would be happy to get together and catch up and talk about this real estate stuff.
Casey
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Carson Wilcox
Davis, CA · Member since 2016 · 595 posts · 344 votes
8y
I too have been intrigued by the clear lake area... My email has been filling up with SFH's lately... I havent seen too many MFH's... but who knows. Lake Co. is very neighborhood dependant.. and even then you have to worry about the transitory scumbags constantly robbing stuff. I drove through it twice this last summer, and yikes. I would do a flip there, but probably wouldnt want rentals...
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Ryan Heywood
OP
St. Helena, CA · Member since 2016 · 147 posts · 59 votes
8y
Casey Maib That sounds good to me, I’ll send you my contact info! Knowing the traffic, and the unfortunate loss of so many houses in Santa Rosa, it seems to be the a better and better option. I like Middletown, there is aren’t enough options there specifically. Many people my dad has worked with in the trades ended up moving that way. I also am hearing rumors of a big influx of $ going into developing the Red Hills area. I’m curious of the changes the area might see in the next 10 years.
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Ryan Heywood
OP
St. Helena, CA · Member since 2016 · 147 posts · 59 votes
8y
Carson Wilcox I definitely see the potential for flipping. Lakeport is what I imagine Calistoga once looked like. For someone retiring out of the Bay Area it would seem to be a good choice, familiar and close by but much cheaper. Working families is may be a little harder as you start to get pretty far away for all the jobs in Napa and Santa Rosa. That said, I used to have a teacher that commuted from Hidden Valley Lake to Napa every day.
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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
well my dad started in Lake co in the mid 60s and went on to buy and sell thousands of lots.. most of nice, a lot of the oaks and a lot of clear lake.. plus we had a nice ranch in upper lake ( hunter Ranch)
now that all said I lived in lake port for years.. and that would be the BEST city its the most stable and the reason is they did not allow MH on private lots like most of the other cities.. so you basically skip the trailer trash.
Hidden valley lake can be good along with the Konocti Riveria / Kelseyville area.
Multi family is few and far between in Lake co.. might be a good play with lakefront for /air bnb craze there will no laws precluding them in 99% of the locations like whats happened in Napa valley.
I lived at Silverado for a decade as well.. so pretty familar with it all. its my roots !!! so my first parcel of land as a new agent in 1975 in Nice for 2,400.00 and my first improved property i ever brokered was in Calistoga in 1979 28k for one of the store fronts on Hwy 29 ( main st Calistoga)...
as an alternative you may want to look at Richmond same distance bigger tenant pool
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Ryan Heywood
OP
St. Helena, CA · Member since 2016 · 147 posts · 59 votes
8y
I don’t know if my @mentions are working, let me know if it pinged you guys please!
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Ryan Heywood
OP
St. Helena, CA · Member since 2016 · 147 posts · 59 votes
8y
Jay Hinrichs I know you have some thoughts on this area. I’m wondering if any of these areas might get some of the folks that would have gone to St Helena or Calistoga 15-20 years ago.
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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
ryan as you stated its become a bedroom community especially so lake co for SR and Napa valley.
@Brian Burke knows a lot about Lake co as well if you can get him to comment his thoughts would be relevant and probably more germane than mine at this time.. I have not really been active there in some years.
although I am pretty certain there is very limited amount of multi..
my brother lives on Cobb mtn so i visit often flying into Lampson.. and I have old friends I stay in contact in Lakeport that are in the bizz plus i read the Lake county record bee everyday LOL.. just like i read the napa register every day and the press democrat.. Even though i live in oregon.. I just never really left N ca mentally
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Merv Screeton
Roseville, CA · Member since 2017 · 21 posts · 25 votes
8y
Go check the area before investing. A lot of the business there like Konocti Resort has shut down. Hwy 20 has so many meth addicts walking along it that you will think you are in a zombie movie. I'm not saying don't invest there but you better be aware of the current situation so you make an educated decision. I drive through there from the Sacramento area to dive in Mendocino. The countryside is beautiful and I would consider living there myself in retirement except for the unemployment and drug problems. If it's made of copper or aluminum kiss it goodbye.
Anytime you see grown men cruising around on BMX bikes that are too small for them you are in a meth area.
3 Reply
Carson Wilcox
Davis, CA · Member since 2016 · 595 posts · 344 votes
8y
@Ryan Heywood my only issue looking at flipping lake Co, besides the distance for me, is the sonoma fires and whether that will kill any chance of landing a contractor....
0 Reply
Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
@Carson Wilcox Remember lake county lost 2400 homes the year before in the cobb mtn / Middletown fires.. same thing whole subdivisions and resorts wiped out..
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Carson Wilcox
Davis, CA · Member since 2016 · 595 posts · 344 votes
8y
SOLID point. forgot about that.
1 Reply
Ryan Heywood
OP
St. Helena, CA · Member since 2016 · 147 posts · 59 votes
8y
Carson Wilcox It would definitely make it tougher. We do most if not all our own work, which is helpful in this situation. I’ve heard that there have been some issues getting things run through the county, which is currently understaffed. We were looking at a place in Cobb, there are some nice homes going back in.
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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
Originally posted by @Merv Screeton:

Go check the area before investing. A lot of the business there like Konocti Resort has shut down. Hwy 20 has so many meth addicts walking along it that you will think you are in a zombie movie. I'm not saying don't invest there but you better be aware of the current situation so you make an educated decision. I drive through there from the Sacramento area to dive in Mendocino. The countryside is beautiful and I would consider living there myself in retirement except for the unemployment and drug problems. If it's made of copper or aluminum kiss it goodbye.
Anytime you see grown men cruising around on BMX bikes that are too small for them you are in a meth area.
Merv Konocti Harbor in has open closed open closed for the 50 some years our family has been involved with Lake county.. and actually a colleague of mine right now is trying to buy it and get it repositioned. Will have to check in on him and see if he made any head way. there is no question lake county has always been a place that had great potential but never could quite get there.
And there is reasons for that.
right after the gold rush Clearlake area was quite popular as resorts.. mineral bath resorts abounded all around the area.. reason proximity to SF populations..
Once CA started to dam up all the rivers coming out of The Sierras and hwy 80 was made into a freeway to Tahoe.. those resort dollars started to filter to a bunch of different areas and markets..
There used to even be a TWA flight into a little strip on the North East side of Mt. Hannah.. this flew people into the Hobergs resorts in DC 3s in the 30s and 40s
So then when they lost the tourist trade and really no industry.. it became a place were more modest second homes were being bought and used.. and it was very much a SF based area.. and had some pretty big SF Italian communities.
in the 1920's over 60,000 lots were platted from NICE to Clear lake Oaks and the city of Clearlake Including 7k lots behind Lucerne which virtually none of them were ever built on .. a Guy Named George Triphon bought most of those lots in the early 60s surveyed them all pushed roads through but never followed through with water or sewer leaving them unbuildable and a environmental mess. you can see that as you drive hwy 20 up behind the city of Lucerne.. those lots were left to rot and then become the fodder of the guys who buy worthless tax sale lots and resell them on line.. we know all about the land geek and those dudes.
Another big company developed Konocti Riveria's they at least put in paved roads and water but not enough water capacity to build out and all the lots need septic and many don't perc... so that was an issue.
then you have Boise Cascade comes in and builds Hidden Valley lake following their theme of big development private lake golf course etc.. think Lake Wildwood etc Boise built 27 of those up and down the Seirra water sheds.. Same issue though create all the lots but water system only designed to handle the first 500 homes and there was over 4,000 lots and a bunch of the lots did not perc..
all of these issue have led to sporadic growth.. then the city of Clearlake had dirt road level ground and no restrictions on mobile homes so you had people moving in single wides as vacation homes which become full on rural ghetto situations..
So there have been many many developers and people come in after the guys made the big money in the 50 60s and early 70s then have to use modern development standards and just could not make it work..
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Merv Screeton
Roseville, CA · Member since 2017 · 21 posts · 25 votes
8y
That’s some good history. Thanks. I hate to see such beautiful country so run down.
1 Reply
Josh July
Roseville, CA · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 24 votes
8y
They have way too many manufactured houses if I was you I would look for something near the lake/ on the lake that is a non-manufactured house. I think that homes there would make great vacation/short-term rentals since the nearest schools are 3 miles away and the high school 5 miles away
1 Reply
Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
Originally posted by @Merv Screeton:

That’s some good history. Thanks. I hate to see such beautiful country so run down.
that was just a lite over view I can actually give you a lot more detail but I think I would lose the audience :) its still home to me for good bad or worse.. my kids were born there etc.. and there frankly are some pretty cool areas in and around the county specially back up in medo national forest.
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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
Originally posted by @Ryan Heywood:

Carson Wilcox
It would definitely make it tougher. We do most if not all our own work, which is helpful in this situation. I’ve heard that there have been some issues getting things run through the county, which is currently understaffed. We were looking at a place in Cobb, there are some nice homes going back in.
there are some nice spots on cobb.. there are some nice lots on the old Adams springs golf course.. were there was some continuity in building standards. Good luck with it..
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Ryan Heywood
OP
St. Helena, CA · Member since 2016 · 147 posts · 59 votes
8y
Jay Hinrichs Thanks for all the info Jay, it was nice to get a bit of history on the area.
1 Reply
Brian BurkePro Member
Investor · Santa Rosa, CA · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 7k+ votes
8y
There’s no way I know more about Lake County than @Jay Hinrichs but I appreciate the suggestion that I might, Jay.
I first showed up there to flip houses about 20 years ago when the trustees sale in Sonoma County became too competitive. The auction there had less competition but it got really old driving over the Hopland Grade just to find out the sale was postponed.
But I managed to pick up a lot of good deals back then. Even bought a dozen lots in Hidden Valley Lake and built half a dozen homes there. By then lot prices ran up so high that I could make as much selling lots as building houses so I just sold off the rest of my lots. That was just before the crash, a couple of years later you could buy houses for the same price I sold my last lots for.
Then I developed a lakefront resort and sold it just before the crash too. The guy that bought it from me lost it in foreclosure and it sat empty, bank owned for a couple of years and finally sold REO for the price I paid years prior for what was then a run down abandoned summer camp. Despite getting out it still was my lesson as to why I don't want to invest in hospitality property. Maybe that bias is fueled by the land that I traded for the down payment from my buyer, it went to zero in the crash and I lost over a million. No one gets out of Lake County whole if they stick around too long. LOL
Now I own the most multifamily land in all of Clearlake. Oh boy, what a trophy! Anybody want to build a couple hundred apartments?
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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
@Brian Burke thanks Brian did not mean to dig up bad memories... :) My partner in the Cirrus has started a container home manufacturing company... he has the first ones approved for Oregon.. those are pretty built proof we cold stack them 10 tall on your land there in Clearlake and being solid steel they should hold up :)
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Pavan Sandhu
Developer · Sacramento, CA · Member since 2016 · 464 posts · 143 votes
8y
Lots of wisdom and practical advice shared here. Thank you@ @Brian Burke @Jay Hinrichs
Jay i have a friend in wilsonville OR, looking for a MFH/Mixed use. Best way for me to make an intro?
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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y
@Pavan Sandhu I would post on the Portland OR category what your looking for and you will get Reponses from brokers who can help I am sure. Wilsonville is a tight market not a lot of that kind of product..
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Marina Krueger
San Francisco, CA · Member since 2018 · 2 posts · 0 votes
8y
Hi All,
New to the site and finding some great advice already. We are looking at a small mobile home park in Clear Lake. I would love to put tiny homes or container homes on the mobile home lots and then do short term rentals or maybe even vacation rentals. There are currently just a handful of mobile homes and RV's on the lot so I'd put the new homes on one side of the lot and keep the current tenants for income as long as I needed to.
I would LOVE feedback on that business model. Huttopia is coming onto Six Sigma Ranch winery this year and Clear Lake is really trying to turn their image around.
Anyone want to chime in on the success of adding tiny homes/container homes to Clear Lake? Thinking retirees and even small families could live there. A step up from mobile home park living but not apartment or SFH living.
Thanks!
Marina
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Carson Wilcox
Davis, CA · Member since 2016 · 595 posts · 344 votes
8y
first thing that screams at me is zoning/city/permit issues. I know in my area, the mobile home stuff is very heavily regulated as affordable senior housing... make SURE like in writing that the city will allow you to do so... Let alone that clear lake is meth scumbag central, so make sure you do a GOOD tour of the neighborhood, and ensure that it has the safety, activities, and amenities that the tiny house containers vacation person wants..
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