Tenant Not vacating in Bayonne, NJ

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Tenant Not vacating in Bayonne, NJ

Raj G.
Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes

Hi, I just bought a home, it's a two family/floor home.

tenants are there on 2nd floor living on month to month lease, we are living on first floor.

I told him to leave with one month notice, but he said 2 months.

I was ok with 2 months, but in the conversation he tried to threat me that he knows law etc.

I am sure , he will not leave after 2 months also. his wife is pregnant with 3rd baby.

Now, I am not feeling comfortable with them, so I want them to leave in one month only.

Can somebody help me to get perfect legal form for 1 month notice ,also what to do if tomorrow tenant say that he never received any notice, I asked them for email id he said  that he doesn't has any email id, his wife is pregnant does he can use that excuse.

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Jessica Zolotorofe
Attorney 路 NJ 路 Member since 2016 路 1k+ posts 路 794 votes
9y
Ray Reed has it right. And then after the notice to quit expires, you have to file a complaint in the Superior Court, Special Civil Part, Landlord-Tenant Division. They have forms you can fill out online. It will take you way longer to get them out legally than just the 30 days either way, though, and if you don't end things amicably, you risk them leaving the place a mess out of spite. May be best to try to compromise on 45 days, or something you can both live with, if possible?
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  • Matthew Paul
    Severna Park, MD 路 Member since 2013 路 7k+ posts 路 7k+ votes
    9y

    File an eviction .  If you file it first , if they file complaints against you , the eviction is on record as first , then any complaints will look bad for them .

    0Reply
  • Kim Meredith HamptonBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker 路 St Petersburg 路 Member since 2014 路 2k+ posts 路 2k+ votes
    9y

    You really need to check out the landlord tenants laws in NJ, but most likely the tenant is on a MTM and you could give him a thirty day notice on the first of January, but it sounds like you already made a deal with him for 2 months( verbally or written?) 

    When I serve any legal notice, I do several things; taped to front door (take a picture) with date and time. 

    Mail one

    Email one with a read receipt 

    Mail one certified 

    If you don't want to post one on the door  yourself, then get a process server to serve the notice 

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  • Raj G.
    OP
    Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes
    9y

    Hi @Kim Meredith Hampton thanks for your reply, tenant has asked 2 months, I didn't say yes or no.

    I was wondering how to get sample eviction forum, since we are living in the same building I can directly put letter directly in their mail box or I can slide in from their main door.

    But if tomorrow they say that they didn't receive the mail/letter?

    I can't do email because tenant didn't give me email id,said they don't have any email.

    Also wondering how to get sample tenant eviction letter/form for 1 month notice for tenant on month to month lease.

    Hi @Matthew Paul thanks for your reply also, Just wondering eviction filing , I am assuming 30 days notice is pre-requirement and I have to wait to finish 30 days?

    Also , since tenant's wife is pregnant , can they  make it an valid excuse?

    Do I need any reason to ask them to leave, or I can ask send them one month notice since they are on month-to-month lease?

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  • Kim Meredith HamptonBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker 路 St Petersburg 路 Member since 2014 路 2k+ posts 路 2k+ votes
    9y

    There is no need for an eviction at this point, you just need to give him a thirty day notice of non renewal. There is no form letter for that, you just simply tell him that you will not be renewing his MTM (month to month) lease, and he should plan to vacate at the end of January. You should post on 馃毆 (take picture) and mail certified this weekend to make sure you give the proper thirty days.

    Again, you should also check your States laws before moving forward.

    If he does not vacate at the end of January, then you would hire an attorney to evict him

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  • Matthew Paul
    Severna Park, MD 路 Member since 2013 路 7k+ posts 路 7k+ votes
    9y

    As long as you are not the father , pregnacy is not an excuse

    1Reply
  • Raj G.
    OP
    Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes
    9y

    @Matthew Paul , I am father for my  own kids , but not for her pregnancy..LoL.

    I could understand their reason of pregnancy, but I felt like instead of talking or requesting they are trying to threat me...is there any standard format for eviction notice/Form?

    0Reply
  • Matthew Paul
    Severna Park, MD 路 Member since 2013 路 7k+ posts 路 7k+ votes
    9y

    check your local laws , every state is different . 

    0Reply
  • Raj G.
    OP
    Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes
    9y

    That's  why I posted here,so that landlords from  NJ area specially Bayonne, Newark, Jersey city, edison, Hobokon, union could share their knowledge and experience on this.

    0Reply
  • Ray Reed
    Investor 路 Linden, NJ 路 Member since 2016 路 190 posts 路 116 votes
    9y

    you have to file a 'Notice To Quit'.  you can put one in their mailbox and the other you can hand to them or send it certified mail. you cannot file for an eviction until after the month expires and the tenant is still there. you have to verify that you can only give them one month and based on what grounds. I have done it on non owner occupied homes but the laws are different for owner occupied and non owner occupied.  if you google 'landlord tenant law NJ', it will bring you to the state of nj website which states the law and procedures for eviction.. good luck

    2Reply
  • Jessica Zolotorofe
    Attorney 路 NJ 路 Member since 2016 路 1k+ posts 路 794 votes
    9y
    Ray Reed has it right. And then after the notice to quit expires, you have to file a complaint in the Superior Court, Special Civil Part, Landlord-Tenant Division. They have forms you can fill out online. It will take you way longer to get them out legally than just the 30 days either way, though, and if you don't end things amicably, you risk them leaving the place a mess out of spite. May be best to try to compromise on 45 days, or something you can both live with, if possible?
    4Reply
  • Raj G.
    OP
    Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes
    9y

    Tenant is saying(verbally) 2 months , what if he ask for more months after 2 months?

    We are having verbal conversation only.

    0Reply
  • Raj G.
    OP
    Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes
    9y

    Do I need to give reason for eviction? it's month to month basis,and giving them 1 month notice is not enough?

    0Reply
  • Ray Reed
    Investor 路 Linden, NJ 路 Member since 2016 路 190 posts 路 116 votes
    9y

    if you are going to keep going back and forth verbally with the tenant, you lose leverage and the tenant buys even more time. a judge will not even hear your case based off of verbal exchanges. you have to provide copies of the notices when you file for eviction. cover yourself. send the tenant the notices and then work something out with him. once the notices are sent, the clock is ticking against them. 

    2Reply
  • Ray Reed
    Investor 路 Linden, NJ 路 Member since 2016 路 190 posts 路 116 votes
    9y

    why do you want them to leave?

    0Reply
  • Darren SagerPro Member
    Investor 路 Tampa, FL 路 Member since 2013 路 2k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    9y

    @Raj G. Since you occupy your home, it's my understanding that "normal" landlord/tenant laws apply differently.  From what I've been told the courts view your tenant more so as a guest (Only because you live there and it's less than 3 units) than a regular landlord/tenant relationship.

    Don't do anything anymore with your tenant verbally, although verbal contracts ARE legal from what I understand here in NJ.  Stop talking to them, put it all in writing.  If you have their cell # and email those are great places to keep records but still not always your best option.

    If they're month to month and you gave them 2 months (in writing) I would look up and let them know (in writing) what holding over is.  For those who don't know "Holding Over" is when a tenant doesn't move out when they're supposed to.  Here in NJ, landlords are allowed to collect double rent from their tenants when they do this.   Not it's not just cut and dry you can get double rent even though you're entitled to it so don't listen to me and do your homework on it. 

    I'm not an attorney so I'd consult with one and don't rely upon anyone's advice here without talking to your counsel first.  BiggerPockets is a great place to learn however when it comes to legal advice please don't rely upon me or anyone else in the forums. Laws change over time, what we know today might not be true tomorrow.  You might be trying to save $$ by doing so (relying upon the advice here) but in the end it might wind up biting you in the rear as some say.  

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  • Raj G.
    OP
    Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes
    9y

    Hi @Ray Reed and @Darren Sager Thanks for your reply.

    Darren you mentioned about 2 months notice, so just wondering, I need to give 2 month notice or just 1 month notice?

    1Reply
  • Darren SagerPro Member
    Investor 路 Tampa, FL 路 Member since 2013 路 2k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    9y

    If they're month to month you only need to give one month.  So to get them out by end of January you need to tell them before the end of THIS month, December.  If you tell them January 1, then they don't need to get out until end of February @Raj G.

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  • Raj G.
    OP
    Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes
    9y

    Hi @Ray Reed and @Darren Sager Thanks for your reply.

    Now just wondering if somebody could please share sample format for eviction.

    Also do I need to mention some reason,I was searching on google seems like I need to give reason?

    reason is , before buying our home we were paying $1900 for 2 bed 2 bath,now here tenant is paying just $1250 for 3 bed 2 bath, so I am thinking to increase rent to $1850.

    tenant said he can not pay that much, however it's justified ,but it's a big increase.

    So,not sure if we mention this reason how court see this?

    Just FYI..in 2016 tax of this property was $16k.

    0Reply
  • Chinmay J.
    Investor 路 Northern, VA 路 Member since 2016 路 1k+ posts 路 904 votes
    9y

    @Raj G. - I am still waiting on the threat part. How does he telling you that "he knows the law" a threat.  Did you try telling him that you know people from the 5 families? Try that. See what he says. 

    OK on a serious note. Why do you need eviction if its month to month? And if he knows that he needs to be out by end of two months, why not let him stay another month and a week like you agreed originally.  What does the lease say about termination of tenancy (I almost wrote pregnancy..lol)? OK. First of all is there even a lease to begin with, or everything has been agreed to orally until this point?

    0Reply
  • Chinmay J.
    Investor 路 Northern, VA 路 Member since 2016 路 1k+ posts 路 904 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Chinmay J.:

    @Raj G. - I am still waiting on the threat part. How does he telling you that "he knows the law" a threat.  Did you try telling him that you know people from the 5 families? Try that. See what he says. 

    OK on a serious note. Why do you need eviction if its month to month? And if he knows that he needs to be out by end of two months, why not let him stay another month and a week like you agreed originally.  What does the lease say about termination of tenancy (I almost wrote pregnancy..lol)? OK. First of all is there even a lease to begin with, or everything has been agreed to orally until this point?

     OK, I skimmed through the posts and it seems to be a verbal agreement only. So I guess good luck holding that in court. Your best bet is to let him stay and leave without much drama. If he is a decent tenant, i.e. pays on time, not too loud or messy, why are you hung up on what what merely agreed to in a conversation and that is very hard to prove in court of law. 

    0Reply
  • Jessica Zolotorofe
    Attorney 路 NJ 路 Member since 2016 路 1k+ posts 路 794 votes
    9y
    Is the property subject to rent control? You have to be careful there. The form summons and complaint are on the court's special civil part website with step by step instructions.
    0Reply
  • Ray Reed
    Investor 路 Linden, NJ 路 Member since 2016 路 190 posts 路 116 votes
    9y

    so you want them to move out in 30 days because you want fair market rent??  I personally don't agree with that. If they pay on time and are not causing any problems, why kick them out in the middle of the winter. Work with them.  For you it is money but for them it is their home.  It is not their fault that they are paying $1250 rent.  Why didn't you have the prior owner tell them they had to move since the house was being sold?  Did he/she tell you how much they were paying in rent?

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  • Chinmay J.
    Investor 路 Northern, VA 路 Member since 2016 路 1k+ posts 路 904 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Ray Reed:

    so you want them to move out in 30 days because you want fair market rent??  I personally don't agree with that. If they pay on time and are not causing any problems, why kick them out in the middle of the winter. Work with them.  For you it is money but for them it is their home.  It is not their fault that they are paying $1250 rent.  Why didn't you have the prior owner tell them they had to move since the house was being sold?  Did he/she tell you how much they were paying in rent?

    No he wants to kick them out because he says the tenant agreed orally to leave after 60 days but now our precious little  @Raj G. feels threatened that the guy won't leave after 60 days.  My biggest question is how the hell he is going to be able to prove in front of the judge that the conversation ever took place? Then comes the morality of kicking someone out who's wife is pregnant in the middle of the dead NJ winter. Looks like he doesn't know what a real threat looks like. Someone has a lot to learn in landlording.

    0Reply
  • Raj G.
    OP
    Investor 路 Jersey City, NJ 路 Member since 2015 路 304 posts 路 48 votes
    9y

    First of all, I was in process of buying this home for the last 3-4 months, in the beginning only I have told to previous landlord that we want home empty or rent will be this much,and he had conveyed this  message to tenants, we had many times talk on this, so it's not a surprise for them, they knew it and had enough time.

    2nd when I talked to tenant he tried to threaten me, he was not nice with me in such scenario I got some fear if he doesn't leave then?

     I asked him to send me email on whatever we agreed he said he has no email id, then I said ok send me SMS,he didn't do this, whenever I sent them SMS they didn't reply.

    Even though I am giving them more than 2 months notice.

    One more thing, next home is his father's home, he has tenant also, it's bigger than my home.

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  • Chinmay J.
    Investor 路 Northern, VA 路 Member since 2016 路 1k+ posts 路 904 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Raj G.:

    First of all, I was in process of buying this home for the last 3-4 months, in the beginning only I have told to previous landlord that we want home empty or rent will be this much,and he had conveyed this  message to tenants, we had many times talk on this, so it's not a surprise for them, they knew it and had enough time.

    2nd when I talked to tenant he tried to threaten me, he was not nice with me in such scenario I got some fear if he doesn't leave then?

     I asked him to send me email on whatever we agreed he said he has no email id, then I said ok send me SMS,he didn't do this, whenever I sent them SMS they didn't reply.

    Even though I am giving them more than 2 months notice.

    One more thing, next home is his father's home, he has tenant also, it's bigger than my home.

    Why did you close on the house if it was not delivered to you empty? No one really cares who said what to whom. I bet your tenant is smarter than you not to get entangled in web of texts and emails.  Is there even a signed lease? or was there ever was a signed lease? I bet answer to the question is NEGATIVE. 

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