At what point in time does a college education not make sense?

At what point in time does a college education not make sense?

Shiloh LundahlPro Member
Rental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes

There is an economic term called diminishing marginal rate of return. Meaning for every one more unit sold the benefit becomes less and less. With the rise in college tuition costs and the strong emergence of availability of online education and trade schools, at what point does a college education stop making sense? 

I went to college and I got my undergraduate degree in social work (although I started out in business). Then I went on to get a master's degree in social work. I believe my whole education cost about 40k (if you count up all of the associated costs relating to my degrees) and it took me 6 years. My first year out of college I made 40k which is high for a social worker, especially right out of school. After a few years I became a supervisor making 55k a year. A few years later I started and built a private therapy practice where my income is now well over 100k. So my return if it were calculated on a cash on cash basis would be 100% my first year and 250% now, however, I was making little to nothing during the 6 years while I was going to school. So if you divide it by the length of time it took me to get my education (I believe that would be the IRR) then after the first year my return over the 6 years would have been 17% per year. Of course with more time that rate goes up. Now my return from when I started college until now 17 years later (let's say for simplicity's sake that years 09 and 10 I made 40k, 11 and 12 I made 60k in years 13 - 19 I made 100k for a total of 900k over a 17 year period with an initial investment of 40k). So my new IRR would be 132% per year now. But what about the social workers who never go into private practice but work for local or state agencies and continue to help out the community but their income is averaged out at around 45k per year. Following the same scenario, their IRR would be 73% per year (45k x 11 / 17 / 40k x 100).

Now the expenses come into place such as student loans and interest on those loans along with debt accumulated during the time one is going to college even with the “bare minimum” expenses to live during college and after while one is starting out. So if the 45k a year is living pay check to paycheck and barely coving student loan debt, and after the 11 years since school you are not in much of a better financial place then you were when you started, was it financially worth it to go to college?

Comparing this scenario with maybe someone who goes to a trade school for 20k but afterwards is able to start making 45k a year starting year 2, IRR would be 113% after the second year and 150% after the third year and 169% after the 4 year, etc., with only 20k in debt to pay off. Now imaging professions that have a lot more debt for the required education. Does there become a point where it no longer makes financial sense to get a college education?

What are your thoughts?

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Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2017 · 824 posts · 1k+ votes
6y

I saw this coming when I was going to community college. I didn't quite understand how spending thousands and thousands of dollars on an education with no guaranteed rate of return would have been a good idea.

I have friends with 200k in debt...still...because they either went to an in-state university with full room and board or out-of-state university with full room and board. And unless you are going to school for something with a high rate of salary return, e.g. business, finance, engineering, doctors, lawyers, etc., why would you spend so much money?

I had friends tell me I was "missing out" on the campus life. Like a piece of me would be missing. You know what...I went to plenty of parties, drank plenty of beer, had plenty of fun, while couch-surfing and commuting to school while living at home. And instead of putting money to loan payments, I was able to put money to things I WANTED...real estate investments is one (but also, my personal home, guitars, other investments, et al.)

So I hope my generation when they talk to their kids tell them hey -- be smart with schools. Not every school is worth it. If you're an art history major, maybe don't spend 80k a year. Consider community colleges and their transfer programs to 4-year universities (a godsend for me).

Also, and I don't know if this is the case for everyone, but I'm noticing kids are not getting jobs as kids these days. For example we have a family member who is in college right now, always TALKING about all the amazing stuff he's doing in college. I'm happy for him, he's on this committee, that program, etc. But the kid has NEVER. HAD. A. JOB. I don't think you can be successful until you know three things:

1. How hard it is to make money.

2. How hard it is to live off the money you make.

3. What it's like to take orders from people -- bosses, customers, etc., and do it with a smile.

So I'd rather see more focus on required work programs and education, so you know what makes sense and how to deal with life.

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  • Tyler GibsonBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Orlando, FL · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    @Shiloh Lundahl I love this topic. I went to college for 3 semesters starting back in 2003. After 3 semesters I found myself unsure of what I wanted to do after college so I decided I would stop paying for something I wasn't sure I was going to use. I dropped out moved to a sleepy ski town in Colorado and became a Ski bum (well snowboard bum). I learned in the 5 years I lived there how to be an adult how to manage or not manage my money. I learned that if you are willing to do the work others don't want to you can make decent money (I worked doing landscape installation).  Fifteen years later I still have no degree but have held several positions with a technology company and currently work as an account manager for a international fortune 100 company. I have found that the most valuable thing to an employer is experience. I have held many many different jobs. If you were to look at my full resume you would be puzzled at how I came to be where I am today because it has things like coffee shop worker, coffee shop manager, airline baggage handler, airline customer service, airline supervisor, landscape installer, landscape supervisor, media intern, irrigation technician. What I have always done is apply myself totally to each job and then try to translate that experience into the next role. I am a firm believer that College is not for everyone. Many young people are not studious or don't have well developed social skills. They may however be great workers. Our public education system needs to allow young people to discover if knowledge work will be a good fit for them or if skilled labor would be a better fit. Unfortunately Shop class has been a thing of the past in high schools around this country for many years now.

    A great example is here in Florida a local power company hires entry level ground workers (these people have no skills) at $19+ an hour. If that person works no overtime (which there is always overtime in this industry) they would make $39,520 a year. They train you how to do the job and there is room for career advancement, not to mention that if you work up to be a journeyman line man you can find a job in all 50 states making around $25-$50 an hour depending on the state. 

    If you want to be a Doctor then go to school. If you want to be a Lawyer then go to school. If you want to be the CEO of a fortune 500 company then yeah go to school. But if your goal is to make a good living and put your self in a position to be able to retire comfortably the I would be willing to bet there is a Trade or skilled labor position that can get you there without being saddled with tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt. 

  • Real Estate Agent · Albany, NY · Member since 2017 · 309 posts · 149 votes
    6y

    I think what's tough about the "should I go to school or not" question is there is so many dynamics that are in play. First it's the money, will I make a good return on what I'm spending once I get out. But there is also the factor of what do I want to with the rest of my life where the only pathway may be schooling and if you truly accomplish that by going to school, the money might not be so important. There's also the factor of needing to make this decision as an 18 year old (most of the time) which I certainly know as an 18 year old I had no idea what I wanted to do and I would think most people don't. From my personal experience I went to a community college because I didn't know what I wanted to do. Fast forward two years and I thought I wanted to work in sports so I got my undergrad in sport management. Another two years goes by and I think I think I want to work in collegiate administration so I go get my MBA. I get into grad school and while I'm there I realize I don't want to do any of it anymore and I get my real estate license and I have been practicing real estate ever since. On one side if I could have known real estate would be my thing 8 years ago, I would've saved tens of thousands of dollars on school. For me you could say going to school is a waste, but I also learned a lot of valuable lessons and met some incredible people (including my wife) along the way. So yes the money sucks but I wouldn't trade my experience for anything. I realize I probably took this in a little bit of a different direction than what you were asking, but in my opinion, college only makes sense has it pertains to your goals in life and reading too much into the money can get tricky. 

  • Jaron WallingPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y

    You earned a masters degree in 6 years for about $40k. That's extremely affordable if you ask me. My undergraduate degree in environmental science cost more than that from an average school in the mid west. The numbers you provide are really pretty. 

    College doesn't make sense when the degree (a piece of paper) costs $100k+ and you the job you want pays $60k per year starting out. It's a scary time to be in college ramping up debt you can't pay off for 10-15 years. **Watched to many Dave Ramsey videos on YouTube**

  • Shiloh LundahlPro Member
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y

    @Jaron Walling that calculation is a lot simpler than mine. 

    I was able to go to state and private schools that were between 3k and 5k a semester which really lowered the cost. Also, no one has ever really cared where I got my degree from so I am glad I didn’t seek out any prestigious schools.

  • Jaron WallingPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y

    @Shiloh Lundahl That was smart on your part. My education wasn't very expensive so I feel lucky. If I could do it again I'd aim for an environmental engineering degree. 

    I would could be making 3x the money currently make. 

  • Investor · Youngstown, OH · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    It widely depends on the degree, but generally speaking, college is no longer a wise investment. The costs exceed the benefits. It's much wiser to go into a trade. 

  • Rental Property Investor · New York City · Member since 2019 · 703 posts · 538 votes
    6y

    I never really liked school.  Sure there were subjects that I found more interesting than others but for the most part it wasn't for me.  I found it difficult to concentrate and learn about things that I had no interest in. In a way, it still holds true.  I wanted to move up the ladder at work. I already had my vested time for a full pension with benefits but was way too young to collect anything. I wasn't happy, I wanted to be a manager. Here I am with a very good job, never got laid off, always worked overtime if needed and managed to buy my first 2 family rental home for $400+K in my mid twenties but I wasn't satisfied.  With experience, I qualified for management but every good company that I wanted to work for had minimum educational requirements for a bachelor degree. Here I am at 40+, My wife told me to bite the bullet and go back to school because you'll be miserable to live with going to work and not being happy. After lots of complaining I finally enrolled in on-line courses with a fully recognized and accredited SUNY college for construction project management.  With about 12 credits shy of a bachelor degree I got the job with the company that I wanted with the understanding that ill be all done with finishing my bachelor degree in a couple of months.  The college was affordable plus the union picked up 50% of the tuition and I paid the rest each semester.  

    In my case, it was worth it to continue college but I also made sure that the college was affordable. Even though I am older than most graduates I wanted to make sure that the degree will open doors for me immediately.

    I believe that college makes sense because for some careers its a must and a HS diploma alone is worthless today..Just make sure the college is affordable.  In some states, qualifying for a menial labor job for the city/state requires 60 college credits or 2 years in the military.  I also believe that whatever major one chooses, the graduate needs to be able to come out of the gate running and not stuck trying to find work.  If college is out of the question than a skill needs to be learned. I have a niece that became an RN and not only was college needed but she's coming out of graduation with employers knocking on her door for a career that pays well from the start. Then, some that majored in business management get stuck looking for work and settling for a cashier job with debt up to their neck.

  • Real Estate Investor · Springfield, MO · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    "It depends".

    Why are you going to school?  What are you goals?  What about attending the school will help you achieve your goals?

    Once upon a time, it was thought that getting a sheepskin was like finding the golden ticket to Willy Wonka's chocolate factory, but if you recall in the movie only 1 out of the 5 ticket finders actually won "the prize" at the end.  So that old adage is dead.

    I don't think college has changed much.  It costs more than it did when I went 20 years ago, and since I only used my degree that took me 5 years to get for about 5 years before moving on, at best I probably broke even.  Due to increased access brought on by bottomless taxpayer subsidized loans, more kids use it more as a phase to "find themselves" and "experience life" now than they used to.

    If you want to be a doctor or a lawyer (i.e. white collar professional), most likely college is required.

    If you want to be an entrepreneur, blue collar worker, or trades-person, it probably is not required, although there may be some great business classes that would help.

    Whatever you do, don't go into debt for it.  Too many undergrads (43%) fail to graduate, but the debt remains regardless.  Sometimes it's not even their fault: sickness, accidents, family issues, lack of aptitude, etc. can and do cause people to drop out of school often.   

    This topic it too broad to say much more.  Good news, though.  I think there are some college writing classes about narrowing down topics... ;-)

  • Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2017 · 824 posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    I saw this coming when I was going to community college. I didn't quite understand how spending thousands and thousands of dollars on an education with no guaranteed rate of return would have been a good idea.

    I have friends with 200k in debt...still...because they either went to an in-state university with full room and board or out-of-state university with full room and board. And unless you are going to school for something with a high rate of salary return, e.g. business, finance, engineering, doctors, lawyers, etc., why would you spend so much money?

    I had friends tell me I was "missing out" on the campus life. Like a piece of me would be missing. You know what...I went to plenty of parties, drank plenty of beer, had plenty of fun, while couch-surfing and commuting to school while living at home. And instead of putting money to loan payments, I was able to put money to things I WANTED...real estate investments is one (but also, my personal home, guitars, other investments, et al.)

    So I hope my generation when they talk to their kids tell them hey -- be smart with schools. Not every school is worth it. If you're an art history major, maybe don't spend 80k a year. Consider community colleges and their transfer programs to 4-year universities (a godsend for me).

    Also, and I don't know if this is the case for everyone, but I'm noticing kids are not getting jobs as kids these days. For example we have a family member who is in college right now, always TALKING about all the amazing stuff he's doing in college. I'm happy for him, he's on this committee, that program, etc. But the kid has NEVER. HAD. A. JOB. I don't think you can be successful until you know three things:

    1. How hard it is to make money.

    2. How hard it is to live off the money you make.

    3. What it's like to take orders from people -- bosses, customers, etc., and do it with a smile.

    So I'd rather see more focus on required work programs and education, so you know what makes sense and how to deal with life.

  • Flipper/Rehabber · Maumee, OH · Member since 2017 · 39 posts · 23 votes
    6y

    I think a bachelor's degree is a must for anyone who can get one.  That said, the degree is not the end goal, a career is.  I started college after High School but my web development business took off and I dropped out.

    I was doing well in that and another business without a degree until the market crashed.  Then, everything went to crap and I was only qualified for menial jobs locally or I could move across country and get paid 1/2 of what I was making.  That was an extremely humbling experience.  

    So, I went back to school later in life, kicked butt, did an internship, got hired into a leadership development program at a big company and watched my career and salary soar (I worked as hard for them as I did for myself).  Right after graduation, I was making $20k more a year than I owed in debt not including valuable benefits, like 401k matching.

    It's pretty easy to make 6 figures a year consistently with a good Bachelor's degree.  Not so when you're in your own business (you have to get there & make it through crashes and shifts).

    My electrician was trying to get my son into the trade, bragging about how he made $100k last year for the first time.  I had to talk to my son later.  My electrician has been in the Union for 25 years, was promoted to supervisor 2 years ago, and said he had such a good year because he was literally working 80 hours a week on a project.  That sounds steep and underpaid to me.

    2 years ago, I quit and decided to flip full time.  I still use what I learned in college getting my Business degree and from my corporate work experience and always have that to fall back on.  I knew what I wanted to do out of college when I went back in to finish my last 2 years and made sure there was going to demand in that job market.  I see people who want to be psychologists and counsel people but don't want to get a P.h.d. and other risky majors.  That's not reasonable and it ends up being a dead end for some.

  • Multifamily Syndicator · Houston, TX · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    @Shiloh Lundahl First, I really appreciate the way you calculated the returns based on time. Very fascinating...

    From a qualitative perspective, I think there is always that rite of passage even if you go straight into an apprenticeship, the time in which you must learn the craft, first, and yes you do get paid something, however minimal, during that time as an apprentice. Now, does that minimal pay outweigh the other intangible skills you get from a college environment? That's the million-dollar question I suppose...

    Furthermore, the intangible benefits of going to university can range from building a strong network of people to mastering public speaking. For instance, the network one can build from going to an Ivy League school such as Harvard is priceless (the extreme end of the spectrum) to the appreciation of working with people from all over the world in a university setting (diversity breeds creativity).

    Though the cost of higher education in the US is astronomically high when compared to other parts of the world, the benefits should always be weighed not only on the cost but on the intangible elements of higher education. 

    Personally, I think college adds a ton of value to those who go through a relatively good school.

    To answer your question: I think going to college or not should start with well-thought questions such as what am I hoping to get out of it? How would this benefit me in the nearest future or in the long term? 

    If the point is just to get a piece of paper, then that doesn't make any sense; however, if it is going to benefit you in the short and long term, then that's a no brainer. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Hawthorne, CA · Member since 2018 · 655 posts · 900 votes
    6y

    @Shiloh Lundahl

    If you look at this only monetarily then you become blinded by that because based on money it makes no sense at all.

    Now a higher education means the world to many people who based on where they grew up, their position in life and how they are viewed in society, a higher education means way more than just a dollar amount.  

    So to your initial question, getting a higher education does not make sense when your:

    A trust fund baby and are going to be rich regardless anyway

    When society no longer values college degrees socially

    When barriers to great paying careers and internships are not tied to college degrees

    Bottom line is if you want to open certain doors in life, sometimes the only key is a college degree.

    Secondary to that is your personal values.  Wealth and Fame can be taken away from you at anytime, an Education (some people refer to it as a piece of paper) never can.

    That is my perspective and my values.  That is why I am paying a lot of money for my kids to go to University.  It doesn't benefit me personally but it shows how much my wife and I value higher education.

  • Realtor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2019 · 274 posts · 191 votes
    6y

    Great topic! I have absolutely questioned the modern pursuit of a college education. I would say that the value that I rely on is that if everything in my life happens to go wrong tomorrow, I will have a degree, even if just a bachelors to fall back on. Only then, there is the question of is it a waste of time when you could use that time to further your real estate or trade based job as you referenced. Personally if I had to spend tens of thousands of dollars I would not do it, just because I would use my energy on bettering myself in real estate or the trade I was involved in as you mentioned. 

  • Real Estate Investor · Des Moines, IA · Member since 2016 · 922 posts · 533 votes
    6y

    @Nicole Heasley Beitenman

    I couldn't disagree more.

    4 year degree holders (and more), all else equal, have a better chance in life.  

    There's a lot of examples (exceptions) that prove the rule.

    However, we don't have a great way to compare their possible outcomes if they had gone and finished a (decent) degree.  Numbers don't lie though, those with a degree do better outcome wise, and not just on income.

    Should we start listing off example after example of ignorant people that can never get ahead in life to prove our point?  Of course not, that's what statistics is for, and oddly - a real good grasp of statistics and the language that comes with it - comes from a 4 year (decent) degree.

  • Realtor · Boulder, CO · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    6y

    @Shiloh Lundahl College was the best 20 years of my life! In all seriousness though, in addition to the data which tells us those with college degrees are more likely to earn more than those without degrees, there is also so much soft value from attending college that can't be quantified. Yes Mark Zuckerberg, Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, Kanye West, Oprah, and Ellen all dropped out and still became extremely successful but they are the exception not the rule. In the cases of Zuck and Gates they definitely wouldn't have built their billion-dollar businesses without the connections they made at Harvard before dropping out. Jobs said experimenting with LSD while attending Reed College is what lead him to "think different" and start Apple so school played an important role for him too in his own eccentric outlier way. People like to talk about the handful of cases where dropouts became extremely wealthy but the fact is the vast majority of highly successful people finished school and in most cases graduated from elite universities. So while college isn't always necessary or even the best path for everyone, having a degree certainly opens a lot of important doors in terms of landing a high paying job, continually benefiting from the personal network you create while in school throughout your entire life, and achieving a certain level of confidence in the job market. Plus college is super fun which doesn't have an IRR but shouldn't be overlooked as life is about more than numbers. I do feel that trade schools or just entering into a career in the trades after high school and learning on the job has been looked down upon unfairly over the past few decades though. The folks mentioned above became successful through attending prestigious schools that the vast majority of people don't have access to. For many without that privilege, trades are a better option and it's time we honored careers in the trades with a commensurate level of respect to the value they provide to society.

  • Investor · NJ · Member since 2018 · 869 posts · 921 votes
    6y

    College doesn't make sense when You're 60k-100k in debt after 4 years and still only make 40k a year in a entry level job. If you plan on being an engineer, doctor, dentist, architect etc then it makes sense. Alot of the people I know who went for vague degrees struggled to find work after graduation. 

    For me personally, a more logical route was a trade. A 4 year apprenticeship as a plumber, electrician, HVAC or welder and your making way more than most college grads with no debt. My first employer paid for all of my schooling, certifications, full benefits and plenty of overtime. 

    Then once you get a license like a master plumbers or electric license etc. You can be your own boss, make way more and have some sort of control over your employment. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    6y

    @Shiloh Lundahl

    My wife went to school for 12 years and graduated at 30 with a PhD . She got her doctorate in counseling and therapy . Now she does psychological evaluations , she’s a clinical director of a children’s behavioral health center and also does a private practice counseling people . For her it was well worth it even with 300k in debt it is worth it . She was making well over 6 figures in her twenties .. and in our area that’s huge because the average median family income is 35k .

    I got a PhD as well . Public high school diploma . My income has been around half hers for many years now . I am in manufacturing and at the top of my game in my field . I had a chance to get an engineering degree but decided to keep working to support my family because it was the safe secure bet . What I wouldn’t give to go back 20 years and follow through with getting into that field .

  • Rental Property Investor · Carthage, NY · Member since 2019 · 72 posts · 47 votes
    6y

    The law of diminishing returns does not apply to education until a very extreme threshold. We can agree that in most fields, including yours of sosc or pysch, a 4 year degree is increasingly insignificant, whereas a 6 year is often required. Or that In my field of finance and economics, the average starting salary after 4 years of business school is $41K and $48K respectively, whereas the average starting salary with a 6 year MBA (only 2 more years of college) is 85K. I proceed to go on into several very 'narrow and deep' areas of finance in post graduate study. 1 of those I shall not name here carries with it an average starting salary of $290K. At meetings I hear those attending just for continuing education credits state that at age 45 or 55 that they are "sick and tired of more school.". Series this, series that-I cannot keep them all straight. But as for business school, the law of diminishing returns does not kick in until one has the delegation skills to partner with other individuals or separate post graduate designations or highly specific regulatory or otherwise certifications. I feel it is the same in sosc or psych. I talk to Drs for general things. Most affluent people do. But I would never let an LSW counsel me. I insist they have a Ph.D. And they have multiple multiple degrees from several highest tier colleges in the country. They may have went to school 15 years, but I know of no one in school 15 years who does not earn 7 figures.

  • Specialist · Easton, PA · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    @Shiloh Lundahl

    Zero college, zero loan debt. I do just fine. Wouldn’t trade it for anything. My wife is 38 and still owes $20k+.

  • Realtor · Boulder, CO · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    6y

    @Dennis M. That’s funny, I always thought PhD stood for Post Hole Digger

  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    6y

    Thoughts:

    1. College is just like anything else in life: you get out what you put in. It can be a 4/6/8 year babysitting academy, or it can be a life altering experience. 

    2. Statistically speaking, college graduates far outpace any other demographic when it comes to lifetime earnings. Naturally there are outliers on both ends but bell curve to bell curve, graduates are far wealthier over the course of a lifetime.

    3. Most trades depend significantly on your body as much, or more so, than your mind. My HVAC guy is 10+ years younger than me, owns his own business, and moves and lives like he's 20 years older. Crawling in crawl spaces, heaving heavy units into attics, etc. eventually breaks the body down. Once that happens you better own the business and can supervise from a chair, or you are finished.

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  • Rental Property Investor · Beavercreek OH · Member since 2018 · 422 posts · 970 votes
    6y

    College costs today (due to easy government guaranteed loans) are the single biggest atrocity of my lifetime.  If you want to be a doctor, lawyer, engineer, architect or other licensed professional that requires a degree, you have little choice.  For anything else, the same money invested in almost any viable business, will give you a much greater chance for financial success IMO.

  • Specialist · Portland, OR · Member since 2010 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    It certainly is not a fair system. If you have money then it is a good investment. If you don't and end up in debt without the ability to repay and buy a home then it is questionable IMO.

    My schooling in math and accounting has been invaluable and has allowed me to do and understand things very few people can. Getting a degree in business had no value to me because working in banking or as an accountant did not appeal to me. I have/had no desire to be a manager as I do not like to be managed or manage people. I am most qualified to be FI. That is all I ever wanted to be.

  • Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 439 posts · 578 votes
    6y

    There is a lot more that can be taken away from attending college than just a degree/education. And not everything can be compared to a RE investment. Friends, experiences, networking, learning how to live on your own, partying, paying bills.... all part of college. I know it’s not necessary to attend college to gain these experiences but it’s all part of it.

    I didn’t go to college. Made a pretty decent living for myself and my family. I now work .2 miles away from UCLA frat/sorority row and see the students more than I’d like to Thursday-Sunday nights.... at 32 with three kids I’m tempted to apply, attend and join a frat.

  • Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @JD Martin:

    2. Statistically speaking, college graduates far outpace any other demographic when it comes to lifetime earnings. Naturally there are outliers on both ends but bell curve to bell curve, graduates are far wealthier over the course of a lifetime.

     

    JD, I agree with you regarding the above, but there is one thing I'd like to point out based on my own experience, and I don't think my experience is an anomaly.

    While college graduates bring in more income, most of them are extremely bad at turning that income into personal wealth. I believe the process of earning a four-year degree tends to brainwash people into the spend-what-you-earn lifestyle with much greater finality than those who do not go through college.

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