Investor · Northern California · Member since 2015 · 126 posts · 40 votes
Hi BP Community!
One of my SF in the Dayton, OH is reporting bed bugs. They moved in December 1, 2016 and just reported it to my PM this week. I know it wasn't infested 6 months ago, and I have always made repairs in a timely manner once reported. Tenant is insistent that it wasn't him, and expects me to pay the $2600 treatment. He also wants to sue for damages of mattresses thrown out, furniture, etc. In this area we have seen an uptick in bed bugs, but he's been living there long enough for a judge to side with me. Any ideas on how to help my Property Manager defuse the situation before court even happens? I'm so over this tenant!
Northampton, MA · Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 5 votes
9y
I'm a lawyer among other things, and this idea is for educational and entertainment purposes only: Tell the tenant to *please* sue you--if he files first you won't have to pay the court-filing and process-server fees when you counter-sue him for bringing bed bugs into your renal property.
Investor · Carlsbad, CA · Member since 2012 · 73 posts · 34 votes
9y
What does your lease say about pests? Normally you're responsible for getting rid of pests (or at least make reasonable efforts) and refund the rent for the period the tenant is forced to temporarily live elsewhere, but you're not responsible for their property lost. In CA, a pro-tenant state, I'd suggest offering the tenant some incentive (100% deposit refund and prorate the rent plus $100 moving) to terminate the lease so you can apply treatment properly. There are too many ways a tenant can make your life a living hell in CA. Never assume a judge or a city code enforcer will side with you when there's the slightest doubt.
One of my SF in the Dayton, OH is reporting bed bugs. They moved in December 1, 2016 and just reported it to my PM this week. I know it wasn't infested 6 months ago, and I have always made repairs in a timely manner once reported. Tenant is insistent that it wasn't him, and expects me to pay the $2600 treatment. He also wants to sue for damages of mattresses thrown out, furniture, etc. In this area we have seen an uptick in bed bugs, but he's been living there long enough for a judge to side with me. Any ideas on how to help my Property Manager defuse the situation before court even happens? I'm so over this tenant!
Thanks all!
I'm in Dayton, Ohio and bed bug treatment does not cost $2600. I know of a reputable company that does four treatments for about $1000 total. Have they already paid for the treatment? Who authorized the treatment? I would contact a local attorney and see what your options are. Also if the bed bug infestation is recent then it is something that they did. Either they had a guest that had bedbugs or they visited someone with bedbugs and brought it back into their home. Anyways it was not your fault. If this was the case six months ago then it would be different. Long end of it do not let the tenant bully or dictate what is going to happen. Contact an attorney.
Lender · Dayton, OH · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 705 votes
9y
First question, does your lease address bugs at all? Second, who is your PM?
In general, for a single family, the presumption after this period of time would be that the tenants were the cause, and are responsible for the cost of fixing.
The PM should have a nice quiet personal conversation with the tenant.
Investor · Schaumburg, IL · Member since 2015 · 219 posts · 104 votes
9y
@Lauren Heart
First someone needs to confirm that they are bed bugs. Just because a bug is in a bed does not mean the bug it the blood sucking bed bug that is a nuisance to remediate. Second just because the tenant is adamant, that he did not bring the bed bugs does not mean that you put them their. Six months is quite some time. These days yoy cannot rule out anything. people have found bed bugs in the most obscure places. such as movie theatres, fitting rooms, at the office. Not just in hotel rooms. they could of transferred from bags at yhe airport. Don't cave to his threats. If he mentions attorney, ask him for the attorneys info and you will address this with between attorneys. If it is bed bugs this problem will not fix it self. Get the situation remediated properly and quickly. If this does go to court will your insurance cover this? Have you contacted his previous landlord? Finally, you have a PM company, they should be quarterbacking any and all problems. The purpose of a PM company is to insulate you from these issues. Also if you get sued are you indemnified? who would be accountable, in the worst case scenario? This is a tough issue, and not to be taken lightly.
Real Estate Broker · Temecula, CA · Member since 2014 · 994 posts · 783 votes
9y
It shouldn't cost that much, but I do believe landlords are mostly responsible. Bedbugs can come from a hotel stay, on shoes, etc. No necessarily because your tenant is a slob.
He needs to work with the remediation company to get this resolved. HIs renters insurance (hopefully you require this) should cover any of his items that were or are damaged, and maybe even a temporary place to stay.
Investor · Schaumburg, IL · Member since 2015 · 219 posts · 104 votes
9y
Sorry for all the typos and I ment you put them there. Anyone, know why the BP app in Andriod does not allow paragraphs? Anytime I try to enter a new paragraph, the post just truncates all the lines.
Investor · Northern California · Member since 2015 · 126 posts · 40 votes
9y
@Paul Amegatcher Would LOVE to have your contact info for a bed bug buster. Yes, I'm contacting an attorney for advice tomorrow, but really don't want to go that far.
First question, does your lease address bugs at all? Second, who is your PM?
In general, for a single family, the presumption after this period of time would be that the tenants were the cause, and are responsible for the cost of fixing.
The PM should have a nice quiet personal conversation with the tenant.
I'm thinking my PM needs to do the same. Wished I could find better management! Lease protects me and this is Ohio. Thank you!
Investor · Northern California · Member since 2015 · 126 posts · 40 votes
9y
@Christine Kankowski Great insurance point! Yes I require it, and yes my PM will definitely have a little chat with him about it.
@Ravi P. Thanks for the all the great questions. It is indeed an unwelcome but growing problem! I'll have my landlord follow up with previous landlord, but many times they are mum and happy to be rid of tenant. :(
Real Estate Agent · Southington, CT · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes
9y
@Lauren Heart The tenant or someone affiliated with the tenant brought the bed bugs in the house. Plain and simple. They are just trying to see if they can get you to pay for it.
Investor · Northern California · Member since 2015 · 126 posts · 40 votes
9y
@Ian Walsh You have made an excellent point. The current lease does not have a time statute as I haven't encountered this issue before. Believe me, the next one will! :)
Rental Property Investor · Melbourne, FL · Member since 2011 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
9y
I am having one of my houses tented for termites, and they tell me it will kill bed-bugs, roaches etc. This is a 4000 sf two story property in Florida, with a steep metal roof, so they have to bring out a cherry-picker. It is more expensive than a smaller house, obviously, and will cost $3000 to tent and trench. My post is aiming to support the cost of treatment. ;-)
You should have the property inspected before a tenant moves into any unit. Have the proper documentation that shows that there is no bed bug infestation or presence of any kind.
Write into the lease that if bedbugs become a problem after the move in date, that the tenant has to pay for the extermination procedure. (Deductive reasoning suggests that the tenant brought the bedbugs into the property.)
Of course, this is for the next unit you lease. I wish you the best of luck in navigating this sticky scenario.
Professional · Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2017 · 624 posts · 147 votes
9y
@Lauren Heart You certainly want to address this asap before tenant tacks on 'infliction of emotional distress'. This is a serious issue. You both would have to prove how or who is responsible.
I recommend you have a canine inspection done to confirm that they are indeed bed bugs. If it turns out to be positive and are responsible for the cost of treatment you should select the pest control provider of your choosing. Most pest control companies provided free quotes and you'll at least know what the cost really goes for. $2600 seems too much for a treatment but that doesn't mean they didn't hire a prep team to fumigate third belongings. That alone could run you over $2K.
Northampton, MA · Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 5 votes
9y
I'm a lawyer among other things, and this idea is for educational and entertainment purposes only: Tell the tenant to *please* sue you--if he files first you won't have to pay the court-filing and process-server fees when you counter-sue him for bringing bed bugs into your renal property.
Real Estate Consultant · Edmond, OK · Member since 2016 · 24 posts · 6 votes
9y
So bed bugs suck to deal with period. Sometimes they can find where the point of origin is. Is it a single family home? Duplex, town home etc. The reason I ask is if it isn't a single family home if one of the adjoining units is infested it can come to your unit. This is where treatments get expensive. Here in Oklahoma treatments range from 350-500 per treatment and usually require at least 2. However I just had a 7 unit that one tenant had the problem and we had to treat everything.. That was $2400. 2600 seems quite irrational. If you are going to pay for it you should have a right to get your own estimates and treatment opinions by your people not just because a tenant makes a demand. I have charged the treatments back to the tenants multiple times. Point being generally they brought them. If they weren't there before the tenant was and now they are........ well its the tenant. Personally I would fight that tenant. Our leases specifically state that pest control is on the responsibility of a tenant. Now, do we recommend to ALL of our owners that we do normal bug treatments yes. Why, because we all know tenants aren't going to do it.. For the most part. Anyways let us know how it turns out. Good Luck
Investor · Hyattsville, MD · Member since 2012 · 822 posts · 441 votes
9y
I'll just throw in my 2 cents about the treatment. None of the furniture needs to be thrown out unless the exterminator deems it necessary (always follow exterminator written and verbal guidance). It all gets treated and can be used following treatment. Sometimes the mattress is too far gone and they require the mattress be thrown out, but its always AFTER treatment and has to be specially wrapped and spray painted so others don't try to reuse (gross but possible). So if they preemptively started tossing furniture and mattresses before getting an inspection from an exterminator with guidance on treatment options, then contacted you afterward, they were also a bit too quick to claim that you should be sued for cost of replacement furniture. How could you respond to their notification if they already threw out furniture and didnt allow you to follow your due diligence? Regardless of how you settle who pays, I would get a bit more in front in vetting and selecting the exterminator so you can get feedback to make sure tenant complied with exterminator instructions for the multiple treatment visits required to get rid of the bugs. they need to follow washing clothes procedures etc... some get lazy and dont follow instructions and they might come back... good luck and sorry it happened to your property...
I'm a lawyer among other things, and this idea is for educational and entertainment purposes only: Tell the tenant to *please* sue you--if he files first you won't have to pay the court-filing and process-server fees when you counter-sue him for bringing bed bugs into your renal property.
Rental Property Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
9y
I went through this nonsense last summer. Tenant immediately claimed bed bugs the first day they moved in. They were professional tenants. I hired an inspector who came out and didn't even find poop or eggs, let alone bed bugs.
They were pretty dumb tenants. They claimed they were staying in a hotel before and that they had called them and confirmed no bed bug outbreak, so it must have been there already.
Funny thing is, they put the address of their last rental HOUSE on their application....In any case, even when I kicked them out a month later (MTM lease) for not paying utilities and being a general PITA, not to mention an attempt to extort me when I tried to get them to pay their rent, they were so stupid that their story changed repeatedly in writing, and they admitted to committing a a felony as well.
They tried to scam me but in the end they lost, I kept all their rent money and a good portion of their deposit. They threatened to sue, and made all other kinds of idiotic comments. I had so much evidence against them that I basically told them to get bent and then stopped responding to their emails. They cashed what was left of their deposit a week later and I never heard from them again.
Frankly, I will sue anyone who threatens to sue me from now on, and mess up their credit through collections, as well as a warning to other landlords.
I'm a lawyer among other things, and this idea is for educational and entertainment purposes only: Tell the tenant to *please* sue you--if he files first you won't have to pay the court-filing and process-server fees when you counter-sue him for bringing bed bugs into your renal property.
Ha! Hilarious! LOL. Just what I needed...good old fashioned laugh therapy. :)