Success in Rental Arbitrage

Success in Rental Arbitrage

Member since 2023 · 19 posts · 10 votes

Hi all,

I am curious about how people are successfully operating rental arbitrage businesses. I own multiple rentals in the south/mid west and recently I was approached by an aspiring arbitrager to lease out one of my duplexes. They have furnished the unit as well as complied with my annual rent increases and its been a great long term relationship - they've always paid on time or early, I collect my rent, they maintain their "place of business" keeping my property running tight, and they in turn profit by doing STRs.

Myself coming from the ownership side, I am not looking to get into the businesses but I am just curious what successful arbitragers are doing and possibly what horror stories people have. Simply looking to gather some insight on:

Who has been successful in rental arbitraging and what leads to that success? Is it property managers who have quality systems in place already who are just diversifying their business model? How are leads being generated for this, there really isn't a "Zillow" where people can go to find arbitrage opportunities, its all market research and cold calling it seems. I have seen very mixed reviews scouring through the BP forums and am curious.

Does anyone have horror stories or major problems faced that stopped them from success in this business? What would make this method more attractive?

Thanks all for sharing insights!

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John UnderwoodPro Member
Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votes
3y

It sounds like it is working well for you. You are the investor you benefit from mortgage paydown, equity build up and tax deductions.

The Arbitrage person just has a job, but they are making money at their job.

I have heard of unsuccessful Arbitrage people just walking away from leases, especially during the pandemic. 

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @James Hamling:

    ....but you could use a licensed, insured PM to run the STR.

    I may have a tainted view... Some of the LL had the foresight to get first and last month’s rent and deposit. 

    I also do not understand it from the arbitrager perspective (even though one of my friends is an MTR arbitrage - she started when Covid was still high risk).  They have a job but no upside of appreciation, equity pay down, tax benefits, etc.  


    Ok, this is super easy to answer because what your doing is a fallacy argument, and I can use that for literally anything and everything. Here, how about we use the same on driving a car. Using your fallacy argument I can say driving a car is dumb, because what if someone is drunk, they can run off the road a die because of driving, or get arrested and go to jail for driving. See the point. 

    Yes, if you do something in the dumbest, stupidest way possible throwing out all the rules of basic operation, yeah, duh, bad things will happen. 

    No security deposit, that's just plain-DUMB! No SD is asking for a hurting from ANY tenant. So it's got nothing to do with arbitrage, everything you detailed in that vein is bad landlording. 

    On hiring a STR-PM, yeah in theory that could work well, but in reality I see the STR-PM's charging as much as 40% of gross revenues, and other assorted fee's. BONKERS charges. And, they have 0-skin in the game, what's the STR-PM's downside if vacancy is at 60%? Little to nothing. With a Hosting-Partner, they have a set basis rent every month, so yeah, pressure is on. If they do nothing, rent is due. If they do ok, rent is due. If they do awesome, rent is due. Follow?

    Rather than handing out 20-40% of revenues, I STRONGLY prefer a partner, who's got skin in the game, who shares liability and risk, and actually eat's the lion share of it. A STR-PM has none, 0 liability.     It's just not even close on the 2. Maybe if STR-PM's stop being so dang greedy and get realistic in fee's, but until then, I will arbitrage. 

    At end of day it's just a ever so slightly different corporate rental for me, it's nearly identical to what I do with Cargill, 3M or General Mills. It's a lease with sublet rights, some components that look like NNN but not all the way there. Both of these components, corporate rentals and NNN lease have loooong been around, so it's not rocket science.
    But yeah, with ANY tenant, if you just hand out a property, don't get correct terms, don't collect SD, if act like a fool, you'll get treated like a fool. 

  • Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @James Hamling:

    They have a job but no upside of appreciation, equity pay down, tax benefits, etc. At the end of lease the LL can in effect take away all the effort they have put in building the STR business by not renewing the lease. Can they find another unit to arbitrage? Will the furnishings work elsewhere?


     To answer specific to the Arbitrager benefits, because there is many, I will answer that here. 

    Let's take a $400k property that, for example, let's say done correctly averages $7k monthly as STR.

    So the STR-Host "could" do arbitrage with me, and for that they bring up-front to secure property on average as little as $7,500, and are looking at $3k monthly. Or maybe I give them first month at $0, 2nd at $1,500, and 3rd is at full rate and going forward.

    Now they also need on average $30k to furnish, prep, market and launch that STR. There out of pocket is around $40k to have an operating STR.

    Now long term benefits: They have a 3yr lease to start, with all rents locked in and known for that term, they know exactly what there monthly expense is yr1, yr2 etc.. At end of yr 3 we re-evaluate, and they have baked right in a right to renew 10 years! Terms detail that, in short-short version, as long as all is going well and no issues. And with that rents set and known going forward making for 13 years of utilization potential under contract. 

    Now if things go pear-shape, yeah, they can pack up furnishings and roll it forward to next one. 

    Now, let's look at if they try to do everything solo. 

    To acquire property they need to come up with $80k-$100k minimum just to secure property. And now that $30k on top of it all. Now looking at $110-$140k to get started. Literally 3X+ the costs vs arbitrage. Or, what that means in Opportunity Cost is for the same $ they can do either 1 STR or 3, a choice between that $ getting $7k monthly revenue or $21k.

    Which seems better ROI on spending ~$120k, getting $7k monthly revenue or $21k????

    Next, what if 21 months into it everything goes pear-shape and the property simply won't perform as a STR? Or better yet, the regulations change and they are now BANNED from STR in that property? If they bought it, now they are F'd aren't they. They have well over $100k tied up into a property they can't do their business of STR with, it's a big problem. With arbitrage, it's a conversation, lease is terminated early, they clean place up and out, and move onto the next. Total cost is maybe 2 months rent, $6k vs a $140k+ problem. Again, seems a no-brainer to me.

    The benefits for an arbitrager are significant mitigation of performance risk, and significant empowerment to scale. 

    To put this in perspective look up "the" dividend king-of-kings, a little stock called "O". Read the business profile and find they own all the CVS and Walgreen pharmacies', among just a couple names. No, not the business's, just the property. They lease to them. And it's a win-win for everyone. "O" empowers those companies to use their capital to scale, and operate, vs secure the infrastructure to scale and operate. It's a win-win. 

    STR-Arbitrage is doing the exact same thing, for the exact same purpose, on a different asset class for a different operation.

    And if I could do the same with Hilton or Radisson, you better believe I'd be doing it in a heartbeat. And who knowns, maybe someday my post on BP will be about my newest arbitrage tenant with Hilton or Radisson. 

    Point is, STR is a hospitality business. It's long been the standard for business's to lease infrastructure, just go look at any mall anywhere. Why people, yet again, think STR is some mutant of a thing so immune from the rules and standards of business is beyond me, it's just a micro-hotel, it's not all that different a thing.

  • Dan H.Pro Member
    Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Sarah Kensinger:
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @Sarah Kensinger:

    I'd love to hear some stories too. All the time horror stories on the landlord and arbitrager side have been referenced to, but never a here's what happened. If you want in-depth info on arbitrage, the ins and outs, and hang ups landlords have, check out Michael and Elizabeth Chang and I know Tj Tijani has done it as well. 

    In my San Diego market, I know no STR arbitrager that did not break lease during the Covid lockdown (I.e. had a lease before Covid and maintained it a full year later). I do not know exactly how many I am aware of, but my guess is about a dozen. I do know a MTR arbitrager that did not bail (she has quite a few MTR units she is arbitraging) and another MTR arbitrager who started as Covid was still a significant issue that did not bail (she has 2 and is looking for a 3rd).

    in my market we had full lockdown (no STR stays allowed) from March to July and again from before thanksgiving through the new year.  Note in the time that STR stays were allowed, occupancy sucked because all attractions including the beach were shutdown.  

    is there any San Diego STR arbitragers on this site that was arbitraging before Covid and still had same San Diego unit as arbitraged unit in march 2021?  Someone show me that there was a single STR arbitrager in my market that did not bail when the going got tough.  

    this is a single risk of STR arbitrage, but in my market this one risk was significant enough to warrant not to consider it.  
     

    Yeah, that was tough year for the STR market, forget the arbitragers it was everyone that hosted a STR. You either quickly changed strategies or you lost big time! Those that offered their properties to essential workers for longer stays pulled through just fine, but not everyone was willing to do that or even thought of it. San Diego only allows one STR license per person (homeowner), so I'm surprised arbitragers were able to get more than one. But maybe if they're an operator and not the owner it's a little different.

    Unfortunately, the large cities and metropolitan areas that went on lockdown complicated things for the arbitragers...and other hosts. But there were many cases where the landlord requested the property back from the arbitrager, because they had so many calls for a LTR as the lockdowns started coming. From the stories I heard the arbitrager had made their profit, so it was ok and a bit of a relief even though most had plenty of traveling nurses that needing housing. But I'm sure there were cases where an arbitrager lost money since the lease wasn't entirely finished as planned.


     >San Diego only allows one STR license per person (homeowner), so I'm surprised arbitragers were able to get more than one.

    That is San Diego city only (San Diego county wide does not have a quota) and went into effect May 2023 (I currently know no LL siding STR arbitrage in part due to bad taste from previous arbitraging. I do know 2 MTR arbitragers). Also there are ways around that limit (the host limit basically is not a limit in any real manner) as you can get anyone to agree to host/co-host and a professional PM is not considered the host by this law (otherwise all the PM companies would have needed to close). if you have friends that are willing to put their name as host, you can have as units as friends willing to do-host. This was all in what the city told people at the time but when it came out one man had a large number of units with co-hosts the politicians are calling it a loop hole. It is not a loop hole if that was what they were telling you to do and the rules are explicitly written to not be by ownership but by host.

    >But there were many cases where the landlord requested the property back from the arbitrager, because they had so many calls for a LTR as the lockdowns started coming.

    This was not the case in San Diego.   The arbitragers were bailing against LL’s desire.
     Finding LTR renter typically takes me a single open house.  during the Covid lockdown I had a few units to fill.  Appts had to be one perspective tenant at a time.  My guess is my average time showing each unit was ~50 hours (versus ~2 hours normally). I did not want to try to obtain LTR tenants then.  In addition, if the unit needed work to flip for next tenant I was limited to one contractor on site at a time which on one of my units resulted in what should have been a week to turn taking a few weeks (tenant had been in 8 years and were not bad but significant wear and tear in 8 years).  

    I go back to if someone is to use your unit as an STR, why choose an unlicensed, uninsured, low asset arbitrager over a licensed, insured, professional PM that has a team of employees, lots of experience, a grand network, etc.? Our STRs and our MTR (it did not get a license in the city STR lottery (was a STR until May 2023)) have a professional, licensed, insured PM operating them.

  • Dan H.Pro Member
    Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @James Hamling:
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @James Hamling:

    They have a job but no upside of appreciation, equity pay down, tax benefits, etc. At the end of lease the LL can in effect take away all the effort they have put in building the STR business by not renewing the lease. Can they find another unit to arbitrage? Will the furnishings work elsewhere?


     To answer specific to the Arbitrager benefits, because there is many, I will answer that here. 

    Let's take a $400k property that, for example, let's say done correctly averages $7k monthly as STR.

    So the STR-Host "could" do arbitrage with me, and for that they bring up-front to secure property on average as little as $7,500, and are looking at $3k monthly. Or maybe I give them first month at $0, 2nd at $1,500, and 3rd is at full rate and going forward.

    Now they also need on average $30k to furnish, prep, market and launch that STR. There out of pocket is around $40k to have an operating STR.

    Now long term benefits: They have a 3yr lease to start, with all rents locked in and known for that term, they know exactly what there monthly expense is yr1, yr2 etc.. At end of yr 3 we re-evaluate, and they have baked right in a right to renew 10 years! Terms detail that, in short-short version, as long as all is going well and no issues. And with that rents set and known going forward making for 13 years of utilization potential under contract. 

    Now if things go pear-shape, yeah, they can pack up furnishings and roll it forward to next one. 

    Now, let's look at if they try to do everything solo. 

    To acquire property they need to come up with $80k-$100k minimum just to secure property. And now that $30k on top of it all. Now looking at $110-$140k to get started. Literally 3X+ the costs vs arbitrage. Or, what that means in Opportunity Cost is for the same $ they can do either 1 STR or 3, a choice between that $ getting $7k monthly revenue or $21k.

    Which seems better ROI on spending ~$120k, getting $7k monthly revenue or $21k????

    Next, what if 21 months into it everything goes pear-shape and the property simply won't perform as a STR? Or better yet, the regulations change and they are now BANNED from STR in that property? If they bought it, now they are F'd aren't they. They have well over $100k tied up into a property they can't do their business of STR with, it's a big problem. With arbitrage, it's a conversation, lease is terminated early, they clean place up and out, and move onto the next. Total cost is maybe 2 months rent, $6k vs a $140k+ problem. Again, seems a no-brainer to me.

    The benefits for an arbitrager are significant mitigation of performance risk, and significant empowerment to scale. 

    To put this in perspective look up "the" dividend king-of-kings, a little stock called "O". Read the business profile and find they own all the CVS and Walgreen pharmacies', among just a couple names. No, not the business's, just the property. They lease to them. And it's a win-win for everyone. "O" empowers those companies to use their capital to scale, and operate, vs secure the infrastructure to scale and operate. It's a win-win. 

    STR-Arbitrage is doing the exact same thing, for the exact same purpose, on a different asset class for a different operation.

    And if I could do the same with Hilton or Radisson, you better believe I'd be doing it in a heartbeat. And who knowns, maybe someday my post on BP will be about my newest arbitrage tenant with Hilton or Radisson. 

    Point is, STR is a hospitality business. It's long been the standard for business's to lease infrastructure, just go look at any mall anywhere. Why people, yet again, think STR is some mutant of a thing so immune from the rules and standards of business is beyond me, it's just a micro-hotel, it's not all that different a thing.


     You indicate PM charges 20 to 40% of revenue (in my market it is 15 to 30%, but I no no one paying over 25%) but then follow it up with have no skin in the game.  Their skin is that they get no pay when the unit is not rented.  

    In San Diego, leases over one year is very rare because rents spike regularly. In the last 12 months, rent on the average 3/2 SFH increased over $700/month (source Rentometer). This is near 20% increase. It would be difficult to get a tenant to agree a year ahead of time to anything close to 20% rent increase. So longer than one year leases often fall way below market rent.

    https://www.rentometer.com/california-home-rents

    As I indicated I know multiple LL that have got burned by arbitragers in the last few years in my market. The arbitragers in general had no assets to go after when they broke their lease early (they may have had some assets prior to encountering the difficulties but there was no collecting from them for lease termination during Covid). It likely explains why we have different perspectives on use of unlicensed, typically low asset, typically uninsured, typically low experienced arbitrager versus use of a licensed, insured, professional PM that has a team of employees and a large network. I choose to go with the professional on my STR and MTR units.


  • Bruce WoodruffPro Member
    Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Sarah Kensinger:

    Depended on your location....I started STRs in 2020 and did a booming business with both of mine. But it's so dependent on where you are, in this case, specifically Red vs Blue area. 

    Another reason I stress the importance of paying attention to the politics of your RE areas....make sure they are a good fit with your goals....

  • Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @James Hamling:
    Quote from @Dan H.:

    It would be difficult to get a tenant to agree a year ahead of time to anything close to 20% rent increase. 

    I know multiple LL that have got burned by arbitragers in the last few years in my market.  The arbitragers in general had no assets to go after when they broke their lease early 


    Again, your using the example of bad landlording to justify calling STR-Arbitrage "bad".

    Why would you rent to ANYONE without a security deposit, forget arbitrage, just ANYONE? Or a person who has f-all to loose? Bad credit, no assets to speak of, why, why would you lease to them? 

    I would NOT let someone STR-Arbitrage a unit if they had F-all for asset's or capital reserves. So it's a full-stop there.

    Your argument is if someone does no due-diligence, leases it in the single DUMBEST way possible, oh things go bad and therefore the strategy itself is bad. No, the execution is where fault lies, 100%. 

    Lol, and you state in your market the charge is up to 30% but they don't actually charge that. Uhm, ok, so if they don't ever charge that why is that detailed as the charge? Makes 0 sense. 

    And no, that's NOT skin in the game. Do the math. If they get $1k less in revenues that's just $300 they miss out on making, they are $0 out of pocket on it. And, it doesn't make much difference to them if a property averages $5k per month or $7k per month, so what do they do, they go whichever way is most efficient FOR THEM. That's parasitic. 

    With STR-Arbitrage, it's a whole different stance. I get __X__ amount per month REGUARDLESS of what revenue they drive. And they are dang motivated to clear those costs, and than it's pure profit from there so they want to do the best they can. They want to keep the property in the BEST they can.

    It's the difference of having a "partner" who's focused on doing "good-enough" or "BEST". Do we not want the BEST tenants? Or are we to strive for "good-enough" tenants? 

    I would rather allow the hosting-partner reap those rewards than a "good-enough" PM, for what, the "potential" at a few more bucks? Along with that comes the "Potential" to get maintenance'd to death, to have 2am calls about toilets, to have to actively monitor and manage the manager to press them to do their dang-job, to HOPE I make __X__ money that month, or next month.    No thanks, I want reliability, stability, predictability. 

  • Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @James Hamling:
    Quote from @Dan H.:

     On your item of "unlicensed, uninsured".... Exactly what tenants are you getting that are "licensed" tenants?     What "tenant insurance" do you have your tenants getting? 

    And actually, you dead-wrong in your assumption, my STR-Arbitrage tenants ARE insured. Again, back to doing it CORRECTLY. They provide a full policy covering property too 120% market value of property.

    So, they are insured. 

    Standard tenant's, no insurance. Renters insurance cover's diddly-squat if they damage property. 

    I am not arguing that it's some magic-wand and it's all roses and rainbows for any and all no matter how they do it. I have repeatedly said about doing things CORRECTLY, I have called out my 28 page lease. 

    Yes, done wrong, as with anything, stuff can go horribly. But again, that's on execution, not the venture itself. 

  • Dan H.Pro Member
    Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @James Hamling:
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @James Hamling:
    Quote from @Dan H.:

    It would be difficult to get a tenant to agree a year ahead of time to anything close to 20% rent increase. 

    I know multiple LL that have got burned by arbitragers in the last few years in my market.  The arbitragers in general had no assets to go after when they broke their lease early 


    Again, your using the example of bad landlording to justify calling STR-Arbitrage "bad".

    Why would you rent to ANYONE without a security deposit, forget arbitrage, just ANYONE? Or a person who has f-all to loose? Bad credit, no assets to speak of, why, why would you lease to them? 

    I would NOT let someone STR-Arbitrage a unit if they had F-all for asset's or capital reserves. So it's a full-stop there.

    Your argument is if someone does no due-diligence, leases it in the single DUMBEST way possible, oh things go bad and therefore the strategy itself is bad. No, the execution is where fault lies, 100%. 

    Lol, and you state in your market the charge is up to 30% but they don't actually charge that. Uhm, ok, so if they don't ever charge that why is that detailed as the charge? Makes 0 sense. 

    And no, that's NOT skin in the game. Do the math. If they get $1k less in revenues that's just $300 they miss out on making, they are $0 out of pocket on it. And, it doesn't make much difference to them if a property averages $5k per month or $7k per month, so what do they do, they go whichever way is most efficient FOR THEM. That's parasitic. 

    With STR-Arbitrage, it's a whole different stance. I get __X__ amount per month REGUARDLESS of what revenue they drive. And they are dang motivated to clear those costs, and than it's pure profit from there so they want to do the best they can. They want to keep the property in the BEST they can.

    It's the difference of having a "partner" who's focused on doing "good-enough" or "BEST". Do we not want the BEST tenants? Or are we to strive for "good-enough" tenants? 

    I would rather allow the hosting-partner reap those rewards than a "good-enough" PM, for what, the "potential" at a few more bucks? Along with that comes the "Potential" to get maintenance'd to death, to have 2am calls about toilets, to have to actively monitor and manage the manager to press them to do their dang-job, to HOPE I make __X__ money that month, or next month.    No thanks, I want reliability, stability, predictability. 

    >Why would you rent to ANYONE without a security deposit, forget arbitrage, just ANYONE? Or a person who has f-all to loose? Bad credit, no assets to speak of, why, why would you lease to them?

    I never stated they did not collect SD or do proper check. They screened fine, but the arbitragers typically did not exit prior to depleting their reserves because of their “skin in the game” (furnishings). 

    > you state in your market the charge is up to 30% but they don't actually charge that. Uhm, ok, so if they don't ever charge that why is that detailed as the charge? Makes 0 sense.

    What I stated was I do not know anyone paying more than 25%.  You are smart enough to understand that PMs can charge up to 30% but I do not know anyone paying over 25%.  The investors I know recognize they can get full service PM for 25%.  I suspect those paying 30% have checked out from their asset managing responsibilities.  The analogy would be people own McLaren F1s, but I do not know anyone that owns a McLaren F1. 

    >Exactly what tenants are you getting that are "licensed" tenants? What "tenant insurance" do you have your tenants getting?

    PMs are typically licensed and insured which is my point. Tenants may have renters insurance but not the same level of insurance as professional PMs. Tenants likely do not have the STR insurance that I have on my STRs.

    It is my view that n matter how thoroughly you vet you unlicensed, typically under insured, typically low net worth, typically inexperienced arbitrager you are taking on more risk than using a professional PM.  If you do not agree then we disagree.   I known LLs that recently got burned (in the last few years) by arbitragers including the family with highest RE value of anyone I know (they know how to screen).

    Good luck

  • Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @James Hamling:
    Quote from @Dan H.:
    Quote from @James Hamling:
    Quote from @Dan H.:

    It is my view that n matter how thoroughly you vet you unlicensed, typically under insured, typically low net worth, typically inexperienced arbitrager you are taking on more risk than using a professional PM. 

    This is now the third time your arguing, that if a person does bad landlording, poor due diligence, allows a NON-qualifying person to arbitrage, that bad things happen. 

    And the 4th time I am now replying; "DUH". 
    And, that I don't lease to such, and I encourage other's not to. 

    But so far 3 times you've ignored this point, and reply saying these tenants are something they are not. It's clear you've simply decided the end and are going to argue and ignore responses to just create the narrative to fit your decided end. Sorry, that's reality, those you know who got burned, very good chance they messed up and left themselves open to being burned. I don't, I securitize my interests, I have recourse, I make sure I have recourse, I make sure there is something to "bite" into, that it will hurt, and hurt bad to try and burn me. 


  • Dan H.Pro Member
    Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    3y

    I do not know if you ignore the fact that I indicate they screened these tenants, collected deposits, etc. We disagree on the poor due diligence on the tenant screening. These are experienced LL (one is the LL in this city that has more privately owned units than anyone else I know) that did proper due diligence on their STR arbitrager but you are ignoring this. The tenants were properly vetted but could not survive little to no rental Income for an extended period of time (over a year). The arbitrager also had their investment that was not going to be recoverable so they typically did not provide notice on impending failure until too late (pride may have played a role also).

    Every STR arbitrager failed to make it through 2021 in San Diego. Did every LL that rented to STR arbitragers do poor due diligence? You can believe that if you desire, but my view is the fact the arbitragers did not have assets to purchase their own RE doomed them to failure at that time. They needed bigger, deeper financial pockets than any of them had. If they had the assets necessary to survive, they would have owned RE with all the benefits of RE ownership and not been arbitragers.

    I’m out!

  • John UnderwoodPro Member
    Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    3y

    check out the Arbitrage Horror story thread.

  • Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Alexander Knox:

    Hi all,

    I am curious about how people are successfully operating rental arbitrage businesses. I own multiple rentals in the south/mid west and recently I was approached by an aspiring arbitrager to lease out one of my duplexes. They have furnished the unit as well as complied with my annual rent increases and its been a great long term relationship - they've always paid on time or early, I collect my rent, they maintain their "place of business" keeping my property running tight, and they in turn profit by doing STRs.

    Myself coming from the ownership side, I am not looking to get into the businesses but I am just curious what successful arbitragers are doing and possibly what horror stories people have. Simply looking to gather some insight on:

    Who has been successful in rental arbitraging and what leads to that success? Is it property managers who have quality systems in place already who are just diversifying their business model? How are leads being generated for this, there really isn't a "Zillow" where people can go to find arbitrage opportunities, its all market research and cold calling it seems. I have seen very mixed reviews scouring through the BP forums and am curious.

    Does anyone have horror stories or major problems faced that stopped them from success in this business? What would make this method more attractive?

    Thanks all for sharing insights!


     I have about 100 of my units leased by a handful of arbitrage people.  They do well.  At least I assume they do (based on the fact they continue to lease and pay me rent).

    No horror stories yet.  I actually like the concept. 

    That said, I get emailed/called/texted by 10000 of those people.  Most of them have no money and no experience and just waste your time.   So if you want to rule them out, when someone reaches out to you tell them you need a $5k deposit and see if they're still game. 

  • Investor · NC · Member since 2016 · 51 posts · 1 vote
    1y

    Where do you guys suggest posting a property for arbitrage? As a long term landlord, I am new to any other methods and a little hesitant but would like to give it a try if the numbers and partnership is right.

    • Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
      1y
      Quote from @Sada Rafi:

      Where do you guys suggest posting a property for arbitrage? As a long term landlord, I am new to any other methods and a little hesitant but would like to give it a try if the numbers and partnership is right.


       I've not posted any of my properties for arbitrage...  I've just responded to those asking with a template reply (our website with a /str at the end).  Gives our canned reply about which ones we do it at, what they need to do etc.

      I wouldn't advertise it. You want to have a barrier of entry at least high enough so that people have to be competent to find you and ask the question. Otherwise you'll get what I call the 'llc inc gmail' people. you know, the people who have an email address like "Bob-Jones-Property-Inc-LLC @gmail.com"

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