the stock market has one huge advantage from real esta

Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote

Hi all,

I have been a stock options tradee and a real estate investor and one huge advantage on trading the stock market is that you dont have to spend hundreds of hours looking for a deal( and time is money right) In some areas finding a steal of a deal could be almost impossible ..imo..... in the stock market you constantly find good deals and you can use stock options to create cash flow. Think about it.

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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member

Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes

I myself am a stock market expert I excel at buying high and selling low...

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Account Closed
IL · Member since 2016 · 64 posts · 31 votes
9y
One big advantage of the stock market is liquidity but it is not easy to find great opportunities without a lot of time and analysis.
4 Reply
Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
9y
I myself am a stock market expert I excel at buying high and selling low...
Podcast Guest on Show #222
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9 Reply
Kevin Siedlecki
Investor · Madison, CT · Member since 2014 · 710 posts · 458 votes
9y
@Ozzy Ordonez -
Love to start a conversation about this. Here are my thoughts. Please respond so I can follow your thinking a little more clearly. Maybe you can convince me to put more of my total net worth into stocks.
Here's my big question: How do you "constantly find good deals" in the stock market? How do you know a deal when you see one? Every stock picking genius in history has eventually gotten in wrong, or been found to be cheating, so I don't trust my own ability to find those deals.
I would argue that in order to find the winning stocks you probably have to spend a lot more time researching than you do to find a decent buy and hold rental. Rental income and expenses are pretty predictable when you know your market. At this point, I can pretty much know if a deal is going to work immediately, and need to do about 10 minutes of analysis in order to come to the numbers I would need to make it work. No matter how much research I did, I wouldn't trust myself to make the same decision on a stock. No one really knows what a particular stock will be worth in a year or two, but with a buy and hold rental, I can be reasonably confident in my long-term ROI.
Other thoughts:
While you are correct that a good deal is impossible in some markets, there are plenty of deals in other markets, usually within a couple hour drive of any location. My town does not work, but there are 5 other towns/small cities within a 30 minute drive of me that work great for rentals.
The tax benefits of real estate are the exact opposite of the tax burden of stocks, particularly dividend paying-stocks, and the fees associated with trading.
2 Reply
Kevin Siedlecki
Investor · Madison, CT · Member since 2014 · 710 posts · 458 votes
9y
@Jay Hinrichs yep me too. Once I listened to an advisor my dad had been working with for years. He was sure this company was going to take off, and suggested we both invest. Turned out they were cooking their books, and the stock is now worthless. If I had used that money to turn a basement into a 3rd unit on one of my duplexes, I would be making an extra $800/mo forever. Instead, I learned an important lesson!
1 Reply
Jeff B.
Buy & Hold Owner · Redlands, CA · Member since 2015 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
9y
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
I myself am a stock market expert I excel at buying high and selling low...
Just go contrary to my picks - - you'll be just fine :sigh:
0 Reply
Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
9y
@Kevin Siedlecki not sure if you remember in the day.. but the gurus were setting up day trading rooms.. everyone gets rich... so many got wiped out that scheme died along with those that ended it all.
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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
9y
@Jeff B. well I am going to break my 20 year void of buying stocks and buy 10k worth of Tesla.. LOL...
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Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
using stock options actively, you can generate cashflow, doing cover calls or selling puts. I have generated 10% annually. Selecting a stock as long as you are in a blue chip stock and evaluating technical analysis, anybody can do it.
Drawback of Real estate investing it has cycles , and now I believe we on an uptrend. ( nobody knows the top)
Even rental income is predictable, repairs and vacancies are unpredictable.
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Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y

Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

@Jeff B. well I am going to break my 20 year void of buying stocks and buy 10k worth of Tesla.. LOL...
tesla overvalued........and speculative
0 Reply
Jeff Filali
Rental Property Investor · Broken Arrow, OK · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
9y
Flipped four properties so far this quarter and averaged 116% return on my investment in less then two months... I'll stick with being more involved with the outcome of my investment instead of trying to predict the market for a stock. As for finding deals, I could never purchase all the deals I'm finding myself.
1 Reply
Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
Originally posted by @Account Closed:

One big advantage of the stock market is liquidity but it is not easy to find great opportunities without a lot of time and analysis.
using option strategies actively you can create cashflow, without waitinv for stock apreciation
0 Reply
Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
using option strategies, you can generate cash flow, without waiting for stock appreciation. I do it
0 Reply
James Barnhart
Rental Property Investor · Ocala, FL · Member since 2016 · 226 posts · 140 votes
9y
In real estate investing, I can leverage my buys a lot. When I buy stocks, I pay for 100% of it. And, I think I have more control of my properties than I do of the stock market, which is mainly controlled by the 1%ers.
4 Reply
Kevin Siedlecki
Investor · Madison, CT · Member since 2014 · 710 posts · 458 votes
9y
@Ozzy Ordonez - repairs and vacancy are predictably unpredictable, though. You know the market and the property, so you can budget for them. As long as you're not counting on appreciation for your exit strategies, cycles don't matter. 10% ROI would not be considered very good in the buy and hold rental world, and that's before the tax benefits. So you've failed to convince me. You're doing well; good for you! But it's not for me. I think this is a case of you knowing the stock option business really well and not knowing real estate very well, and vice versa for me.
@Jay Hinrichs - I think I'm too young to have enough money to be exposed to that, but I read Wolf of Wall Street, which went into way more detail about the actual scheme than the movie did!
1 Reply
Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
9y
@Ozzy Ordonez well I just bought an S for myself and a X for my wife and will buy the 3 when it comes out.. so I am single handily keep them in the black,
I think their roof product could be a real game changer.. but who knows.. Like I said I can just keep doing what I always did buy high and sell low... seems to work fine for me.
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Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
if you are making 116% flipping in one single quater, you should be in biggerpockets podcast, normally flippers aim at 15% + if lucky

Originally posted by @Jeff Filali:

Flipped four properties so far this quarter and averaged 116% return on my investment in less then two months... I'll stick with being more involved with the outcome of my investment instead of trying to predict the market for a stock. As for finding deals, I could never purchase all the deals I'm finding myself.
0 Reply
Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
Originally posted by @James Barnhart:

In real estate investing, I can leverage my buys a lot. When I buy stocks, I pay for 100% of it. And, I think I have more control of my properties than I do of the stock market, which is mainly controlled by the 1%ers.
buying stocks you also get leverage $4 for every $1
0 Reply
Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
9y
@Ozzy Ordonez I think what you will find is that return on investment at the really high % when flipping is done with leverage..
so its return on Cash not return on gross..
in our little world we like to make 15% of gross and we routinely make far more than 100% APR cash on cash when leverage is involved.
IE... take a new build bank gives me 90% LTC ( now most of you folks wont get this ,, this is a 25 year banking relationship).. so I put up 35k in cash.. bank gives me 225k loan ... on construction costs and 70k advance on my lot so I have 35k all in... we sell at 375k... after all cost we net 50k profit... on our 35k out... in 7 months... so not sure what the return is on that but its pretty decent.
Now if you can only do a few a year its no big deal but we were bless this year and close 45 of them so far in the year.. so it all adds up.
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1 Reply
Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
I also do rental properties, but my point is real estate was good investment from 2009 to 2015, i made huge profits too. but good deals are harder to combine. So my point, consider diversifying your investments.

Originally posted by @Kevin Siedlecki:

@Ozzy Ordonez - repairs and vacancy are predictably unpredictable, though. You know the market and the property, so you can budget for them. As long as you're not counting on appreciation for your exit strategies, cycles don't matter. 10% ROI would not be considered very good in the buy and hold rental world, and that's before the tax benefits. So you've failed to convince me. You're doing well; good for you! But it's not for me. I think this is a case of you knowing the stock option business really well and not knowing real estate very well, and vice versa for me.
@Jay Hinrichs - I think I'm too young to have enough money to be exposed to that, but I read Wolf of Wall Street, which went into way more detail about the actual scheme than the movie did!
0 Reply
Kevin Siedlecki
Investor · Madison, CT · Member since 2014 · 710 posts · 458 votes
9y
@Ozzy Ordonez - If you were making huge profits, were you flipping? IF you bought right, you should still be making those profits on your rentals.
I agree there aren't as many deals out there - that's why I asked you to explain your strategy more fully, so I could consider if it's something I truly should be looking into. It sounds to me like you are doing a lot of research to figure out your plays, not at all passive income, but I really would like you to elaborate on what you do so all of us can think it through with a better idea of what it entails!
0 Reply
Matthew Paul
Severna Park, MD · Member since 2013 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
9y
Real estate , stocks and life , its all a crap shoot , sometimes you win some times you lose . Thats what makes it fun
1 Reply
Steve B.
Engineer · Portland, OR · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
9y
I thought about it and your post is ridiculous. Why intelligent people have even replied other than as a comedy aside is beyond me.
0 Reply
Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
Originally posted by @Steve B.:

I thought about it and your post is ridiculous. Why intelligent people have even replied other than as a comedy aside is beyond me.
Why would Warren Buffet buy stocks?
go somewhere else if you are not contributing.
0 Reply
Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
Real estate is just one asset class, if you want to grow as an investor, you need to learn different asset classes.
Oil stocks are now what real estate was back in 2009.
As I mentioned before Im a real estate investor too, but diversification on asset classes is key.
0 Reply
Ozzy Ordonez
OP
Port Orange, FL · Member since 2016 · 26 posts · 1 vote
9y
Originally posted by @Matthew Paul:

Real estate , stocks and life , its all a crap shoot , sometimes you win some times you lose . Thats what makes it fun
stocks are speculative, if you use stock options you remove specullations and creat cashflow
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