Replacing "Landlord" with "Housing Provider"

General Landlording & Rental Properties
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Replacing "Landlord" with "Housing Provider"

Laura Guy
Flipper/Rehabber · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 54 posts · 144 votes

Our team in Indiana has hired a lobbyist to represent the interests of housing providers and investors.  One of our first objectives is to replace the word "landlord" with "housing provider" in ALL pieces of legislation.  The "lords of the land" in history refers to landowners that essentially provided housing and oversaw most aspects of tenants lives.  We are housing providers that provide a product/service in exchange for money.  That is it. However, we need to find a term that replaces "landlord' for commercial providers as well - any ideas?  

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Account Closed
Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
5y

The entire point of language is to communicate. When the language we employ fails to create an understanding between people and further creates a misunderstanding between people, the language is a failed one. The use of ambiguous terms is never helpful for the purpose of clarity, and can be disastrous when used in legislation. Politicians love ambiguous terms and employ them endlessly.

The term "housing provider" does not well describe the property owner within the business of residential rental property. It is ambiguous and suggests a role that is false. I own property and I rent it to people for them to use however, they have provided the housing for themselves, not the other way around. I provide housing for myself and my dependents; my employer does not do that for me, my bank does not do that for me, and the builder who constructed my house does not do that for me - we are not all housing providers, only I am. The term "housing provider" suggests a dependent is involved.

I am a property owner. I provide a leasing opportunity to people who are in need of housing. If anything, we are lease providers and not housing providers. As it turns out, more specific terms for landlord and tenant already exist in the legal world, they are lessor and lessee. Look at that, the terms are specific to exactly what it is we all are doing, in no uncertain terms. Perhaps what's really needed is a lesson in vocabulary.

With all due respect, I think this endeavor is dumb. There is nothing that needs to be solved and further, the suggestion of using the term "housing provider" creates unnecessary ambiguity when the entire rationale for the change according to the OP is to eliminate ambiguity. This is an incredible waste of time and money that in my opinion makes things worse, not better for landlords or tenants or anyone. Frankly, using a term like 'housing provider' in this situation is downright thoughtless and lazy. If it's all that bothersome and persons are bent on making a change, use lessor and lessee. People can Google what those terms mean if they don't already know. Even then though, what about all the legislation that already uses the terms landlord and tenant??? LOL. Is someone going to go back and get all those pieces of legislation changed too? How about the ambiguity of having one term used in the past and another used now and into the future? Will the term "housing provider" be deemed inappropriate in the future and then someone will go back and change everything again? Will we have three different terms for the same thing depending on when the legislation was written? Good grief. Leave well enough alone.

This whole thing stinks of PC BS to me.

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  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Sean McKee:

    @Jay Hinrichs I agree with the negative bias's that some professions will have no mater what. Whatever term we end up using, this will never change.  I was called a slumlord for not having on site laundry, even though that is very common for my market. There's absolutely nothing wrong with my units. So while annoying, I accept it as part the role I'm in.

    The problems start however when these negative perceptions feed into legislation. Whether it's eviction moratoriums or limits on tenant screening, legislators have the political leeway to get away with it. We as "landlords" are outnumbered by tenants and people sympathetic towards tenants. So politicians don't really have to worry about offending their voter base. COVID was the prefect storm for some of this resentment to turn into legislation. I understand where Laura is going with this and the frustrations I'm sure many of us have had for more than a year now. While I don't think we will ever get rid of the negative perceptions, I do think we can lessen some of the fallout and make some laws more balanced.

    But ultimately this can be risky business, and it comes with the territory.

    Bottom line you hit the nail on the Head its a for profit business and as such it carries risk   risk to market risk to political whims etc.

    I just look back at my years in Development  where the stroke of a pen can cost us millions  we have the homebuilders associations in many areas that lobby hard for us.. But we are still taking massive regulatory risks and not all cities are the same.. in Portland its a nightmare.. I am building 90 homes in a town just south called Canby  and its been once of my best experiences.  So landlord Tenant laws are no different. The Government does not owe private business anything.  They create these laws based on what they perceive the greater good.. Not what's best for the profit side of the equation.. If an investor does not like the rules no one is forcing them to buy rentals .. there are plenty of other investments out there. 

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  • Jason Denny
    Rental Property Investor · Member since 2019 · 15 posts · 6 votes
    5y

    @Laura Guy

    How about Tenant Services or Tenant Service Provider. Sounds more like a business name than a government entity name. In my opinion but you are definitely on to something.

    2Reply
  • Darren SagerPro Member
    Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    We'll use whatever word the state tells us to use in that locality.  As long as the $$$ comes in on the first of the month,  I personally don't care what they call us.

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  • Laura Guy
    OP
    Flipper/Rehabber · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 54 posts · 144 votes
    5y

    @Jason DennyI like!  Thank you! 

    1Reply
  • Nik Moushon
    Architect · Wenatchee, WA · Member since 2018 · 843 posts · 907 votes
    5y

    @Laura Guy

    With labeling it Housing Provider, I have to agree with most here that it would cause more harm than good in the long wrong. I support what you are trying to do but Housing Provider sounds the same as Health Care Provider and look whats happening with that. The major push for government run health care and that its should all be free and paid for by the government. If you don't want to see whats happening in Portland happen elsewhere....then don't open a door that allows them to gain a foothold like this.

    Words have an extremely powerful effect on how people interpret the meaning and connotation of its purpose. You can use 10 different single words that mean the same thing and you will have 100 different interpretations of it at the end of the day. So its not just enough to get rid of Landlord and replace it with anything. Especially in todays society you really have to think about all the different perspectives...of pretty much everything. Its sad that its come to that but its the truth. 

    Personally I think Owner and Renter are clear enough that define the given role of the two parties no matter if its residential or commercial. But you could also a bit more descriptive and say Residential Owner/Renter and Commercial Owner/Renter. Similar to how you have residential/commercial architect or contractor. I think keeping it simple and reducing the amount of available options to interpret it differently is the key. I'm not saying my suggests would be the perfect one either. I just feel that Housing Provider would do more harm than good in the long run. 

    You also dont want to go down the path that renaming Master Bedroom to Owner's Suite did. It was a big push about 5-8 years ago and almost every major developer changed the name on your sales drawings because someone thought Master Bedroom had too much connotation with slavery. Well now no seems to really care about it that much and no one views that bedroom any differently than they did before. 

    Best of luck with your lobbying. 

    1Reply
  • Jason Denny
    Rental Property Investor · Member since 2019 · 15 posts · 6 votes
    5y

    @Laura Guy you’re welcome

    0Reply
  • Nate Smoyer
    Specialist · Rapid City, SD · Member since 2016 · 100 posts · 46 votes
    5y

    @Laura Guy We've been working with the Chan Zuckerberg Initiative on a program in California. We had this very discussion and settled on Local Rental Owners. 

    You can also see this video that CZI put out (not associated with our company directly). It does, I think, a great job at giving an accurate picture of local rental owners or housing providers. https://twitter.com/attn/statu...

    I appreciate this effort y'all are undertaking. Communication is so important and terminology matters, greatly.

    0Reply
  • Laura Guy
    OP
    Flipper/Rehabber · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 54 posts · 144 votes
    5y

    @Sandra Morrison thank you! I am in regular contact with Vena- she’s awesome.

    1Reply
  • Laura Guy
    OP
    Flipper/Rehabber · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 54 posts · 144 votes
    5y

    @Curt Bixel legislation would include a definition. For example… is someone that sells a property on contract a “landlord” because in my state, they are treated as such for a specified period of time in the beginning of the contract. Is a condominium association a landlord? They maintain the common grounds….. I think the term “landlord” is no longer accurate, as well as carrying negative connotations.

    0Reply
  • Laura Guy
    OP
    Flipper/Rehabber · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 54 posts · 144 votes
    5y

    @Merritt S. Wait…. Do you think it’s dumb to change the word but you’re simultaneously disgusted by the term “housing providers”? Hmmmmmm 🤔

    0Reply
  • David Muellers
    Member since 2020 · 4 posts · 3 votes
    5y

    How about Tax payer / Transient?

    1Reply
  • Austin Ficco
    Contractor · Fort Lauderdale, FL · Member since 2019 · 4 posts · 1 vote
    5y

    @Laura Guy I just strictly go by LORD

    2Reply
  • Scott Esmail
    Investor · Orlando, FL · Member since 2016 · 162 posts · 125 votes
    5y

    I like "property owner" over housing provider so the words can also refer to other things like storage unit,apts, commercial spaces etc.

    0Reply
  • Sandra Regnell
    Rental Property Investor · Vancouver, WA · Member since 2014 · 68 posts · 37 votes
    5y

    @Garrett Cannizzo I agree.

    I have also been both a landlord and a tenant, occasionally at the same time.

    I can’t speak for anyone else, but my bad feelings towards landlords stemmed from entitlement on their part - overcharging, failing to respect boundaries and general intent on service to self rather than being considerate of my needs (Ie treating me like a p&l instead of a fellow human).

    A successful rebranding effort will focus on the issue that needs to be addressed rather than just changing the name.

    How does changing the name to this name further that goal?

    I think calling a landlord a “housing provider” likens it to a service provider which is confusing. Further, with large corporations going into the rental business, one runs the risk of become faceless and lacking in compassion from a perception point of view. It feels socialistic to me as well which definitely is not going to go over well right now.

    My opinion. For what it’s worth.

    Sandra

    1Reply
  • Terrell Garren
    Rental Property Investor · Concord, NC · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Laura Guy:

    we don’t call a motorcycle a bike. It’s antiquated and inaccurate. 

     Slowdown cowgirl, yes we do. 

    '20 Heritage for therapy, '17 Multistrada for thrill, '14 Valk for both.

    2Reply
  • Eddie Torres
    Rental Property Investor · Member since 2021 · 76 posts · 36 votes
    5y

    @Laura Guy Seems like a waste of time and energy and I don't see any sort of impact that this can possibly make.

    2Reply
  • Bruce WoodruffPro Member
    Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Eddie Torres:

    @Laura Guy Seems like a waste of time and energy and I don't see any sort of impact that this can possibly make.

     Yep. Nothing positive anyway. Only negative. A total waste of time.

    0Reply
  • Bruce WoodruffPro Member
    Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Jason Denny:

    @Laura Guy

    How about Tenant Services or Tenant Service Provider. Sounds more like a business name than a government entity name. In my opinion but you are definitely on to something.

    How about landlord and/or property owner? If it ain't broke don't fix it....

    0Reply
  • Ian Davidson
    Member since 2021 · 6 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    @Laura Guy I am very confused.  Your original post is simply about your desire to swap one term for another that you find less offensive.  Not a peep about eviction bans.  After pushback you bring up eviction bans.


    Can you explain what one has to do with the other?  I can't imagine you believe that swapping one phrase for another will swing public opinion on the bans?
      

    0Reply
  • John T.
    Rental Property Investor · Central U. S. A. · Member since 2013 · 296 posts · 149 votes
    5y

    What a waste of time!

    1Reply
  • Garrett Pearson
    Addison, IL · Member since 2018 · 72 posts · 24 votes
    5y

    @Colleen F.

    @Merritt S.

    @Laura Guy

    I’m going to agree that lessor and lessee is the most appropriate term. It is already a legal term used as part of Real Estate law. Housing provider is a term often used in social services and nonprofits. That is not to say anything negative because I appreciate the work we do. Keep in mind shelters are housing providers for homeless well that word is inappropriate in some arenas so I should say the “unhoused” because someone needed change that term. When the Housing Authority, Grantors and many in the Social Service community are referring to the person who is providing free or subsidized housing, they refer to them as the Housing Provider. When I hear the term, I immediately think it is potentially a charitable situation. With that in mind, what’s to differentiate the difference between renters/lessee from those who are recipients of free housing (without a lease or legal obligation to pay) from “housing providers” unless you use the terms, tenants/lessee. As a RE licensee and CEO of a Nonprofit, I can tell you that it’s important to be able to easily differentiate the two terms especially when something is in writing and an explanation made not be readily available.

    1Reply
  • Alma Mills
    Real Estate Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2013 · 98 posts · 48 votes
    5y

    Words matter. I fully support such a change and believe it can help the public see us in a different light. If we are ever to solve our housing crisis in so many cities housing providers must be seen in their proper role as the only ones who can help us turn this around.

    1Reply
  • Daniel Lahey
    Investor · Howell, NJ · Member since 2019 · 5 posts · 1 vote
    5y

    @Laura Guy

    I don't think housing provider covers all bases. It's not always housing. Sometimes it is renting out space like a basement or garage. Should it be land provider. Probably not because it's not always land. Is it always property? Yes it is. Could it be property provider. Maybe, however it sounds like we provide housing like a shelter as opposed to selling rental space. Could it be property distributor, maybe as it gets closer to the point and is all encompassing.

    Why can't it just be property owner? That hits all the boxes. If not that than how about property supplier as that is what it actually is. We don't provide but instead supply, giving an opportunity to people to buy.

    1Reply
  • Laura Guy
    OP
    Flipper/Rehabber · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 54 posts · 144 votes
    5y

    @Nate Smoyer this is amazing- thank you for sharing! I will definitely pass it on

    0Reply
  • Laura Guy
    OP
    Flipper/Rehabber · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 54 posts · 144 votes
    5y

    @Ian Davidson they have nothing to

    Do with one another. I was responding to

    Someone saying I was only hiring a lobbyist to change a term. I’m not. I hired a lobbyist to cover many areas we struggle with. I was simply asking for ideas on one particular aspect.

    0Reply
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