Who is responsible on this one? Tenant or Landlord?

dallas texas · Member since 2018 · 39 posts · 10 votes

Hi Guys,

I got a funny one: My tenant called me yesterday to let me know that there was no more power in one of her bedrooms. I asked a few questions before deciding to send my handy man.....Well it turns out that all he had to do is go to the breaker box and flip the fuse back on...This costs me $75....

I should have asked my tenant to check the breaker box but I wonder if checking the breaker box is one of the basic things that is expected from a tenant. If so, can I charge her the $75 for negligence?

I looked at the lease but it is not clear. The one paragraph that would remotely be applicable would be "The tenant shall pay for all repairs, replacements and damages caused by the act or neglect of the tenant",

If you have any feedback, please share it. This apt is located in NJ

Tks

Nicolas

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Anthony Wick

Rental Property Investor · Ankeny, IA · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes

Eat the $75 and call it educational expense. Not sure how the Tenants lack of knowledge can be called negligence. I bet you won't make this same mistake again.

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Anthony Wick
Rental Property Investor · Ankeny, IA · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
7y
Eat the $75 and call it educational expense. Not sure how the Tenants lack of knowledge can be called negligence. I bet you won't make this same mistake again.
8 Reply
Hannah Krebs
Flipper/Rehabber · Saint Paul, MN · Member since 2018 · 85 posts · 65 votes
7y
@Nicolas Beck Unfortunately, in this case, I feel that the bill should go to you. Unless you suggested she check the breaker box and provided detailed instructions to do so, I think she can within her rights say she did not know to the check the breakers, or even how to check the breakers. I think you would have a hard time proving the tenant negligent on that account. I think it would be easiest to just pay the bill this time.
What tripped the breaker would be my next question. You may want to see if they are running something that is going to continue to throw the breaker. If that's the case, you may want to make sure that in the future she will know where and how to reset the breaker.
4 Reply
Samuel Glantz
Peoria, AZ · Member since 2018 · 55 posts · 24 votes
7y
in our leases we have it so the tenants cover the first $65 in repairs, this mitigates nuisances like this. We do not enforce it on legit problems just the ticky tack ones
1 Reply
Dennis M.
Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
7y
two rules of being a landlord 1- the tenant is always at fault 2. If it’s the landlords fault ,see rule number 1
2 Reply
Chris Szepessy
Catskill, NY · Member since 2018 · 636 posts · 668 votes
7y
I agree. Just pay the $75 and use it as a cheap lesson learned. I’ve learned over the years not to assume someone is smart/capable enough to do something basic without being properly instructed. “Common sense isn’t so common” is the saying.
1 Reply
Bob B.
Investor · Jasper GA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
7y
@Nicolas Beck you need to find why the breaker tripped.
1 Reply
Jason D.
Rental Property Investor · St. Petersburg, FL · Member since 2017 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
7y
@Bob B. Great question! That's the first thing I would ask. What happened just before the power went out?
0 Reply
Nicolas Beck
OP
dallas texas · Member since 2018 · 39 posts · 10 votes
7y
Hi Guys: Thank you so much for all the great feedback. I will eat the $75 and make sure next time that I am as educational as possible with my tenants!
Happy Thanksgiving
ps: Yes, I will check why the power went out...
2 Reply
Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
Moderator
Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
7y
@Nicolas Beck it's surprisingly common to find tenants that don't know when to check breakers or how to reset them. Eat the cost, educate yourself, and then you can help the tenant trouble-shoot the issue if it happens again.
Many tenants will report that they've checked the breakers and none of them are tripped. However, some breakers will trip and appear to be in the "ON" position. I ask them to humor me and walk through the steps with me before sending a contractor out. It's important to push the break to the "OFF" position and then all the way back to the "ON" position. You should do it hard, not soft, and you sometimes have to do it more than once to get it to click into place. I tell tenants to "push them forcefully". I've saved thousands of dollars by walking tenants through the process.
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5 Reply
James Wise
Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
7y
Originally posted by @Nicolas Beck:

Hi Guys,
I got a funny one: My tenant called me yesterday to let me know that there was no more power in one of her bedrooms. I asked a few questions before deciding to send my handy man.....Well it turns out that all he had to do is go to the breaker box and flip the fuse back on...This costs me $75....
I should have asked my tenant to check the breaker box but I wonder if checking the breaker box is one of the basic things that is expected from a tenant. If so, can I charge her the $75 for negligence?

I looked at the lease but it is not clear. The one paragraph that would remotely be applicable would be "The tenant shall pay for all repairs, replacements and damages caused by the act or neglect of the tenant",

If you have any feedback, please share it. This apt is located in NJ
Tks
Nicolas
Always always ask them several questions to prevent a service call like this. You'd be very surprised as to how often things like this happen. Another common one is tenants not knowing how to change smoke detector batteries & or being confused by the beeping the smoke detector makes when the batteries need to be changed,
0 Reply
Peter M.
Rental Property Investor · DFW, TX · Member since 2013 · 953 posts · 910 votes
7y
Had this issue before as well. After driving an hour round trip on toll roads to flip 2 breakers I finally typed up a two page troubleshooting guide for common household problems. At the end it says that if the issue turns out to be anything on this list, they are responsible for the repair. I also make it clear that they should always report a problem and not try to hide it. It also lists problems that they are not allowed to try to fix themselves like roof issues, working at heights, etc. In your case, eat the charge this time but explain the situation to them and how to fix it in the future. Tell them if it happens again they will have to pay for it.
0 Reply
Nicolas Beck
OP
dallas texas · Member since 2018 · 39 posts · 10 votes
7y
@ Peter: Tks for your feedback. Are you at liberty of sharing that list of yours? You can pm me if you wish
Tks
Nicolas
1 Reply
Yvonne H.
Mooresville, NC · Member since 2018 · 68 posts · 39 votes
7y
@Bob B. and @Hannah Krebs are right. Regardless of your $75, you need to figure out why that breaker is tripping.
0 Reply
Stephen Shelton
Debary, FL · Member since 2017 · 110 posts · 113 votes
7y
$75 is a bargain. In one of my properties an outlet connected to a light switch failed and it was a simple issue with the wires in a wire nut not being twisted together.
I fixed it myself, but it cost be hundreds if not thousands of dollars into the future because during that trip I found a little black puff of a kitten in the yard and I estimate that's what he's going to cost over the next 15 years.
BTW why didn't you stop by to see if it was something simple before calling a pro? A lot of electrical gremlins have the potential of being easy fixes with a few cheap tools. Is this a long-distance property?
As for who should pay I say do whatever your history has established. Is anything in your lease? I typically do my own repairs so if out of the blue I charged my tenant they'd wonder what was up. Yes repairs under (I think my lease says $100) are supposed to be handed by the tenant, but I like doing them and if I suddenly charged it could cause a trust issue. Also they'd be less likely to inform me of small issues until they become big issues.
3 Reply
David S.
Investor · Prairieville, LA · Member since 2015 · 311 posts · 424 votes
7y
Yes, I had this issue many times.
Unfortunately since your lease does not include specific language about the breakers, then I am on the side that it is your responsibility UNLESS you can prove the tenant did something wrong that would trip the breaker and that would be very difficult to have definitive evidence.
For $75, I hope someone just did not flip the breaker and leave? I would expect a basic troubleshooting of what was on that circuit.
For example:
1. Do you have a short somewhere?
2. Is it a weak breaker or is the breaker bad?
3. Do you have damage to the bus bar?
4. Does the tenant have anything on that circuit that would trip it? Like a space heater? A faulty appliance or light?
This does bring ideas on how I can improve my systems. Moving forward, I think I will:
1. Put in the lease that tenant must try resetting the breaker 1st before we send in an electrician, or pay the cost of paying an electrician to flip the breaker.
2. Train new tenants on how to flip breakers and the locations. Some of my places have 2 different electrical panels in different locations of the residence.
3. Type up a guide for each unit on location and procedure.
4. Do the same for water cutoff valves to the unit. This may save thousands if they know where the water cutoff is.
1 Reply
Elise Hazzard
Property Manager · Saint Petersburg, FL · Member since 2016 · 182 posts · 51 votes
7y
@ David S., great trouble shooting advice, thank you.
Will be happy to pass this on to the PM
:)
1 Reply
Thomas S.
Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
7y
As pointed out you need to educate all tenants on simple fuse/breaker panel operation. The cost then will be their responsibility when it is a simple breaker reset.
As pointed out breakers need to turned solidly to off before resetting. I have one my welder trips regularly that does not visually appear to be tripped but is always is.
As for the cause of the prroblem if it was cold out I would check to see if th etennat is uaing a plug in electric heater and if so tell them to stop. They are unsafe and it should be in th elease that no auxilery heating units are permited to be used in th eproprty.
0 Reply
Tchaka Owen
Real Estate Agent · Merritt Island, FL · Member since 2017 · 974 posts · 1k+ votes
7y
@Stephen Shelton - as the owner of 3 cats, I totally dig your response! :-)
1 Reply
Stephen Shelton
Debary, FL · Member since 2017 · 110 posts · 113 votes
7y
Originally posted by @Tchaka Owen:

@Stephen Shelton - as the owner of 3 cats, I totally dig your response! :-)
😅😅 He's nearly 12 pounds now and solid muscle. He's like a feline pitbull.
1 Reply
Account Closed
Member since 2018 · 5 posts · 1 vote
7y
GROSSSSSSSS
Originally posted by @Dennis M.:
two rules of being a landlord
1- the tenant is always at fault 2. If it’s the landlords fault ,see rule number 1
0 Reply
Pat L.
Rental Property Investor · Upstate, NY · Member since 2012 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
7y
Sone of our tenants send us a text with a pic of the problem. So seeing a breaker requiring a reset would be easy, assuming they knew where & what a panel looked like. Best one was a pic of the plumbing repair a 30 something college graduate sent me. The sink plumbing was leaking so he sent me pics of all the duct tape work he did to stop the leak, but it failed. I subsequently instructed him on tightening the plumbing trap to sink drain interface. But he was a great tenant & just bought their own home.
0 Reply
Kenneth GarrettPro Member
Investor · Florida Panhandle/Illinois · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
7y
@Nicolas Beck
Things I thought were so simple before becoming a landlord apparently are not. As far as the breaker I would eat the cost of having your maintenance personnel reset it. Agree with the others as far what was going on when it tripped. Maybe it’s a sign of a bigger problem.
My lease has 12 pages of rules for the tenant to follow. Resetting a breaker is not in there. The smoke detector is beeping. Did you check the battery? How do I do that is the answer. I get calls about the towel bar in the bathroom is loose. You would think they could operate a screw driver. No, not in this case. I had a heat complaint where the boiler had a problem. They had discovered it wasn’t working early in the afternoon, but didn’t call until 7:00pm. Now it’s an emergency call out. That cost me more money. I keep tweaking my rules on tenant responsibilities as things come up that are not addressed in there.
There is a fine line of tenants working on the unit and common sense. I would rather they call and I can decide how urgent something is.
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Michael Noto
Real Estate Agent · Southington, CT · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes
7y
@Nicolas Beck Unfortunately this happens and I trhink you have to eat this one. Usually if one room or area of an apartment has no power it is because the breaker of GFI tripped. Lesson learned for the future. Very cheap lesson to learn in the grand scheme.
0 Reply
Dan L.
Rental Property Investor · Albany, NY · Member since 2019 · 125 posts · 47 votes
6y
I think this is a lesson that everybody learns at some point. The key is just to learn it once!

I did something like this to myself in my own primary residence years ago. My central AC stopped being cold (it blew air, but not really cold air). I called an HVAC company, knowing it was a $150 charge to walk in the door. Took him ONE minute to flip the breaker in the basement for the AC unit (the blower was still running on a separate breaker, but the condenser was not).

So, the first time I had a tenant tell me that their dryer stopped working and that they need a new one, my immediate response was “did you check the breaker?” And of course that was the problem.

Be happy you learned for $75 what cost me $150!

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