New York Rent Control - Is Cuomo Really This Dumb?

New York Rent Control - Is Cuomo Really This Dumb?

Rental Property Investor · Albany, NY · Member since 2019 · 33 posts · 33 votes

Not sure how many of you all have seen in the news, but New York is going full-on-socialist with expanding "tenant protections" across the entire state.

NYC has had rent control for a while, from my understanding. But now they're expanding these laws to include upstate (Albany, Buffalo, Rochester, etc.), as if upstate NY cities didn't already have enough economic issues.

From the NY Post:

"The current rules allowed landlords to increase rents by 6% a year to pay for major building-wide improvements or unit rehabs. The omnibus rent bill cuts that down to 2%."

… So disincentivize landlords from making improvements to their buildings. Can anyone explain to me how this makes any economic sense? It's like they want building-owners to be slumlords!! I can't believe it!

From the local paper here in Albany, the Times Union:

"The laws require landlords to give tenants several months notice before an eviction for non-payment, and enable judges to "stay" an eviction up to a year if it will cause "hardship," such as adversely affecting the tenant's childcare arrangements or health."

If someone can explain to me how this benefits anybody in the long-run, tenants or landlords, I'd love to hear it. 

Saw a great quote from a local Albany developer in the newspaper - something along the lines of "The real estate won't move, but my money can." That about sums it up!

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Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
7y

No surprise ..Sounds like your typical insane liberal policies that kill business 

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    7y

    No surprise ..Sounds like your typical insane liberal policies that kill business 

  • Rental Property Investor · Ithaca, NY · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Josh E.

    Straight craziness. I’m looking into investing in other parts of real estate and not multifamilies or houses. I’m looking at office space, strip malls, or hotels in NY. Before they take that away.

  • Rental Property Investor · St. Petersburg, FL · Member since 2017 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y

    @Josh E. All I can say is that there will still be people that make money, even with these rules. You can choose to adapt and be one of those people, or toss in your cards and play the game somewhere else....

  • Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
    7y

    We're seeing it across the country. Government is taking away the rights of the Landlord and creating rules that favor the tenant. As @Jason D. said, you can figure out how to operate within the law or move to another area that doesn't feature that law. Large cities are increasingly headed towards more socialist/communists policies so you can expect this to work its way from the coast to other cities over the years.

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  • Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    Well, the thing to do actually is to engage in politics. Politicians apply grease to the squeaky wheel. Currently in the US, the only people squeaking to the politicians are the special interests, not the general public and viola, the special interests get attention and the people do not. It is overly idealistic to believe politicians are going to do the right thing because it is the right thing to do.

    As far as asking if he is stupid or not...that depends on how you define stupid...my guess is no. Does he have ambition and interests? Absolutely. I'll say no more, as this forum forbids political discussions (though I wonder why, considering politics shapes real estate).

  • Rental Property Investor · East Wenatchee, WA · Member since 2014 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    7y

    WA had some similar coast-esque laws (but not a year eviction stay option, holy jeez) pass recently.  They go into effect at the end of July.

    First thing I did to adapt?  Show 2 marginal tenants the door (with a generous 60 day notice). 

    And I tightened my screening criteria up. Majorly. 

    Legislators must think we're stupid or something. Massive tenant protections make us only rent to the extremely well-qualified. Or sell our rental homes to owner-occs as I have my last 6, further reducing rental supply.

    Good to have low debt in blue states like ours. Patience when filling units a must.  I'd much rather have a vacancy than place a problem tenant.  Make sure you're not undercapitalized. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Weehawken, NJ · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 704 votes
    7y

    @Josh E.

    There are few (if any) mainstream economists that support the idea of rent-control: 

    https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/insights/rent-controls-winners-losers

    It's very frustrating to see an entire political movement (conveniently) ignore expertise. Granted, we have examples of that on both sides of the political spectrum.

  • Rental Property Investor · Buffalo, NY · Member since 2017 · 257 posts · 130 votes
    7y

    Dumb, I don't think so. Evil, yes. 

  • Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 17 votes
    7y

    This inadvertently is going to demonize any single parent. As a landlord if you know that you cannot evict someone if it will cause hardship due to childcare, why would you ever rent to someone with one income and children? One layoff and you just ate a bill for a year long eviction. Whether it's legal or not to screen this way doesn't mean it won't happen. 

  • Rental Property Investor · The Vampire State · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    He's just overtly trying to buy votes, as he always does.

    Since demographically, there are more tenants in NYS than landlords, pander to the greater numbers for job preservation come re-election time.

    Unfortunately, this continues to drive the money out of the state.  Sadly, someone's going to be left holding the bag. And I can tell you it's not going to be me.

  • Rental Property Investor · The Vampire State · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Jason D.:

    @Josh E. All I can say is that there will still be people that make money, even with these rules. You can choose to adapt and be one of those people, or toss in your cards and play the game somewhere else....

     I'm not sure I agree.  Where the successful adaptation is happening (Seattle, San Francisco, etc.) are appreciating markets, so the landlords can still survive in the socialist environment.

    Upstate NY does not have ANY appreciation in small multi's.  None.  Apart from forced appreciation, the buildings are selling for the same prices they sold for 10 years ago.  Check the data.

  • Investor · Mahwah, NJ · Member since 2016 · 15 posts · 7 votes
    7y

    Unfortunately, this law will benefit no one in the long-run. Typical for a governing body to propose a short-term solution to get votes as oppose to addressing the main issue. There will always be opportunities to make money in real estate, however the laws can make it more challenging. Sometime best to wait on the sidelines for the dust to settle to see what will work in a new legal environment such as this.

  • Rental Property Investor · Jersey City, NJ · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 876 votes
    7y

    This stuff is what gives landlords a bad name, because only someone willing to be scumbag buys these properties. The person willing to be a slumlord, harass tenants and break laws. The ethical landlord says "I can't make money here, pass". There's no cage match between landlords and tenants in an open market with enough inventory.  

    A sane government would tie increasing rent protections with removing density zoning, so the problem of low inventory will go away. Check out this block in my city, prewar rent controlled 56 units on the left, conforming 2 families on the right with 8 homes. This is why there's not enough housing!

  • Ryan VienneauBusiness Member
    Investor · Stillwater, NY · Member since 2015 · 149 posts · 121 votes
    7y

    @Josh E. Yes, Cuomo is a moron, but rent control was not mandated upstate, it was just made legal for each muni to adopt rent control if they choose. With all of the muni's here around Albany desperately trying to attract investment, I'd be pretty shocked if they did, but it could happen. I'm still waiting to hear from my attorney for guidance on the remainder of the bill. Fortunately, we screen tightly and have never had to evict, but either way it's typical NY socialist BS.

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  • Farmington, NY · Member since 2016 · 13 posts · 7 votes
    7y

    @Steve Vaughan interesting point...how do you avoid issues with turning away potential tenants? IE, discrimination claims, etc? I know this is a more "general landlord" question than anything in this thread, but curious to hear on your experience.

  • Rental Property Investor · Red Bank, NJ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    I often thought we should get the activists to flip the script and demand that SF homeowners be capped at a 10% increase on resale due to the outcry about people unable to afford the proverbial "American home ownership dream." Oh what an outcry there would be! I can just see the heads exploding.

    But then I opened the WSJ and NYT today and see that they are already laying the groundwork for that- blaming the REI on current housing issues.

  • Rental Property Investor · Upstate, NY · Member since 2012 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    & then you have these idiots....

    Los Angeles should penalize landlords who keep homes vacant as the city suffers a housing and homelessness crisis, several members of the Los Angeles City Council declared in a proposal unveiled Tuesday.

    City Councilmen Mike Bonin, Marqueece Harris-Dawson, Paul Koretz and David Ryuare asking city staffers to come back with options for an “empty homes penalty” or vacancy tax, which would likely have to go before voters for approval. They cited U.S. Census Bureau data estimating that as of two years ago, there were more than 100,000 vacant units across the city.

  • Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    7y

    @Pat L.

    Geez They’ll get you on the front end or the back end . Screw you on renting out the place by limiting your income and regulations..then when you lose the tenant you get hit you the city for the vacancy . How can a landlord win ?

  • Rental Property Investor · San Ramon, CA · Member since 2017 · 350 posts · 611 votes
    7y

    Rent control forces the private sector to directly subsidize public programs.  It's as if the government caps new iPhone prices at $50 so that everyone can have one.  Apple can't make money and will ditch the product.  

    If government entities want to help the tenants, they should increase rent voucher programs like Section 8 to fall in line with rental demand and prices.  Also reduce soft costs associated with development (like permits and building regulation fees in California) to spur building.  Rent control, on the high end of spectrum, can reduce property values and thus reduce property taxes, essentially shooting themselves in the foot by reducing a revenue source.  Some folks in government need to take basic Econ 101 classes.

  • Rental Property Investor · East Wenatchee, WA · Member since 2014 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Austin Welty:

    @Steve Vaughan interesting point...how do you avoid issues with turning away potential tenants? IE, discrimination claims, etc? I know this is a more "general landlord" question than anything in this thread, but curious to hear on your experience.

     I don't normally comment on specific criteria I have, but do ask questions that must be answered when someone responds to my for rent ad.  Notably how much do they smoke and how many animals do they have.  I also ask how soon they can/wouod like to move and 8f their commute will be long.

    No answer, no response from me. No ph#, no address.  Gather information and pre-screen as much as you can prior to meeting.

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Steve Vaughan:
    Originally posted by @Austin Welty:

    @Steve Vaughan interesting point...how do you avoid issues with turning away potential tenants? IE, discrimination claims, etc? I know this is a more "general landlord" question than anything in this thread, but curious to hear on your experience.

     I don't normally comment on specific criteria I have, but do ask questions that must be answered when someone responds to my for rent ad.  Notably how much do they smoke and how many animals do they have.  I also ask how soon they can/wouod like to move and 8f their commute will be long.

    No answer, no response from me. No ph#, no address.  Gather information and pre-screen as much as you can prior to meeting.

    Oregon just passed state wide rent control..  a hedge fund that owns 150 plus props in Portland about 75mil worth  just put them on the market I say 2 years to late.. in shopping this around to buyers I know that could take it down.. most have just came out up front with discount would have to be 30 to 40% off of todays market to take on that big of job with new rent control rules..  

  • Engineer · Portland, OR · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Austin Welty I do most of the same things @Steve Vaughan does. You just need to be smart and avoid any “protected class” type questions.

    The easiest and most important thing you can do is require a good credit score. Requiring a 670+ eliminates 80% of the jokers immediately. Most tenter horror stories you read about on this website could have been avoided with a simple credit check.

    With more government regulation and requirements which way do you think credit requirements for basic housing are going to go? They have yet to figure out how to make “lousy credit” a protected class but I’m sure they are working on it. So much for helping poor people.

  • Engineer · Portland, OR · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Paul Choi you’re exactly right. It’s more economically effective to subsidize the people you are trying to help then to put an expensive but unseen compliance burden of the supplier as it adds inherent economic inefficiencies. The problem is it’s politically easier to just operate with Carte Blanche on a bad solution you can foist on an economically ignorant voting class.

  • Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    7y

    Typical feel good liberal bull **** spearheaded by Bonehead Bonin and his Three Wise Monkey tag-a-longs so that people can think that they are making a difference.

    Those 100,000 vacant units represent a 2.7% vacancy rate. The national average is 7%. There aren't 100,000 affordable homes out there just sitting empty. That number includes weekend beach houses, high rise condos on the westside that are used when executives come into town, lots of high priced spec mansions, and something that these politicians will never want to talk about, the extremely high number of empty units in downtown LA. 

    Downtown LA went through a rebirth a few years ago. LA relaxed some of its building rules, builders came in and built a lot of higher end units, the police moved the bums along out of the area and high end restaurants and shops started to move in. DTLA started to become a trendy place. Then "progressiveness" hit and the police do nothing about the bums, there are piles of trash literally 10+ feet high, rats running all over the place, human crap and used needles on the streets, homeless camps across the street from million dollar condos, and diseases infecting people. Shockingly, no one wants to move to DTLA anymore and there are a ton of vacant units. They can't sell the places that they just built and people who bought a couple years ago are super pissed. Take a look at for sale sites and you will see these properties are staying on the market for long periods of time and prices keep getting reduced. It's only going to get worse as there are 7,000+ units set to be completed in the coming year and few buyers. 

  • Lititz, PA · Member since 2013 · 595 posts · 272 votes
    7y

    New York State has 6% property tax in many communities.  That's $500/month going to property tax on a home assessed at $100,000.  Add mortgage, insurance, maintenance, vacancy, and several months to handle an eviction, and single family home rentals can be nearly impossible.  Single family home purchases can too!

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