Sweet 80 year old tenant can’t afford rent
Rental Property Investor · Canton, OH · Member since 2018 · 59 posts · 77 votes
Sweet 80 year old tenant can’t afford rent
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When posts like these pop up trope and trite lines about "realties" of being a landlord or how we run business, not charities get thrown around like lawn furniture in a tornado, but they miss one salient fact: it costs nothing to type that advice, but you'll be the one that has to follow through on it and live with the consequences. They don't have to wake up every morning and look themselves in the face while brushing their teeth and know that as a direct result of their actions an elderly person is homeless, but you would. Thus I'd take most of that advice with a hearty grain of salt.
What goals do you have for this property? Do you want to house hack, have this as long term rental, or something else?
If you intend to have this for the long term, I think you have a few options.
1. Talk to the seller and get a haircut for cleaning up the situation that they couldn't/wouldn't deal with. That makes up for the next few years of reduced cash flow.
2. Talk to the agents involved and see if they have experienced anything like this, know of any other charities in the area, or would be willing to chip in a few points of their commesion to help this lady out.
3. Ask yourself if you need to solve this problem before you buy or if you could take 12-18 months to figure out the best solution that results in a win-win for you and her.
4. Accept that this will be your charity donation for the next few years.
5. Buy the property, raise the rent, and evict her.
Best of luck and kudos to you for the hard work you've done so far trying to find a way to help this person out.
95 Replies
- 4yTheresa HarrisPro MemberMember since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
See if she knows someone who she can move in with or have them move in with her.
- 4yBjorn AhlbladPro MemberInvestor · Shelton, WA · Member since 2017 · 6k+ posts · 6k+ votes
We always get family connections for our oldsters. Ours are paying at market but you need it anyway if they get sick or need help. Children have paid rent for their older relatives when needed.
two years ago a tenant died. Family came in and took care of everything. We even gave them back the security deposit! - Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes4y
Assuming that you knew that's what she was paying when you went under contract, you really have two options:
1. Get her up to market rates or kick her out;
2. Accept the lower amount of money.
That's really the crux of it. Being a landlord is hard. You will have to ask yourself who needs that money more, you or the tenant? I'm curious also how you know she is a sweet little old lady? People can be both old and nasty. I know several :)
What you really have inherited is someone else's problem. They didn't want to be the wilderbeast that kicked her to the curb, so they sold to you, harvested the windfall (I'm guessing they didn't give you the "little old lady" discount on the sales price) and left you figuring out whether to accept half the market rate or make her homeless.
What will you do when things break in her apartment and she's paying you a little over 5 grand a year to stay there?
I am sure there's some type of charity intervention in your area, whether it's through a church, non-profit or the government. That doesn't mean that they will pay you the extra rent, only that they might be willing to do some legwork to keep an 80 year old lady from living under the overpass. But you'll have to communicate to them - assuming you want to take ownership of this - that they either find her some relief or she's going to be living on the street when the sheriff comes to carry her and her stuff out to the front lawn.
Sounds glamorous, huh? 🤣
Skyline Properties - Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes4y
This is pretty common and the real shame is the lack of family members willing to care for their own. I hate being the bad guy, but it's not my responsibility to care for all the tenants in the world. I would be generous and give her up to six months to find a low-income housing solution or something.
The DIY Landlord Book4.7247 Reviews Quote from @Nathan Gesner:
This is pretty common and the real shame is the lack of family members willing to care for their own. I hate being the bad guy, but it's not my responsibility to care for all the tenants in the world. I would be generous and give her up to six months to find a low-income housing solution or something.
This is business and not a charity. You have a tough choice to make 1. Raise the rent to market 2. Accept what she’s been paying and slowly bleed to death.
Rod Hanks Insurance4.9156 Reviews- 4yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
Pass on this property if you still can....don't take her on as your problem......life will give you plenty of your own.
If it is too late and you are stuck with this property, you have to give her notice that the rent will be brought up to market - as quickly as possible.
Let her figure this out for herself...don't get involved in this, it will drag you down into the muck and this will quickly become your problem. Is that why you went into REI...?
Do you really want to take on a negative cash flow property? Why don't you just give her money every month if that is your goal?
When posts like these pop up trope and trite lines about "realties" of being a landlord or how we run business, not charities get thrown around like lawn furniture in a tornado, but they miss one salient fact: it costs nothing to type that advice, but you'll be the one that has to follow through on it and live with the consequences. They don't have to wake up every morning and look themselves in the face while brushing their teeth and know that as a direct result of their actions an elderly person is homeless, but you would. Thus I'd take most of that advice with a hearty grain of salt.
What goals do you have for this property? Do you want to house hack, have this as long term rental, or something else?
If you intend to have this for the long term, I think you have a few options.
1. Talk to the seller and get a haircut for cleaning up the situation that they couldn't/wouldn't deal with. That makes up for the next few years of reduced cash flow.
2. Talk to the agents involved and see if they have experienced anything like this, know of any other charities in the area, or would be willing to chip in a few points of their commesion to help this lady out.
3. Ask yourself if you need to solve this problem before you buy or if you could take 12-18 months to figure out the best solution that results in a win-win for you and her.
4. Accept that this will be your charity donation for the next few years.
5. Buy the property, raise the rent, and evict her.
Best of luck and kudos to you for the hard work you've done so far trying to find a way to help this person out.
Hi Sheena,
Perhaps she could stay with a son, or daughter, or grandchild in their home--they are the people that should be helping her.
Who wouldn't want their grandma to stay with them (fresh baked cookies--built in babysitter--interesting conversation and scrapbooks of pictures).
Plus she would have $475 a month extra now to (buy presents for the grand kids, eat more nutritiously, go play bingo with at the old folks center).
She should be phoning them right now to get herself set up for a BETTER life than living alone.
Good Luck!
- Investor · Van Isle · Member since 2021 · 455 posts · 226 votes4y
Quote from @Sheena R Roth:
We are under contract on a side by side duplex near our hometown in Ohio. We just found out that we are inheriting the sweetest 80 year old tenant who has lived in the place for 20 years.
Market rent is $950+. This little lady is paying $475… there’s no way we can afford to pay market price on the purchase and keep her rent anywhere close to that low. We basically have to get her to $750 to break even on her unit but she can’t afford to pay that much on her SS income.
She has no computer or skills to use one. I can’t bear the thought of raising her rent and leaving her to try and figure out her options by herself so I’m trying to line up some options to bring to her.
The most obvious choice would be to find herself a roommate.
The only other option I’ve found is Section 8. However, I’ve been told that it could take years for us to get the both her and home into Section 8 program. They also mentioned that since she has a place to live right now she would be placed low on the waiting list.
I struck out on the Agency Center on Aging. United Way, and misc charities in our area.
Any other ideas for possible rent assistance specific to senior citizens?
Roommate of her choice, or potential crowd funding.
Was tenancy not looked into and considered in the offer.
- Investor · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2014 · 230 posts · 122 votes4y
Homelessness is a rising problem among seniors, a vulnerable population. Do everything you can about not going there.
No, it's not your problem, but you can be a decent human being about it. For all of those who say the obvious "we're a business, not a charity", this could be YOUR mother or grandmother. All these "sweet granny baking cookies and babysitting" and playing bingo at "the old folks center" comments are stereotypical nonsense. Many of today's 80-year-olds may be on Social Security, but they may not want to live with their children and grandchildren and do their babysitting because they may have their own lives, don't get along, or don't have the patience. Their families may not want to live with them, either. Additionally, they may have difficult health issues or their younger family members may have health issues or can't afford to take anyone else on. This is 2022. "Old" is relative. She very well may have something better to do with her life than play bingo.
My adopted aunt chose to go to work on her 80th birthday. (She worked part-time at GNC.) The trouble started when she was 83. She was living with her disabled son and a grandson who was on the spectrum. He lost his job, and they couldn't afford rent on the mobile home they were in. Social agencies are stretched horribly. They ended up living in a shelter for months (she slept on a lounge chair in a church basement!), and while everybody got them a motel room once a week, her health went downhill, even though they've been in a Section 8 apartment for 18 months. The stress took a lot out of her. It's been a struggle to see what has happened to a vibrant, working older person.
The first thing I would do would be to give her the respect and talk to her honestly. I'd suggest you explain that you simply cannot afford to rent the apartment for that amount of money because you're going to need to pay your mortgage and other bills. Ask her how you can help her resolve her housing situation. Maybe you can compromise between your number and her rent (we've made compromises for seniors on a fixed income, as well as military), but maybe not. Depending on her health, ask her about her preferences. Don't expect a family member or a social service agency to rush forward to save her. If she belongs to a place of worship, they might be able to help. I also would suggest that you contact other landlords in your area. Maybe they know of something. Also, ask around to see if there are any older realtors/investors with ideas.
Roommates can be tricky. They may not get along, and that's more stress, which is particularly hard when folks get older.
I wish you luck. It's a difficult situation to be sure. I don't know much about the Ohio market, but could there be any mobile homes that would work for her?
Bless you for trying to help. You have a conscience.
@Sheena R Roth
I’d reach out to your local section 8 office and see what it takes to get the property under section 8. It’s pretty quick here, but the inspections take a while. Getting her approved for section 8 may take time as well, but let them know the situation. They are people too and may have other options for you as well.
- 4yColleen F.Pro MemberInvestor · Narragansett, RI · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
@Sheena R Roth first is this tenant overhoused? Is she say in a 2-3 bedroom house for one person? A roommate is a viable option that she has. When you tell her the rent is increasing tell her the process for getting a roommate approved if she wants to take that option. She doesn't have to like it but it is an option. If it is a 1 bedroom try to assist to get her on the list for senior housing. If she has family stand firm in your position on the rent, whatever that may be. You should get some discount for handling this problem.
I actually assisted an 80 year old friend in moving to a 2 bedroom apartment with a roommate last year, they complain but it is a great financial relief for her and it seems good for both of them.
- Rental Property Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2019 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes4y
It's business, not personal. Give her 4 months to find a new place to live. That's roughly 120 days and very fair.
- Rental Property Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2019 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes4y
If you want, you can try to assist her or see if she has any relatives who may be able to help also.
- Rental Property Investor · Lehigh Valley, PA · Member since 2017 · 200 posts · 191 votes4y
This is a little dicey but assistance programs are quicker to help when the tenant is behind on rent and going through the eviction process.
If you're going through with the deal give her 90 days to make the market rent or find a new place. If you are in a landlord network it would be helpful to ask if anyone could take her.
You're doing the right thing trying to help
- Investor · Costa Mesa, CA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes4y
Do the kind thing and offer to help her pack.
@Sheena R Roth I’ve looked at several properties like this but have always passed on them. Not my cup of tea. So I would back out, personally. But if you’re committed to the deal, I would do some more research on section 8 and find out for sure how long it will take/ what the process is rather than going on hearsay. Unless you can verify that as a viable option, or she has family willing to step in and help (they would need to be co-signers on the lease and be responsible for the rent), then I’d be out.
I kept getting taken by grandmas as a landlord.
Guy quit/lost his job? Too bad - pay or quit.
Lady with 3 kids claims she can't afford rent? Too bad live somewhere else.
Sweet old grandma lady gives me a sob story? Fell for it every time. Multiple Grandmas owe 3+ months of back rent.
I now use a property manager so they can meet and get to know and evict grandma.
Thirty day notice IMMEDIATELY. The gravy train is under new management, sorry. How many years did she suck up the gravy? Well, it's time to move on or find a solution, and it's not your job to find a solution for her.
"I can't bear to do X,Y,Z" will die a quick death with you during your career as a landlord or you'll go broke, sorry.
I love the "you're going to make her homeless and need to look at yourself in the mirror" stuff. We've become a country where no one is responsible for themselves, but responsible people are suddenly responsible for the irresponsible.
I'm not trying to sound cold and heartless, but people need to take responsibility for themselves. She was paying under market for 20 years and I guarantee you that she knew this. Did she save up any of this money? She received 3 stimulus checks during COVID. Did she save this money? She knew she was going to be retired at some point. Did she plan for retirement? It's not fair to you to make her problems your problems.
If she can't afford the rent she needs to move. I'm sure there are cheaper areas of the city or outskirts to move to. She can get a roommate. She can move into a room in a house. She can (possibly) move in with family. These might not be ideal things for her, but that's life.
Whether you have the backbone to go through with the purchase or you back-out and someone else buys it, the tenant is going to be gone. Someone is raising the rent on that unit because that is what the market demands. And it is probably better that you do it since it sounds like you have a heart. The next buyer may give her 30 days notice and not care if she freezes to death.
You can kick her out and still be a decent person. Find out if she has family and see if you can contact them. Search for another place for her to live. Allow several months for the process. Once she finds a place, give her back 100% of her security deposit early so she can use it for the next place. If you're feeling generous, hire people to help her move.
- Member since 2022 · 25 posts · 21 votes4y
There is pretty good advice here for options but eviction is not one of them in my opinion. Would you really be okay with someone kicking your mom out on the streets??! I really see two options: find support through your/local church(es) or don’t buy the property. My portfolio is that important to kick out an elder or place financial burden upon her meek shoulders. If there isn’t anyone who is willing to help, you can by letting the current owner continue to give her housing. Unless they are wanting out of the property then God has placed you in this position to “care for the widow and orphan”. Especially since you have heart enough to post this on BP!
- 4yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
@Jim K. and @Greg M. are spot on as usual. I didn't stop before to do the math, but let's say she's been underpaying rent by roughly the same amount for these 20 years...that would be $114,000 cash she's ahead of the bank. Apply any reasonable amount of interest to that and she's made a small fortune suckering landlords.
And I love the way every time this story comes along (weekly) the tenant is so sweet and perfect. Raise their rent to market and watch that change in a heartbeat.... :-)
- Rental Property Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2021 · 17 posts · 15 votes4y
Sheena I’m curious - how do you know this woman can’t afford higher rent? It’s not out of the question that you’re being played. We’ve all had tenants that have tried using the poverty card to their advantage. It’s very possible she has other means besides her Social Security. Anyway, I agree with previous posters who suggest giving her an extended amount of time (6 months would be very generous) to find somewhere else to live.
- Rental Property Investor · Canton, OH · Member since 2018 · 59 posts · 77 votes4y
Quote from @Sean Walsh:
Sheena I’m curious - how do you know this woman can’t afford higher rent? It’s not out of the question that you’re being played. We’ve all had tenants that have tried using the poverty card to their advantage. It’s very possible she has other means besides her Social Security. Anyway, I agree with previous posters who suggest giving her an extended amount of time (6 months would be very generous) to find somewhere else to live.
Sean - She has not asked us for anything. We met her through our initial walk-through inspection and she told us she knows her rent will probably go up and she eagerly whipped out her budget and calendar to show us that she could afford to pay about $100 more per month (which is obviously still way below market). I'm going to meet with her to talk about the actual rent increase in a couple of weeks, just before we close on the property. I just wanted to go to that meeting prepared to present to her with any options I know of that may be helpful to her.
- Rental Property Investor · Canton, OH · Member since 2018 · 59 posts · 77 votes4y
Quote from @Jim K.:
Thirty day notice IMMEDIATELY. The gravy train is under new management, sorry. How many years did she suck up the gravy? Well, it's time to move on or find a solution, and it's not your job to find a solution for her.
"I can't bear to do X,Y,Z" will die a quick death with you during your career as a landlord or you'll go broke, sorry.
Wow. You wouldn't even present the new rent and give her the chance to find a roommate or figure out some other way to get the rent paid? It seems like that would actually be shooting myself in the foot to kick out an otherwise great tenant before even presenting the new lease options or investigating possible solutions.
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