Tenant wants extension - you will not believe the reason

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Tenant wants extension - you will not believe the reason

Lauren Van Riper
Graphic Designer & Marketer · Southern Shores, NC · Member since 2015 · 31 posts · 40 votes

Long post -  HELP.

I got an email this morning from my tenant that I sent a non-renewal letter to last month. I gave this tenant an extra month to find new housing as it is very difficult to find housing here. She has 3 young children and I feel bad for their family, This tenant is manic. Off her meds. They have triggered 6 eviction notices in their year lease. Started with a lease violation of pets. Their dogs on the lease had a litter of 14 puppies that they didn't tell me about. They when I approached them about getting the puppies adopted she told me to get the "f off the property". This was while I was taking my kids down the street to a birthday party and they hear this lady screaming at me about "What should I have done?, Drown the puppies? Did you want me to take a coat hanger to the mother? These things happen!" 

While I agree that these things happen this was not the reaction I was expecting. Then I get a call from her employer asking for the deposit back that she paid. I ask why, and they tell me that she quit her job.   The tenant tells me she was fired. Then the rent starts not coming in, I can't get a hold of them and they won't answer the door/phone/emails or texts. I understand that can be very stressful. This goes on for 6 months. Then she gets another job and all seems to level out. Then she quits a month later. Rent goes late again. So with 8 late rents, multiple lease violations and hostile interactions with them I decided to not renew the lease. I send the letter a month early and then get an email this morning. This is the first email/communication I have ever gotten from her since she rented a year ago. See the email:

-- We received your notices to vacate the premises as of May 14th. We have been actively searching and filled out multiple applications for multiple properties. However, our older daughters (XXXXXX-5 and XXXXXXX-4) were in XX visiting our parents for the last month. They returned April 6th, but that night something was wrong with XXXXXX. She has shown signs of some physical, sexual or emotional abuse (we are not sure what yet) and I plan to enroll her in play therapy (per recommendations from our friend who is a preschool owner and teacher.) After she had an episode-that now occur daily, multiple times (which consist of me trying to help her brush her teeth, or another activity, with her panicking and screaming "I just want to go to bed") I overheard XXXXXX and XXXXXXXXX having a conversation that "The lady....touched....where the babies come out." It was difficult to hear the entire conversation because I was in the kitchen, but that was enough along with the behavior to be concerned and seek further assistance.

At this time, I am very concerned about uprooting her life and finding a new home. She needs stability, she needs familiarity, and what she has here are family and friends that she is comfortable to be around, which we will not have if we move. This whole situation has completely broken my heart, and I do not know what to do. If we could get an extension, or something.....anything....I would forever be in your debt. From one mother to another, please help me. I don't know what to do.

Thank you for your consideration. --

I am lost as how to proceed or even handle this. 

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Elizabeth Wilson
Real Estate Investor · Memphis, TN · Member since 2016 · 940 posts · 695 votes
9y

@Lauren Van Riper - every post I've read on BP: when a landlord doesn't follow his/her eviction procedures and tries to be nice to tenants, it backfires. Sucks because we all want to be liked and thoughtful of others.

Help them find a new place. Offer to help pay for some moving expense. Whatever you feel comfortable with but if you want them out, allow the eviction process to continue.

So very sorry you've had such a rough experience.

Best of luck.

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  • Lauren Van Riper
    OP
    Graphic Designer & Marketer · Southern Shores, NC · Member since 2015 · 31 posts · 40 votes
    9y

    @Kathy Johnson I was just thinking the something today that the move out date is coming closer just shy over thirty days that I would send them a reminder notice at 30 days stating the same as the 60 day notice that it's time to move along. Thank you.

    0Reply
  • Duane Kidman
    Professional · Mansfield, TX · Member since 2013 · 77 posts · 44 votes
    9y
    I would have evicted her a long time ago. I am not sure why you let it go this far?!? Had you taken action when she was 30 days late, you wouldn't be in this situation. Nevertheless, there are counselors, family services, police and courts that take care of sexual abuse problems. Unless you work in one in one of these roles, you should play the role of landlord.
    0Reply
  • Duane Kidman
    Professional · Mansfield, TX · Member since 2013 · 77 posts · 44 votes
    9y
    If you are trying to get rid of her without trashing the place, pay her to leave (cash for keys). It would be a win-win proposition.
    0Reply
  • Ben McMahonPro Member
    Investor · San Diego CA · Member since 2014 · 341 posts · 140 votes
    9y
    Lauren Van Riper I stop reading the posts halfway down. Sorry for the repeat. Seems like there is a common thread and you already know what to do. I will say congrats on the title of your post because it's attention grabbing. That's what marketers like to see. I like the cash for keys. That's a solid choice. I will also agree with a few others, she is probably telling some truth and mixing it with lies and exaggerations. As a pm I've gotten myself to tied up in the drama a handful of times as well,so I understand how that can happen. The best thing I've been able to do in those situations is to bring in somebody else to finish handling it. Either another pm, or attorney, or husband, or whoever. Your history might be in the way of progress at this point, and your most likely losing sleep over this thing. Give someone else all the details and orchestrate from a distance. That's my advice. Don't know if that's a repeat, but nobody is worth ruining your peace over. It's one house, lesson learned, get it off your plate and handled correctly. You can use all that energy making money somewhere else. There is an opportunity loss that goes beyond all of this.
    0Reply
  • Ralph R.
    Investor · Bethel, AK · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 852 votes
    9y
    Lauren Van Riper Your mistake was made months ago when you first off didn't hire a Pm to vet your tenants and second went on " her ground". She now has you where she wants you. Proper vetting would have ruled her right out! The real sadness will come if you offer cash for keys. If you pay her to leave it won't show up as an eviction. Then when she rents from some poor fool that couldn't find an eviction record on her she will want cash for keys again and it will cost this guy more as she has learned that game now. That's why inexperienced land lords have a responsibility (to the rest of us landlords) to hire a PM until they have learned to properly manage a rental. Your hard luck will now be passed to somebody else because she has now learned to play the game. When she gets to an experienced landlord and he kicks her out right away she will likely tear up his unit in frustration. I'm not trying to be mean but this is where bad tenants are created. Cash for keys will only make it worse for the next guy. So will continuing to self manage until you have some experience under your belt. Get a PM and learn from them. It will be cheaper in the long run. RR
    0Reply
  • Blair Russell
    Investor · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2015 · 273 posts · 217 votes
    9y

    @Lauren Van Riper We've all been there, you are doing the right thing and being human. The people with the rude responses have obviously already learned this stuff the hard way, and they didn't quit, so not sure why they feel entitled to tell you that you need to run a charity or get out of the business. All experienced landlords/PMs were inexperienced landlords/PMs at one time, and you can't learn if you don't do so not sure why anyone would say that. You do not have a responsibility to anyone but yourself and your business.  They've just been burned and come out the other side very bitter. Like "Heaven forbid you walk down the street, how could you?"...give me a break people. 

    Honestly I think some people like being a landlord because they like "lording" over others. Like most places on the internet there are people who feel good making others feel bad, and acting superior. Any real experienced landlord is going to tell you that tenants always fine a way to be ridiculous no matter what you do, it's just learning how to deal with them in the most efficient way and knowing when to trust your gut. 

    This a forum to express ideas and thoughts. Often with tenants what I personally feel inside does not reflect how I have to behave for my business outside. I understand you wanting to share this story here with other landlords from the personal/internal side. I can see that you are very knowledgeable about the process and have kept these tenants accountable the whole lease period. 

    Take the good advice here. It seems you have already notified CPS which is great, next is just keep going with the non-renewal, if you get a bad gut feeing about what she will do you can try cash for keys but try to hold out.

    2Reply
  • Brandon Seyferth
    Rental Property Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 33 posts · 7 votes
    9y
    I respect your empathy. But also remember that to date, she has been unable to empathize with you or build any trust between the two of you. I would stick to your guns, as you seem to have done in a very human way. There can be an unclear line between having empathy and allowing yourself to be a sucker. That line can also be seen better from a distance. Thanks for reaching out to the community!
    0Reply
  • Dana Baggett
    Rental Property Investor · Kingston Springs, TN · Member since 2016 · 10 posts · 28 votes
    9y
    Lauren Van Riper Before I got into real estate, I was a therapist. I learned the hard way that property management is an entirely different skill set. First, I keep my properties nice and respond quickly to tenant requests - good tenants are like golden eggs. In the beginning, I always run background (which they pay) and have minimum standards listed on my marketing ads - this alone cuts out half of interested parties that would not be a good fit. I train them in first 90 days by being on them like "white on rice" and sticking to terms of lease - any violations such as unapproved pets, high grass, extended visitors not on lease, trash in yard, or neighbor complaints are addressed. Late notices are sent out at light speed and no waiving of late fees. Once tenant is established and demonstrates understanding of the lease, then I can loosen up a little if I choose and make compassionate concessions to them if circumstances warrant. I would rather get them out on the front end if they can't make the cut than deal with nonsense for a year or more. The type of tenant you described in one or especially multiple units can lead to stroke. I have found that cash for keys is best approach for me if it is just not meant to be - once we have agreed on date they can be out, they are given funds after everything is out (not they are still cleaning or they have just a couple of more things to get...) and they have signed paper indicating agreement and receipt of funds. My script for this type of tenant is, "I'm really sorry you are having to deal with that right now. However, these are your problems and I cannot allow them to become mine or we will both be out of a place to live. When is the earliest you can be out?" Me or thee and I choose me.
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  • Ramsey Blankenship
    Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2016 · 119 posts · 129 votes
    9y

    @Lauren Van Riper,  I have inherited tenants in the past who were similar in how they handled things.  Unfortunately it has made me grow cold when speaking with tenants. The best help I can offer is on the front end of your screening process. Every add I post for an available unit I include the following:  

    First and Last months rent plus security deposit required before occupancy.

    Criminal background check and credit report will be conducted. Must have 600+ Credit score. Felonies, hard drug charges, or evictions need not apply. Must have an income of three times the monthly rent. No Cats, No Smoking.

    This helps me screen out the crazies and those not serious about renting. 

    When I meet the tenant to sign the lease, I am nice and friendly however very serious once discussing late fees and tenant rules. I explain on the front end, and always use the following analogies phrases well before any issues arise: 

    "Everyone has problems, please do not allow your problems to become my problems." 

    I have had a tenant text me and say, "I am not trying to make my problems become yours, however I just want to let you know I will be late this month however rent will be paid by X with all late fees included." - I know it sounds cold, however saying it on the front end seems to help them understand that their life's challenges should not effect yours. 

    I also like to use the analogy that they wouldn't call the bank and ask them to waive the late fees on a late car payment, so please do not ask me. We have mortgages to cover and late payments are unacceptable.

    As far as your current situation, continue what you are doing with getting rid of that tenant. It is hard to give someone the cold shoulder, but the next tenant who pays rent on time and does not give you trouble will warm it back up again. For those telling you not to property manage, these experiences are how we learn how to handle issues. 

    Hope this Helps!

    1Reply
  • Ramsey Blankenship
    Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2016 · 119 posts · 129 votes
    9y

    i am in an area in which I receive a lot of applications for my units. I handle things on a case by case basis on the credit check mostly looking for delinquent payments. I have never had an issue finding a renter with a decent score however like i said in my post, it helps screen out tenants who do not fit my units and would waist both of our time. If i lived in an area where I had very few applications, it would likely change things. The point is simply to create a filter for yourself theough the adds. It helps

    0Reply
  • Dick Stevens
    Rental Property Investor · Haverhill, MA · Member since 2017 · 290 posts · 185 votes
    9y

    When is the last time you have been inside this property?  I'm guessing it's trashed (especially with all those puppies).  Schedule a walk through and after you see the condition you likely won't feel bad about evicting them.

    2Reply
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